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Mr. Franchise · 03-23-2010, 04:59 PM

I remember a while ago somebody saying that offensive line doesn't get taken into account during simming. Is this true? This might make or break if I pick this game up again.

rjd3396 · 03-23-2010, 06:45 PM

thats bull, the O-line is one of if not the most important position when simming

Glorious Arc · 03-23-2010, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjd3396


	thats bull, the O-line is one of if not the most important position when simming

Take the colts offense or the pats offense and release all their offensive linemen and replace them with guys who are rated in the 50s. Then sim the season and watch as the line as a whole gives up less then 20 sacks(I had them give up less then 6 with colts once). Just saying...

EDIT
This is my test from madden but head coach and madden use very similar simulation engines. You can run the tests yourself and see for yourself but the Oline is basically irrelevant when simming a season.
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...imulation.html

huskerwr38 · 03-23-2010, 07:31 PM

are you talking about Head Coach 09 or Madden cause the ratings act differently.

Mike3207 · 03-23-2010, 07:38 PM

You definitely see that offensive line players get more pancake blocks when you sim the games vs. play them. I'd look at more than sacks if you sim the games, though. How effective was the quarterback, and did you establish a good running game when simming the games.

Also, Head Coach's Game AI is based on a old Madden game, I think it's 2007.

Glorious Arc · 03-23-2010, 07:46 PM

The link listed was tests specifically run for madden.

The tests I have run on HC09 I was about to take the colts and go 13-3 with 50 rated Olinemen with the least amount of sacks in the league.

I know for a fact, I have taken the Broncos playbook and ran the west coast offense and only had 60-70 rated Olinemen and had Eli Manning put up 3000 yards 30+ tds and less then 10 ints(not sure about sacks) and had Darren Mcfadden ran for over 1500+ yards and 10+ TDs each year averaging at least 4.5 to a 5.5 YPC. This was over the course of 4 years.(The Oline were zone blocking scheme)

If you dont believe me just go and take the 15 mins to test it out yourself. I would go as far to even say that the special skills dont have any effect when simulating either.

I took a created coach and gave him no stats with the panthers and they had a solid pass defense(top 5-15) with the worst run defense. I then created another coach and gave him all the LB skills and I had the exact same results of 5-15th ranked pass defense and one of the worst run defenses.(I have ran similar tests with the QB, WR, RB, DB, and the Oline skills) I was planning on making a sim only coach and I wanted to make sure I wasnt wasting any points in useless skills during simulation.

Mr. Franchise · 03-23-2010, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glorious Arc


	The link listed was tests specifically run for madden. The tests I have run on HC09 I was about to take the colts and go 13-3 with 50 rated Olinemen with the least amount of sacks in the league. I know for a fact, I have taken the Broncos playbook and ran the west coast offense and only had 60-70 rated Olinemen and had Eli Manning put up 3000 yards 30+ tds and less then 10 ints(not sure about sacks) and had Darren Mcfadden ran for over 1500+ yards and 10+ TDs each year averaging at least 4.5 to a 5.5 YPC. This was over the course of 4 years.(The Oline were zone blocking scheme) If you dont believe me just go and take the 15 mins to test it out yourself. I would go as far to even say that the special skills dont have any effect when simulating either. I took a created coach and gave him no stats with the panthers and they had a solid pass defense(top 5-15) with the worst run defense. I then created another coach and gave him all the LB skills and I had the exact same results of 5-15th ranked pass defense and one of the worst run defenses.(I have ran similar tests with the QB, WR, RB, DB, and the Oline skills) I was planning on making a sim only coach and I wanted to make sure I wasnt wasting any points in useless skills during simulation.

That's extremely disheartening. I was really itching to play with all the draft hype.

Skarecrow · 03-24-2010, 06:24 PM

we are differentiating "sim" here from "super-sim", right? We're talking the insta-game results, right?

I remember reading somewhere where one of the Devs said something along the lines of "super-sim does about 100x the calculations of sim, and normal play does about 100x the calculations of super-sim". I wish I could find it.

Even if this o-line stuff is true, it's got to be taking something about the teams into account, cause in everybody's league, I'm sure you see that some teams quite simply just suck for several years in a row (multiple seasons 3-13 or worse), so it can't be completely random.

03-23-2010, 04:59 PM	#1
Mr. Franchise WAT OVR: 33 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hoboken, NJ Posts: 2,318 Blog Entries: 5	Is This True? I remember a while ago somebody saying that offensive line doesn't get taken into account during simming. Is this true? This might make or break if I pick this game up again. __________________ Note to self: BUY MADDEN 12* there are considerable franchise upgrades One More Time - A New York Yankees Dynasty*

03-23-2010, 06:45 PM	#2
rjd3396 Rookie OVR: 3 Join Date: Oct 2009	Re: Is This True? thats bull, the O-line is one of if not the most important position when simming

03-23-2010, 07:31 PM	#4
huskerwr38 MVP OVR: 15 Join Date: Mar 2009	Re: Is This True? are you talking about Head Coach 09 or Madden cause the ratings act differently.

03-23-2010, 07:38 PM	#5
Mike3207 MVP OVR: 26 Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 4,673 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Is This True? You definitely see that offensive line players get more pancake blocks when you sim the games vs. play them. I'd look at more than sacks if you sim the games, though. How effective was the quarterback, and did you establish a good running game when simming the games. Also, Head Coach's Game AI is based on a old Madden game, I think it's 2007. Last edited by Mike3207; 03-23-2010 at 07:40 PM.

03-23-2010, 07:46 PM	#6
Glorious Arc MVP OVR: 26 Join Date: Sep 2008 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Is This True? The link listed was tests specifically run for madden. The tests I have run on HC09 I was about to take the colts and go 13-3 with 50 rated Olinemen with the least amount of sacks in the league. I know for a fact, I have taken the Broncos playbook and ran the west coast offense and only had 60-70 rated Olinemen and had Eli Manning put up 3000 yards 30+ tds and less then 10 ints(not sure about sacks) and had Darren Mcfadden ran for over 1500+ yards and 10+ TDs each year averaging at least 4.5 to a 5.5 YPC. This was over the course of 4 years.(The Oline were zone blocking scheme) If you dont believe me just go and take the 15 mins to test it out yourself. I would go as far to even say that the special skills dont have any effect when simulating either. I took a created coach and gave him no stats with the panthers and they had a solid pass defense(top 5-15) with the worst run defense. I then created another coach and gave him all the LB skills and I had the exact same results of 5-15th ranked pass defense and one of the worst run defenses.(I have ran similar tests with the QB, WR, RB, DB, and the Oline skills) I was planning on making a sim only coach and I wanted to make sure I wasnt wasting any points in useless skills during simulation. Last edited by Glorious Arc; 03-23-2010 at 07:54 PM.

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03-24-2010, 06:24 PM	#8
Skarecrow Rookie OVR: 2 Join Date: Feb 2010	Re: Is This True? we are differentiating "sim" here from "super-sim", right? We're talking the insta-game results, right? I remember reading somewhere where one of the Devs said something along the lines of "super-sim does about 100x the calculations of sim, and normal play does about 100x the calculations of super-sim". I wish I could find it. Even if this o-line stuff is true, it's got to be taking something about the teams into account, cause in everybody's league, I'm sure you see that some teams quite simply just suck for several years in a row (multiple seasons 3-13 or worse), so it can't be completely random.

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