From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

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  • CujoMatty
    Member of Rush Nation
    • Oct 2007
    • 5445

    #31
    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

    Originally posted by Knight165
    That's your loss then.
    First....Dickey still performs pretty well even with his age degradation. Sometimes VERY well.
    ...and while nothing will stop his age 40 drops.....they aren't
    -pre determined ......not as set numbers anyway. Both training AND performance will alter his drops. It's not going to be enough to satisfy you guys.....but it's dependent on a few things.
    If he goes 12-12 with a 4.80 ERA...his drops will be different than if he goes 15-7 with a 3.45 ERA....
    -They also don't necessarily mean that he will be a bum. Either in the current season or the next.

    There is a variance in the game....a definite randomness in player performance regardless of ratings. I think SCEA put the random factor into performance rather than on the chance of ratings changes(for the exact reason that YOU immediately rid yourself of Dickey......so that guys will have a chance to get a surprise player.
    In my instance it's Eric Young Jr. 50 games into my season..with his crappy high 50's mid 60's contact...he is hitting almost .400 in 170 or so AB's. If you looked at his ratings only, you'd never give him a chance. I did...and it's paying off.

    --A 20 point drop in OVR(groan).....doesn't mean a 20 point drop in individual ratings....it's 10-12 usually for that drop at that age.
    While it starts at age 34(usually...there are some that don't)...it's usually a progressively steeper drop as they get older....which is in line with the numbers that fangraphs and other sites show as being the case.

    It could be more random......I want everything to be more "random" in the game.....(maybe just less predictable)....but like I said...they already did this in a way.

    M.K.
    Knight165

    While I was waiting for OSFM this year I said screw it and stuck with him at first. He was my best pitcher 6-1 with an Era under 2. That was about a month and a bit in. I look and he's starting to drop and starts getting drilled in his starts. Within 2 weeks he lost mph on his knuckle ball (which makes zero sense)
    And every other stat too. Buehrle same thing just not as bad. It had nothing to do with me giving any sort of interest about his ratings. I've never cared ever about ratings. It's a number. It did have everything to do with him being horrible and the fact that he's going to be useless by the all star break and that the only real reason I could see was his ratings plummeting no matter what I do.

    Again I could care less about what someone's overall rating is and I think your misunderstanding me that I do. I promise I don't. I know their are a lot of guys that moan that so and so is only a whatever But im definetly not one. Hes noticeably terrible in game.

    I said it before and ill try and be clearer. Also for the sake of this argument you need to assume his stats are comparable to his real life stats. If mlb 14 the game felt it was realistic that Dickey lost 8 mph on his pitches in one year than in mlb 15 that probably should've been the case on the default roster. SCEA's roster. If you compare Dickey's individual ratings after 1 year on mlb 14 they should be similar to his ratings on mlb 15 default roster If IMO the regression system is to be considered realistic. I think that that's fair. But they aren't close. Not even remotely. Not even if dickey has a great year. In 14 after one year his ratings, overall and individual pitch speed, h/9, whatever are abysmal. No matter what. But in 15 they are very similar to where he started in 14. I just can't believe that I'm the only one that thinks that doesn't make sense lol.

    So clearly I'm not understanding what's going on with you saying ratings don't really mean anything. You definetly know more than me about the ratings with all the work you do on rosters and such (which I'm very thankful for BTW lol) I guess more clarification would be nice.

    Im guessing you haven't played as the jays but buehrle and dickey are both useless the way the game handles regression. Basically willard (who knows the jays roster better than anyone IMO) said in his jays thread I believe, that he manually edits dickey's ratings so he doesn't decline so rapidly. I really shouldn't have to do that.
    2016 NLL Champion Saskatchewan Rush
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    • Smallville102001
      All Star
      • Mar 2015
      • 6542

      #32
      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

      Originally posted by cujomatty
      As a jays fan I can totally agree about Dickey. I can't stand him. But my point wasn't just to be about him. All the older players plummet like crazy, regardless of in game production. I honestly don't see how anyone agrees with a player dropping 20 plus points in a half a year. I like that there is a regression system but the results are so pre determined regardless of any other factors than age.
      Dickey can be amazing in my game and he's inevitably going to drop.

      I could see if he was playing terrible dropping to a 70 by the end of the year and then having to make a decision to call it a carreer. That would be pretty cool actually. As is as right now Dickey could be having a Cy young season and be mid 60s by the all star break. I dunno maybe I'm wrong but that seems so dumb to me. If he was playing awesome and dropped from an 84 to 78 because of his age by the end of year you would be in a situation were a desicion of "ok do i give Dickey 1 more year" type situation which would be super cool.

      The way it is now I know Dickey is going to be a crutch. No matter what. No matter how he performs. I better deal him before I play game 1. I just don't like that pre determined outcome at all.


      Yeah most players in sports don't just fail off the wall. Most players will get a little worse for sever years in a row. Also yeah with the way it is a guy like him and have a great year and then is going to need to maybe retire next year because he is going to be so much worse. Most players don't go from having a great year to retiring just like that. If a picture is 35 and has a like 20-5 year with a ERA of 2 he is not going to just be like I am not the same player time to retire lol.

      Comment

      • Purplepower_NC
        Pro
        • Sep 2004
        • 674

        #33
        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

        I have been following this topic…..but I never sim ahead seasons and manage my games. But I have noticed that training does curve some of the decline, and the way the CPU's auto-train works. I have noticed that when I have a player set to auto-train, most of the time it works on an area that the player does not need. For instance a player with low steal rating…that is not a base stealer. Even in year 2 of my franchise this happens. So could this be the cause of some of the drops.

        I know and understand what you guys are saying about 20 pt drops at certain age, but is this type of drop happen in 1 year, or is it a gradual drop of areas over years because the CPU only address the areas that have little or no use to that player i.e training for speed when he is not a fast player to began with.

        Comment

        • taterskin
          Pro
          • Jul 2008
          • 590

          #34
          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

          It's an overnight drop. I saw on a RTTS team ....the team I was on signed trout to a 5 year deal. He was at a 93. The very next season....in low 70's at age 34.

          Comment

          • TonyDanzaFan
            Banned
            • Mar 2012
            • 594

            #35
            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

            This has been a problem since the first inception it feels like. Idk why they refuse to fix this. It's annoying having to constantly edit players.

            Comment

            • Knight165
              *ll St*r
              • Feb 2003
              • 24964

              #36
              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

              http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/hitte...-only-decline/

              M.K.
              Knight165
              All gave some. Some gave all. 343

              Comment

              • BestServedCold
                Banned
                • Jul 2010
                • 673

                #37
                Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                Originally posted by Knight165
                Yeah, but it doesn't seem like a steady decline, it's a sudden drop.

                Comment

                • Steven78
                  Banned
                  • Apr 2013
                  • 7240

                  #38
                  Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                  Like Albert Pujols in real life?

                  Comment

                  • garyjr33
                    Pro
                    • Dec 2011
                    • 517

                    #39
                    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                    Using the Yankees is horrible with this in effect...haha. I am in September now. And Teixeira is a 70. ARod is a 66. Beltran is a 72.
                    NHL: Rangers
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                    • Knight165
                      *ll St*r
                      • Feb 2003
                      • 24964

                      #40
                      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                      Originally posted by Steven78
                      Like Albert Pujols in real life?


                      Albert?......C.C.? .....Cudd??.....

                      Can you guys hear me?

                      I'd send down the rope, but it's not long enough!!!

                      M.K.
                      Knight165
                      All gave some. Some gave all. 343

                      Comment

                      • tabarnes19_SDS
                        Game Designer
                        • Feb 2003
                        • 3084

                        #41
                        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                        Originally posted by garyjr33
                        Using the Yankees is horrible with this in effect...haha. I am in September now. And Teixeira is a 70. ARod is a 66. Beltran is a 72.
                        Each Sim is different. I am in 2016 and Tex is an 82. Pujols is an 83.

                        There is not a linear path.

                        2016 and Koji is a 64 Overall but about to win the RP of the year award.

                        Stop caring about the Overalls...

                        Comment

                        • MLB Bob
                          MVP
                          • Jan 2011
                          • 1008

                          #42
                          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                          Wheres Youkilis playing now?

                          Comment

                          • Steven78
                            Banned
                            • Apr 2013
                            • 7240

                            #43
                            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                            He's playing in retirement leagues.

                            Comment

                            • geisterhome
                              MVP
                              • Sep 2011
                              • 2101

                              #44
                              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                              Originally posted by Knight165
                              Well...that's not really how the ratings for players on default rosters work.
                              Last 3 weighted....which still includes his phenomenal 2012 Met season still factoring in.

                              ...and 2-5 with a 5.49 ERA....if he keeps it up....he will be a 60 if he's lucky.

                              But I think Lorne gave him some extra love on '15 anyway....nothing about his 2014 season screamed the ratings he got(I'm not going to even discuss the ridiculous OVR rating that most of these talks surround...what an inherently irrelevant rating that they never should have put in the game in the first place)

                              M.K
                              Knight165
                              The OVR in the game is a much better evaluation of a players ability than you make it sound, for sure it sounds pretty cool claiming not to even bother looking at it since this is way too shallow but in fact it often gives you a very good indication of the quality of a player. And when it comes to regression it becomes even more relevant since players decline across the board pretty evenly.
                              Spending time with Jesus!

                              -Glad to be an Operation Sports Member!-

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                              • jvalverde88
                                Moderator
                                • Jun 2008
                                • 11787

                                #45
                                Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                                Originally posted by tabarnes19
                                Each Sim is different. I am in 2016 and Tex is an 82. Pujols is an 83.

                                There is not a linear path.

                                2016 and Koji is a 64 Overall but about to win the RP of the year award.

                                Stop caring about the Overalls...
                                This so much, pay attention to what attributes are declining and by how much. I have Bartolo's OVR declining but he's still in the top 5 of the NL in K's for me.
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