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How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

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Old 04-16-2014, 06:19 AM   #1
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How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

Okay, so the idea behind this thread is to aggregate relevant knowledge on this topic in a single location. I remembered reading a small discussion in this forum touching on this subject, but had a hell of a time searching for it. Turns out it was because the subject/title of that thread was not very descriptive: "import draft question/questions."

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...questions.html

I ran into some issues with Player Types while I was moving around Offensive Linemen (changing their position on the O-line) in a 32-team CFM.

I want to make notes on how to change a Player's 'Type' within the game (after you've already started a franchise in CFM mode).

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First off, so nobody gets confused, let's initially clarify that there are two pieces of the equation: "Scheme" and "Type".

"Scheme" is the overall scheme of the offense or defense. We're talking West Coast, Power Run, Spread, etc. Forget about this one. To my knowledge, "Scheme" has absolutely NO bearing on what the Player's "Type" is. Added note, to my knowledge, there is NO way to change a specific player's assigned "Scheme" in Madden. They're all stuck with whatever Scheme they start with.

So now we're focused on the Player's "Type". This is his POSITION Type. Each position has a multitude of possible types.

Changing position types is NOT easy. Depending on what position type you're attempting to change a player to, it may be extremely hard or even impossible.

Let's start with the basics.

Q1: How do you get a player to change their 'Type'?

A1: There is only one way that I know of, and that is to change the player's position.

A1b: This brings up some minor issues. First, for example, are the positions like WR. You cannot change a WR to any other position. Because of this limitation, you will never be able to change a WR's 'Type'. This goes for QB as well, because while you can change a QB to another position, you can never change them BACK to QB. Second, only certain positions can be changed during the season. For example, FB, HB, and TE cannot be changed until the offseason. So you will not be able to change a player's 'Type' if he falls into this sub-category of positions, until you reach the offseason.



Q2: Okay then, how do I change a player to a specific 'Type'?

A2: Every player's 'Type' is defined by algorithms that take specific player stats into account.

Basically, take a position. Offensive Line is an easy one, since LT, LG, C, RG, and RT all use the same 'Types' and have identical requirements.

So for the Offensive Line positions, the possible types are:

Balanced
Pass Blocking
Run Blocking
Big Mauler
Zone Blocking

Each of those possible types has a set of specific stats that it's individual algorithm processes:

Balanced ("decent Strength", Awareness, Pass and Run Blocking)
Pass Blocking (Pass Blocking, Strength, Awareness)
Run Blocking (Run Blocking, Strength, Acceleration)
Big Mauler (Run Blocking, Strength, Impact Blocking)
Zone Blocking (Run Blocking, Agility, Acceleration)

I'm not 100% positive about how "Balanced" for O-line fits with the others. My guess right now (which could easily be wrong) is that your lineman ends up as Balanced if he doesn't meet the Threshold for either the Big Mauler, Zone Blocking, Run Blocking, or Pass Blocking types.

As for the others, note that "Run Blocking" is a component of these three types:

Run Blocking (Run Blocking, Strength, Acceleration)
Big Mauler (Run Blocking, Strength, Impact Blocking)
Zone Blocking (Run Blocking, Agility, Acceleration)

Strength is a component of two of those three:

Run Blocking (Run Blocking, Strength, Acceleration)
Big Mauler (Run Blocking, Strength, Impact Blocking)
Zone Blocking (Run Blocking, Agility, Acceleration)

So say you have a Run Blocker 'Type' and you'd really like him to be a Big Mauler 'Type'. Increasing his Run Blocking or Strength will likely get you nowhere, because both of those 'Types' share those same two components. Your best bet is to not upgrade Run Blocking at all, and solely pump Impact Blocking through the roof.

After pumping up Impact Blocking, change the player's position to a different O-line position, and see if he's now a Big Mauler 'Type'.

It's probably obvious at this point that it's likely to be far, far easier to change a player's 'Type' when he's younger, and his stats are lower. This is because you can more easily pump a specific stat up (say, Impact Blocking from 60 up to 80-85) when they're more pliable.

Now imagine you have a 90+ OVR player with 95 RBK, 95 PBK, and 95 IBK, and the game is telling you that he's a Run Blocker 'Type' but you want him to be a Big Mauler 'Type'.

Not only would it be very expensive to boost his Impact Blocking at that point, but even if you had a massive amount of XP to do it, you could only raise it 4 points, up to the 99 ceiling.

So, this theory is probably far more applicable to "project" players, and young players you obtain via the draft classes.


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Let's use a case study.

I recently created a 32-team controlled franchise. To start out each team, I decided before signing any Free Agents to ANY team, I was going to sort out what they already had on their roster and move them around the best I could to make best use of the players already on the payroll, before making any decisions to add or remove players.

While sorting through the Bears offensive linemen, I noticed that the majority of them excelled in Run Blocking (or at least, it was usually their best component stat out of the relevant ones above).

So for example, I moved the LG ('Balanced' Type) to RG, and then back to LG again. His 'Type' had now changed from 'Balanced' to 'Run Blocker'.

Did the same with LT Jermon Bushrod, who also changed his 'Type' to Run Blocker, after previously being the Pass Blocker 'Type'.

For reference, LT Jermon Bushrod was initially listed as a Pass Blocker with these stats:

STR: 91
AWR: 87
PBK: 83
RBK: 93
IBK: 87
ACC: 78 (SPD: 69)
AGI: 68

Note that, of the 3 blocking stats (Pass, Run, Impact), Pass Blocking was in fact his LOWEST, even though he was supposedly a Pass Blocker 'Type'.

Moving him to RT and then back to LT forced the game to re-process his current stats, and accordingly re-classified him as a Run Blocker 'Type'.

Remember (what follows is a visual reference to help illustrate the differences):

Balanced ("decent Strength", Awareness, Pass and Run Blocking)
Pass Blocking (Pass Blocking, Strength, Awareness)
Run Blocking (Run Blocking, Strength, Acceleration)
Big Mauler (Run Blocking, Strength, Impact Blocking)
Zone Blocking (Run Blocking, Agility, Acceleration)

Pass Blocking:

STR: 91
AWR: 87
PBK: 83

RBK: 93
IBK: 87
ACC: 78 (SPD: 69)
AGI: 68

Run Blocking:

STR: 91
AWR: 87
PBK: 83
RBK: 93
IBK: 87
ACC: 78 (SPD: 69)
AGI: 68

Big Mauler:

STR: 91
AWR: 87
PBK: 83
RBK: 93
IBK: 87
ACC: 78 (SPD: 69)
AGI: 68

Zone Blocking:

STR: 91
AWR: 87
PBK: 83
RBK: 93
IBK: 87
ACC: 78 (SPD: 69)
AGI: 68


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Let's move on to Case #2.


RG Kyle Long (Balanced 'Type' prior to changing his position)

I saw the following stats, and I thought to myself, "Oh, this is good. I'll change his position real quick and it'll make him a Pass Blocker":

STR: 82
AWR: 66
PBK: 87
RBK: 79
IBK: 82

ACC: 83 (SPD: 73)
AGI: 69

I mean, clearly his Pass Blocking stat is the best out of the three. Seemed like a no-brainer that he'd be labeled a Pass Blocker 'Type' when it re-classified him, right?

Nope, it re-classified him as a Run Blocker 'Type'.

Let's re-examine the components of the Run Blocker 'Type':

STR: 82
AWR: 66
PBK: 87
RBK: 79
IBK: 82
ACC: 83 (SPD: 73)
AGI: 69

82 (STR) + 79 (RBK) + 83 (ACC) = 244 component score for Run Blocker 'Type'.

Let's calculate the other 'Types'.

87 (PBK) + 82 (STR) + 66 (AWR) = 235 component score for Pass Blocker 'Type'.

79 (RBK) + 82 (STR) + 82 (IBK) = 243 component score for Big Mauler 'Type'.

82 (RBK) + 69 (AGI) + 83 (ACC) = 234 component score for Zone Blocker 'Type'.

So there you have it. I believe this is the super simple formula for how the game determines Player 'Types'.

Obviously there are other positions where the Types are determined off of one, two, or four components (like "Balanced" here). No idea the exact formula for these, my guess is the game either averages them all together, or takes specific components and either doubles them or cuts them in half.

Some quick takeaways from this:

If you want to turn a Run Blocker into a Big Mauler, crank his Impact Block through the roof until the numbers add up.

High Pass Block + Awareness will cause Pass Blocker to over-ride the other 'Types'.

The rookie O-linemen coming out of the drafts with high Speed / Acceleration can almost always be immediately converted to the Zone Blocker 'Type' (if they aren't already) simply because their Strength usually sucks, and Strength is a component in ALL of the other O-linemen 'Types'.

It's going to be much, MUCH harder (read: practically impossible) to change an O-lineman to a Zone Blocker later in his career, because Agility and Acceleration are so expensive to upgrade. If you don't convert him to a Zone Blocker within the first year or two of his career, chances are you won't get another opportunity to do so.

Lastly, the problem with why SO many O-linemen end up as the Run Blocker 'Type' when you change their position, is because it combines the 3 components with the highest average amongst most good linemen.

Most good O-linemen that you'd want to develop long-term tend to have good Acceleration. They usually also have good Strength and Run-Blocking.

The lower their Acceleration is, the easier it makes them to convert into the Big Mauler 'Type'.

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Okay, that probably wraps up the section on Offensive Linemen.

I'll post more later for some other positions.

Also, I currently don't think that height or weight plays any role in the 'Types'.

[EDIT: Skimmed what I just typed, I'm going to have to double-check the calculations for LT Jermon Bushrod, as it doesn't appear to follow the same exact pattern as RG Kyle Long. Specifically, at first glance it appears to be weighting Acceleration heavier than Impact Blocking. I'll take another look at it when I'm not falling asleep at the keyboard.]

Last edited by Robrain; 04-16-2014 at 06:31 AM.
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Old 04-17-2014, 02:50 AM   #2
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Re: How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robrain
[EDIT: Skimmed what I just typed, I'm going to have to double-check the calculations for LT Jermon Bushrod, as it doesn't appear to follow the same exact pattern as RG Kyle Long. Specifically, at first glance it appears to be weighting Acceleration heavier than Impact Blocking. I'll take another look at it when I'm not falling asleep at the keyboard.]
Okay, just double-checked the math and there appears to be a difference in the way Big Mauler is calculated:

261 pass blocker
262 run blocker
271 big mauler
239 zone blocker

According to the method of merely adding together the 3 components for each 'Type', LT Bushrod should be a Big Mauler 'Type'.

However, he ends up as a Run Blocker 'Type'.

One potential theory is that height and/or weight DO have something to do with the player 'Type', at least in the case of the Big Mauler 'Type'. [for the record, LT Bushrod is 6'5" 315 lbs, so he doesn't exactly seem underweight...]

An alternate theory which I believe holds more potential is that there is some sort of additional 'limiter', probably related to the Strength stat.

Big Mauler claims to take into account primarily Strength, Run Blocking, and Impact Blocking. Perhaps to be considered a 'Big Mauler', your Strength stat has to be the largest of those three stats? So, if it comes down to being either a Big Mauler or a Run Blocker, if your Strength stat is 95 and your Run Blocking stat is 90 and your Impact Blocking Stat is 90, then you end up Big Mauler 'Type'?

RBK: 93
STR: 91
IBK: 87

Bushrod's Run Blocking stat is the highest of those three. Perhaps if Strength is higher than Run Blocking, you're a Big Mauler 'Type'?

One more alternate theory is that it's potentially bugged and you can't get a player's 'Type' to switch TO Big Mauler 'Type', but I think I've done it before with at least a few linemen (or switched a Big Mauler 'Type' player to a different position and they retained the Big Mauler 'Type', either of which would invalidate this particular theory).

I'm about to sift through the O-linemen on all 32 team's rosters, so I'll see what I come across.

At this point, Pass Blocker and Run Blocker seem pretty straightforward.

Balanced is unknown, Zone Blocker is unknown as of yet, and Big Mauler needs a bit of specific research.

Last edited by Robrain; 04-17-2014 at 02:53 AM.
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Old 04-17-2014, 03:15 AM   #3
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Re: How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

Some more test examples.

For easy reference:

Balanced ("decent Strength", Awareness, Pass and Run Blocking)
Pass Blocking (Pass Blocking, Strength, Awareness)
Run Blocking (Run Blocking, Strength, Acceleration)
Big Mauler (Run Blocking, Strength, Impact Blocking)
Zone Blocking (Run Blocking, Agility, Acceleration)

Players:

LT Anthony Collins (Bengals - was Balanced 'Type')
6'5" / 315 lbs (identical height / weight to LT Bushrod above...)

STR: 90
AWR: 76
PBK: 88
RBK: 84
IBK: 82
ACC: 72 (SPD: 57)
AGI: 61

Changed him to RT, then back to LT. He's now Run Blocker 'Type'.

254 pass blocker (88 PBK + 90 STR + 76 AWR)
246 run blocker (84 RBK + 90 STR + 72 ACC)
256 big mauler (84 RBK + 90 STR + 82 IBK)
217 zone blocker (84 RBK + 61 AGI + 72 ACC)

I'm at a loss at this point what's happening here. Either Acceleration is weighted really heavily in the Run Blocker 'Type' formula, or STR is weighted heavier in the Run Blocker 'Type' formula than it is in the Pass Blocker 'Type' and Big Mauler 'Type' formulas.

Or these 'Types' are factoring in other completely unknown stats in varying amounts besides the primary ones that they list.

For added data, the LT position was set to 'Big Mauler' when I did the position change, so I don't think that the currently selected Position Type (under the team scheme) has any bearing whatsoever on the outcome. Just to rule that out. The RT was also set to 'Big Mauler'.

Again:

LT Anthony Collins:

STR: 90
AWR: 76
PBK: 88
RBK: 84
IBK: 82
ACC: 72 (SPD: 57)
AGI: 61

254 pass blocker (88 PBK + 90 STR + 76 AWR)
246 run blocker (84 RBK + 90 STR + 72 ACC)
256 big mauler (84 RBK + 90 STR + 82 IBK)
217 zone blocker (84 RBK + 61 AGI + 72 ACC)

OVR:
84 Run Blocker
82 Big Mauler
80 Pass Blocker
79 Balanced
78 Zone Blocker

Something is getting weighted far heavier for Run Blocker. Whether it's Run Block being weighted heavier for Run Blocker than Pass Block is being weighted for Pass Blocker, or some secondary stat, it's pretty obvious at this point.

Perhaps Pass Blocker weighs Pass Block and Awareness heavier than it weighs Strength. Possibly in a descending order, Pass Block being weighed heavier than Awareness, and Awareness being weighed heavier than Strength.
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Old 04-17-2014, 03:36 AM   #4
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Re: How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

Player:
LG Andrew Whitworth (Bengals - Pass Blocker 'Type'):
31 years old
6'7" / 335 lbs

STR: 94
AWR: 92
PBK: 97
RBK: 88
IBK: 86
ACC: 67
AGI: 55

283 pass blocker (97 PBK + 94 STR + 92 AWR)
249 run blocker (88 RBK + 94 STR + 67 ACC)
268 big mauler (88 RBK + 94 STR + 86 IBK)
210 zone blocker (88 RBK + 55 AGI + 67 ACC)

OVRs:
90 Run Blocker
89 Pass Blocker
87 Balanced
84 Big Mauler
82 Zone Blocker

...it just doesn't make any sense. Pass Blocker should severely outweigh Run Blocker in this case. It's clearly not weighing ACC at it's default value, or it's simply not considering the player's ACC at all, even though it states it does.

I mean, the Run Blocker formula has to be skewed pretty significantly for it to take OVER a 35 point swing...

I checked. Changed him to RG, then back to LG. He's now Run Blocker 'Type'.

Basically, you don't have to do any calculations. Just change the Position Type under the team scheme menu, and whichever Position Type gives the highest OVR for that player is what they'll convert to if you change their position.
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Old 03-30-2015, 06:15 PM   #5
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Re: How To Customize Your Player's 'Type' Within Madden 25

Good information here. This is what I've been wondering for the longest. EA seems to make some strange decisions. Why not just allow to switch any position, type, scheme, etc... I might not know they real reason, but it would make me happier haha
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