Infinity vs. Ignite

[Sturzinator]

Quote: Originally Posted by mike24forever

Great answer. It's nice when people answer questions and not take shots at EA in their answers! This actually happens less and less here at OS. Thank you.

Why so protective of EA? Are you on their payroll or something?

Twenty five years of primarily stagnant or even regressive game play is certainly deserving of some criticism.

Who, if not EA, is to absorb the responsibility for this?

[dghustla]

The infinity engine was just a physics engine.

The Ignite engine powers the entire game. The Pillars of the ignite engine as stated on EA website are:

Human Intelligence
True Player Motion
Living Worlds


EA did not completely revamp the game. There will be alot of the same animations in the next gen game. EA has stated that line play has been their focus because they feel everything starts there. They added 300 new OL/DL interaction. My guess is that's were you'll see the most differences in this gen and next gen when madden 25 releases.

In Terms what will be different, if the animations are the same. I will say this is purely my take and is all speculation:

In current gen the MLB in tampa 2. Always plays his zone identical every single time. He drops back to same depth. You can repeatedly run the same play over and over and he never jumps the route, he never adapts. this has opened the doors to money plays left and right. hopefully with human intelligence and the new "player sense" this has been corrected. the MLB can recognize when there is no threat behind him and come down on short routes. The cpu adjusting to player tendencies and a more read and react system not a psychic system. So even though the LB will look the same when he drops back into his zone in term of his actual movement. The way he is playing the zone and reacting to the offensive players will be different.



On a side note. Something jumped out to me while watching the saints vs Dolphins on Monday night. On Sproles first catch he was running a wheel route. The SS who was assigned to cover him immediately crashed hard to the flat because he thought it was a flat route. When Sproles turned up field he was wide open for 30 yard catch-&-run. I noticed in Madden we never see this because of the psychic DBs who know what route is being run regardless of the way it's run. Hopefully with Human Intel (not saying it will be this year) they can more away from whatever coding was in place that determined the game could only work if the DBs knew the route. to what DBs actually do which is react to what they see with fast reflexes.

[infemous]

Quote: Originally Posted by dghustla

The infinity engine was just a physics engine. The Ignite engine powers the entire game. The Pillars of the ignite engine as stated on EA website are: Human Intelligence True Player Motion Living Worlds EA did not completely revamp the game. There will be alot of the same animations in the next gen game. EA has stated that line play has been their focus because they feel everything starts there. They added 300 new OL/DL interaction. My guess is that's were you'll see the most differences in this gen and next gen when madden 25 releases. In Terms what will be different, if the animations are the same. I will say this is purely my take and is all speculation: In current gen the MLB in tampa 2. Always plays his zone identical every single time. He drops back to same depth. You can repeatedly run the same play over and over and he never jumps the route, he never adapts. this has opened the doors to money plays left and right. hopefully with human intelligence and the new "player sense" this has been corrected. the MLB can recognize when there is no threat behind him and come down on short routes. The cpu adjusting to player tendencies and a more read and react system not a psychic system. So even though the LB will look the same when he drops back into his zone in term of his actual movement. The way he is playing the zone and reacting to the offensive players will be different. On a side note. Something jumped out to me while watching the saints vs Dolphins on Monday night. On Sproles first catch he was running a wheel route. The SS who was assigned to cover him immediately crashed hard to the flat because he thought it was a flat route. When Sproles turned up field he was wide open for 30 yard catch-&-run. I noticed in Madden we never see this because of the psychic DBs who know what route is being run regardless of the way it's run. Hopefully with Human Intel (not saying it will be this year) they can more away from whatever coding was in place that determined the game could only work if the DBs knew the route. to what DBs actually do which is react to what they see with fast reflexes.

This is what I am hoping Ignite is, but we'll see when the game drops, not before, as these are things that will only be learned through playing the game.

[Mizzou24]

They also claimed the ignite engine would have 1000s of new animations.. I think u guys really need to wait and see before u bash it.. Who knows maybe they will impress us.

[Senator Palmer]

My question is how much is this is actual innovation and how much is just re-branding? I was all excited when I heard the E3 presentation, but the more I thought about it, the more I remember this stuff has been promised before. Forgetting about the more powerful graphics (even though we've seen 3D grass before), I've heard EA promise more a more immerisive experience -- now it's called "Living Worlds." I've heard them talk about footplanting and locomotion. Now it's true player step or something like that. They're talked in the past about the game adjusting to you and your playcalling and the CPU opponent countering accordingly. Now it's Player Sense. I've heard about the smarter targeting for the offensive line and improved assignments, and I even saw a fair amount of it in Madden 25 when I Redboxed it for a weekend.

They talk about building the offensive/defensive line interactions from the ground up. Well, I saw a fair amount of improvement there too. I saw the engaged player movement we've been asking for. I saw the pass rushers take inside moves, and dips, etc.

Madden has always operated on multiple "engines" to power different part so the game from textures to physics. It's just they've never given these seperate parts an all-encompassing name like Infinity. So how much of this new tech isn't in Madden 25 already and how much is truly next-gen? Is this the real deal Holyfield or is it like when Bodog shut down and came back as Bovada?

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

My question is how much is this is actual innovation and how much is just re-branding? I was all excited when I heard the E3 presentation, but the more I thought about it, the more I remember this stuff has been promised before. Forgetting about the more powerful graphics (even though we've seen 3D grass before), I've heard EA promise more a more immerisive experience -- now it's called "Living Worlds." I've heard them talk about footplanting and locomotion. Now it's true player step or something like that. They're talked in the past about the game adjusting to you and your playcalling and the CPU opponent countering accordingly. Now it's Player Sense. I've heard about the smarter targeting for the offensive line and improved assignments, and I even saw a fair amount of it in Madden 25 when I Redboxed it for a weekend. They talk about building the offensive/defensive line interactions from the ground up. Well, I saw a fair amount of improvement there too. I saw the engaged player movement we've been asking for. I saw the pass rushers take inside moves, and dips, etc. Madden has always operated on multiple "engines" to power different part so the game from textures to physics. It's just they've never given these seperate parts an all-encompassing name like Infinity. So how much of this new tech isn't in Madden 25 already and how much is truly next-gen? Is this the real deal Holyfield or is it like when Bodog shut down and came back as Bovada?

Love this, online poker is currently my vice in place of football gaming.

I wonder why is it that whenever Madden is criticized, even fairly, it somehow equates to EA bashing, instead of just calling it like you see it. I wish there could be some kind of "blind" game play test where when new sports games are coming out, they just release game play without any developer branding, I willing to bet far more people would be critical of Madden, not less. Meaning EA branding gives Madden far more unwarranted praise, imo, than it does unwarranted criticism, reasonable people criticize Madden because, surprise, it's an inferior sports simulation video game.

I'm about done venting about Madden in general and just about to avoid its' forums more, so I'll keep it trill. Just because something is personally enjoyable does not mean that it's of high quality. I absolutely love the movie Half Baked, it is so hilarious to me and some of my friends, for whatever reason. However that does NOT mean that Half Baked is a high quality film with superb acting and a stellar comedic script.

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

Love this, online poker is currently my vice in place of football gaming. I wonder why is it that whenever Madden is criticized, even fairly, it somehow equates to EA bashing, instead of just calling it like you see it. I wish there could be some kind of "blind" game play test where when new sports games are coming out, they just release game play without any developer branding, I willing to bet far more people would be critical of Madden, not less. Meaning EA branding gives Madden far more unwarranted praise, imo, than it does unwarranted criticism, reasonable people criticize Madden because, surprise, it's an inferior sports simulation video game.

I've always asked people(Madden hardcore fans and defenders mostly), if madden was in the position of backbreaker, or APF, with little to none known players, would they play it strictly off of it's gameplay? I've never gotten an answer, lol. Honestly if Madden had no license but was the same exact game, I'd never touch it.

[dghustla]

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

My question is how much is this is actual innovation and how much is just re-branding? I was all excited when I heard the E3 presentation, but the more I thought about it, the more I remember this stuff has been promised before. Forgetting about the more powerful graphics (even though we've seen 3D grass before), I've heard EA promise more a more immerisive experience -- now it's called "Living Worlds." I've heard them talk about footplanting and locomotion. Now it's true player step or something like that. They're talked in the past about the game adjusting to you and your playcalling and the CPU opponent countering accordingly. Now it's Player Sense. I've heard about the smarter targeting for the offensive line and improved assignments, and I even saw a fair amount of it in Madden 25 when I Redboxed it for a weekend. They talk about building the offensive/defensive line interactions from the ground up. Well, I saw a fair amount of improvement there too. I saw the engaged player movement we've been asking for. I saw the pass rushers take inside moves, and dips, etc. Madden has always operated on multiple "engines" to power different part so the game from textures to physics. It's just they've never given these seperate parts an all-encompassing name like Infinity. So how much of this new tech isn't in Madden 25 already and how much is truly next-gen? Is this the real deal Holyfield or is it like when Bodog shut down and came back as Bovada?

Let me preface my comment with this: Don't take this as a EA defense. I don't think Madden is as bad as ppl make it out to be. I enjoy Madden and also get very flustered with Madden at times. My mood with Madden is temperamental I usually get burned out with it in 4-5 months. I just want to draw a parallel between Madden and other markets, to say that we should evaluate what it is they are offering today and not so much compare it to what they have "hyped" in the past.

When you ask about how much is re-branding I will say this. How is Madden's re-branding any different from all of the other Major brands in any market who sell annual re-iterations of previous model products? For example take cars. Look at Ford they have been selling an annual rendition of the Mustang for over 30 years. Every 5 years or so once they are able to improve on a feature or something they created several years or even decades prior. When that is the case they re-introduce the improvements they made. Whether it is the drive train or suspension, turbo, fuel injection or the transmission etc. Now if Ford came out next year and said they improved the Mustang's fuel injection system would you say, "they already improved that system once 5 years ago that's not anything new?"

My point is this yes we've had grass improvements, yes we've had "more immersive game play", "improved A.I." & "Revamped Line Play" before. But what EA is "selling" us on now. Is that those elements of the game have been taken to another level. They believe those elements are better upgraded versions of the previous renditions. They are saying "yes we had improved A.I. but now we've taken that to the next level". "Yes we had immersive gameplay but now we've brought the stadium to life unlike it was before." The question shouldn't be centered about what EA is promising, but if they can deliver on those promises.