EA: Please take out DPP and fix the bugs next year.

[JoeMimic]

I can definitely say the fumble prone role they have on Gore is working in my franchise. He has four in 5 games, and this is with me covering up as much as I can.

[mjhyankees]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoeMimic

I can definitely say the fumble prone role they have on Gore is working in my franchise. He has four in 5 games, and this is with me covering up as much as I can.

So a player role is working...just curious...is 4 fumbles in 5 games realistic? No....his worst year was 6 fumbles. And two years ago (didn't play much last year) he fumbled 4 times the entire season...and the year before that too. I had a game with him recently, that i shut off in disgust, where he fumbled 3 times in one game....2 of them while I was covering up!!! And no it wasn't raining. Could that have been the DPP at work (I did get a window showing me that Gore...covers ball....NO!!!...).
but I was covering!!!! Not sure whether the role or DPP or his fumble rating accounted for all that.

[Senator Palmer]

Quote: Originally Posted by mjhyankees

I here you...I was not offended and hope you weren't either. I'm just not seeing any difference. I've played 50-100 games or so and to me it just looks like streakiness that I saw anyway based on guys ratings. Again I pose this question: Is what you seeing because Brady had great ratings and the other guy doesn't? Would not that account for consistency in one and not the other? Could player roles not account for this? Captain comeback makes the guy good under pressure. Franchise QB makes the guy more consistent? Maybe even a role or rating for consistency...seems easier and better to me. I'm truly glad if many people see a difference and enjoy it....god bless them. I'm not seeing it. Now if they had this AND fixed the bugs I'd be fine. But it bothers me that they spent time and money (and certainly hyped this feature as the BIG NEW ADDITION this year) on DPP and we still see annoying crap like every punt bouncing the same way, and all the other stuff people are complaining about. Again I have to state for the record, I overall like (not love) the game this year and feel it's the best next gen game as far as gameplay goes (sadly still not as good as last gen IMO). I just don't see what all the hype was about...and am troubled that other things got left in their shoddy state.

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but let me drop my .02 in and let me take quarterback play because it's the easiest to identify. Last year, the game differentiated players (QBs) using ratings and it felt cheap, because the only thing they could use was accuracy.

The only difference I say playing against Brady or Jason Campbell was the accuracy -- not the decision-making. In Madden 11, both would sit in the pocket for extended periods of time, they may move a little to the right and if nothing was there on 3rd down, they would launch a deep pass down the sideline for the heck of it. Brady's would come close to a receiver, wheras Campbell would throw the thing 5 yards out of bounds. But they both picked up blitzes pre-snap and changed protections. They both hit the receiver in a zone blitz like clockwork.

In Madden 12, Jason Campbell misses wide open receivers because his eyes come down to the rush, due to his "tuck and run" DPP. If he doesn't get the running game going early, he's rushing passes and throwing it in the dirt. I'm able to disguise blitzes and get to him. If nothing is there, he'll break the pocket. With Brady, he's picking everything up pre-snap and getting the ball out on time. He's finding holes in the zones, using the checkdown. Nothing's there, he sits in the pocket, then throws the ball away. Last year, I knew exactly where every quarterback would attack in cover 2 -- the vertical seam route. Now I'm more on my heels and always adjusting. There is more than accuracy ratings here at play, there is a difference in decision-making. That's why DPP beats what I saw in Madden 11.

[JoeMimic]

Quote: Originally Posted by mjhyankees

So a player role is working...just curious...is 4 fumbles in 5 games realistic? No....his worst year was 6 fumbles. And two years ago (didn't play much last year) he fumbled 4 times the entire season...and the year before that too. I had a game with him recently, that i shut off in disgust, where he fumbled 3 times in one game....2 of them while I was covering up!!! And no it wasn't raining. Could that have been the DPP at work (I did get a window showing me that Gore...covers ball....NO!!!...). but I was covering!!!! Not sure whether the role or DPP or his fumble rating accounted for all that.

I think it may have something to do with sliders, like the DPP roles were designed for default and when you tweak sliders it effects it. Like say your QB ACC slider is 0-15 and your QB is on a cold streak, normally he might miss a few in a row but with the ACC so low it gets over powered.

[ComfortablyLomb]

I think DPP rocks and just needs a little refinement going forward.

The OP makes little sense anyway. DPP simply adjusts ratings based on performance so a guy who is a natural 80 might play like an 85 or a 75. It's not like a 75 can't still make catches if you keep forcing the ball at him. It's not a magic feet for hands function.

Real players vary in ability from week to week and when you get the same 80 rated WR every single week and on every single play what you end up with is a very repetitive product. Has the OP ever played a sport? Some days you're "on" and others you just feel out of whack. This was a great addition this year and simple needs to be refined. It would be a terrible shame if it were scrapped rather than improved and adding an "off" button for the people who don't like variety.

Reading between the lines it sounds a lot like the OP needs to spend A LOT of time working on sliders and getting the game to play properly for him. It takes effort and time but it's worth it.

[mjhyankees]

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but let me drop my .02 in and let me take quarterback play because it's the easiest to identify. Last year, the game differentiated players (QBs) using ratings and it felt cheap, because the only thing they could use was accuracy. The only difference I say playing against Brady or Jason Campbell was the accuracy -- not the decision-making. In Madden 11, both would sit in the pocket for extended periods of time, they may move a little to the right and if nothing was there on 3rd down, they would launch a deep pass down the sideline for the heck of it. Brady's would come close to a receiver, wheras Campbell would throw the thing 5 yards out of bounds. But they both picked up blitzes pre-snap and changed protections. They both hit the receiver in a zone blitz like clockwork. In Madden 12, Jason Campbell misses wide open receivers because his eyes come down to the rush, due to his "tuck and run" DPP. If he doesn't get the running game going early, he's rushing passes and throwing it in the dirt. I'm able to disguise blitzes and get to him. If nothing is there, he'll break the pocket. With Brady, he's picking everything up pre-snap and getting the ball out on time. He's finding holes in the zones, using the checkdown. Nothing's there, he sits in the pocket, then throws the ball away. Last year, I knew exactly where every quarterback would attack in cover 2 -- the vertical seam route. Now I'm more on my heels and always adjusting. There is more than accuracy ratings here at play, there is a difference in decision-making. That's why DPP beats what I saw in Madden 11.

Wow....I certainly don't see all that and I play 2 games or more per day. Wouldn't Qb awareness account for the stuff you mention though? Just wondering. I saw differences in Qb's in M11. I play on all madden, not sure if that matters. Last year cambell missed passes, missed open guys, didn't scan well etc. Now I agree that it's more pronounced this year but I still get crap Qb's having stellar days against me and good ones struggling. Still seems random to me...maybe I'm missing something. I WISH i saw the things you say. Don't see it.

[mjhyankees]

Quote: Originally Posted by ComfortablyLomb

I think DPP rocks and just needs a little refinement going forward. The OP makes little sense anyway. DPP simply adjusts ratings based on performance so a guy who is a natural 80 might play like an 85 or a 75. It's not like a 75 can't still make catches if you keep forcing the ball at him. It's not a magic feet for hands function. Real players vary in ability from week to week and when you get the same 80 rated WR every single week and on every single play what you end up with is a very repetitive product. Has the OP ever played a sport? Some days you're "on" and others you just feel out of whack. This was a great addition this year and simple needs to be refined. It would be a terrible shame if it were scrapped rather than improved and adding an "off" button for the people who don't like variety. Reading between the lines it sounds a lot like the OP needs to spend A LOT of time working on sliders and getting the game to play properly for him. It takes effort and time but it's worth it.

Regarding DPP affecting ratings. Do you see the ratings drop from game to game in the player's menu? Are you assuming this, or assuming it's so because EA said so? Just wondering how you know this because I've heard guys posting that they don't see a change in the numbers. I personally don't see any thing different from week to week that I didn't see before. Maybe it's more pronounced now...not sure that's good anyway.
Second point. Played sports. Football Baseball and coached football on the high school level. Also fought Tae Kwon Do tournaments. To be honest I found that most people play or fight as they are. Good fighters dont' suddenly forget how to fight. They may get beat badly by someone much better (which I did my share of whoopings) but they dont' forget. I still did certain things well and scored on them....but sometimes the other guy was just better. Same in playing and coaching football. Did my Qb have days when he was better then others? yes. Did he suddenly forget how to do his reads, or suddenly become INaccurate...not really. yeah, some games he had less time and this affected him but he didn't suddenly LOSE IT. Same in the pros. An Accurate QB is always accurate...it's the rush or better coverage that affects his completion %. Maybe wind too or rain.
Sliders...oh God I spend way too much time on sliders. Have some posted every year. This year I found that I needed to do far less than in years past (kudos to EA on this) but also after roster update the cpu is suddenly killing me on the run...may have to adjust this.

Thanks for your points....I respectfully disagree.

[dirtguru]

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but let me drop my .02 in and let me take quarterback play because it's the easiest to identify. Last year, the game differentiated players (QBs) using ratings and it felt cheap, because the only thing they could use was accuracy. The only difference I say playing against Brady or Jason Campbell was the accuracy -- not the decision-making. In Madden 11, both would sit in the pocket for extended periods of time, they may move a little to the right and if nothing was there on 3rd down, they would launch a deep pass down the sideline for the heck of it. Brady's would come close to a receiver, wheras Campbell would throw the thing 5 yards out of bounds. But they both picked up blitzes pre-snap and changed protections. They both hit the receiver in a zone blitz like clockwork. In Madden 12, Jason Campbell misses wide open receivers because his eyes come down to the rush, due to his "tuck and run" DPP. If he doesn't get the running game going early, he's rushing passes and throwing it in the dirt. I'm able to disguise blitzes and get to him. If nothing is there, he'll break the pocket. With Brady, he's picking everything up pre-snap and getting the ball out on time. He's finding holes in the zones, using the checkdown. Nothing's there, he sits in the pocket, then throws the ball away. Last year, I knew exactly where every quarterback would attack in cover 2 -- the vertical seam route. Now I'm more on my heels and always adjusting. There is more than accuracy ratings here at play, there is a difference in decision-making. That's why DPP beats what I saw in Madden 11.

I agree with SenatorPalmer on this, as well as his post on the first page. Currently 3 and 3 using Steelers, losses where dissapointing but I never felt cheated. I would easily be 6-0 in M11.

As for DPP and it's effectiveness, it's not perfect as MJ points out, the Palamoulo and Gore examples clearly show this. I have seen other cases where DPP made sense to me. MJ and I have discussed this before and I do believe some form of DPP has been programmed into past games but rarely affected QB's as it does in M12 as SenatorPalmer noted above.
Whatever the case, I am finding the reality of having to make offensive and defensive adjustments based on how the game is playing the most fun I have had in years.

One example I can point to is playing the Colts I naturaly gameplanned my D to look for the pass. In M11 this would have easily garaunteed success. Apparrently not in M12 as Joseph Addai lit up the best runstopping D in my virtual NFL for 132 yds. Truly effective cpu playcalling as Manning would carve me up whenever I focused on Addai, put pressure on Manning and back to the run. Back and forth all game.