Rocket Catching

[sois]

The problem is that users can alter routes. Don't allow that and you have solved the issue. Keep the button to jump, but don't allow the receiver to magically know when the ball was thrown.

[rhombic21]

The issue is 100% the fact that the WRs can hold onto the ball at such a high rate, although watching those videos, I'm still not certain that it will be impossible to stop. I'd like to see how often it works against user hit sticking, which looks like it would be fairly reasonable to pull off, since the DBs in all of those catches are correctly positioned facing the receiver, such that if you hit B when the ball is thrown, you should be able to get control of them and do a big hit.

But if I was a developer, here is how I would address it. They need to change the "catch" decision such that it's affected by ball height. Passes that are either lower to the ground, or higher in the air relative to the receiver when a catch animation is triggered should be harder to catch. In other terms, if a WR has to jump for a pass, then the catch likelihood should decrease. Not necessarily to the point where a catch is never made, but just such that there are more drops. Then you add in an additional modifier so that WRs who jump for the ball and are hit by DBs are even less likely to catch. So in effect, you have an additional catch "penalty" that gets triggered if the WR gets hit while in the act of making the catch if he is off the ground. Finally, I would adjust it so that DBs automatically go for the big hit/wrap swat on all passes that are precision passed high. Those things should solve the issue.

[sois]

Quote: Originally Posted by rhombic21

But if I was a developer, here is how I would address it. They need to change the "catch" decision such that it's affected by ball height. Passes that are either lower to the ground, or higher in the air relative to the receiver when a catch animation is triggered should be harder to catch. In other terms, if a WR has to jump for a pass, then the catch likelihood should decrease. Not necessarily to the point where a catch is never made, but just such that there are more drops. Then you add in an additional modifier so that WRs who jump for the ball and are hit by DBs are even less likely to catch. So in effect, you have an additional catch "penalty" that gets triggered if the WR gets hit while in the act of making the catch if he is off the ground. Finally, I would adjust it so that DBs automatically go for the big hit/wrap swat on all passes that are precision passed high. Those things should solve the issue.

Rhombic, you're always thinking

Good idea man, this is brilliant and can (hopefully) be included in a patch. That would make the risk/reward of trying rocket catches more strategic. If you only catch 25% of these passes, you will be more likely to use a different tactic.

[md0t]

Quote: Originally Posted by WK21

No, there is something wrong with rocket catching..its unrealistic yea, we can stop it..but a very small percentage of people would find a game in which they have to defend that sort of BS all game vs a game that resembles real football ...fun and that is the point of this whole thing.. NCAA online is not real football...and it is not EAs fault it the JAs faults.. Out of the 500+ games I have played, then than 40 of those were straight up games by my opponent wide receivers at te, hb at fb...yea we can combat these by doing equally cheesy things on defense but WHATS THE POINT.. some people just want to play a game like they see on TV.. /rant

concurrence.

[NoLittleBabies]

Quote: Originally Posted by rhombic21

The issue is 100% the fact that the WRs can hold onto the ball at such a high rate, although watching those videos, I'm still not certain that it will be impossible to stop. I'd like to see how often it works against user hit sticking, which looks like it would be fairly reasonable to pull off, since the DBs in all of those catches are correctly positioned facing the receiver, such that if you hit B when the ball is thrown, you should be able to get control of them and do a big hit.

I think you're oversimplifying the issue, my friend. Sure, the rocket catch animation may not result in enough drops, but that's not the fundamental problem. There are several underlying issues from what I can tell. One is that there are different animations available between receivers and defensive backs. When someone good at rocket catching positions their receiver perfectly (as long as their isn't someone directly in front of the receiver) there is nothing the defense can do (either CPU or manually controlled) to break up the pass, because there is no animation that will work on the rocket catch animation if you're not directly in front. And sometimes, even if you do have a DB right in the way, the rocket catch animation will overpower the DB jump animation, and the WR will magnet to the ball. For a perfect example of this, go to 1:47 in the video I linked to. The Florida DB is in perfect position, but the animation at his disposal simply gets overtaken by the receiver's rocket catch animation.

So I would say that the animation is the number one issue with rocket catching. But the other issues, along with the one you mentioned, are:

1. QBs are still too accurate. Look at the balls being thrown in the video. They are all extremely accurate bullets. And I know it's the Heisman winner throwing them, but c'mon, nobody throws with that much precision on 20-25 yard passes.
2. [This is a problem with user catching in general] The psychic connection between the QB and the WR. In real life, if a receiver is running a 20 yard fly route, and 12 yards into it the QB bullets the ball at the back of his head, nothing good will come of it. Either the ball will fall imcomplete or a defender in zone will jump up and intercept it before the WR even looks around. But in the game, you can throw this pass, immediately switch to the receiver and turn around. Which leade me to the final issue...
3. Lack of realistic momentum. Still. A 200-pound man moving at 17 mph cannot come to a complete stop, turn around 180 degrees and jump up for a ball in half a second. Not even close But in the game, you can do exactly that.

So, how to fix rocket catching? Well, I don't have an answer to my #2, but the rest shouldn't be that difficult to patch up.

First, give every player the same catching animations, offense or defense. The only differences will be the swat animations available to the defense. And there should be lots and lots of swat animations available. You also need to make sure that there are plenty of animations available to players who aren't right at the balls "landing spot" (or spot where you can get the right animation to go up and get it). Because what happens a lot is, the offensive player gets in perfect position, and the DBs goes to catch or swat, but ends up getting an animation that's designed as if he were right on the landing spot. So naturally the animation misses and fails, because the players reacting as if he were in the perfect position, when really he is a foot or two off of it. I hope that makes sense.

Second, make QBs less accurate. They may have made minor improvements in 10. More improvement is needed.

Third, make momentum/physics more realistic. This is definitely the most difficult fix, but it will be well worth it, because it will make the game much better in many other areas as well.

[jdrhammer]

Exactly! The fact that rocket catching and most user catches in generally are automatic cause them to be broke. Apply common logic. If the DB can't get a hit on the WR then it should be fairly easy to complete but when a WR leaves his feet it should be easier for the DB, cpu controlled or not, to tatoo the WR, knocking the ball loose.

I don't feel like there is any reward for hitting the WR as soon as he catches the ball, especially on curls. This should be very chancey to do, especially when the D is set to aggressive. To me, the logic isn't right because when a guy catches a pass and comes down with it he should be more likely to retain possession. However, it should be very difficult to ever catch when the WR is jumping/stretched out and gets hit in mid-air.

[hcopenhagenh]

Quote: Originally Posted by Potatoes002

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ YES!!! Dont turn them down just remove them, you never see these catches anyways.

LOL... Why? I want to do the work for myself. I don't want the CPU do it for me. Why be able to control a RB then? Or why control when the QB throws?

I User Catch everything. It doesn't matter if it is rocket catch or not. Slants, outs, hitches, drags, In's, Fades, I do it all for myself because I don't trust the AI to do it for me. What is wrong with that?

[countryboy]

I don't user catch...so maybe thats why I don't recall seeing this? Is it a user-catch only issue?