Bottom line - passing game just isn't fun

[Meast21Forever]

Quote: Originally Posted by MaddenFranchise10

I do the bait and switch play calling as well, but it's not realistic or fun. Even when you audible from a pass to a run, the defense knows it. It knows exactly what play you called and instantaneously adjusts. However, I've noticed that occasionally the CPU lets the user win or make a huge play. It's like the game's outcome is predetermined by the CPU. For example, sometimes (maybe 1 in 20 times) I'll call a pass play and the CPU defense will line up in a scheme that allows my play to actually work without a run/pass audible. But for the most part, if you call a run play, the defense will blitz the gap you're aiming for. If you call a wide option, the CPU will know and stack that side. If you call a pass play, the defense will usually be in a zone, with those pesky super LB's ball hawking the entire middle of the field. And if you can lob it past those LB's, you still have to contend with the psychic DB's that turn on a dime to make impossible plays. There's no strategy to play calling. You can't bait the CPU into playing the pass or run, then calling the opposite. You can't outsmart the CPU. There's no point in establishing a ground game, because the CPU won't overcommit to the run. The second you call a pass play (even a play action) the CPU knows and defends it with zone. Disappointing.

I disagree with this post completely. There are run plays that are linked with PA pass plays that will get the CPU to over commit. I do this all the time. It's a beautiful thing. I think the passing game is a bit more difficult this year because of the LB issue and the improved zone coverage, but to me, that makes the game way more fun. I'm not a great player, but I used to win on AA by an average of 2 or 3 TDs. On this game, I've lost 4 games in on AA. I win by probably an average of 5 or 6 points. I love that. I get close games. Maybe I suck just enough to make the game fun.

I do hate the audible thing though. Calling a draw play from shotgun 4WR, the cpu comes out in a base 43 defense with the lbs showing blitz. Then audible to a pass, they roll over the receivers and the safeties move back. That is annoying.

The main issue is that the devs haven't found a way to make the game harder realistically. They improved the defensive awareness, but now they move too quickly, cover too much ground, make plays with their back to the ball, etc.

There are problems with the game, but I'm lovin it anyway.

[MaddenFranchise10]

Quote: Originally Posted by Hurricain

-Set up the run, use play action. -Vary the sets you run. -watch for the blitz. -MOVE IN THE POCKET. So important, this will move the LBs. Just a couple tips. I'm liking the passing game.

Read my post at the top of this page. The CPU knows every play and audible you call. You can't establish a ground game, since the CPU won't overcommit to the run. As soon as you call or audible to a pass, the CPU knows and adjusts to a zone coverage.

It's not that I'm having difficulty passing the ball. It's that the defensive programming is inherently flawed.

The defense shouldn't know every play the offense calls before the snap. That's unrealistic and looks awkward. If I call a run, the defense stacks against it, usually blitzing the gap I'm supposed to hit. If I call a pass play, the defense is almost always in a zone coverage. If I set up a HB Mid, the CPU comes out showing a LB blitz, but as soon as I audible to a pass, the LB's switch to zone coverage.

It's such awful programming I don't understand how so many of you can't see it. It's as obvious as super LB's and psychic DB's, and yet some still refuse to acknowledge those flaws too. I'm baffled by some of you.

[MaddenFranchise10]

Quote: Originally Posted by Meast21Forever

I disagree with this post completely. There are run plays that are linked with PA pass plays that will get the CPU to over commit. I do this all the time. It's a beautiful thing. I think the passing game is a bit more difficult this year because of the LB issue and the improved zone coverage, but to me, that makes the game way more fun. I'm not a great player, but I used to win on AA by an average of 2 or 3 TDs. On this game, I've lost 4 games in on AA. I win by probably an average of 5 or 6 points. I love that. I get close games. Maybe I suck just enough to make the game fun. I do hate the audible thing though. Calling a draw play from shotgun 4WR, the cpu comes out in a base 43 defense with the lbs showing blitz. Then audible to a pass, they roll over the receivers and the safeties move back. That is annoying. The main issue is that the devs haven't found a way to make the game harder realistically. They improved the defensive awareness, but now they move too quickly, cover too much ground, make plays with their back to the ball, etc. There are problems with the game, but I'm lovin it anyway.

The bolded part contradicts your first paragraph.

If the defense knows whether the play you called is a run or pass, how can play action really work?

If I try to establish a good run game, I expect the defense to adjust to stop me. But if I run the ball 10 times in a row, then call a play action, the CPU defense comes out in a zone coverage. If I audible from the PA to an option, they OLB's and safeties adjust to stop the run, usually stacking the side I'm optioning toward.

You're absolutely correct about EA not being able to make the game more challenging and realistic. The greatest gameplay challenges come from unrealistic gameplay issues: psychic defense AI, psychic DB's, super LB's, bad offensive AI, poor WR awareness, etc.


Ultimately, there is no getting around the fact that the CPU defense knows every play you call on offense. Sometimes the CPU will let you get away with a good play or two. It's as if the CPU wants you to succeed on certain plays, but sets you up to fail on others. Every play and every game is predetermined by the whims of the CPU.

With that said, how can people defend EA resorting to cheap programming tricks to create a challenging, yet unrealistic gameplay experience?

[md0t]

Quote: Originally Posted by jackson

I have been in practice mode for an ungodly amount of time and I too feel this frustration. I discovered that there was very little difference between playing against a good secondary and a bad one. I spent hours tweaking sliders to help my passing game which was lacking. btw I am an AA player who has been playing college football games its beginnings. I think I am an average player that appreciates realism but wants to have fun. I adjusted the cpu pass coverage to 0 to 5. At 0, the cpu will at times lose sight of the ball in the air, or at least that's the concession I've decided to convince myself of. At 5, this doesn't really happen, at least at any quantitative level. I also raised the hum pb to around 80 to 85. I know; You guys are saying that those numbers don't jive, but hang on. The cpu blitzes a lot. To have a regular passing game that threatens the opposing defense, these numbers are critical. To offset the blitz that happens all the time you must make your ol pb pretty well when there is no blitz, that way when there is, the defender that gets through more often than not is the unblocked blitzer. I run with OU cuz I went there and live in the state. You all know OU passing game is not one easily rivaled in the NCAA. I was struggling with excessive sacks due to the computer getting to me with chump d lines and covering perfectly behind it. THIS WAS NOT FUN OR REALISTIC. And no I don't hold the ball forever. I would encourage you guys to experiment with these sliders as they are still difficult and their is not much of a difference in the cpu coverage at that low of a level but it does help. I hope this helps you guys. I am more than happy to share my sliders if anyone is interested. I am 32 and love NCAA and play maybe two to three hours every couple days give or take, to give you some perspective of my level. Sorry bout the long post. Looking back over the text it's kinda hard on the eyes.

my sentiments exactly...I myself started off playing Bill Walsh when i was around 13 and this year is the most frustrating copy of college football thanks to the bad ball trajectory enabling the linebackers to swat almost every pass in their proximity, defensive backs all being able to locate passes without even looking, receivers dropping 95% of the passes they after they've been hit - personally i'd rather some of those drops be fumbles....and dont let me mention how dbs make up ground when clearly they have been beat, and the offensive line that almost doesnt even touch the dline...i have put the pass rush/defense sliders down to ZERO and i see absolutely NO difference in play(oh and i didnt forget about all the morphing and suctioning)...its like the developers purposely make the game cheat on defense. dont get me wrong, i still play the game a lot and i still do have some fun playing, but for the 18+ years ive been playing, again i say THIS copy is by far the most frustrating, and yes i play offline dynasty and RTG on heisman, sliders untouched.

[Meast21Forever]

Quote: Originally Posted by MaddenFranchise10

The bolded part contradicts your first paragraph. If the defense knows whether the play you called is a run or pass, how can play action really work? If I try to establish a good run game, I expect the defense to adjust to stop me. But if I run the ball 10 times in a row, then call a play action, the CPU defense comes out in a zone coverage. If I audible from the PA to an option, they OLB's and safeties adjust to stop the run, usually stacking the side I'm optioning toward. You're absolutely correct about EA not being able to make the game more challenging and realistic. The greatest gameplay challenges come from unrealistic gameplay issues: psychic defense AI, psychic DB's, super LB's, bad offensive AI, poor WR awareness, etc. Ultimately, there is no getting around the fact that the CPU defense knows every play you call on offense. Sometimes the CPU will let you get away with a good play or two. It's as if the CPU wants you to succeed on certain plays, but sets you up to fail on others. Every play and every game is predetermined by the whims of the CPU. With that said, how can people defend EA resorting to cheap programming tricks to create a challenging, yet unrealistic gameplay experience?

The linked plays work. It's not a contradiction. Even if they know the play, corners, safeties and linebackers still react to the run on PA passes if the play has been setup. Setup plays work.

But really, there will never be a game where the AI doesn't know what you're doing. It's all programmed. It's more about making the CPU defenders react realistically. They've taken a few steps forward in zone coverage in my opinion, but their corner/wr animation system is flawed.

And games are not predetermined. I just don't believe that. Some games are closer and some aren't. It may seem like you're not meant to win, but the user can always out play the cpu.

I defend EA because most people who complain about issues in a game have no idea how difficult programming is. "Fixes" are rarely simple. A patch you download in 2 minutes takes weeks of work to complete. The team at EA works hard. They're not some evil empire like most think.

[1GATOR FAN]

So pretty much what we have learned from this thread is "If it ain't easy, it's broke"

I'm doing fine playing on heisman passing the ball

[novadolla]

Quote: Originally Posted by Mtneer08

I would rather it be harder to throw like it is this year than too easy like all other years.

I agree but when **** like this happens on third down against max zone. wtf is an air raider suppose to do?

http://www.easports.com/media/play/video/83722433

[Meast21Forever]

Quote: Originally Posted by 1GATOR FAN

So pretty much what we have learned from this thread is "If it ain't easy, it's broke" I'm doing fine playing on heisman passing the ball

Thanks for such a great contribution to this thread.