WW CXXVI: Wolves in Asgard - Game Over (Result in Post 2538)

[MrBug708]

Persuade me

[Racer]

Yeah me too

[hoopsguy]

I'm afraid I can't be persuaded, on account of that desperate nightfall vote.

Just counting down the time to see if the night actions bring anything new and interesting?

[Racer]

I'm afraid I can't be persuaded, on account of that desperate nightfall vote.

Just counting down the time to see if the night actions bring anything new and interesting?

:p

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, since I've got you around at this point - I've had some major concerns about you since about Friday due to your prolonged time outside of the thread. Is that strictly a by-product of the vacation or is this game just not doing it for you?

Assuming you are around for the endgame (or at least Day 9) I would hope that you are invested enough to try and help your team win rather than lurk on the fringes. Whatever team that might be.

[mauchow]

It's not too late.. didn't type it right.

I've said what I can. I guess all I can give at this point is my gut feelings. I think we've had some damn good analysis to go off the last few days. I would still look at Telle. I didn't vote hoops because I actually believe him, that he's not a villager. I don't get the same vibe that others are getting, which leads me to say that people who were calling him desperate last night/this morning might be the ones to look at.

One of those incuded EF. I can't remember off the top of my head who the other one was.

[hoopsguy]

By the way, on the off chance that someone has an ability that blocks actions ...

When mauboy is the 4th wolf, if you are in fact convinced that I'm a wolf I would encourage you to block me, spy on me, or in any way you see fit interfere with my actions. I don't have any, but if that would help prove innocence I'm all for it. I selfishly want to be around for the end of this game.

If there did happen to be 6 wolves, you would have to think they would send me to take any kill action tonight. I'm the marked man right now, so there would be every reason for me to do any terrible deeds.

Bottom line, I don't know how the wolves moved their vote yesterday but they did and I benefited from it by virtue of living, so I'm expecting to make my way to Valhalla. But if there is an angle to be played to let me live to the end, I'm trying to think of it.

[hoopsguy]

It's not too late.. didn't type it right.

I've said what I can. I guess all I can give at this point is my gut feelings. I think we've had some damn good analysis to go off the last few days. I would still look at Telle. I didn't vote hoops because I actually believe him, that he's not a villager. I don't get the same vibe that others are getting, which leads me to say that people who were calling him desperate last night/this morning might be the ones to look at.

One of those incuded EF. I can't remember off the top of my head who the other one was.

Racer was another one. Given a max of one conversion, it seems a bit of a stretch for both to be wolves. I personally think that the trust for both is a little overdone, but neither would be people I would think should be the next lynch without a pretty compelling reason.

[EagleFan]

I didn't vote hoops because I actually believe him, that he's not a villager.

Last time I saw a slip like that it was correct...

[EagleFan]

Interesting, then he deletes instead of edits?

[EagleFan]

I guess he was trying to erase all evidence of the mistake.

[mauchow]

Last time I saw a slip like that it was correct...

It was a mistype. Say what you want.

NOt really around - cleaning the house for in-laws. Wife has control tonight. lol

[mauchow]

Interesting, then he deletes instead of edits?
Who deleted what?

[EagleFan]

I saw a slip like that one other time, forget who it was.

The post at that time said something along the line of... "I don't know if he is a wolf or not, I only know that I am" Which later upon lynch we found out that he was telling the truth and was indeed a wolf. :)

[EagleFan]

Who deleted what?

Don't see an edit tag on the post so I can only assume it was deleted and reposted.

[EagleFan]

Oh, sorry, thought you had delited, guess you didn't do either. Thought It looked diffeent.

I take that statement back.

[mauchow]

Oh. I see.

25 minutes before my doom, I guess. Lasted longer than I thought I would as a villager. I knew I'd somehow screw this up as I always do with a role.

[JAG]

I saw a slip like that one other time, forget who it was.

The post at that time said something along the line of... "I don't know if he is a wolf or not, I only know that I am" Which later upon lynch we found out that he was telling the truth and was indeed a wolf. :)

FYI, that was a game where you were also a wolf. :) (Pass' Godfather game)

[EagleFan]

Looking back at the hammer...

Thor's Hammer - Telle >> ?? >> ?? >> ??
Thor's Hammer - ?? >> Narcizo >> Hoops >> Chubby (Fake) disappeared
Thor's Hammer - ?? >> ?? >> ?? (DV?) >> Racer >> Chubby

The hammer had to go through DV at some point. The question is, could a wolf pass the real one to him on a night and have DV pass the fake to the wolves' original target?

To me everything is pointing at Telle again. If Darth actually started with the hammer and planted the fake with a villager while passing the real one to a wolf for day two. Day three it would be passed back to Darth, as it had to be given to him that night again.

Then trying to gain trust for Telle she comes out with her story.

They may not have know that it would crumble when given to Thor and thus reveal it as a fake. Probably hoping that he would hold that hammer assuming it was the real one but not having its actual power gains.

Also, assuming the wolves also had to pass the hammer back and forth.

[EagleFan]

The only other thing would be if hoops receiving the hammer on night two allowed him to immediately trade it with Darth for the fake.

[EagleFan]

That last post was under the assumption that hoops is a wolf.

Using that line of thought it seems certain that either Telle or hoops is a wolf.

[EagleFan]

Of course Racer could be trying to gain trust by handing the hammer to Thor but that would seem to be too big of a risk.

(just paranoia talking there)

[EagleFan]

FYI, that was a game where you were also a wolf. :) (Pass' Godfather game)

True, we were looking for the other wolves at that point (the two teams of wolves game) and thought that was too good of a clue to be true.

[EagleFan]

Someone stop me, I am dola'ing out of control...

[EagleFan]

If we're wrong about you mau, I hope you end up in Vahala.

[EagleFan]

Though I don't think we are wrong at this point.

[mauchow]

If we're wrong about you mau, I hope you end up in Vahala.

Roled villagers don't go to valhalla.

at least i don't think so...

[EagleFan]

Roled villagers don't go to valhalla.

at least i don't think so...

Oh, didn't realize.

[EagleFan]

that line isn't moving, I believe it is a dead line...

[JAG]

Final Day 7 voting:

mauboy1: A lot
Everyone else: A little

[Racer]

Can I go ahead and post who I sent mistletoe to?

[EagleFan]

Sure

[Racer]

I made a late switch and sent a PM to send mistletoe to Barkeep (9:57 pm to be exact). Originally I had it going to Telle but based on EagleFan’s late post I decided I better not.

I don’t have any information on either of these players or any other players in the game nor do I possess the ability to get it. I decided against passing it to Hoops because I think people could be hesitant to lynch him tomorrow if he has it. I didn’t go with MrBug because I think he could well be night killed. It was completely a gut decision to go with Barkeep over Jeheinz and Lathum.

[hoopsguy]

I have yet to receive a PM about receiving mistletoe.

[EagleFan]

Inquiring minds want to know... :)

[hoopsguy]

I have yet to receive a PM about receiving mistletoe.

This was a joke, by the way. Gallows humor, I suppose.

[mauchow]

hopefully someone used the duke

[JAG]

You feel confident you have the forces of evil on the run after the death of their leader in Loki. After the day began with wild swings, you come to a unanimous decision that the one naming himself Freyr in fact has no trace of divinity. hoopsguy, as the most outspoken against him, grabs him by the scruff of his neck and drags him to the block as mauboy1 quietly stares out with a sullen look on his face. You sense a deep sorrow in his eyes and hesitate a moment...and in that moment of hesitation, the illusion drops and he is revealed to be a she. Hel herself stands before you. Having no physical abilities of note, hoopsguy easily shoves her bodily to the ground. He pulls his sword from its sheath in a single motion and says, "Don't think of this as an execution. Think of this as a one-way trip back home to Niflheim. Give my regards to Garm." With a single swing of his sword, he lops off her head.

mauboy1 was Hel.

As the last bit of life flows from Hel, the rest of you begin to shimmer and glow. Then all at once, the illusions crumble and reveal you to all be warriors of distinction with nary an evil member amongst you. Balder smiles at you all benevolently and proclaims his profound joy at the victory you have shared. Racer continues to glow after the illusions have vanished and you can't help but think you've seen her face recently.

The forces of Good have triumphed over the forces of Evil!

[Autumn]

Wow.

Narc totally called it with Hel, in Valhalla that is.

[EagleFan]

Wow, thought for certain there was one other wolf.

Great job all.

Sorry hoops. :)

[hoopsguy]

OK, so lets assume that the wolves were not dumb about passing the sword between their number. What that would suggest to me is that they had something more important that they needed to protect.

Also, Freyr/mauboy had indicated getting extra abilities when he received the sword but saw it pass. Not that we need more evidence of him being a wolf (JAG will provide the final point later) but I had thought of this earlier tonight and had not gotten around to posting it. Anything he was doing over the past 8-10 hours has been with the intent to create some little bit of chaos for the rest of Asgard.

The fact that Racer brought up a villager having the sword, and it then happened, made me feel better about him. I think his trust level has been a bit more certain than it deserved, but that was a good step. Only way this doesn't make sense is if EF/Racer were both wolves. If that is the case, we may as well end the game now. We're going to have to trust someone.

Interested to see who is the night kill. I'm a little worried that it could end up being Barkeep and the mistletoe would be on the move.

[mauchow]

We fucked up bad last night.

[hoopsguy]

Huh, figured there had to be one more :)

And that it was going to take you two days to find it because everyone wanted me dead.

[Autumn]

Look at hoops padding his post count.

[hoopsguy]

mau, you could have just given us the damn Nightfall hours ago if you were last man standing :)

[mauchow]

We were 0 for 4 in conversion tries I believe.

[EagleFan]

OK, so lets assume that the wolves were not dumb about passing the sword between their number. What that would suggest to me is that they had something more important that they needed to protect.

Also, Freyr/mauboy had indicated getting extra abilities when he received the sword but saw it pass. Not that we need more evidence of him being a wolf (JAG will provide the final point later) but I had thought of this earlier tonight and had not gotten around to posting it. Anything he was doing over the past 8-10 hours has been with the intent to create some little bit of chaos for the rest of Asgard.

The fact that Racer brought up a villager having the sword, and it then happened, made me feel better about him. I think his trust level has been a bit more certain than it deserved, but that was a good step. Only way this doesn't make sense is if EF/Racer were both wolves. If that is the case, we may as well end the game now. We're going to have to trust someone.

Interested to see who is the night kill. I'm a little worried that it could end up being Barkeep and the mistletoe would be on the move.

Best minute late analysis ever!!!

[mauchow]

mau, you could have just given us the damn Nightfall hours ago if you were last man standing :)

I was going to but I wanted to leave it up to JAG.

I did feel bad to see all this analysis going. And I was actually busy at work today to even really think about it. SOrry guys.

[hoopsguy]

Look at hoops padding his post count.

Just making sure I was going down swinging. I HATE HATE HATE getting lynched as a villager.

[JAG]

First, thanks very much to everyone for playing, especially those who hadn't played in a while as I think it was refreshing to have some new (or old if you prefer) voices in the conversation and hope you can forgive the rough edges in this game. I was extremely please with the activity level even with the weekend breaking things up some. It made it a lot of fun to follow and I was happy to see people so engaged in the game.

Congratulations to the village. While I now feel like I underpowered the wolves (though they helped me out by killing Odin immediately), I feel like there was some pretty strong villager play and poor luck for the wolves with the exception of the Odin kill Day 1-3 that helped put them at a severe disadvantage. At that point it was going to be a steep uphill climb to win, though even then they put up a pretty reasonable fight and had some momentum going until mckerney's little play brought home the win.

I'll provide a full list of roles and such in a bit, but I wanted to start by laying out some things that were going on that a number of people were probably wondering about.

1. The stuff with the fake Mjolnir / real Mjolnir. None of the villagers guessed what had actually happened (or if they did, I missed it). The hammer that was passed around by Telle / Narcizo / hoops was the real hammer. On Day 2, Loki crafted a fake hammer (he requested it, though it was to be a random item from the list, and by chance happened to be Mjolnir). On Day 3, as hoops passed the real one to Chubby, Zinto passed the fake one to Chubby. Not being able to tell the difference, it was random chance which hammer Chubby ended up with...and he ended with
the fake. That spun the real hammer off to Racer. I found that pretty humorous. When I drew up the idea for items, I never suspected the fake one would end up getting used that way. In retrospect I realized they could've also tried to send it to whomever was getting the Mistletoe to try and spin that off randomly,

2. The Mistletoe did not have to be weaponized to kill EF, only passed to him. EF had no special abilities other than being immune to lynching. For those that played in it, it was like my role in Pass's Godfather game where passing the horse head to me would've killed me. That was a special hell of stress for me to deal with and I figured this was an opportunity to use the same mechanic to pass the experience on to someone else (sorry EF :) ). There was this special for Loki though: If Loki received the Mistletoe and passed it to EF, he had an abillity to frame anyone else so in the write-up it would look like someone else caused Balder to die (as Loki had Hodor shoot the arrow that killed Balder).

3. Racer was the Valkyrie, the hidden role in the game. As long as he was alive, dead vanilla villagers went to Valhalla. If he had died, no other vanilla villagers would've gone there.

4. There was actually a conversion ability in the game, but a rather weak one that only worked on dead vanilla villagers whose spirits did not go to Valhalla. It probably would've been snuffed out immediately by anyone realizing Hel was the only reasonable explanation for a player returning
from the dead, but it seemed like it could be useful for an endgame situation or to force the village to waste a day killing the convert.

5. The no night kill on Day 2 was Chubby successfully blocking an NK attempt on J23.

[Autumn]

<b>vote hoopsguy</b>

[EagleFan]

So what was the story with the hammer?

[hoopsguy]

We were 0 for 4 in conversion tries I believe.

Want to explain how that would have worked?

And what did happen on Night 2? Was there no kill because you were making the fake hammer or was something else happening?

Who was the bodyguard? Tyr?

[Thomkal]

yay Team Good, well done! Good try Team Evil!

[MrBug708]

Sweet! So is the game over? Or one more wolf?

[Autumn]

Check last post last page guys.

[Autumn]

I'm a little surprised at that fake hammer mechanic, I would have thought (did think) that Chubby would keep the real one and the fake would spin off.

[hoopsguy]

vote hoopsguy

Sheesh, I lay down meaningful votes on 3 of the 4 wolves - the only 3 to be lynched - and this is the respect I get?

[Racer]

Yeah, I didn't quite get all the trust I was getting either to be perfectly honest.

I was (a) Valkyrie by the way - basically a transportation system for vanilla villagers to get to Vahalla. Basically, all vanilla villagers went to Vahalla while I was in the game and once I was out no one would have went.

[Thomkal]

okay EagleFan, what the heck was that clue you left us in the message with the missing letters? None of us in Valhalla could figure that out!
And I'm so bummed that we didn't find out any of our killers-we really thought we might come in and save the day! :(

[hoopsguy]

So what kind of items did the wolves get their hands on?

And how did the vote manipulation thing work?

[Autumn]

I thought the game was a great deal of fun, JAG. You were probably kicking yourself every time we went on and on about how there had to be 5 wolves. I know whenever I start a game and people say stuff like that i start fretting about my balance.

It woulid have been fun to have some real impact from Valhalla, but obviously the village didn't need us. Such crazy luck with no villagers going until what day four? So I guess the deal is that Odin would have been able to receive our messages directly?

[EagleFan]

ah, posted that question just a bit too late.


Good game JAG. Thanks for the effort.

[Danny]

Thanks for the idea and all your efforts JAG. I don't think it was the most balanced game, but I'll save those comments for the other wolves behind your back ;).

Actually, these games are extremely difficult to balance and a number of things simply did not go our way (basically everything after the night 1 kill of Odin).

That said, I thought the village played a great game!

[EagleFan]

I lied, or lied by insinuation at least, my *** off about not being able to be killed on day one. I didn't know how much the wolves knew about the mistletoe so I wanted the to think that they needed to use it to kill me.

No sweat on that JG, actually glad that I was able to be cleared on day one and pretty much not have to worry about the mistletoe accidentally being passed to me. I was going to reveal on day two anyway so the wolves pretty much stepped up the cycle a little (and got them off on a bad start at least).

[JAG]

Just going to throw out some observations / thoughts I've had over the time the game has been running in case anyone was wondering:

Game notes that amused me or made me happy:

1. Zinto mentioned this in wolf PM and I thought it could cause problems when I saw the list of wolves also...he figured with he, mau, and DV as wolves there was a very good chance of a wolf getting D1 votes. So naturally, those three were fine but the safe fourth member of the team Danny would nearly get voted out the first day.

2. I was amazed at how much was riding on the day 1 deadline and actions. The game could've taken a wild turn for either the worse or better for the village. Here's the full situation and potential permutations:

At 1 minute to deadline, the public vote was 7 for Danny, 5 for Chubby, and 4 for EagleFan, the actual vote was 6 for Danny, 5 for Chubby, and 5 for EagleFan (Zinto's vote was not actually on Danny but on EF). The wolves were desperately trying to get Zinto to switch from EagleFan to Chubby, apparently Zinto sent the vote switch to mau instead of hitting reply all (his first day ever as a wolf so a mistake like that under pressure is quite understandable).

a. Let's say no one switched at that point. Danny would've ended up lynched. The order they sent in was to brutal dubb and NK Narcizo if that were to happen, not knowing that bhlloy (Tyr) would have short-circuited that plan. So in this case the village would've been down bhlloy and Narcizo, but Odin would've survived at least one additional day.

b. Now, if Zinto had gotten the vote switch to Chubby, there would've been a tie and a toss-up between Danny or Chubby dying. If Danny dies, you get the same situation as in a., but if Chubby gets lynched...we could've had both Odin AND Thor die on day 1, which would've ranked amongst the greatest of all-time starts for the wolves. Except for one minor thing...Lathum began the game with Gleipnir, the Fenrir Wolf fetter. He sent it to Chubby, but he had a conditional order that if Chubby were to be lynched, Gleipnir would've been sent to Danny, which would've effectively knocked him out of the game. Still, not a terrible result to knock out two of the top villager roles on Day 1 in exchange for a wolf who had the worst powers of the four.

c. But then we have Chubby make what appears to be a pointless deadline change of voting Lathum to voting EF (it changed the public voting from 7-5-4 to 7-5-5), which allowed Danny to make the deadline switch to EF and preserve himself (though if Zinto had also gotten the vote switch to Chubby, the final result would've been 6-6-5 Danny-EF-Chubby).

d. And as if things weren't crazy enough with the result, there's still a last little tidbit for the day. dubb was passed the Mistletoe, but because he died, it ended up moving randomly to Danny. However, because Chubby was passed Freyr's Magic Sword and Gleipnir, the Sword also spun off randomly and landed with Danny. random.org decided he would keep the Sword instead of the Mistletoe. That little 50-50 shot took away an easy bonus kill opportunity from the wolves (assuming Danny could've survived the following day), as well as robbing Loki of the chance to frame another person for the killing.

3. Bug was the target of both dubb and mckerney scans the first day.

4. Weaponized Mistletoe. I love it.

5. bhlloy's comment about having two of the three guaranteed roles for good (Thor and Balder) up for lynch D1 being correct (Chubby and EF) though at the time he was musing about Danny being one of them post-fake reveal.

6. Random observation in the middle of D2 post Danny's fake reveal: Being a GM can be fun. :)

7. Lathum's post 594 re: his item (Gleipnir) helping in case of wolf attack. I loved the double meaning, which I assume was intentional.

8. I was very pleased with how the editing rule worked. After the goofing around early D1, there was a reasonably steady use of it for real purposes without it being abused in any way that I could tell. The idea of it could've been refined to some degree, but it worked out as I had hoped and even got more use than I thought it would.

9. Going into Day 4, I suspected there would be some interesting fallout from the fake Mjolnir pass the wolves successfully executed to Chubby. Had that 50-50 chance not succeeded, the fake Hammer would've spun off randomly (and more or less uselessly, unless it interfered with a Mistletoe pass). I was not disappointed with the hijinks that followed.

10. Day 4 listening to the wolf chat about mau wanting to reveal as Freyja and claiming the sword (perhaps not remembering, despite it being in the description, that it was Freyr's sword...those darn confusing siblings), I'm thinking to myself, "A mau fake reveal...sounds great...what could possibly go wrong?" :) (you know I love you mau)

11. a. I'm amazed how a game can turn on such a little detail Part 1. With the D1 vote at 4-4-4-3 (Danny with the 3), there was a reasonable chance Danny could've avoided being the lynch target without much suspicion, but then came DV's post about EF-Chubby-Lathum leaving out Danny and dubb alertly calling him out on it probably brought Danny more to the forefront than he might've otherwise been in that group. What if one of EF-Lathum-Chubby is the final lynch target without the wolves showing their vote manipulation abilities? Danny has typically been a D1 NK target for
wolves, but getting some votes might've made it realistic that he would slide by for a few days with less suspicion. If the wolves avoid getting lynched just a day or two, it would've really openned things up for their powers. But instead, that little post contributed to the village catching two of the four wolves in the first three days, including the wolf seer.

11. b. I'm amazed how a game can turn on such a little detail Part 2. Going into Day 6, the wolves had a bonus kill in hand and were trying to figure out how to best use it, and I think I can say they were frustrated at not being able to have used mau's conversion ability despite trying to activate it since Day 2. They originally had Racer (the Valkyrie) down as their kill and were trying to sort out who to use the bonus kill on when mckerney popped up as Heimdall. They finally ended up switching the kill to mckerney and Narcizo which led to their downfall, and about 10 minutes post-deadline, they both sent PM's which summarized as, "That might've been a grave mistake after looking at the rules" (presumably Heimdall's entry). If they had realized it ahead of time, they could've sent mau to kill Racer and mckerney (or maybe Narcizo if they wanted to try and get mckerney lynched the next day...as he had scanned Racer that night, I'm guessing that could've been a possibility), which would've finally paved the way for them to get the conversion they had been seeking since Day 2, assuming mau could've survived the following day (or they could've swapped roles using a Loki ability to guarantee they would be able to get the conversion in). In addition, Racer was passed the Mistletoe, so there would've been a chance that either of the wolves could've ended up with it or it could've even spun to EagleFan and given them a lovely 4 villager kill day (including lynch) with the village potentially having lost 3 roles in a day. mckerney pulling off the move he did was obviously a huge factor in the village closing out the game successfully and the wolves were tantalizingly close to giving themselves a realistic chance to pull off a heck of a comeback.

12. hoopsguy's Shawshank Redemption comment to EF.

[hoopsguy]

EF, how vulnerable were you to being killed? Was mistletoe truly the only way?

[EagleFan]

Autumn lied to me, Darth didn't create the fake hammer.

Thomkal, what were you trying to say in your vision? people.... people what?


JAG, how did the visions work? Did the wolves alter the messages?

[JAG]

I thought the game was a great deal of fun, JAG. You were probably kicking yourself every time we went on and on about how there had to be 5 wolves. I know whenever I start a game and people say stuff like that i start fretting about my balance.

It woulid have been fun to have some real impact from Valhalla, but obviously the village didn't need us. Such crazy luck with no villagers going until what day four? So I guess the deal is that Odin would have been able to receive our messages directly?

Danny mentioned it right off the bat. I knew I didn't want to have five wolves to start (my idea was to compensate the wolves for that by having fewer more powerful wolves, but I believe I botched things there), but around Day 2 or 3 I realized a Loki Worshiper cultist role would've been cool. Ah well.

[MrBug708]

This is the first game that I've made it to the end alive and our side has won. Probably out of 25 some odd games

[JAG]

Autumn lied to me, Darth didn't create the fake hammer.

Thomkal, what were you trying to say in your vision? people.... people what?


JAG, how did the visions work? Did the wolves alter the messages?

He didn't lie actually. He was offering their conjecture.

The Valhalla crew could send out one message per day. If they sent it to Odin, the entire message would go through. If Odin wasn't alive, they could only operate by sending dreams where the entire message would not go through. It was random as to what percent would make it and which part of the message you would get (beginning / middle / end), which is why the messages were cut off in weird places.

[hoopsguy]

This is the first game that I've made it to the end alive and our side has won. Probably out of 25 some odd games

It doesn't happen often for me either - nice when it does, no doubt about it.

[Autumn]

Autumn lied to me, Darth didn't create the fake hammer.

Thomkal, what were you trying to say in your vision? people.... people what?


JAG, how did the visions work? Did the wolves alter the messages?

I was just trying to give you some thoughts. Looking back at the roles I realized that it seemed much more likely that DV's role would be able to fake an item to Thor. AFter seeing your response to our note I realized I shouldn't have put anything in it really, it was misleading.

We had a chance of finding out information about our killers, but never did.

Also, EF, we weren't sure if you had been converted, so we were communicating iwth one hand behind our back.

Did your note to us mean something? A code or typos?

[MrBug708]

So I passed the mistletoe to Dubb and happened to get scanned by both mckerney and Dubb?

[MrBug708]

How did the conversion work? Who was targeted?

[Zinto]

McKerney you kicked my butt. I was so afraid you where going to scan me and if I ended up lynched the next day Mau's sword would have ended up in a villagers hand(most likely) and we would have lost. I panicked and we lost hahah

[EagleFan]

EF, how vulnerable were you to being killed? Was mistletoe truly the only way?

Pretty sure I could have been a regular night kill as well but didn't want to advertise that.

[Thomkal]

Great game JAG, thanks for inviting me to play.

[EagleFan]

Did your note to us mean something? A code or typos?

What note?

[hoopsguy]

Will be interested in hearing how players possessing items enhanced their roles - in particular, Thor since he actually got his item.

[Thomkal]

Autumn lied to me, Darth didn't create the fake hammer.

Thomkal, what were you trying to say in your vision? people.... people what?


JAG, how did the visions work? Did the wolves alter the messages?

Here is the message I tried to send:

Greetings Balder the Beautiful!

Your loyal servants Thomkal and Autumn here. We are able to communicate with one person/day from valhalla and send a message. Here are the Valhalla rules and powers:

1. Communicate through JAG with one message to the player of our choice. Can only be done once/day and will only be partly received. We in Valhalla will not know what parts you received.

2. We have a chance each day to find the identity of our killers if nightkilled/people who voted us for lynch that are a wolf. So far we know nothing unfortunately.

That is why Chubby kept bringing me (Thomkal) up yesterday-he was trying to signal me how to use #2 above, but we have no control over who to look at unfortunately. So far we have not found out anything about anybody.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We knew nothing about what parts of the message you would actually see other than what you revealed in thread, so I thought the best idea was to write messages where I repeated the more important things, hoping what didn't get through on the first time I said it, might get through on the second (or third). When we saw how little you apparantly you got from that message, we moved to shorter, more concise messages.

[EagleFan]

Here is the message I tried to send:

Greetings Balder the Beautiful!

Your loyal servants Thomkal and Autumn here. We are able to communicate with one person/day from valhalla and send a message. Here are the Valhalla rules and powers:

1. Communicate through JAG with one message to the player of our choice. Can only be done once/day and will only be partly received. We in Valhalla will not know what parts you received.

2. We have a chance each day to find the identity of our killers if nightkilled/people who voted us for lynch that are a wolf. So far we know nothing unfortunately.

That is why Chubby kept bringing me (Thomkal) up yesterday-he was trying to signal me how to use #2 above, but we have no control over who to look at unfortunately. So far we have not found out anything about anybody.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We knew nothing about what parts of the message you would actually see other than what you revealed in thread, so I thought the best idea was to write messages where I repeated the more important things, hoping what didn't get through on the first time I said it, might get through on the second (or third). When we saw how little you apparantly you got from that message, we moved to shorter, more concise messages.

I got...

We in Valhalla will not know what parts you received.

2. We have a chance each day to find the identity of our killers if nightkilled/people

[Zinto]

If we figure out McKerney's power five minutes before instead of after the deadline I think we would have been in a good position going into today. Hoops would have most likely got lynched(or thats how I planned it in my head) and the game would have been much more in our favor.

[Thomkal]

I got...

We in Valhalla will not know what parts you received.

2. We have a chance each day to find the identity of our killers if nightkilled/people

LOL well that wasn't particularly helpful was it? at least we got the part about the identity of our killers to you.

What were the chances of us getting that info JAG?

[Autumn]

EF, when you revealed Thomkal's note in thread, we thought maybe you were trying to leave a code. You said something about looking for a code in our note, and you left out a bunch of letters from words in your note.

Guess it was just shoddy typing ;-) Glad I didn't spend any more time deciphering it.

[EagleFan]

From Autumn I got...

"...that Thor was killed by a knife in the back. It seems possible that Loki had his own action each night. Also Darth Vilus was likely the one to have created the fake hammer. Ponder this."

[Thomkal]

Hey Zinto,

Were you trying to get a run on J23 on day 2-the vote I called you out on? Man I wish I had pursued that a bit stronger now.

[EagleFan]

EF, when you revealed Thomkal's note in thread, we thought maybe you were trying to leave a code. You said something about looking for a code in our note, and you left out a bunch of letters from words in your note.

Guess it was just shoddy typing ;-) Glad I didn't spend any more time deciphering it.

Sorry, that was completely my lousy keyboard (combined with quick typing).

[Zinto]

Hey Zinto,

Were you trying to get a run on J23 on day 2-the vote I called you out on? Man I wish I had pursued that a bit stronger now.


No I guess it was just a good observation by you that I put the vote on right after Racer did even though I have no idea what was going on in my head at that point in the game.

[JAG]

So what kind of items did the wolves get their hands on?

And how did the vote manipulation thing work?

The only one besides the fake hammer that they had at any time was Freyr's Sword. And they knew he wasn't in the game.

[EagleFan]

I must say, it was rather liberating to know that I couldn't be the day one lynch. :)

[JAG]

Vote manipulation was Loki's daily ability. He could make a private vote that would invalidate his public one, but not be shown. Thus he outwardly voted for Danny D1, but privately he switched it to EF.

[hoopsguy]

The only one besides the fake hammer that they had at any time was Freyr's Sword. And they knew he wasn't in the game.

Bad luck - without any items they weren't in position to try and create "item conflicts" where they passed stuff to people they thought would receive items and displace the passes to random.

Did items get retired from the game when the associated character (Odin, Wolf) were removed? Seemed that way ...

[JAG]

Here are the rest of the roles, sorry if the formatting is off (and try not to laugh at my poor balancing...lamentations):

Role PMs:

You are Odin, All-Father of the gods. Your drink from the Well of Wisdom has allowed you a keen insight that allows you to see beyond outward appearances. In terms of game purposes, you are the seer and once per night, you may scan to determine the alligence of another player. Your
authority over all other gods also gives you a one-time opportunity to change the result of a lynch (be warned that this will result in you being revealed if you haven't already). Once per day you may send and receive a message from those in Valhalla through the GM (so they will not know your identity, nor you the one who sent it to you).

You are Thor, God of Thunder, Giantsbane. You are the greatest warrior of all the gods and a such it will take two attempts to successfully night kill you. You may also use your prowess in battle to protect other gods and goddesses. In game terms you are the bodyguard and each night
you may choose a player to protect from being night-killed. You may not guard yourself. Once per game you may choose to guard one player for two consecutive nights, but if you do so, you cannot guard that person the remainder of the game. You are also immune to any abilities of giants that
may be in-game. You have knowledge of one family member that is in the game (though not if there are others). Your know your son Magni is J23, however he does not know your identify and you cannot communicate privately with him.

You are Balder, beloved of the gods. You are so well-loved that people refuse to do you harm. In game terms, you cannot be lynched (though you will be revealed if you would otherwise be lynched). If you are passed the Missletoe, the one earthly substance that can hurt you, you will die.

You are Magni, son of Thor and the only one besides Thor who can wield his mighty hammer. You may make use of Mjolnir though if Thor is alive, you will only be able to unlock a portion of its abilities. If Thor dies, you may wield the full might of Mjolnir for yourself (the extent of which is not known to you at this time).

You are Heimdall, the Watcherman of the Gods and guardian of the Bifrost Bridge to Asgard. Your powers of observation are far beyond that of any other, even Loki himself cannot fool you. As Loki's sworn enemy and as you are fated to slay him during Ragnarok, each night you may scan one
player to determine if they are Loki. You are also immune to Loki's powers and if Loki attempts to night kill you, he will be successful but you will kill him as well. You will be aware of who passes you an item in the event that you receive one.

You are the Valkyrie. While you are alive, you are able to transport the spirits of fallen Norse Berserkers to Valhalla (this does not require any action of you, you will do this automatically). If you die, no additional warrior spirits will be able to enter Valhalla.

You are Tyr, one-armed God of Justice and Truth. You once sacrificed your hand to aid in binding the Fenrir Wolf and you are here to help with him again. You are aware that the Fenrir Wolf is present in the game and that he has the power to kill another player when he dies. If he tries to
use this while you are in the game, you will sacrifice yourself to prevent him from using this ability on another.

Your spirit now resides in Valhalla. You may not post in the game thread, however you may PM freely with other Valhalla spirits. Once per day, one of the Valhalla spirits may choose to convey a message to Odin (PM it to me and I will send it to him). If Odin is dead, you may convey a message to any other player (PM me and I will send it to them), however, unlike a message to Odin, the message to anoter player will not be perfectly transmitted. Each night you have a chance of receiving some insight into your slayer (or slayers if you were lynched).

You are the forces of Evil. Prior to the deadline of Day 1, you must decide the order of who will perform each night kill and adhere to that the remainder of the game (skipping any dead members). If you are successful in completing a full cycle of night kills without one of you dying, you will receive a bonus night kill to be performed by any member you choose. This bonus kill can only happen once per game.

Roles and abilities:

You are Loki, Trickster of the Gods and leader of the forces of Evil for game purposes. You have a wide array of powers to wreak your mayhem throughout the forces of Good.

Powers that can be used every day:
---Your public vote does not have to match who you actually wish to vote for (please submit your private vote in regular voting format to me via PM)

Powers that can be used every other day (starting with Day 2):
---You may choose one player who, if they are scanned, will yield the opposite result of a true scan. You cannot choose the same player in consecutive nights and you can only once choose an Evil member to be the target of this ability.

Powers that can be used once / game (no more than one of these powers can be used per day):
---You may use your powers of disguise to swap roles with another evil player (i.e. you choose Hel who becomes Loki and you become Hel). You cannot use this on the Fenrir Wolf.
---You may disguise yourself as another player for a day. For that day, they will be forced to post what you wish them to publicly post (PM me what you want them to post and I will convey it to them). However, you will only be able to post once as yourself that day and must forego voting (your puppet may vote however). You will learn nothing regarding what items the victim has and they may still pass any items they have. The victim will know this is a result of Loki, but not which player Loki is. The victim will still be able to make use of any night actions they may have.
---If you possess the Missletoe and make a successful pass to Balder (thus killing him), you can frame any other player of your choice for the Missletoe pass leading to his death.
---On Day 2 (or beyond), you may craft a fake item that will so closely resemble the real one that no one can tell them apart. The item that will be crafted is randomly selected among the item list. If the fake item ends up with its supposed owner, the item will turn to dust and the player who has the role linked to the item will be revealed to you. If you die, the fake item will turn to dust.
---You may move a player's vote off you onto another player.


You are Hel, Queen of the Underworld.

Powers that may be used once per game (no more than one of these powers may be used per day)
---You may raise from the dead a vanilla Norse berserker (but not a God or Goddess) whose spirit has not gone to Valhalla. They will receive PM rights with the rest of your team and count as Evil for victory conditions, but otherwise have no powers and not be able to perform a night kill.
---You may banish an item you possess from the game to Nifflheim (it will be removed from the game...note that the item being removed from the game will be announced publicly).

You are the Fenrir Wolf. If you are lynched, you may open your jaws wide and swallow another player of your choosing to take to the grave with you.

Powers that may be used every other night:
---You may close your enormous jaws around another player. That player will be blinded and only able to randomly target other players with their abilities that day. You may not use this power on the same player more than once.

You are Utgaard-Loki, a fearsome giant with the power of illusions. Your skillful illusions allow you to observe other players undetected.

Powers that may be used every night:
---You may scan a player to learn their role (if they have one).

Powers that may be used once per game:
---You may choose to learn what item a player possesses (if any)

[Autumn]

I got off track quite a bit, but feel pretty good that I fingered Danny, Zinto and Darth at some point. And I was write about Telle. I was terrified she was going to turn out to be a wolf and make me look like an idiot.

From now on I'm just going to close my trap, a lot more often. I always manage to talk myself into trouble.

[mauchow]

Last night I was defeated and wasn't really trying all that logically to sway votes - I knew it was over at that point barring some crazy move..

It would have worked out fantastic to kill Racer last night in addition to Narcizo and claiming it as my kill with the sword - we would have kept the sword in our hands and I would have been on a higher level of trust.

We even contemplated me killing Zinto last night but we knew the write-up might not work in our favor so we backed out of that. And add in that the sword would have landed in a villagers hand, too. Granted, we were planning on destroying the weapon after the kill to make it look like it was used - but again, at the mercy of the write up.

I felt I had a realistic fake-reveal given the timing of it all. Had I not revealed, I would have likely died within the next two days, leaving Zinto as the last wolf. I think we were in a tight spot if I didn't do that and it seems like it almost would have worked if we did our actions differently last night.

[EagleFan]

feel pretty good that I fingered Danny, Zinto and Darth at some point.

What you guys do behind closed doors is no business of ours... :eek:

[JAG]

Item abilities:

Mjolnir - If Thor (or Magni if Thor has already died) possesses this, it grants the following abilities:

a. All votes on giants count as three votes though they will be shown as one vote publicly
b. If a giant tries to kill you, you will not be harmed and will kill it instead
c. You gain a 1 in 3 chance to fight off a night kill attempt, or 1 in 6 if it is Loki attempting it (he is sneakier). You will not be told your attacker's identity, but you will learn their role's name. This ability will not work more than once.
d. You gain a one-time ability to change the lynch to a player receiving two or more votes (you role and that you possess the item will be revealed upon making this change). This ability can only be used once per game.

If Magni possesses Mjolnir and Thor is alive, he will gain powers a and d, but not b and c.

Gleipnir (Fenrir Wolf's fetter) - As this has been passed to you, you are now fettered and will not be able to use your abilities (including your brutal ability) or take any public action including posting and voting. You may still communicate via PM with your teammates.

Gungnir (Odin's Spear) - This spear was rumored to never miss its target and likewise will your voting ability gain in accuracy with it. Your vote now counts triple when on an evil player (this will not be shown publicly).

Mistletoe - Kills Balder if he receives it.

[Thomkal]

Sorry, that was completely my lousy keyboard (combined with quick typing).

oh my god, I was going crazy trying to figure that out! You just got my vote on day 1 if/when I play again, lol.

[EagleFan]

oh my god, I was going crazy trying to figure that out! You just got my vote on day 1 if/when I play again, lol.

Funny thing is I saw how badly it was typed after I hit submit and then said... nope not going to edit... never crossed my mind that it would be seen as anything but lousy typing.

[JAG]

oh my god, I was going crazy trying to figure that out! You just got my vote on day 1 if/when I play again, lol.

I saw you guys talking about that, but I must've missed what he said because I had no idea what the heck you were going on about.

[Thomkal]

No I guess it was just a good observation by you that I put the vote on right after Racer did even though I have no idea what was going on in my head at that point in the game.

yeah that first time wolf thing is tough especially when you are the big baddie himself. I thought you might have tried to get me lynched after I called you on that. My less than stellar voting didn't help matters either. I was thinking you were going after J23 because he was connected to Chubby somehow and killing him might do something to Chubby.

[Thomkal]

This is the first game that I've made it to the end alive and our side has won. Probably out of 25 some odd games

Congrats :)

[Autumn]

I like the idea of having the wolves try to hit the cycle, setting their kill order ahead of time, JAG. That's a fun twist.

[Thomkal]

Oh meant to mention that I liked the Valhalla concept-giving us vanilla villagers a chance to still participate and discuss the game, even if none of us made it there to till Day 4. :) More games should have this kind of concept I think.

[Autumn]

Oh meant to mention that I liked the Valhalla concept-giving us vanilla villagers a chance to still participate and discuss the game, even if none of us made it there to till Day 4. :) More games should have this kind of concept I think.

Yeah, I think it's a nice way to work that concept in. In the Amazing Race game having villagers hang around was maybe too powerful. Thi sis a nice way to harness that, but mediate the power. I'm definitely going to consider this mechanic as a way of doing something like that in other games where I've considered having a "hades" type thread.

[JAG]

Valhalla was one of the things I most enjoyed about the rules I made up. It was basically like having an in-game speculation thread for dead villagers and giving vanilla villagers additional chances to influence the outcome of the game. Though fooey on you all for waiting so long to kill off the vanillas.

[EagleFan]

Yeah, I think it's a nice way to work that concept in. In the Amazing Race game having villagers hang around was maybe too powerful.

But the wolves won that game so it couldn't have been that overpowered for the village. :)

[JAG]

The write-ups gave hints as to what wolves performed the killing. Large blunt force object was Utgaard-Loki, the dagger and sneak killing was Loki, and mau had the 'natural death' one (it took that long for him to have a kill because N2 he was blocked and N4 he only damaged Chubby).

[Autumn]

Narc guessed that was Hel's touch, his death. Good catch by him. I read too much into the sneak attack though, assuming that meant two different wolves had attacked.

[mckerney]

McKerney you kicked my butt. I was so afraid you where going to scan me and if I ended up lynched the next day Mau's sword would have ended up in a villagers hand(most likely) and we would have lost. I panicked and we lost hahah

I was planning the move all day, but I really didn't think it was going to work. I added the stuff about thinking I was safe because Loki had used an attack last night, but I was still thinking to myself, "There's no way they'll buy this, I'm practically begging Loki to attack me." I was expecting to be dead from the attack of one of the other wolves, but was very happy upon finding out I'd made my semi fake reveal believable enough. :)

[mauchow]

Zinto and I chatted on AIM for about an hour and a half last night on what we should end up doing. It was racer all night until you came along and wrecked our plans. Zinto got to licking his chops and wanted you badly. :) It was destiny I guess.

[EagleFan]

I was planning the move all day, but I really didn't think it was going to work. I added the stuff about thinking I was safe because Loki had used an attack last night, but I was still thinking to myself, "There's no way they'll buy this, I'm practically begging Loki to attack me." I was expecting to be dead from the attack of one of the other wolves, but was very happy upon finding out I'd made my semi fake reveal believable enough. :)

MVP!!!

[mckerney]

MVP!!!

Thanks! I certainly wasn't helping much tracking the wolves down, so I had to come up with some way to help the villager.

[mckerney]

I was mostly honest in my role reveal, I just made of the protection from vanilla wolves and left out the item stuff. Oh, and the part about killing Loki was obviously omitted.

You are Heimdall, the Watchman of the Gods and guardian of the Bifrost Rainbow Bridge to Asgard. Your powers of observation are far beyond that of any other, even Loki himself cannot fool you. As Loki's sworn enemy and as you are fated to slay him during Ragnarok, each night you may scan one player to determine if they are Loki. You are also immune to Loki's powers and if Loki attempts to night kill you, he will be successful but you will kill him as well. You will be aware of who passes you an item in the event that you receive one.

[MrBug708]

Zinto and I chatted on AIM for about an hour and a half last night on what we should end up doing. It was racer all night until you came along and wrecked our plans. Zinto got to licking his chops and wanted you badly. :) It was destiny I guess.

You would have randomized the mistletoe

[J23]

When Narc was killed and was a villager, I still thought he must have really been Loki, and one of his abilities was to fake his death. I could have sworn that Narc had posted that he sent me Odin's Spear night one at some point, but I never saw it, and didn't get an item until Hoops sent me the mistletoe night3(?).

[Danny]

I was pretty happy with how I thought my fake reveal was going to work out. Initially it was going to buy me a couple days, and then when Chubby revealed, it was going to get me killed, but we assumed I could brutal Thor and then night kill J23 and remove two more roled players and be in a pretty good position even down one wolf. The brutal going to bh ended up costing the wolves two night kills.

[CrimsonFox]

Why did you kill dubb and then j23. That was so .... odd. Because of that I was totally thinking that jeheinz or barkeep were wolves.

[CrimsonFox]

Congrats on your first game JAG. Was sensational!

[Danny]

Dubb was my call. I wanted him out of the game. No idea he was the seer and I knew it would reflect bad on me, but I was already done fairly early at that point. When someone is on like that, you want him dead.

[Danny]

Plus I didn't know Chubby would switch last minute, so especially thinking I might be dead then, Dubb would have been very trusted.

[Narcizo]

When Narc was killed and was a villager, I still thought he must have really been Loki, and one of his abilities was to fake his death. I could have sworn that Narc had posted that he sent me Odin's Spear night one at some point, but I never saw it, and didn't get an item until Hoops sent me the mistletoe night3(?).

I did. I think the item disappears when the correct owner of the item dies.

Bit shocked that Hoops wasn't a baddy and that there wasn't one.

I think Racer had a very good game for the village, no disrespect to mckerney's awesome play that, basically, blew the game open when it needed it the most, but I consider him MVP. I think the fact that he's the villager who was trusted the most without having a role at the end speaks of how well he played.

Loki had a lot of great powers. Would have been fun/uber-stressful to play. I think the problem with giving one player so many powers is that it adds a large degree of randomness into the game. I think a stronger conversion ability (something along the lines of Loki having a chance of swapping with a live player if they are vanilla) or weaker powers but a 5th baddy would have worked. But this was a fun game and a lot of the breaks went against the wolves so who knows.

Not the most inspiring performance by me all told. At least I voted Darth on day three - apart from that probably more of a hinder than a benefit to the good guys.

[Lathum]

I wonder if chubby still thinks I'm a wolf?

[jeheinz72]

Woo hoo! Winnah winnah chicken dinnah!

I played like shit but who cares I was alive for the win! :)

[Telle]

Good game all!! Was a lot of fun to play this one.

[The Jackal]

Seemed like a very fun game. The Valhalla speculation PMs was definitely a cool touch, even though we really didn't have any info to pass along.

[Autumn]

Yes, Racer played great, very clear thinking, I loved the way he put his notes together.

Telle, it was great to have you right in the thick of things. I was worried that maybe you were being more active because you were a wolf! But you added a lot to the game. If only Thomkal or NTN were bad, we would have looked genius!

[Telle]

I know.. can't believe that we had three villagers on the block two days in a row that far in!

[Autumn]

I know.. can't believe that we had three villagers on the block two days in a row that far in!

That was a real bummer, because I think you and I did well to recognize each other as villagers, and sway the vote. If only we'd had someone to sway the vote to.

[jeheinz72]

That was a real bummer, because I think you and I did well to recognize each other as villagers, and sway the vote. If only we'd had someone to sway the vote to.

Agreed, I was pretty confident you were both acting honestly. But yeah, fat lot of good that did me in my actual vote.

[Autumn]

Oh, and i know Hoops thought I was crazy to vote myself at the very end that night. I just wanted to point out that I didn't do so until deadline, it wasn't a ploy to get votes off me. But I knew i was vanilla, with no items. NTN hadn't been around all day, and I didn't want a last second tie to go to him only to find out he was important or had an item or some such.

[Thomkal]

I wonder if chubby still thinks I'm a wolf?

I do! But hey you got your revenge on me in the end. :D

[Thomkal]

Good game all!! Was a lot of fun to play this one.

It was great to see you be more active than normal here Telle, though perhaps being on the block forever had something to do with that. was great to see and chat with when we were both on the block.

[Thomkal]

Seemed like a very fun game. The Valhalla speculation PMs was definitely a cool touch, even though we really didn't have any info to pass along.

The Jackal has the "honor" I believe of being the first person to replace a "dead" player and still be active in the game. ;) Thanks for jumping in to help us out at the end there.

[Thomkal]

And if/when I play again, just remember when there's been absolutely no one making posts trying to defend me or vote switches to save me (well the votes on Telle there late perhaps an exception) as its been the last two games I've been on the block it really does mean I'm a villager-so please remember that! :)

[CrimsonFox]

Anyone who wants to be amused by me talking to myself can visit JAG's forum. I think JAG has to move the thread to PREVIOUS GAMES right?

[Chubby]

YAY we won!

[CrimsonFox]

This is actually the most active game I've ever seen right out of the gate. Ever day lots going on.

[Danny]

This is actually the most active game I've ever seen right out of the gate. Ever day lots going on.

Yes, very active. Not quite up to the level of Hoops' marvel game or spawn 3, but the most active I think we've had since then. Though my Group Therapy game as really active as well.

[Barkeep49]

I just want to say that I feel really good about my play as a vanilla villager this game. I attracted enough attention that the wolves never tried to kill me, but not so much attention that I got lynched. I was 100% in telling the truth from the lies with role reveals. Now granted I drew the wrong conclusions from mckerney's lies (what a great move btw) but at least I knew he was lying.

[Danny]

Yeah you played a strong game BK

[CrimsonFox]

There is an amusing comment about you toward the end of the thread in JAG's forum, barkeep :)

[Barkeep49]

There is an amusing comment about you toward the end of the thread in JAG's forum, barkeep :)
Absolutely a wolf, huh :)?

[Barkeep49]

Yes, very active. Not quite up to the level of Hoops' marvel game or spawn 3, but the most active I think we've had since then. Though my Group Therapy game as really active as well.
Damn you. I started re-reading Spawn 3. I love that rule set.

[CrimsonFox]

Absolutely a wolf, huh :)?

which explains my break from being a player. :)

[Danny]

Yes, I missed Spawn 1 and 2 as I didn't start playing WW yet, but I loved Spawn 3.

[Autumn]

You were so spot on, BK, you had me convinced you must be a wolf. Seriously, the way you were all over Danny from the first moment felt like too much to me. You were absolutely right, and I agreed with you about Danny's reveal, but you seemed so sure, and so determined to paint the rest of us as going along with him, that I felt you must be trying to game something.

I guess next time I'll just have to remember that's your villager stance ;-)

[Barkeep49]

You were so spot on, BK, you had me convinced you must be a wolf. Seriously, the way you were all over Danny from the first moment felt like too much to me. You were absolutely right, and I agreed with you about Danny's reveal, but you seemed so sure, and so determined to paint the rest of us as going along with him, that I felt you must be trying to game something.

I guess next time I'll just have to remember that's your villager stance ;-)
I have spent a lot of time thinking about game design and that role just didn't make sense. I think next game I'm going to try and play closer to how I played in later days when I pushed but with a different style. So when I show up slightly kinder and gentler don't lynch me :)

[Autumn]

I have spent a lot of time thinking about game design and that role just didn't make sense. I think next game I'm going to try and play closer to how I played in later days when I pushed but with a different style. So when I show up slightly kinder and gentler don't lynch me :)

Already making excuses.

<b>vote barkeep49</b>

Seriously, I need to tinker my playing style also, obviously. I'm not particularly good at analysis but I try to keep posting and thinking in thread, to at least keep things rolling. But it doesn't help if it distracts the village. I will be going for more thoughtful I think, less voluminous.

[mckerney]

Absolutely a wolf, huh :)?

See, I wasn't the only one. :)

[hoopsguy]

Yeah, posting too much in the thread never works. :)

I'm just glad the game ended the day it did, as I don't think I would have been able to stay alive Day 8. And that is the sort of comment I usually make as a wolf, not as a villager.

[Chubby]

Yeah, posting too much in the thread never works. :)

I'm just glad the game ended the day it did, as I don't think I would have been able to stay alive Day 8. And that is the sort of comment I usually make as a wolf, not as a villager.

i'm' glad you were a villager, i BG'd you twice

[CrimsonFox]

i'm' glad you were a villager, i BG'd you twice

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

That was a ballsy move!
I believed hoops but still...it IS hoops! :)

[CrimsonFox]

Yeah, posting too much in the thread never works. :)

I'm just glad the game ended the day it did, as I don't think I would have been able to stay alive Day 8. And that is the sort of comment I usually make as a wolf, not as a villager.

As I commented in the JAG thread, that last couple days, you reminded me of me yelling at the village to prove your innocence and not caring if they screwed themselves. :)

[Chubby]

i went

hoops, J23, almost Autumn but switched to Thomkal last minute (seriously thought about using my ability and BG'ing J23 again but decided to try and save it for later), hoops, racer

I tried to scare the wolves off from trying to kill me since I wasn't invicible but did have a chance to block a NK against myself and a chance to kill the attacker

[Thomkal]

thanks Chubby. :)

[CrimsonFox]

Was EF REALLY invincible or whatever or was all that just BS to keep the wolves from killing him.

[Zinto]

I thought you had 2 hit points like Batman in Autumn's game. We thought you where playing day two extremely weird and when you survived the night kill I figured you must have known you where going to survive the lynch and still have one one more life.

[Chubby]

I thought you had 2 hit points like Batman in Autumn's game. We thought you where playing day two extremely weird and when you survived the night kill I figured you must have known you where going to survive the lynch and still have one one more life.

who me? I didn't have any HP, if lynched i would have been dead at any time. I could survive one NK from the start, once I got my hammer I got chances to survive another and take out the attacker

[Zinto]

who me? I didn't have any HP, if lynched i would have been dead at any time. I could survive one NK from the start, once I got my hammer I got chances to survive another and take out the attacker


Yeah that's what was going through my head when you said you would survive night kills I thought you where just lying about it so we took a shot at you and luckily it was my turn to night kill or if we didn't kill you we would not have tried again.

[JAG]

Was EF REALLY invincible or whatever or was all that just BS to keep the wolves from killing him.

Just BS. He could've been NK'ed at any point.

[CrimsonFox]

I figured that. heh. Can't believe they bought it.

[Chubby]

Yeah that's what was going through my head when you said you would survive night kills I thought you where just lying about it so we took a shot at you and luckily it was my turn to night kill or if we didn't kill you we would not have tried again.

i had 1/3 chance of surviving a NK
1/6 chance of surviving a loki NK
100% chance of surviving a giant NK, 100% chance of killing said giant

(all post getting the hammer)

[Lathum]

This isn't a slight to any of the awesome players we have now, more funny going back several years, but I never thought I would see the day me, Hoops, and Barkeep would live to see the end of the same game as villagers.

[CrimsonFox]

This isn't a slight to any of the awesome players we have now, more funny going back several years, but I never thought I would see the day me, Hoops, and Barkeep would live to see the end of the same game as villagers.

I see what you mean. It was kinda crazy having that group plus a couple others live that long when usually they are killed pretty quickly by various methods. I kind of attributed that to the extra people and the oldbies coming back.

[JAG]

This isn't a slight to any of the awesome players we have now, more funny going back several years, but I never thought I would see the day me, Hoops, and Barkeep would live to see the end of the same game as villagers.

It doesn't seem all that long ago you couldn't make it past D2 alive.

[Autumn]

Just a couple months ago you guys were going through a long string of dying immediately, and getting really frustrated. So I'm glad to see we've dialed back on that enough to let you guys play through. I think we've had other guys come through with great villager or wolf games now, so there's not such a need to kill or lynch y'all.

[Lathum]

Just a couple months ago you guys were going through a long string of dying immediately, and getting really frustrated. So I'm glad to see we've dialed back on that enough to let you guys play through. I think we've had other guys come through with great villager or wolf games now, so there's not such a need to kill or lynch y'all.

I agree with this, some amazing play by everyone lately. I think I am going to adopt the new NTN style of playing, I've made it to the end of the game back to back.

[Lathum]

Just a couple months ago you guys were going through a long string of dying immediately, and getting really frustrated. So I'm glad to see we've dialed back on that enough to let you guys play through. I think we've had other guys come through with great villager or wolf games now, so there's not such a need to kill or lynch y'all.

I agree with this, some amazing play by everyone lately. I think I am going to adopt the new NTN style of playing, I've made it to the end of the game back to back.

[hoopsguy]

As I commented in the JAG thread, that last couple days, you reminded me of me yelling at the village to prove your innocence and not caring if they screwed themselves. :)

I cared - I deeply cared - but there was an element of "I'm going to push my agenda like crazy while I'm still around to promote it". I'm definitely not good at going quietly, and that is almost as true as a wolf.

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, your NTN style is going to get me to nuke you for not playing like yourself. I was already pushing this the last few days. It freaked me out, and that was after I had defended you earlier in the game.

[EagleFan]

I figured that. heh. Can't believe they bought it.

Wasn't sure if they bought it or were just waiting for the mistletoe so they could get two night kills during and not have to waste a night kill on me.

[Danny]

Lathum, your NTN style is going to get me to nuke you for not playing like yourself. I was already pushing this the last few days. It freaked me out, and that was after I had defended you earlier in the game.

Yeah, it's the type of thing that may work once or twice, but I don't see this being effective long term. I tend to vote for those types of players early in game and give the more vocal / active players a pass unless their is evidence against them.

[MrBug708]

Wasn't sure if they bought it or were just waiting for the mistletoe so they could get two night kills during and not have to waste a night kill on me.

Hey, I get some credit for hoarding the mistletoe :)

[CrimsonFox]

I cared - I deeply cared - but there was an element of "I'm going to push my agenda like crazy while I'm still around to promote it". I'm definitely not good at going quietly, and that is almost as true as a wolf.


I could definitely tell you cared for sure. But how passionate you were getting just didn't seem to be your usual self and definitely not something you do as a wolf. As a wolf you are calm and Satanic and sly speaking very quietly and succinctly and suggesting things that sound perfectly logical.

[Barkeep49]

I think hoops is better than anyone at varying his game. The crazy side is always just beneath the surface. The analytic side is just beneath surface. And depending on the day or the game you get to see which side of hoops he's chosen to show.

[dubb93]

Was a good game. Bummer I get a super role and die day one. Still can't believe DV tried to pull that crap day 1 ;)

[CrimsonFox]

As a note, this game was actually WW CXXXVI, not WW CXXVI