Reaching or Wishful Thinking?

[vladiator]

Quote: Originally Posted by Boltman

My thoughts exactly, look what dudes di with WE9, they redid all the kits, names, logos, etc.

I just wrote about PES 4, which, I think, might be just another name for WE 9. Sorry.BTW, why haka is signature. Are you from NZ?

[mercalnd]

Quote: Originally Posted by vladiator

There best game is PES 4, which was more popular that EA FIFA games.

First of all, they're up to PES5. Second of all they do have some licences like the Spanish Primera and Italian Serie A and Dutch League (PES4 also had these) which all have real players and clubs. PES5 also has many real players even on fake clubs, such as with the Premier League that has fake teams with real players, as well as licensed Arsenal and Chelsea. Also, FIFA outsells PES/Winning Eleven worldwide so to say that PES is more popular is not accurate. But it is indeed a better game than FIFA.

Other factors include the fact that soccer licensing is much more complex than the NFL, which allows Konami to buy licenses to individual leagues and clubs even though EA owns an exclusive FIFA license. This could not be done with the NFL. Last but not least, soccer games have a global market, which does not exist in football. Sure, there are football gamers around the world but nowhere near in the proportion of soccer gamers. Most US football fans that play football videogames want real teams and players out of the box, not with hours upon hours of tinkering. It's a shame but it is a fact.

[vladiator]

Quote: Originally Posted by spectralfan

First of all, they're up to PES5. Second of all they do have some licences like the Spanish Primera and Italian Serie A and Dutch League (PES4 also had these) which all have real players and clubs. PES5 also has many real players even on fake clubs, such as with the Premier League that has fake teams with real players, as well as licensed Arsenal and Chelsea. Also, FIFA outsells PES/Winning Eleven worldwide so to say that PES is more popular is not accurate. But it is indeed a better game than FIFA. Other factors include the fact that soccer licensing is much more complex than the NFL, which allows Konami to buy licenses to individual leagues and clubs even though EA owns an exclusive FIFA license. This could not be done with the NFL. Last but not least, soccer games have a global market, which does not exist in football. Sure, there are football gamers around the world but nowhere near in the proportion of soccer gamers. Most US football fans that play football videogames want real teams and players out of the box, not with hours upon hours of tinkering. It's a shame but it is a fact.

I didn't mention PES 5 because I knew that it was pretty much licensed so it wouldn't be a good comparison. Are you sure that Spanish league was licensed in PES 4? I only played English league, so I don't remember.As for the tinkering, I don't know... I am a non-American football fun, so I don't mind doing it.

[mercalnd]

Quote: Originally Posted by vladiator

I didn't mention PES 5 because I knew that it was pretty much licensed so it wouldn't be a good comparison. Are you sure that Spanish league was licensed in PES 4? I only played English league, so I don't remember.As for the tinkering, I don't know... I am a non-American football fun, so I don't mind doing it.

Yes the Italian, Spanish and Dutch leagues were all licensed in PES4.

[jrivera34]

Quote: Originally Posted by vegaas

I think its wishfull thinking. But imagine if they developed a game that improved upon 2k5 gameplay. But added all the off the field stuff. Suspensions for drugs, trade demands, etc. Then imagine they have a online feature that lets you create real leagues. I mean, multiple seasons, drafts each year, free agency, the works. All online, each team run by a human player. You wouldnt buy this because it doesnt have the NFL associated with this? Then you are not a football fan my friend.

I think you nailed it with your last sentence. The majority of people are "NFL" fans, not fans of the game of football. Which will translate into poor sales and that is all EA, 2K, MS, Sony, etc care about. I am not a soccer fan, but I think soccer fans love the game of soccer more than the players and/or teams and that is why non licensed soccer games do well.

I would love a fully customizable football game. I remember about 5 years or so ago (not sure if they still have it) in the Madden PC game, you could create your own teams (logos, jersey, helmet, etc) and your own league. I had a blast with that game. Many gamers on the web used this as an opportunity to create old school unis and NCAA uni's, but I created totally new teams.

Unfortunately, I think I am in the minority and I am afraid that is 2K's thinking as well. Let's hope it is just taking much longer than expected to make this a fully customizable game and they don't want to commit to anything yet.

[Chibi]

Quote: Originally Posted by jrivera34

I think you nailed it with your last sentence. The majority of people are "NFL" fans, not fans of the game of football. Which will translate into poor sales and that is all EA, 2K, MS, Sony, etc care about. I am not a soccer fan, but I think soccer fans love the game of soccer more than the players and/or teams and that is why non licensed soccer games do well.

Maybe over here, and even in Japan, there's some of that (love of the sport ahead of a particular team), but to those in Europe or South America, their loyalty to their team far exceeds loyalty to the sport. WE does great business internationally, due to its sheer quality, even without most of the Premiership or national sides or what have you being licensed.

Of course, the fact that you can edit teams into almost perfect replicas, for the most part, certainly doesn't hurt.

I'd kill for a 2k football game that followed the WE formula, but I definitely think things are too different (Madden is a 900-pound gorilla, as opposed to FIFA, which sells great but doesn't have nearly the same kind of hold on its respective market) to be very hopeful about it.