Werewolf L Kate Beckinsale - day 7, deadline Thursday 10pm Eastern Time

[Lathum]

not to be a jerk Ant, but you shouldn't post in the same color as the games GM

[DaddyTorgo]

whoops. In all honesty I forgot that about cartman. Makes me wonder about tangle though...

UNVOTE CARTMAN

[tanglewood]

Interesting analysis. But how do you square that with Alan seeing player X visit and take something from Cartman night 2?

If he had come up a wolf, whoever viewed him would likely have stated it by now.

That is true, I had forgotten about that.

Of course it could have been the Mad Scientist who took it, so he could have been converted. But yes, it seems more likely that it was the Good Scientist who did so.

Unvote Cartman

At least for now.

[Gonzo]

UNVOTE OLLIEGIRL
VOTE ANTMIESTER

I'm not sure I feel comfortable voting for someone over a mistake that wasn't their doing, now that Dodgerchick's been subbed out.

Antmiester doesn't seem willing to defend himself. Furthermore Chief Rum voted for him on day one, which is a known ploy for wolves to vote for each other on the first day, and then point back to it when under pressure. And apart from that post he just made, he hasn't done much this game either.

[DaddyTorgo]

schmidty...remember that alan saw someone (presumably the good scientist) visit cartman and take something that had dna on it. If cartman was evil we'd likely see the scientist making more of a push towards him. Although i'm not discounting that say...tangle might be the scientist and this is his way of pressing without revealing.

[Antmeister]

Gotta go with Barkeep49 again:

Vote Barkeep49

[Gonzo]

schmidty...remember that alan saw someone (presumably the good scientist) visit cartman and take something that had dna on it.

Problem is that it might just have easily been the Mad Scientist taking DNA to convert Cartman. I'm not saying that it's true, but I am saying that we shouldn't assume Cartman is 100% good.

[Antmeister]

UNVOTE OLLIEGIRL
VOTE ANTMIESTER

I'm not sure I feel comfortable voting for someone over a mistake that wasn't their doing, now that Dodgerchick's been subbed out.

Antmiester doesn't seem willing to defend himself. Furthermore Chief Rum voted for him on day one, which is a known ploy for wolves to vote for each other on the first day, and then point back to it when under pressure. And apart from that post he just made, he hasn't done much this game either.


That's interesting because I never voted for him. I was suspicious of him. And I guess you are purposely missing my long post above.

[Schmidty]

schmidty...remember that alan saw someone (presumably the good scientist) visit cartman and take something that had dna on it. If cartman was evil we'd likely see the scientist making more of a push towards him. Although i'm not discounting that say...tangle might be the scientist and this is his way of pressing without revealing.

I had to look back just now, but I realize that now. Because of that, and the fact that I'm just not sold on Antmeister:

Unvote cartman
Vote tanglewood

As per usual, subject to change, but I just think the push toward Ant is flimsy at best.

[DaddyTorgo]

not too much to go on tonight again

[DaddyTorgo]

that's an odd vote by ant that's for sure

[Antmeister]

not to be a jerk Ant, but you shouldn't post in the same color as the games GM

Didn't think about that, but I can't change it now.

[Gonzo]

That's interesting because I never voted for him. I was suspicious of him.

What I was saying is that he voted for you.

I don't understand people going after Barkeep, wasn't he the person who came up with the idea that Chief Rum was a wolf beacuse Alan T blacked out after following him?

[path12]

Might as well toss one of these together. My offhand observations of those still in the game (non-researched except as noted):

1. JHandley
2. path12 -- As usual, filled with wisdom, charm and good looks. :)
3. LoneStarGirl -- seems typical LSG
4. Antmeister -- first game, flip flops some (I think that's normal 1st game)
6. Telle -- quieter than last game.
7. DaddyTorgo -- looked back through all his posts, was suspicious, not so much now.
8. RendeR -- looked back through all his posts, was suspicious, not so much now.
9. Barkeep49 -- sure got quieter after Alan/Chief gone. Leaned good, but that's interesting.
10. cartman -- Alan saw X take something. Leaning good for now.
11. Schmidty -- Actually more vocal than usual. Might mean something.
15. KWhit -- I need to look at his posts more closely.
16. Gonzo -- BGG style? Gonzo, is that where you're from?
17. Neon Chaos -- villager vibe. Don't agree with weekend rush. Watching though.
18. Tanglewood -- day 2 vote stands out. Very helpful. Pinging my radar hard.
19. Dodgerchick - replaced by oliegirl day 4 -- no read at all.

FWIW. Which is likely nothing. :)

[path12]

Oops -- forgot to put something for JHandley. No read at all. I need to look at his posts.

[Gonzo]

16. Gonzo -- BGG style? Gonzo, is that where you're from?

erm...yes? :confused:

[tanglewood]

Trying to do a kind of 'Heat Factor' or something.

NAME - TIMES VOTED FOR - POSTS - POSTS/VOTES

<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cols="4" frame="void" rules="none"> <colgroup><col width="86"><col width="86"><col width="86"><col width="86"></colgroup> <tbody> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="33" width="86">Antmeister</td> <td sdval="10" sdnum="2057;" align="right" width="86">10</td> <td sdval="9" sdnum="2057;" align="right" width="86">9</td> <td sdval="0.9" sdnum="2057;" align="right" width="86">0.9</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Neon</td> <td sdval="12" sdnum="2057;" align="right">12</td> <td sdval="30" sdnum="2057;" align="right">30</td> <td sdval="2.5" sdnum="2057;" align="right">2.5</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">RendeR</td> <td sdval="11" sdnum="2057;" align="right">11</td> <td sdval="39" sdnum="2057;" align="right">39</td> <td sdval="3.54545454545455" sdnum="2057;" align="right">3.55</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Tangle</td> <td sdval="12" sdnum="2057;" align="right">12</td> <td sdval="60" sdnum="2057;" align="right">60</td> <td sdval="5" sdnum="2057;" align="right">5</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Chief Rum</td> <td sdval="10" sdnum="2057;" align="right">10</td> <td sdval="53" sdnum="2057;" align="right">53</td> <td sdval="5.3" sdnum="2057;" align="right">5.3</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">JE</td> <td sdval="6" sdnum="2057;" align="right">6</td> <td sdval="32" sdnum="2057;" align="right">32</td> <td sdval="5.33333333333333" sdnum="2057;" align="right">5.33</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Cartman</td> <td sdval="3" sdnum="2057;" align="right">3</td> <td sdval="24" sdnum="2057;" align="right">24</td> <td sdval="8" sdnum="2057;" align="right">8</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Barkeep</td> <td sdval="10" sdnum="2057;" align="right">10</td> <td sdval="99" sdnum="2057;" align="right">99</td> <td sdval="9.9" sdnum="2057;" align="right">9.9</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Alan T</td> <td sdval="8" sdnum="2057;" align="right">8</td> <td sdval="114" sdnum="2057;" align="right">114</td> <td sdval="14.25" sdnum="2057;" align="right">14.25</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Telle</td> <td sdval="2" sdnum="2057;" align="right">2</td> <td sdval="47" sdnum="2057;" align="right">47</td> <td sdval="23.5" sdnum="2057;" align="right">23.5</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">DC / OG</td> <td sdval="1" sdnum="2057;" align="right">1</td> <td sdval="24" sdnum="2057;" align="right">24</td> <td sdval="24" sdnum="2057;" align="right">24</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Gonzo</td> <td sdval="2" sdnum="2057;" align="right">2</td> <td sdval="48" sdnum="2057;" align="right">48</td> <td sdval="24" sdnum="2057;" align="right">24</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Lathum</td> <td sdval="1" sdnum="2057;" align="right">1</td> <td sdval="41" sdnum="2057;" align="right">41</td> <td sdval="41" sdnum="2057;" align="right">41</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Path12</td> <td sdval="1" sdnum="2057;" align="right">1</td> <td sdval="70" sdnum="2057;" align="right">70</td> <td sdval="70" sdnum="2057;" align="right">70</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">DaddyT</td> <td sdval="1" sdnum="2057;" align="right">1</td> <td sdval="71" sdnum="2057;" align="right">71</td> <td sdval="71" sdnum="2057;" align="right">71</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Jhandley</td> <td sdval="0" sdnum="2057;" align="right">0</td> <td sdval="59" sdnum="2057;" align="right">59</td> <td align="right">~</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">LSG</td> <td sdval="0" sdnum="2057;" align="right">0</td> <td sdval="62" sdnum="2057;" align="right">62</td> <td align="right">~</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Kwhit</td> <td sdval="0" sdnum="2057;" align="right">0</td> <td sdval="65" sdnum="2057;" align="right">65</td> <td align="right">~</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="18">Schmidty</td> <td sdval="0" sdnum="2057;" align="right">0</td> <td sdval="20" sdnum="2057;" align="right">20</td> <td align="right">~</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
Updated to Antmeister's vote for Barkeep

Well, at least it's amusing myself I guess...

[cartman]

So, how do the votes stack up, has anyone been keeping track. At one point, it looks like I was gonna be lynched running away, and now I think I don't have any votes. :)

Any guesses yet as to the X is who Alan saw take my hankie?

[path12]

erm...yes? :confused:

I meant, have you played most of your WW at BGG (BoardGameGeek). I played a ton there when I was crash course learning the game.

[Gonzo]

I meant, have you played most of your WW at BGG (BoardGameGeek). I played a ton there when I was crash course learning the game.

Nope, never been there.

[tanglewood]

So, how do the votes stack up, has anyone been keeping track. At one point, it looks like I was gonna be lynched running away, and now I think I don't have any votes. :)

Any guesses yet as to the X is who Alan saw take my hankie?

Currently it is Ant 7 / Gonzo 2 / Barkeep 1 / Tangle 1

The highest it got on you was Ant 6 / Car 3 / Gonzo 2, so I think it's exaggerating to say you were gonna be lynched running away. ;)

[Antmeister]

What I was saying is that he voted for you.

I don't understand people going after Barkeep, wasn't he the person who came up with the idea that Chief Rum was a wolf beacuse Alan T blacked out after following him?


Well Barkeep is also the person who wrote this:

Another vote or two for me and I'd switch to Neon out of self preservation. At this point, I am tempted to argue that Lathum's full throated agreement with Alan about Alan being good leads me to think that Lathum is more likely evil now, though I still think Alan is a threat to us down the road.

Lathum and Alan are gone now. He's was either bad at reading the situation or he was trying to set up people later on.

[Gonzo]

He's was either bad at reading the situation

Bingo.

Considering he effectively bagged us a wolf, I'm not sure lynching him for misreading Alan (something I did too) is the right way to go.

[Telle]

Here's what I've got:

7 - Antmeister - Neon Chaos, RendeR, JHandley, KWhit, cartman, Oliegirl, Gonzo
2 - Gonzo - LoneStarGirl, Telle
2 - Tanglewood - path12, Schmidty
1 - Barkeep49 - Antmeister

[Alan T]

I meant, have you played most of your WW at BGG (BoardGameGeek). I played a ton there when I was crash course learning the game.


I should take a crash course to learn this game there too..


err nvm, ignore me :)

[path12]

I should take a crash course to learn this game there too..


err nvm, ignore me :)

Ha. Whatever. Everyone aspires to be Alan T. :D

[path12]

Besides, you were the sole Survivor.

[path12]

Lathum and Alan are gone now. He's was either bad at reading the situation or he was trying to set up people later on.

I can understand why you're coming up with Barkeep, but I think that the fact he was instrumental in lynching CR gets him at least a day reprieve to be checked out.

[path12]

For the quad dola. I'm third in posts? I need to shut up.

[RendeR]

I'm going to give Antmeister the benefit of a doubt right now. His long post is pinging something in the back of my mind that i can't quite nail down.

UNVOTE ANTMEISTER

The other things thats got my senses tingling has been Gonzo. A relative unknown playing here for the first time, tossing out posts that at times seem almost...semi-concsious. Other people's logic has given me reason to trust a few players, my guts are screaming "wolf" for only one though. I wish I could put my finger on exactly why...

VOTE GONZO

[DaddyTorgo]

I dunno. Maybe I vote tangle I guess? he seems to have been high on everyone's list but is now slipping away, and that's often a place we discover a wolf...

[RendeR]

6 - Antmeister - Neon Chaos, JHandley, KWhit, cartman, Oliegirl, Gonzo
3 - Gonzo - LoneStarGirl, Telle, RendeR
2 - Tanglewood - path12, Schmidty
1 - Barkeep49 - Antmeister

[Gonzo]

The other things thats got my senses tingling has been Gonzo. A relative unknown playing here for the first time, tossing out posts that at times seem almost...semi-concsious.

Semi-concsious? What's that supposed to mean? You're voting for be because of my posting style?

[tanglewood]

I am considering voting Gonzo too. If only because I don't think Antmeister is a wolf and he seems the most likely candidate to overhaul him. I was going to say that if Ant was a wolf we'd likely see some attempt to move another candidate up alongside him, but with Render voting just now for Gonzo, I can hardly say that now as if I make it 7-4 then that's exactly what it looks like happening.

Vote Gonzo

Still going to do it though. :)

Another player I am going to go back and look at now is LoneStarGirl who has an interesting vote record also. I am also not 100% putting Cartman down as good. It could have been the Mad Scientist rather than the Good Scientist who saw him night 1, but I won't vote for him today nor tomorrow I imagine.

[Antmeister]

Still trying to mislead people? Please show me any place I could have voted that would have changed the outcome.

Looks like gonso is your wolf buddy too

Your logic is "I'm good, it would be stupid to lynch me"?

I feel that we should lynch you because you're likely turning into a werewolf, even if you're unaware of it.

I can understand why you're coming up with Barkeep, but I think that the fact he was instrumental in lynching CR gets him at least a day reprieve to be checked out.

No...I get that. I don't think he meant to throw that charge. I believe that was possibly a throw away vote that got out of hand and he got a wolf killed. Chief Rum was not really on anyone's radar at that time. I could be wrong, of course, but it is either him or LSG. And there just seems to be a lot of protecting for Barkeep by Cheif Rum. Also Gonzo has this bad habit of defending him, even harking back when AlanT was thinking Barkeep was wolfish. So he is another suspect, but not as strong as LSG and Barkeep.

[Gonzo]

I was going to say that if Ant was a wolf we'd likely see some attempt to move another candidate up alongside him


...

[Antmeister]

Hope I am right on this guy.

UNVOTE BARKEEP49
VOTE GONZO

[Gonzo]

Also Gonzo has this bad habit of defending him, even harking back when AlanT was thinking Barkeep was wolfish. So he is another suspect, but not as strong as LSG and Barkeep.

Yes. How dare I defend someone else who gave us Chief Rum. I'm obviously a wolf.

[RendeR]

Semi-concsious? What's that supposed to mean? You're voting for be because of my posting style?

Its not a style so much as a feeling of disjointedness every time you post. its like every time i read a post from you it gives me the feeling of a little kid trying to not get in trouble with mom n dad and being very careful of what they say.

Again, I'm just trying to feel out this instinct I have that tells me your more than you seem.

Like i said above, others have given logical reasons for others, I can't find logic in this, but if I were a cat my hackles would be up every time you post. I can't explain it.

[JHandley]

This game cracks me up. 8 frigging hours today of watching air and now in the last hour and a half, the board explodes with accusations.

Going to go back to get an up-to-date vote count.

[tanglewood]

This game cracks me up. 8 frigging hours today of watching air and now in the last hour and a half, the board explodes with accusations.

Going to go back to get an up-to-date vote count.

Ant 6 / Gon 4 / BK 1 / TW 1

[LoneStarGirl]

Might as well toss one of these together. My offhand observations of those still in the game (non-researched except as noted):


2. path12 -- As usual, filled with wisdom, charm and good looks. :)
:)

That is hilarious

[Antmeister]

Yes. How dare I defend someone else who gave us Chief Rum. I'm obviously a wolf.

....and you and Barkeep double team AlanT way before Chief Rum, which seemed odd. It's like you guys are a tag team.

[LoneStarGirl]

Well this day was slow compared to yesterday. I do not see a reason to change my vote, so it will stand as is. I need to take a shower and eat dinner and I will be on later... after lynch

[DaddyTorgo]

blah. I really don't have any idea of who to vote for at this point.

i'm not sold on gonzo, although he is pinging. Ditto with tangle, although he is being VERY helpful all of a sudden. Maybe too helpful?

sure...we'll go there

VOTE TANGLEWOOD

open to change and quite likely will change

[Gonzo]

....and you and Barkeep double team AlanT way before Chief Rum, which seemed odd. It's like you guys are a tag team.

Not really.

My reason for voting for Alan T early on was because I felt that the PM he revealed where he blacked out during the night was a kind of slow conversion process. Barkeep's reasoning was more to do with Alan's votes during the previous two days.

[path12]

No...I get that. I don't think he meant to throw that charge. I believe that was possibly a throw away vote that got out of hand and he got a wolf killed. Chief Rum was not really on anyone's radar at that time. I could be wrong, of course, but it is either him or LSG. And there just seems to be a lot of protecting for Barkeep by Cheif Rum. Also Gonzo has this bad habit of defending him, even harking back when AlanT was thinking Barkeep was wolfish. So he is another suspect, but not as strong as LSG and Barkeep.

Oh, I disagree with you there. I found the CR thing very strange when Alan revealed his PM. There were some comments from myself, BK and someone else I can't think of offhand about it. I know I was ready to jump that way. If he was a wolf he knew better than that.

[JHandley]

Ant 6 / Gon 4 / BK 1 / TW 1

Thank ya.

I'm not willing to move my vote and create another no lynch. I liked my reasons for Antmeister.

I checked with Cronin about it, and he told me that the information gained out of the "incident" can be used to form opinions. At some point we're going to have to deal with Oliegirl/DC. She clearly has a role, she clearly believed herself to be a wolf and she clearly believed Tangle, Gonzo and Neon to be wolves.

We know Chief was a wolf, so obviously her information was sketchy at best, but what role could she possibly have that doesn't make her a wolf?

[path12]

Thank ya.

I'm not willing to move my vote and create another no lynch. I liked my reasons for Antmeister.

I checked with Cronin about it, and he told me that the information gained out of the "incident" can be used to form opinions. At some point we're going to have to deal with Oliegirl/DC. She clearly has a role, she clearly believed herself to be a wolf and she clearly believed Tangle, Gonzo and Neon to be wolves.

We know Chief was a wolf, so obviously her information was sketchy at best, but what role could she possibly have that doesn't make her a wolf?

Why don't we have our wolf seer check her tonight? I'd think that would be a fairly obvious call.

[DaddyTorgo]

I don't think she necessarily had a role. I too had a PM that was sent to a group, and said something to the effect of "if you don't get another PM you're a villager," and yet as I PMed DC after, I almost did the same thing and thought I was a wolf.

[tanglewood]

Why don't we have our wolf seer check her tonight? I'd think that would be a fairly obvious call.

I don't think that she necessarily has a role. I wanted to post in the thread a recommendation for a seer to view her, but was disallowed by st.cronin. I guess now it's in the open it's ok for me to say that now.

[path12]

If I was one of our seers I'd likely go that way. But no biggie. I've got other avenues I'm just as interested in.

[Barkeep49]

Ok couple things:

First Alan didn't vicariously clear Cartman of being a wolf, only the scientist (as we're presuming our scientist tested him for that). So cartman is only slightly less likely to be evil than before.

Second, Ant: As soon as Alan gave the full information I made the right judgment call. Based off of the information we had at the time, I don't think my analysis on Alan was poor. It just was based off of incomplete information.

So I don't really like any of the lynch candidates today, quite frankly. I'm sort of at a loss about what to do. Leaning towards Tangle though.

[Neon_Chaos]

Thank ya.

I'm not willing to move my vote and create another no lynch. I liked my reasons for Antmeister.

I checked with Cronin about it, and he told me that the information gained out of the "incident" can be used to form opinions. At some point we're going to have to deal with Oliegirl/DC. She clearly has a role, she clearly believed herself to be a wolf and she clearly believed Tangle, Gonzo and Neon to be wolves.

We know Chief was a wolf, so obviously her information was sketchy at best, but what role could she possibly have that doesn't make her a wolf?

Just to say, I have ignored it as much as I could, and have put it in the back of my mind until cronin up and revealed it. Tangle, Gonzo and DC were the players I shared the initial PM with. I think DC "replied to all".

[path12]

I don't think she necessarily had a role. I too had a PM that was sent to a group, and said something to the effect of "if you don't get another PM you're a villager," and yet as I PMed DC after, I almost did the same thing and thought I was a wolf.

I got one of those too, BTW. More I think about it the more I think it's likely nothing.

[Gonzo]

More I think about it the more I think it's likely nothing.

Same here.

[path12]

Barkeep, now that you're in thread, I'm interested in your thoughts on KWhit. I'm going through all his posts right now, but as you know that's time consuming as hell.

[Barkeep49]

Frankly I think DC is very harsh on herself and very unforgiving. I really don't think the PM thing means anything.

[Barkeep49]

Barkeep, now that you're in thread, I'm interested in your thoughts on KWhit. I'm going through all his posts right now, but as you know that's time consuming as hell.
Don't have much of a feel for him frankly. There are lots of players at this point in the game who I don't have much of a feel for, but that's somewhat to be expected, I think, with 15 players alive.

[tanglewood]

Ditto with tangle, although he is being VERY helpful all of a sudden. Maybe too helpful?

Fwiw, the reason for all the chart posting etc. is because as it seemed certain with half an hour to or so to go that I was going down last night I asked st.cronin if it would be ok to upload my spreadsheet I have been tracking votes and making notes on instead of the traditional last few words speech as it would be quicker. He said it was ok, then when it turned out I survived I decided to start to post some of it up anyway. This is the second game I've played in where I've kept a spreadsheet and I find it helps collate thoughts and run through scenarios. Doesn't automatically turn me into a good player unfortunately.

[DaddyTorgo]

I like it tangle. It's very helpful

[Barkeep49]

While I don't really like or dislike either of them, I think tangle is less likely to be bad than Gonzo. If Gonzo has played in several games, I just don't think he'd be so skeptical about Alan's reveal.

Vote Gonzo

[KWhit]

Barkeep, now that you're in thread, I'm interested in your thoughts on KWhit.

He thinks I'm sexy and a tiger in the sack.

[path12]

Frankly I think DC is very harsh on herself and very unforgiving.

Agree completely. Hope she keeps playing.

[Gonzo]

If Gonzo has played in several games

I have?

[Schmidty]

Frankly, BK has used frankly twice in his last two posts. Is he telling us that he hasn't been frank so far? Frankly, I don't know.


;)

[tanglewood]

Barkeep, now that you're in thread, I'm interested in your thoughts on KWhit. I'm going through all his posts right now, but as you know that's time consuming as hell.

All of Kwhit's vote posts:

Just to keep things close...

VOTE TELLE

Early first day, Jonathan Ezarik was 3/1 ahead of Telle

I dunno if I'll be around later or not, so I'm going to switch my vote to tangle since he's been pretty absent from the thread (just one post so far). And he already has a vote on him, so it will keep the voting close, which is important on day 1, I believe.

UNVOTE TELLE
VOTE TANGLEWOOD

Day 2

I'm going to be in and out today, but just in case I can't get another vote out there:

VOTE NEON CHAOS

Since he didn't vote yesterday.

Was the first vote on Neon that day.

Day 3

The late votes last night don't make a whole lot of sense, and to me the most suspicious one was from RendeR.

For now, I'm voting for him:

VOTE RENDER

I know I'm tying it up with that, but there's still over an hour left.

I HUMBLY SUGGEST THAT PEOPLE DON'T WAIT UNTIL THE LAST MINUTE TO VOTE UNLESS YOU'RE A WOLF. IT'S JUST TOO RISKY WITH THE VOTE SO CLOSE AND WE NEED A LYNCH TONIGHT!

Tied up Alan T with Render at 4 each.

It's still early enough for me to tie it up with this:

UNVOTE RENDER
VOTE NEON CHAOS

Obviously, we need to not have a tie tonight, but I think NC is a better lynch tonight than AlanT.

Then tied it up Alan T with Neon Chaos at 4-4.

UNVOTE NEON CHAOS
VOTE CHIEF RUM

Was the fifth player to vote on Chief Rum to make it 5-4 vs me, but I had not moved onto Chief Rum yet.

Day 4

VOTE ANTMEISTER

After thinking this through, I think Ant is a better play than Gonzo or Render. I don't have a strong feeling of guilt from anyone else yet either, so for now my vote goes to Ant.

[JHandley]

Ant 6 / Gon 5 / BK 1 / TW 2

Is this right?

[path12]

He thinks I'm sexy and a tiger in the sack.

We knew that from the photos.

[Barkeep49]

I have?
Perhaps not here, but elsewhere.

[cartman]

Uh oh, we might be heading to another tie :(

[Gonzo]

Perhaps not here, but elsewhere.

Role reveals are discouraged on Paradox due to the crazy game mechanics we have.

[tanglewood]

I think it's a 6-6 tie between Antmeister and Gonzo at the moment.

[tanglewood]

If it gets near a tie I will unvote/switch votes to make sure we get a lynch.

[Neon_Chaos]

Time's ticking.

[Barkeep49]

Role reveals are discouraged on Paradox due to the crazy game mechanics we have.
Role reveals tend to be discouraged everywhere, I think.

[Gonzo]

If it gets near a tie I will unvote/switch votes to make sure we get a lynch.

So vote for Antmeister if you think it's a tie.

[Neon_Chaos]

So it's a 6-6 tie with Barkeep's being the tying vote?

Anyone have a correct estimate?

[tanglewood]

Players online right now:

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 11 (11 members and 0 guests)
tanglewood, Antmeister, cartman, Gonzo, JHandley, KWhit, Neon_Chaos, oliegirl, path12, Schmidty, Telle

[JHandley]

is it 6-5 or 6-6?<br>

[Antmeister]

If it gets near a tie I will unvote/switch votes to make sure we get a lynch.

And you would be killing a villager.

[st.cronin]

Is this right:

Vote count:

6 - Antmeister - Neon_Chaos (910), JHandley (973), KWhit (976), cartman (977), oliegirl (978), Gonzo (1004)
6 - Gonzo - LoneStarGirl (951), Telle (971), RendeR (1030), tanglewood (1034), Antmeister (1037), Barkeep49 (1062)
3 - tanglewood - path12 (981), Schmidty (1009), DaddyTorgo (1045)

[JHandley]

If tangle is going to switch, I'm going to stay. I don't know where
this contempt for Gonzo was all day, but it seems mightly late in the
day for a second canidate to arise.<br>

[Gonzo]

And you would be killing a villager.

Well if I get lynched you would kill a villager as well.

But both would be preferable to a no-lynch at this stage.

[Barkeep49]

Ant, vote to save yourself.

[KWhit]

I'm afraid about 4 people are all about to switch their vote and we'll still end up in a tie.

[tanglewood]

It is 6-6.

And ant it would be better to kill a villager than a tie. Another tie and we are dead in the water IMHO.

[path12]

UNVOTE TANGLEWOOD
VOTE ANTMEISTER

Sorry Ant, gotta have a lynch.

[tanglewood]

Ok.

Unvote Gonzo

Still watching.

[Barkeep49]

For future reference here's who is around: Barkeep49, Alan T, Antmeister, cartman, Gonzo, JHandley, KWhit, Lathum, Neon_Chaos, oliegirl, path12, Schmidty, tanglewood, Telle

[tanglewood]

7-5 to Ant now.

[Barkeep49]

So it's going to be Ant by a two vote margin.

[Barkeep49]

Ok that should be deadline.

[Gonzo]

That was a close run thing.

[tanglewood]

Sorry, Ant, I'd have rather lynched Gonzo but KWhit, JHandley, Neon Chaos, Cartman and Olliegirl wouldn't switch.

[path12]

Never mind oliegirl for now -- someone scan Gonzo tonight.

[Antmeister]

Ok that should be deadline.

I already voted for Gonzo.

[JHandley]

I'm not opposed to voting Gonzo tomorrow. I just couldn't switch and take the chance of a tie.<br>

[st.cronin]

deadline

[Gonzo]

Never mind oliegirl for now -- someone scan Gonzo tonight.

Please!

[cartman]

Never mind oliegirl for now -- someone scan Gonzo tonight.

+1

[Antmeister]

Nice of me to quote the wrong post. Great, I am a dead villager. Good luck to you guys as you put this noose around my neck.

[st.cronin]

I have this as the final vote:

Vote count:

7 - Antmeister - Neon_Chaos (910), JHandley (973), KWhit (976), cartman (977), oliegirl (978), Gonzo (1004), path12 (1088)
5 - Gonzo - LoneStarGirl (951), Telle (971), RendeR (1030), Antmeister (1037), Barkeep49 (1062)
2 - tanglewood - Schmidty (1009), DaddyTorgo (1045)

no vote - tanglewood

[st.cronin]

The result of today's discussion is, Antmeister is lynched. Unfortunately, he turns out to be a human. But could he have been the mad scientist?

[Antmeister]

Gurgle....gurgle.....need air! The noose is too tight!

[Antmeister]

This villager is going to haunt your asses until you find those damn wolves!

[cartman]

Damn

[Schmidty]

I had a bad feeling about that lynch from the beginning.

[tanglewood]

The result of today's discussion is, Antmeister is lynched. Unfortunately, he turns out to be a human. But could he have been the mad scientist?

I presume that you just forgot to mention the fact the previously when humans died they could be mad scientists, and the noting of this possibility now is not significant?

[DaddyTorgo]

is that a hint that he was the mad scientist? that wouldn't be a bad kill, hmm?

[tanglewood]

I had a bad feeling about that lynch from the beginning.

So why not vote for Gonzo then? Or suggest other candidates?

[Neon_Chaos]

I'm not disappointed with the result. Ant wasn't as vocal about his innocence as I would have expected him to have been, nor was he adamant about keeping himself alive.

[Telle]

I presume that you just forgot to mention the fact the previously when humans died they could be mad scientists, and the noting of this possibility now is not significant?

He's the only human we've lynched so far.

[st.cronin]

I presume that you just forgot to mention the fact the previously when humans died they could be mad scientists, and the noting of this possibility now is not significant?

Per the rules, the mad scientist will show as human when lynched. Ant was the first non-wolf lynched, it was just a reminder is all.

[tanglewood]

He's the only human we've lynched so far.

Yes, but the wolves could presumably have accidentaly hit the mad scientist. Assuming that they have no PM contact between each other.

[Gonzo]

So why not vote for Gonzo then? Or suggest other candidates?

It's Schmidty. He hasn't done anything as far as I can remember.

[st.cronin]

pms sent

Barkeep49 has been killed!

day 5 has begun, deadline Tuesday 10pm Eastern Time

[path12]

OK, finished my recap of KWhit through post 976:

15 -- ordinary student here
16 -- meaningless
64 -- meaningless
65 -- notes unlisted roles may be in game
85 -- we do? (response to JE statement 2nd vote day 1 is wolf)
99 -- VOTE TELLE just to keep things close
108 -- assuming Mad Sci = conversion. asks for other takes.
113 -- further on subject notes 'working on army of lycanthropes' from rules
121 -- (response Render) need to lynch esp if conversions in game. day 1 might help down road.
123 -- notes VanH may ID wolf per rules
127 -- can see both lynch and no lynch sides. no idea which makes more sense.
129 -- questions BK's math
132 -- (re lynch ?) you can make that argument every night. better day 2? day 3?
134 -- clarify 132. Dont feel strongly abt lynch either way, but if not today day 2 just as random.
136 -- vote recap
140 -- no lynch gives wolves extra day to do their stuff
144 -- agrees day 1 on absent people best
147 -- questions LSG vote count
152 -- vote recap
156 -- possible Mad Sci is conversion re BK math. (very interested in Mad Sci/VH?)
159 -- likes to vote early d1, but often change it.
160 -- meaningless
168 -- (resp BK) game w/conversion favors lynch
169 -- no lynch benefits wolves
171 -- out for awhile. Unvote TELLE VOTE TANGLE (has vote on and absent)
174 -- vote recap
175 -- meaningless
205 -- argues lynch vs no lynch
213 -- doesn't look like lynch tonight. perfect place for wolf to hide vote.
221 -- meaningless
319 -- suggests alan may be on way to conversion? quotes Mad Sci role again, bolds lycanthrope part.
341 -- don't know whether to vote Alan. keep eye on him for sure. could be other possibilities to explain PM
344 -- in and out today. VOTE NEON. reason: absent.
345 -- agrees w/lathum about waiting day on alan.
534 -- (resp Alan) says there are valid reasons to vote for alan. 'lot of blame to go around but you're not immune' sucks about two no lynches in row.
558 -- don't know what to think about alan, inclined to think villager. makes sense to wait and see on him.
585 -- most suspic vote last night was from Render. VOTE RENDER. caps: everyone should vote early!!!! no ties!!
588 -- vote recap
600 -- correct BK vote count
601 -- might switch to neon, but only if others do to prevent tie
602 -- vote recap
608 -- vote recap
610 -- 'early enough to tie it up with this'. UNV RENDER, VOTE NEON. better lynch than alan.
614 -- vote recap
624 -- (resp path) alan brought too much heat on self to be wolf imo. could be hiding in plain sight but doubt it.
630 -- out
726 -- we should spare alan tonight. if wolf, he'll be left alive, if VH, wolves will go after. have to give benefit of doubt.
737 -- response to alan re bodyguard.
740 -- asks for vote count
742 -- another clusterfuck in making with wild vote switches.
769 -- UNVOTE NEON, VOTE CHIEF RUM
773 -- hopes vote got off the tie
781 -- asks DT for clarification of his vote count
826 -- good job!
838 -- resp to gonzo re celebration joke
889 -- resp to DT re misunderstanding
891 -- meaningless
916 -- thx Neon for CR analysis. Inclined to look at Ant, belive better choice than Render b/c CR was pushing R.
925 -- CR made mult posts about R & Tangle when had no heat. believes that helps R and Tangle. looking elsewhere today.
931 -- quotes CR view on Tangle. believes it's worth holding off on tangle for that reason
968 -- quotes Ants posts. unsure conclusion.
976 -- VOTE ANT. after thinking through, better play than gonzo or render. no strong feeling abt anyone else.

Other than that interesting obsession about Van Helsing for awhile, I don't think there's much to hold against him there.

[Schmidty]

So why not vote for Gonzo then? Or suggest other candidates?

I came in after having missed the whole day. I didn't think Ant was bad, as I said numerous times, although it was a gut feeling. I voted for you because of the whole cartman thing, although it wasn't really a rock-solid vote. I honestly have no idea what to think now.

Give me a reason to vote for Gonzo, and I will. Yes, he's a bit.......crusty (?), but I don't know if he's bad. Maybe he is.

I really suck at this game.

[Telle]

Well.. guess my suspicions of Barkeep were unfounded then.

[Barkeep49]

Well.. guess my suspicions of Barkeep were unfounded then.
Yeah. But I'm guessing Ant might still think I'm guilty :)

[Telle]

Yes, but the wolves could presumably have accidentaly hit the mad scientist. Assuming that they have no PM contact between each other.

Has there ever been a WW game where not all of the bad guys knew who each other were? Although I guess technically in WW anything goes.. so even if something's unprecedented it doesn't mean it's impossible.

[DaddyTorgo]

dammit! bye barkeep...we'll soldier on.

[path12]

Has there ever been a WW game where not all of the bad guys knew who each other were? Although I guess technically in WW anything goes.. so even if something's unprecedented it doesn't mean it's impossible.

I've seen that before, but not here. Based on cronin's love of simple games, I doubt that's the case with this game. If I was running such a game, that would be a point I'd make clear at the beginning.

[path12]

It's Schmidty. He hasn't done anything as far as I can remember.

Not that I have any opinion about Schmidty's guilt or innocence (he's actually one of my suspects right now), you should know that he is famous for being one of the quieter players around. And don't be fooled by his protestations of ineptitude.

[tanglewood]

A lot of green on the board now, which isn't all that helpful. I think it is clear that on Day 1 the wolves didn't have to force anything, all the candidates were good guys and with the No Lynch thing going on too they probably just sat back and let everything happen.

Day 2 looks intersting now, with an innocent Barkeep being run up on to 'save' Neon Chaos.

<table style="width: 515px; height: 656px;" border="0" cellspacing="0" cols="5" frame="void" rules="none"> <colgroup><col width="129"><col width="128"><col width="103"><col width="101"><col width="101"></colgroup> <tbody> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="center" bgcolor="#000000" height="20" width="129">Player</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="center" bgcolor="#000000" width="128">Day 1</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="center" bgcolor="#000000" width="103">Day 2</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="center" bgcolor="#000000" width="101">Day 3</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="center" bgcolor="#000000" width="101">Day 4</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Jhandley</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Path12</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Render</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">LoneStarGirl</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Gonzo</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Antmeister</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Gonzo</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Lathum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Telle</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Gonzo</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">DaddyTorgo</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">RendeR</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Gonzo</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Barkeep49</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Gonzo</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Cartman</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Schmidty</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Path12</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Alan T</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000" height="20">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#000000">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Kwhit</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Gonzo</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#b3b3b3">No Lynch</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="center" bgcolor="#000000">X</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left">DaddyTorgo</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00" height="20">Tanglewood</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="center" bgcolor="#000000">X</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="border-style: solid; border-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); border-width: 1px 5px 1px 1px;" align="left" height="20">DC / OG</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Jonathan Ezarik</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Lathum</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(0, 0, 0);" align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>

[KWhit]

Thank ya.

I'm not willing to move my vote and create another no lynch. I liked my reasons for Antmeister.

I checked with Cronin about it, and he told me that the information gained out of the "incident" can be used to form opinions. At some point we're going to have to deal with Oliegirl/DC. She clearly has a role, she clearly believed herself to be a wolf and she clearly believed Tangle, Gonzo and Neon to be wolves.

We know Chief was a wolf, so obviously her information was sketchy at best, but what role could she possibly have that doesn't make her a wolf?

I've been thinking about this and from reading st.cronin's post about the incident, the only real conclusion I can come to is that she is a wolf. I don't know how much or little we should be using that info, but it really seems to me to be the most logical explanation.

DC thinks she's a wolf becasue she is a wolf, and then when she sees a mass PM from st.cronin, she replies to all of them thinking st.c was sending a note out to all the wolves.

I hate the situation, but I don't think we can ignore it at this point in time.

[path12]

Tangle, I know that you say you're good, but that chart becomes more helpful if you leave your name blank since we don't know one way or the other.

[DaddyTorgo]

interesting supposition kwhit. It's as good as anything else we have going right now...

[Gonzo]

I've been thinking about this and from reading st.cronin's post about the incident, the only real conclusion I can come to is that she is a wolf. I don't know how much or little we should be using that info, but it really seems to me to be the most logical explanation.

DC thinks she's a wolf becasue she is a wolf, and then when she sees a mass PM from st.cronin, she replies to all of them thinking st.c was sending a note out to all the wolves.

I hate the situation, but I don't think we can ignore it at this point in time.


I agree.

Logically, Dodgerchick wouldn't have been so upset if she wasn't a wolf.

[tanglewood]

For reference again, here was the day two voting:

<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cols="4" frame="void" rules="none"> <colgroup><col width="92"><col width="180"><col width="135"><col width="311"></colgroup> <tbody> <tr> <td sdval="282" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18" width="92">282</td> <td align="left" width="180">Path12</td> <td align="left" width="135">Render</td> <td align="left" width="311">Ren 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="318" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">318</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">DaddyTorgo</td> <td align="left">Ren 1 / DT 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="320" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">320</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">Ren 1 / DT 1 / NC 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="326" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">326</td> <td align="left">Dodgerchick</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Lathum</td> <td align="left">Ren 1 / DT 1 / NC 1 / Lath 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="328" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">328</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td align="left">Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / AT 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="344" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="17">344</td> <td align="left">Kwhit</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / AT 1 / NC 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="348" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="17">348</td> <td align="left">Render</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / AT 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="349" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">349</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Lathum</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">NC 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / AT 1 / BK 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="356" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">356</td> <td align="left">Gonzo</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td align="left">NC 2 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / BK 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="388" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">388</td> <td align="left">Jhandley</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 3 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / BK 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="393" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="17">393</td> <td align="left">Schmidty</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 4 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / BK 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="395" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">395</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#ff0000">Chief Rum</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> <td align="left">NC 4 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / BK 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="397" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">397</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Antmeister</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">NC 4 / AT 2 / BK 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="402" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">402</td> <td align="left">Cartman</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 5 / AT 2 / BK 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="405" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">405</td> <td align="left">DaddyTorgo</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">NC 5 / BK 3 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="417" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">417</td> <td align="left">Telle</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">NC 5 / BK 4 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="419" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">419</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 6 / BK 4 / AT 1 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="421" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">421</td> <td align="left">Render</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">NC 5 / BK 5 / AT 1 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="423" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">423</td> <td align="left">LoneStarGirl</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Barkeep</td> <td align="left">BK 6 / NC 5 / AT 1 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="424" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">424</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td align="left">Neon Chaos</td> <td align="left">NC 6 / BK 6 / AT 1 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> <tr> <td sdval="426" sdnum="2057;" align="right" bgcolor="#999999" height="18">426</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Tanglewood</td> <td align="left" bgcolor="#00ff00">Alan T</td> <td align="left">NC 6 / BK 6 / AT 2 / Ren 1 / DT 1 / Lath 1 / Ant 1</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>

[path12]

I've been thinking about this and from reading st.cronin's post about the incident, the only real conclusion I can come to is that she is a wolf. I don't know how much or little we should be using that info, but it really seems to me to be the most logical explanation.

DC thinks she's a wolf becasue she is a wolf, and then when she sees a mass PM from st.cronin, she replies to all of them thinking st.c was sending a note out to all the wolves.

I hate the situation, but I don't think we can ignore it at this point in time.

Here's the thing with that, and it may just be ignorance on my part -- but I don't think there is a 'reply to all' option on PM's. When I have had to send a PM to multiple people, I've had to enter them all individually (which is kind of a pain in the ass at times).

So if she was a wolf, she had to respond individually right? Or am I just stupid about how to reply to all?

[tanglewood]

Tangle, I know that you say you're good, but that chart becomes more helpful if you leave your name blank since we don't know one way or the other.

Ok from now on I'll leave myself blank in charts and things.

[KWhit]

Here's the thing with that, and it may just be ignorance on my part -- but I don't think there is a 'reply to all' option on PM's. When I have had to send a PM to multiple people, I've had to enter them all individually (which is kind of a pain in the ass at times).

So if she was a wolf, she had to respond individually right? Or am I just stupid about how to reply to all?

You may be right, but that was the whole story of the incident, right? That she sent the PM to people she shouldn't have. The fact that she may have had to type them all in doesn't really matter, I don't think. Either way, it seems to me that she is likely a wolf.

[tanglewood]

Here's the thing with that, and it may just be ignorance on my part -- but I don't think there is a 'reply to all' option on PM's. When I have had to send a PM to multiple people, I've had to enter them all individually (which is kind of a pain in the ass at times).

So if she was a wolf, she had to respond individually right? Or am I just stupid about how to reply to all?

Just tried it out and yes, you would have to enter each name in manually.

I don't really think that DC/Olliegirl is a wolf. IMHO, after making such a mistake DC wouldn't have left the game if she was a wolf and still had an important role to play.

I hate that we are meta-gaming on this, but well...

[path12]

You may be right, but that was the whole story of the incident, right? That she sent the PM to people she shouldn't have. The fact that she may have had to type them all in doesn't really matter, I don't think. Either way, it seems to me that she is likely a wolf.

But if you were a wolf, you've likely already talked to your fellow wolves at least once, right? So you'd know that the names you typed weren't the people you talked to before, I would think.

[JHandley]

Isn't a very clear rule that the wolves can converse but the villagers aren't allowed to at all? Tell me you guys haven't all been talking, though, that might explain why I'm still very much in the dark here ;)

[Gonzo]

I don't really think that DC/Olliegirl is a wolf. IMHO, after making such a mistake DC wouldn't have left the game if she was a wolf and still had an important role to play.

But then again, why would she be so upset if she was a villager? Surely it'd be more of a deal if you were a wolf and PM'ed random people saying you're a wolf.

[JHandley]

I hate that we are meta-gaming on this, but well...

I don't like it either, which is why I brought it up to Cronin. I'm not a person that can put the toothpaste back in the tube. The information is out there, I can't pretend I don't know it.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[oliegirl]

DC wasn't a wolf, and neither am I...scan me tonight if it's not too late - I promise you I'm not a wolf.

[KWhit]

Isn't a very clear rule that the wolves can converse but the villagers aren't allowed to at all? Tell me you guys haven't all been talking, though, that might explain why I'm still very much in the dark here ;)

Hmm... That's a good point. Makes her look even more wolfish.

Maybe she just cut and pasted the names in and replied.

[Gonzo]

VOTE OLIEGIRL


I'm going to have to as well.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[KWhit]

I don't like it either, which is why I brought it up to Cronin. I'm not a person that can put the toothpaste back in the tube. The information is out there, I can't pretend I don't know it.

My feelings too. I don't like it, but can't help it. It would be silly to think she's a wolf and then make yourself vote elsewhere.

[path12]

DC wasn't a wolf, and neither am I...scan me tonight if it's not too late - I promise you I'm not a wolf.

Cronin said all pm's had been sent, so if you were going to be scanned you already were.

[KWhit]

We have a TON of time until lynch, but for the reasons I laid out above:

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[path12]

Gonna wait and see if one of our seers found anything before I do anything. Out for now.

[JHandley]

Really can't think of a reason to wait, I can still switch if something comes out.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[Schmidty]

The Oliegirl vote seems really bandwagony so far....kind of like the Ant vote.

[Gonzo]

The Oliegirl vote seems really bandwagony so far....kind of like the Ant vote.

Strong evidence against her, though.

[Neon_Chaos]

I really thought that in light of the misfired PM by DC, st.cronin should have just removed her from the game to avoid any confusion.

As it is, we are indeed metagaming a bit, and I feel bad having to vote via metagaming. Anyway, it has to be done, seeing KWhit's analysis of the logic of DC's message... and the fact that there isn't a "reply to all" button.

VOTE OLLIEGIRL

[DaddyTorgo]

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

[Schmidty]

Strong evidence against her, though.

Yeah, but I am always scaed of the "obvious" choice. No where else to go right now, I guess.

Vote Oliegirl

[Neon_Chaos]

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

Then that would be meta-GM'ing. I doubt that wolf roles would be shuffled midway through the game.

[Telle]

From how things happened, I have to think the Oliegirl is either a wolf or a special character. If it's the latter, I strongly suggest she speak up and be prepared to offer some amount of evidence. Otherwise, it would probably be prudent to lynch her as a "just in case" measure.

[KWhit]

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

Yeah, but I think that would really screw up the game - all prior analysis, voting patterns, etc. would be thrown out the window.

And who knows? We may be wrong and there's another explanation, but at this point it is by far the best choice for lynch tonight, IMO (unless we get some new info during the day today).

[KWhit]

From how things happened, I have to think the Oliegirl is either a wolf or a special character. If it's the latter, I strongly suggest she speak up and be prepared to offer some amount of evidence. Otherwise, it would probably be prudent to lynch her as a "just in case" measure.

True. It's entirely possible she's the mad scientist. That might make things really confusing if we lynch her and she turns out to be human, but cest la vie.

[cartman]

I'm still trying to figure out who stole my hanky.

[cartman]

Dola

Or if it was even stolen at all.

[Alan T]

This thread is almost as dead as I am today!

[JHandley]

Wait till 20 minutes to deadline.

[oliegirl]

There isnt' much I can say to defend myself because I've only been in the game for 24 hours...I realize DC was here, but I swear I'm not a wolf...wouldn't it make more sense to scan me tonight? I went with my gut based on what I had read through the whole thread yesterday, and obviously I was wrong but so were a bunch of other people. And it doesn't seem right to lynch me based on things that DC said or did because I'm not her. If I didn't think it would get me kicked out of the game I'm cut and paste the PM that I received asking me to be a replacement and describing my role - which is just villager/normal person - nothing special. I'm not a wolf and I'm not the mad scientist.

[JHandley]

I'm the rookie here, so I gotta ask. How has something like this been handled in the past?

Like I said before, I don't like it, I'm morally against any kind of outside interference affecting a game. But, we can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. It comes down to this for me. Is there any situation where a player is allowed PM contact with other players when they aren't a wolf?

[Gonzo]

I realize DC was here, but I swear I'm not a wolf...wouldn't it make more sense to scan me tonight?

How do you know you haven't already been scanned? If people were asking for you to be scanned yesterday I feel its quite likely you have.

[oliegirl]

How do you know you haven't already been scanned? If people were asking for you to be scanned yesterday I feel its quite likely you have.

Because at 10:42 I posted and said to go ahead and scan me b/c I'm not a wolf, but the PM's had already been sent out. Plus, and most importantly, if I had been scanned then the scanner would know I'm not a wolf.

[JHandley]

Because at 10:42 I posted and said to go ahead and scan me b/c I'm not a wolf, but the PM's had already been sent out. Plus, and most importantly, if I had been scanned then the scanner would know I'm not a wolf.

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

[Telle]

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

Agreed. Maybe you're a villager, maybe you're not. But unless you're a special character, we're better off lynching you now than leaving this whole thing lingering.. and even if you have been scanned it's not worth a seer outing himself to save a plain villager at this point in the game.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[oliegirl]

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.


True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

[path12]

But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

It does if they find a wolf. If a seer has found a wolf, I would expect them to let us know.

[DaddyTorgo]

True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

interesting point

[hoopsguy]

<TABLE class=tborder cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=tcat colSpan=2>Who Posted? Total Posts: 1,170
</TD></TR><TR><TD class=thead width="100%">User Name</TD><TD class=thead>Posts</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>Alan T (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2498) - dead for 1.5 days</TD><TD class=alt1>116</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Barkeep49 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=696) - dead for 0.5 days</TD><TD class=alt2>110</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>path12 (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2700) </TD><TD class=alt1>95</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>DaddyTorgo (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2341) </TD><TD class=alt2>83</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>tanglewood (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3819) </TD><TD class=alt1>81</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>KWhit (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=2592) </TD><TD class=alt2>74</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>JHandley (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1467) </TD><TD class=alt1>71</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Gonzo (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=5665) </TD><TD class=alt2>70</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>LoneStarGirl (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4036) </TD><TD class=alt1>64</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Chief Rum (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=52) </TD><TD class=alt2>53</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>Telle (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3366) </TD><TD class=alt1>53</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>RendeR (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1418) </TD><TD class=alt2>42</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>st.cronin (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3818) </TD><TD class=alt1>42</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Lathum (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=1697) </TD><TD class=alt2>41</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>Neon_Chaos (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3848) </TD><TD class=alt1>36</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Jonathan Ezarik (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4202) </TD><TD class=alt2>32</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>cartman (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=485) </TD><TD class=alt1>30</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Schmidty (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=956) </TD><TD class=alt2>26</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>Antmeister (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3265) </TD><TD class=alt1>20</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>Dodgerchick (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3522) </TD><TD class=alt2>20</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>oliegirl (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=3057) </TD><TD class=alt1>8</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt2>hoopsguy (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=253) </TD><TD class=alt2>2</TD></TR><TR><TD class=alt1>bulletsponge (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/member.php?u=4474) </TD><TD class=alt1>1</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Cronin, can you bring back the dead guys? I'm getting bored following this during the day.

K thx.

[KWhit]

I agree that it is very very quiet.

Too quiet.

[oliegirl]

I probably won't be on tonight, I have plans, but I'll try to check in if I can on my phone. But please reconsider and look at Schmidty and Neon Chaos...I have hunches about both of them. They both posted to vote for me and basically admitted they had no reason to but since everyone else was they would just join in. Yes, we have "bandwagon votes" in day 1 and 2 sometimes, but come on...at this point you should have a damn good reason for voting for someone. If they REALLY thought I was a wolf it seems that they would have come out with posts from DC that incriminate her, something more than the PM fiasco, but that is all they have. That is all anyone who has voted for me today has.

I've been saying it all day, I'm not a wolf.

[RendeR]

I probably won't be on tonight, I have plans, but I'll try to check in if I can on my phone. But please reconsider and look at Schmidty and Neon Chaos...I have hunches about both of them. They both posted to vote for me and basically admitted they had no reason to but since everyone else was they would just join in. Yes, we have "bandwagon votes" in day 1 and 2 sometimes, but come on...at this point you should have a damn good reason for voting for someone. If they REALLY thought I was a wolf it seems that they would have come out with posts from DC that incriminate her, something more than the PM fiasco, but that is all they have. That is all anyone who has voted for me today has.

I've been saying it all day, I'm not a wolf.

Thats just it, based on the way things have gone down in this game we DON'T have a clue about anyone at this point. After 2 no lynches, one lynched wolf and one lynched human, all the night kills have eliminated the real suspects already. We're basically sitting on a day 1 again with no real knowledge to go on.

[oliegirl]

I was reading back to what KWhit said when he pointed the finger at me last night and something dawned on me. IF DC was a wolf, then when she dropped out and St. Cronin came to me - wouldnt' he have switched some roles around, knowing that the "incident" made it look like DC was a wolf?

Maybe there is something going on with DC and Ant...DC said she wasn't that into the game, and Ant was very quiet until he was lynched last night...maybe they have something going on and that is why DC just said forget it when the whole incident happened...

I've given you 2 names to be suspicious of, Schmidty and Neon Chaos. Go back through the posts and look into them, I'm telling you one of them is a wolf.

[RendeR]

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

[Schmidty]

True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

As I've said numerous times, I freaking work graveyard shift, and I'm on PST. I woke up today at 1 p.m. PST and had to take my daughter to the doctor.

I have nothing to defend myself for, and nothing to say. If you want to kill me for nothing, go for it. I'm a villager.

[Schmidty]

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.


VOTE SCHMIDTY

I agree with your statement, but I have no idea why you would vote for me either. I'd like to see some good reasons other than "He's quiet and not around" (which I've explained), so I can at least defend myself from something.

[Schmidty]

Double Dola.

I'm going to mow the lawn right now, but I'll leave myself in the thread, and check back in when I'm done (like an hour).

[KWhit]

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

I agree that it stinks. I don't like it at all.

But I don't think cronin moved roles around without telling us he did something like that because it would change the whole game. Past voting records and posts would be shot all to hell. It would kill any analysis that we would try to do.

Maybe I'm wrong, but logically, OG has the higher likelyhood of being a wolf right now than anyone else. She is the best choice for the reasons I laid out. I could totally be wrong, but I feel confident that absent any other strong evidence, the best choice for lynch tonight is Oliegirl.

[oliegirl]

I agree that it stinks. I don't like it at all.

But I don't think cronin moved roles around without telling us he did something like that because it would change the whole game. Past voting records and posts would be shot all to hell. It would kill any analysis that we would try to do.

Maybe I'm wrong, but logically, OG has the higher likelyhood of being a wolf right now than anyone else. She is the best choice for the reasons I laid out. I could totally be wrong, but I feel confident that absent any other strong evidence, the best choice for lynch tonight is Oliegirl.

But isn't that exactly where you guys say you are - basically on day 1 without a read on anyone???? You are proving your own point! Maybe you don't have a read on anyone b/c cronin pulled a fast one...maybe this is all part of some grand scheme he came up with - it is werewolf after all. All eyes have been on me today and no one has taken the time to look at anyone else, yet every time I make a post defending myself someone says "yeah, you are right". How is that a good strategy?

I'm telling you again, I'm not a wolf!

[path12]

Been swamped today. Main thing that bothers me on the OG vote is that nobody has come out to defend much at all today.

[JHandley]

I need something more than her word for it to make me switch my vote. If I recall, Chief Rum told us he was a villager, too. There's nothing about this that isn't shitty. But every single one of us will adamantly claim to be a villager right up until the noose is tightened.

[path12]

Dola, out again. Back before deadline.

[JHandley]

Just to reiterate. If someone can explain to me a logical, reasonable and legal reason for one of us to message other players, I'd love to hear it.

[KWhit]

Just to reiterate. If someone can explain to me a logical, reasonable and legal reason for one of us to message other players, I'd love to hear it.

In a simple game like this, it is very rare for there to be a rule that allows a villager to PM any else in the game.

Occasionally, there are two people whose role is called The Brothers or somesuch like that and they are able to pm each other. But those roles are pretty seldomly included and really never allow you to PM more than just one other specific person.

[tanglewood]

I don't think Olliegirl is a wolf:

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

2) If Dodgerchick had received a PM saying she was a wolf, that would list who her fellow wolves were. To me this makes it highly unlikely that she would then enter 3 names from a different PM, by typing or copying as you cannot reply to all, and send it assuming this PM was being sent to her fellow wolves.

Two players I would like to look at today:

1) Neon Chaos on day two was at one point 5-2 in the lead with an hour to go to deadline. Of the final seven votes, five were for Barkeep, one for him and one for Alan T. Barkeep we know now was human. Were the wolves mobilising to save one of their own? It has to be considered seriously. Also consider that at the time Barkeep was attacking Alan T who had unwittingly at the time presented to the village the wolf Chief Rum. If Barkeep was lynched and turned human more credence could have been placed on his criticism of Alan T and help get him lynched, thus possibly saving Chief Rum.

2) If we consider Neon Chaos as fishy, then we must look at Render, who was prominently involved in the day two vote, switching from Neon Chaos to Barkeep late on to tie. He also voted for me on day three late on before being the last player to switch to an already doomed Chief Rum.

[DaddyTorgo]

dinner and then i'll be back to post

[path12]

Looks like it's gonna be Oliegirl, which although I'm not convinced I absolutely see the logic on the lynch. However, I think we need to focus on voting records tomorrow.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

Sorry Olie, you just stepped into a tough spot. :(

Well, unless you're really a wolf, in which you still stepped into a tough spot ;)

[DaddyTorgo]

I like the idea of render...we were all hot n bothered about him for a while and then kind of dropped it.

and schmidty seems overly defensive in his post about graveyard shift and all.

Either way tangle, I see your point about DC/OG

UNVOTE OLLIEGIRL

[tanglewood]

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

If Cronin swapped the roles around either when DC quit, or after it came out or after the PM or at any time after the game started, I will never play another WW game moderated by him again. Which is why I am 100% confident that he didn't do something so idiotic.

[tanglewood]

Looks like it's gonna be Oliegirl, which although I'm not convinced I absolutely see the logic on the lynch. However, I think we need to focus on voting records tomorrow.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

Sorry Olie, you just stepped into a tough spot. :(

Well, unless you're really a wolf, in which you still stepped into a tough spot ;)

No offence, but voting for someone because "it looks like they'll be lynched anyway" is the stupidest reason possible. You would be better of abstaining.

[Gonzo]

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

That doesn't make much sense. If she was a wolf, surely it'd be a big deal that she accidentally PMed random people saying that she was? I can't see her PMing people telling them she was a wolf if she didn't recieve a PM saying she was a wolf in the first place.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE RENDER

[LoneStarGirl]

Been swamped today. Main thing that bothers me on the OG vote is that nobody has come out to defend much at all today.

Path you have been very under the radar this game, maybe we should look at you. ;) :p

[LoneStarGirl]

I don't think Olliegirl is a wolf:

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

2) If Dodgerchick had received a PM saying she was a wolf, that would list who her fellow wolves were. To me this makes it highly unlikely that she would then enter 3 names from a different PM, by typing or copying as you cannot reply to all, and send it assuming this PM was being sent to her fellow wolves.

Two players I would like to look at today:

1) Neon Chaos on day two was at one point 5-2 in the lead with an hour to go to deadline. Of the final seven votes, five were for Barkeep, one for him and one for Alan T. Barkeep we know now was human. Were the wolves mobilising to save one of their own? It has to be considered seriously. Also consider that at the time Barkeep was attacking Alan T who had unwittingly at the time presented to the village the wolf Chief Rum. If Barkeep was lynched and turned human more credence could have been placed on his criticism of Alan T and help get him lynched, thus possibly saving Chief Rum.

2) If we consider Neon Chaos as fishy, then we must look at Render, who was prominently involved in the day two vote, switching from Neon Chaos to Barkeep late on to tie. He also voted for me on day three late on before being the last player to switch to an already doomed Chief Rum.

Tanglewood... you have never played with Dodgerchick I believe and she is VERY hard on herself. She has actually taken herself out of three games that I remember, and she did have an important role in one of them. That is just her.

I also think that Neon Chaos and Render are terrific targets for a vote tonight, probably better than olie girl. But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well. He was the only one that wouldn't believe alant for being Van Helsing and some of the things he has posted has really nagged at me

[LoneStarGirl]

I am actually about to get in the car to drive back home to Little Rock, which is 2.5 hours away. So I definitely wont be around for lynch. I am going to put in my vote for somebody whom I think a lot of people will also vote for, so I wont be wasting my vote on Gonzo again today.

vote Render

[JHandley]

This is quickly becoming a trend, isn't it?

Early votes the after the previous night actions go largely undefended until the closing hours of the next day and then suddenly accusations start flying.

This observation means nothing as it happened yesterday to Ant who was a villager. Just think it's odd.

[Gonzo]

But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well.

Unnoticed? I almost got lynched yesterday!

[tanglewood]

Tanglewood... you have never played with Dodgerchick I believe and she is VERY hard on herself. She has actually taken herself out of three games that I remember, and she did have an important role in one of them. That is just her.

I also think that Neon Chaos and Render are terrific targets for a vote tonight, probably better than olie girl. But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well. He was the only one that wouldn't believe alant for being Van Helsing and some of the things he has posted has really nagged at me

I have played with Dodgerchick several times before and know she is very hard on herself. However to me it simply doesn't make sense how she could be a wolf. If she was a wolf then the she would have had to open up a different PM to the one listing her fellow wolves, which would obviously clearly state it is a wolf role pm as opposed to the generic one we all recieved. Then deliberately copied each of the names of all the players from the generic PM to the PM she sent and sent it off, all without realising that the list she was copying and sending was different to the list of wolves that she had been sent earlier. I think that is highly unlikely. I think it is highly more likely that for whatever reason DC thought she was a wolf and PMed the players CC'd in the start pm. I must admit that when I saw the PM had been cc'd I assumed I was a wolf until I read the message. I have never been in a game where ordinary villagers are sent PMs that have been cc'd to other players.

[tanglewood]

I am actually about to get in the car to drive back home to Little Rock, which is 2.5 hours away. So I definitely wont be around for lynch. I am going to put in my vote for somebody whom I think a lot of people will also vote for, so I wont be wasting my vote on Gonzo again today.

vote Render

I agree with Gonzo that to say he has gone unoticed is incorrect, he was tied in the vote until right at the very deadline yesterday.

You say that you agree with some of what I posted earlier, but then vote for Render instead of Neon Chaos. A significant portion of the suspicion around Render depends on whether Neon Chaos is a good guy or a bad guy, so logically we should start off with Neon. If Neon turns up human then that relieves a fair amount of the pressure from Render IMHO. Going the other way around isn't as valuable.

[tanglewood]

Vote is currently:

Ollie 7 / Schmidty 2 / Render 1

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm sick so i'm going to close my eyes. Dunno how long my nap will last.

[tanglewood]

Three people have yet to receive a vote in the game: LoneStarGirl, KWhit and JHandley.

[cartman]

Well, if nothing else, if we lynch Oliegirl, we'll get the answer to our DC questions. Not the ideal situation, but it is what it is.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[RendeR]

VOTE RENDER

Why?

If previous analysis and my own posts didn't convince you yestreday why switch off me then and back on to me today? nothing has changed.

This is aimed at all those voting for me, not just you DT.

What makes me more suspicious than anyone else?

If its the voting stuff, then why am I still here today? why did everyone suddenly go "oh well yeah i don't think he's bad tonight, lets lynch someone else" and then jump right back on a bandwagon tonight?

Lemme look at those voting for me....

daddytorgo and LSG

There have been comments about LSG all game long, yet noone has bothered to go after her, including myself. I may actually change my vote based on that alone.

ST I'm not really getting. he's been all over the place in this game. Can you give me something more specific that makes me suspect in your eyes DT?

[RendeR]

thats DT not ST, sorry. tying too fast.

[RendeR]

Schmidty: I can understand the whole time constraints and being busy issue. I'm not necessarily voting for you do to lack of activity alone. Even when you've been around your comments have been more going with the flow than really being outspoken about anything or anylising anyone. From reading older games you seem to be a lot more outspoken in the past. I'm just noting the difference.

Also voting for you now brings you out into the discussion and makes you defend your situation, creating information for us to work over.

lastly, I'm REALLY not liking the Olligirl/dodgerchick situation, and while I understand the logic in removing that situation right away making things a little easier on the villagers' part, I just don't like the vibe I'm getting off that vote. SO if i avoid voting OG I'm back to square one and want to see what you do/say about being implicated.

Hence my vote for you. Make sense?

[tanglewood]

Okay, let's see if we can get some movement off the Olliegirl vote, which I think is miguided at best.

Vote Neon Chaos

[RendeR]

Tangle, can you explain to me a bit more as to why there is a Neon Chaos/RendeR connection at all? I wasn't aware that he and I had anything relating back and forth?

[RendeR]

be back in 30 minutes or so..

[tanglewood]

Tangle, can you explain to me a bit more as to why there is a Neon Chaos/RendeR connection at all? I wasn't aware that he and I had anything relating back and forth?

You both voted for Barkeep to save Neon with a tie. You both voted for Alan T on day three until his reveal, then both voted for me before switching to Chief Rum after it became apparent he was going down. When you were run up on early yesterday, Neon helped shift the bandwagon off of you onto Antmeister. A few things.

[tanglewood]

I think finding out if Neon Chaos is human or not is far more important than settling the DC/OG situation.

If we discover Neon Chaos is a wolf, then we automatically incriminate the voters who pushed Barkeep up to prevent Neon's lynch on day 2. If we discover he is a human then that alleyway is closed for now and we can move on from what really is an absolutely key issue.

If we discover that DC/Ollie is a wolf (which as already pointed out is highly unlikely in my opinion) then we get no trail to anyone. If she turns up human, then we get no trail to anyone, expect the huge raft of people who voted for her. But seeing as it has become such an inevitable lynch the wolves can easily be hiding in the vote for her if she is a wolf. When it becomes obvious who is going to be lynched well in advance the wolves have a much easier time figuring out their voting patterns and it is harder to catch them. After all voting for Ollie is the 'obvious play' so any villager would obviously do it.

[Gonzo]

I think finding out if Neon Chaos is human or not is far more important than settling the DC/OG situation.

What evidence do you have that Neon is a wolf?

[path12]

No offence, but voting for someone because "it looks like they'll be lynched anyway" is the stupidest reason possible. You would be better of abstaining.

What part of "I absolutely see the logic in the choice" are you having problems with? ;)

[path12]

Been swamped today. Main thing that bothers me on the OG vote is that nobody has come out to defend much at all today.

I see I spoke too soon.

[path12]

I'd be up for switching my vote to someone I have questions about. Tanglewood, for instance.

[Gonzo]

I see I spoke too soon.

Yeah. This mobilisation by the anti-lynch OG is pretty suspicious.

[JHandley]

Here's what happened: Dodgerchick responded to the group pm titled "important," thinking, based on other information she had, that that pm indicated that she was a wolf. She responded to the following people, thinking they were all wolves: tanglewood, gonzo, neon_chaos.


I don't know how appropriate this question is, but I'll go ahead and ask it. What information could she have had to think she was a wolf, if she wasn't a wolf or the Mad Scientist? Why did she believe these three players are wolves?

That's why I think resolving this issue first and foremost is important.

[path12]

Telle, you've seemed much quieter this game than last. What are your thoughts?

[DaddyTorgo]

basically just the fact that i've been shoot-first-n-ask-questions-later this game RendeR. For example, not really keeping as good a track as I usually do of my ongoing feelings about people.

I didn't want to vote for OG, cuz I see the point about her and it not really making sense that she's a wolf.

And I guess I forgot that you had said things that convinced me yesterday

UNVOTE RENDER

[tanglewood]

A different subject.

There are 13 players left in the game currently, tommorow we will have 11. After tonight the Good Scientist will have had 5 views. At what point is it desirable for a reveal to close off the game? When we get a reveal, assuming there is no counter reveal and thus an argument, we will be presented with a COT of those viewed plus the seer himself. If all five players viewed are still alive tommorow (unlikely) and are all good (about a one third chance, but if some views are bad even better) then a reveal gives the village a 6-5 COT majority. From this can be extrapolated vote records etc. and the game should be won reasonably quickly.

It is however unlikely that all viewed players are still alive. What kind of COT are we all happy for the seer to reveal with? Wait until absolute majority? Wait until he hits on a bad guy regardless of COT numbers? This is not a request for the seer to reveal by any means, but an opening towards a discussion I feel is pertinent.

[tanglewood]

What part of "I absolutely see the logic in the choice" are you having problems with? ;)

Sorry, I read that as "I [i]don't[/t] absolutely see the logic..."

[Telle]

Telle, you've seemed much quieter this game than last. What are your thoughts?

I don't know. I feel like there's so little to go on. Last game I got very vocal when I thought I had figured something out :)

I think it would be prudent to lynch oliegirl just to put that whole issue to bed. Of course, if she's the mad scientist she'll still appear human and we won't actually no.

People tickling the back of my mind as potential wolves: Gonzo, Neon_Chaos, and Tanglewood.

[tanglewood]

I don't know how appropriate this question is, but I'll go ahead and ask it. What information could she have had to think she was a wolf, if she wasn't a wolf or the Mad Scientist? Why did she believe these three players are wolves?

That's why I think resolving this issue first and foremost is important.

Me, Gonzo and Neon Chaos were the three players CC'd with Dodgerchick on the intial game start PM sent to all players. I presume that everyone else's start PM was CC'd to three other players also.

[Telle]

A different subject.

There are 13 players left in the game currently, tommorow we will have 11. After tonight the Good Scientist will have had 5 views. At what point is it desirable for a reveal to close off the game? When we get a reveal, assuming there is no counter reveal and thus an argument, we will be presented with a COT of those viewed plus the seer himself. If all five players viewed are still alive tommorow (unlikely) and are all good (about a one third chance, but if some views are bad even better) then a reveal gives the village a 6-5 COT majority. From this can be extrapolated vote records etc. and the game should be won reasonably quickly.

It is however unlikely that all viewed players are still alive. What kind of COT are we all happy for the seer to reveal with? Wait until absolute majority? Wait until he hits on a bad guy regardless of COT numbers? This is not a request for the seer to reveal by any means, but an opening towards a discussion I feel is pertinent.

The problem is that the seers don't give an absolute answer. One can tell you if a person is a wolf, but not if they're the mad scientist. The other can tell you if a person is the mad scientist, but not a wolf. So a person would have to be cleared by BOTH seers in order to be truly trusted.

[RendeR]

You both voted for Barkeep to save Neon with a tie. You both voted for Alan T on day three until his reveal, then both voted for me before switching to Chief Rum after it became apparent he was going down. When you were run up on early yesterday, Neon helped shift the bandwagon off of you onto Antmeister. A few things.


So basically the arguments that I made yesterday that seemed to at least relieve some suspision from me yesterday, today, makes no difference to you.

Ok.

[Telle]

I don't know how appropriate this question is, but I'll go ahead and ask it. What information could she have had to think she was a wolf, if she wasn't a wolf or the Mad Scientist? Why did she believe these three players are wolves?

That's why I think resolving this issue first and foremost is important.

That's why I said she either has to have some special role or be a bad guy. There's absolutely nothing in the PM that went out to everybody that would make you think you're a wolf.. in fact, it SPECIFICALLY says that if you didn't get a prior PM then you're just a plain villager.

So if oliegirl maintains that she does not have a special role, then she must be a wolf or the mad scientist.

[KWhit]

That's why I said she either has to have some special role or be a bad guy. There's absolutely nothing in the PM that went out to everybody that would make you think you're a wolf.. in fact, it SPECIFICALLY says that if you didn't get a prior PM then you're just a plain villager.

So if oliegirl maintains that she does not have a special role, then she must be a wolf or the mad scientist.

Yeah. The logic to me says she's much more likely to be a wolf or mad scientist than not.

[cartman]

Hmm, we've got a guest as we approach the deadline.

[RendeR]

Hmm, we've got a guest as we approach the deadline.


eh?

[Gonzo]

eh?

I think cartman's implying that someone's logged out to avoid being spotted.

[tanglewood]

A different subject.

There are 13 players left in the game currently, tommorow we will have 11. After tonight the Good Scientist will have had 5 views. At what point is it desirable for a reveal to close off the game? When we get a reveal, assuming there is no counter reveal and thus an argument, we will be presented with a COT of those viewed plus the seer himself. If all five players viewed are still alive tommorow (unlikely) and are all good (about a one third chance, but if some views are bad even better) then a reveal gives the village a 6-5 COT majority. From this can be extrapolated vote records etc. and the game should be won reasonably quickly.

It is however unlikely that all viewed players are still alive. What kind of COT are we all happy for the seer to reveal with? Wait until absolute majority? Wait until he hits on a bad guy regardless of COT numbers? This is not a request for the seer to reveal by any means, but an opening towards a discussion I feel is pertinent.

What I forgot to add to the end of this:

If the seer has a) viewed people who are all still alive and b) not yet viewed Olliegirl, then the plan should be to vote for someone other than Olliegirl who will give us more information regarding voting records (i.e. Neon Chaos), Olliegirl is then viewed at night. We then in the morning receive a reveal from the seer where we either get a list of good guys to form a COT or a bad guy or two plus some good guys. Olliegirl could be on either list.

However, if we lynch Olliegirl tonight and she turns up human we gain practically no information on voting records at all.

a) Olliegirl hasn't even been playing for most of the game. Yes players have been voting for the same character, but based on the actions and posts of the person who is performing that character's role. Votes for Dodgerchick are not the same as votes for Olliegirl.

b) Olliegirl/Dodgerchick has been the final end vote of precisely no players. Neon Chaos has been the final vote of a player seven times. Neon Chaos was 5/2 leading with an hour before a deadline before a confirmed villager was advanced into a tie with Neon Chaos. Knowing the identity of Neon Chaos is a key component of clearing or implicating those players who caused that tie! If Neon is a wolf you automatically create several very good suspects based on that vote alone. If OG comes back a wolf, where do you go? It's a dead end.

As it is today's vote is a waste of time imho. Currently we are learning nothing, regardless of whether OG is a wolf or not.

[Gonzo]

As it is today's vote is a waste of time imho. Currently we are learning nothing, regardless of whether OG is a wolf or not.

If she's a wolf, we'd know that you defended her to the death.

[Telle]

8 - Oliegirl
2 - Schmidty
2 - RendeR
1 - Neon Chaos

[Telle]

If she's a wolf, we'd know that you defended her to the death.

You noticed that too? :)

[path12]

A different subject.

There are 13 players left in the game currently, tommorow we will have 11. After tonight the Good Scientist will have had 5 views. At what point is it desirable for a reveal to close off the game? When we get a reveal, assuming there is no counter reveal and thus an argument, we will be presented with a COT of those viewed plus the seer himself. If all five players viewed are still alive tommorow (unlikely) and are all good (about a one third chance, but if some views are bad even better) then a reveal gives the village a 6-5 COT majority. From this can be extrapolated vote records etc. and the game should be won reasonably quickly.

It is however unlikely that all viewed players are still alive. What kind of COT are we all happy for the seer to reveal with? Wait until absolute majority? Wait until he hits on a bad guy regardless of COT numbers? This is not a request for the seer to reveal by any means, but an opening towards a discussion I feel is pertinent.

Two things about this post really bother me.

1) We are within 30 minutes of deadline. It is time to be debating lynch candidates rather than throw out a subject that is likely to have all sorts of arguments back and forth.

2) I think it is FAR better, especially since we do not have a bodyguard, for our seers to work their magic and find us a wolf rather than outing themselves.

I so want to vote for you today. I'm going to be shocked if you're not a wolf.

[tanglewood]

So basically the arguments that I made yesterday that seemed to at least relieve some suspision from me yesterday, today, makes no difference to you.

Ok.

Firstly, I don't want to vote for you tonight (though I'd rather you than Olliegirl to be honest), I want to lynch for Neon Chaos and then go from there afresh.

Secondly, I don't remember ever saying I was convinced by your arguments yesterday. ;)

[path12]

Screw it. I can always change back.

UNVOTE OLIEGIRL
VOTE TANGLEWOOD

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE NEON CHAOS

works for me tangle. Anyone else?

[Gonzo]

I want to lynch for Neon Chaos and then go from there afresh.

http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showpost.php?p=1515413&postcount=1214 !

[tanglewood]

If she's a wolf, we'd know that you defended her to the death.

If I was a wolf, I'd be doing what the wolves are doing and have already jumped on the bandwagon. It's impossible to look bad to the village if you vote for Olliegirl today.

[RendeR]

Firstly, I don't want to vote for you tonight (though I'd rather you than Olliegirl to be honest), I want to lynch for Neon Chaos and then go from there afresh.

Secondly, I don't remember ever saying I was convinced by your arguments yesterday. ;)


Never said anything about convincing people, just alleviating some suspision.(how the fuck do you spell that word? I've done it 5 different ways in the last few hours...)

[path12]

Never said anything about convincing people, just alleviating some suspision.(how the fuck do you spell that word? I've done it 5 different ways in the last few hours...)

Which one, alleviating or suspicion?

[Gonzo]

Suspicion.

[RendeR]

Suspicion.


Thank you Gonzo. *pulls trigger on the circus cannon*

[JHandley]

Alright, screw it. Tangle makes a good point and I'm not as sold that he's a wolf as Path is. Oliegirl can wait one more day.

UNVOTE OLIEGIRL
VOTE NEON_CHAOS

[KWhit]

Anybody have a vote count?

[st.cronin]

vote count:

8 - oliegirl - Gonzo (1143), KWhit (1146), JHandley (1148), Neon_Chaos (1151), Schmidty (1153), Telle (1167), path12 (1189), cartman (1205)
2 - Schmidty - oliegirl (1168), RendeR (1176)
1 - RendeR - LoneStarGirl (1197)
1 - Neon Chaos - tanglewood (1209)

no vote: DaddyTorgo

[JHandley]

Going to need a lot more to follow to make a difference, tho.