From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

Collapse

Recommended Videos

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • thescottyglasgow
    Rookie
    • Mar 2013
    • 175

    #61
    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

    Originally posted by MLB Bob
    Why does the players stats have anything to do with what happens to him physically (in this case his ratings) the next year, especially when hes obviously in his regression years? Bartolo Colon having an era of 2.5 has absolutely no barring on his ability the following year or even what his stats would be. He could be crap or he could be good again. I dont understand the argument.
    I could see if it happened during the offseason but what I am saying is it would be nice if he pitched to a 2.5 era in July lets say so for that month he only dropped 2-3 points or something and then if he pitched above a 4.5 he would drop the 10-15 for being awful. I just have a problem with how well or poorly a player is performing not being reflected in his progression and regression. I would rather it be toned down during the year and if they are going to take a mandatory 10-15 point hit every month for being older it happen during the offseason not while they are pitching in the all star game and winning the mvp.

    Comment

    • cts50
      Banned
      • Jun 2014
      • 557

      #62
      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

      Originally posted by thescottyglasgow
      For me it has nothing to do with overall or any certain players. I only use guys has examples that i notice. I have a problem that it seems every player is set on when they will progress and regress no matter what from the start. Their is nothing random and nothing in the franchise except the potential emails to change it. Playing great or horribly does not change the players ratings over time. I just would like it if I am pitching with bartolo and have a 2.5 era he should not be dropping 10-12 across the board. Likewise if I simulate far into the future and Trout has won mvp three years in a row and leads in every triple crown category plus steals but is regressing heavily at age 30 it makes no sense.
      Dude, buddy is 42 years old and weighs 300 pounds. Sorry that he is regressing physically in your video game. lol

      And Trout should regress around age 30. That is how baseball works.

      Comment

      • MLB Bob
        MVP
        • Jan 2011
        • 1008

        #63
        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

        Originally posted by thescottyglasgow
        I could see if it happened during the offseason but what I am saying is it would be nice if he pitched to a 2.5 era in July lets say so for that month he only dropped 2-3 points or something and then if he pitched above a 4.5 he would drop the 10-15 for being awful. I just have a problem with how well or poorly a player is performing not being reflected in his progression and regression. I would rather it be toned down during the year and if they are going to take a mandatory 10-15 point hit every month for being older it happen during the offseason not while they are pitching in the all star game and winning the mvp.
        But what would driving the change from a 2.5 era to a 4.5 era if it's not ratings, the gamers ability? So is the consensus the stats based progression doesn't affect players during regression as the developers have stated was added this year? Also the example given would almost mean that any older player that gets off to a good start in the season gets to carry that forward throughout the year and can't regress? So if the start with a 2.5 era they should end that way? Players in real life all the time have terrible 2nd halfs for one reason or another and regression through the season is a real thing

        Comment

        • thescottyglasgow
          Rookie
          • Mar 2013
          • 175

          #64
          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

          Originally posted by MLB Bob
          But what would driving the change from a 2.5 era to a 4.5 era if it's not ratings, the gamers ability? So is the consensus the stats based progression doesn't affect players during regression as the developers have stated was added this year? Also the example given would almost mean that any older player that gets off to a good start in the season gets to carry that forward throughout the year and can't regress? So if the start with a 2.5 era they should end that way? Players in real life all the time have terrible 2nd halfs for one reason or another and regression through the season is a real thing
          I do not think their performace affects anything at all unless you get the email. Yes I would like it just to be more about user and player performance. I would be fine if they lose 2-3 or even 5 points while pitching great if older I know they will not carry it throughout the year. If they get off to a hot start the first month they shouldnt drop 10-12 points no matter what. I think they should drop 5 or so. If then they pitch a little bit worse the next month they should go down even more 8-10 and if not great at all then take the big 10-15 point hit. I just dont like feeling like they are going to take the hit no matter what I do or how they are performing. So even if pitching lights out and taking four 5 point hits they would lose 20 points throughout the year and that would be fine with me and seem realistic not 40 or 50
          Last edited by thescottyglasgow; 06-07-2015, 11:48 PM.

          Comment

          • Potatoes002
            MVP
            • Jul 2008
            • 2143

            #65
            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

            I'm not going to convince anyone at this point as the argument has been beaten around for a few months now. But still, my view on the issue is this:

            The game needs more randomness. Some players should completely fall apart in their 30's, dramatically. Some should slowly level off. Some should also have a late surge (Jose Bautista) later in their careers.

            I just have a problem seeing a guy hitting .315, but then losing 15 points in contact/power/discipline etc. over the course of a year. There is no reason for that being so severe when they are producing. You don't see high rated players in MLB 14 THE SHOW who had great years in 2014 lose that much of their rating over to this year's game. Production does matter a little in regression in this year's game, but not near enough.

            I'm okay with physical attributes like speed being depleted over time, as that is realistic with age/injuries.

            While people keep asking why it matters what his rating is if the player is still producing, there comes a point where the player is almost useless because of how fast the regression is.

            I want the roster in my franchise to look like the stock roster regarding the older players. I just don't see that with the individual attributes falling off a cliff.

            Comment

            • cmutat17
              Banned
              • Apr 2015
              • 127

              #66
              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

              Originally posted by cts50
              I have studied the new progression system a lot lately and personally, I love it.

              People need to research aging curves before they come on here bitching about their favorite players regressing in OVR rating.

              Like, someone was just whining about Trout losing OVR points when he simmed out into his age 30 season...

              And Shields losing points once he was 34...


              Um...what exactly did you expect? Trout should just stay 99 forever? Sorry, but it doesnt work that way.


              You could have just typed what's bolded instead of insulting a few people.



              Originally posted by cts50
              Or how about some examples...

              Albert Pujols. Clear peak at age 28-29...steady decline since.

              Josh Hamilton. Clear peak at age 29....steady decline since.

              Josh Beckett. Clear peak at around ages 27-31....steady decline until retirement.

              Miguel Cabrera. Clear peak around ages 27-30.....probably headed for a steady decline.

              CC Sabathia. Clear peak around ages 27-30....steady decline since.

              Derek Jeter. Long time as an elite player, and then a steady decline from age 32 until retirement.

              I can keep going.

              Okay, genius are these examples of a 'steady decline'......
              Attached Files

              Comment

              • MLB Bob
                MVP
                • Jan 2011
                • 1008

                #67
                Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                Originally posted by cmutat17
                Okay, genius are these examples of a 'steady decline'......
                What are their stats? If the ratings arent translating to a massive decrease in stats, the overalls or individual ratings arent a big deal. Its what the player can do all together. So what was his stats before and after decline?

                Comment

                • KBLover
                  Hall Of Fame
                  • Aug 2009
                  • 12172

                  #68
                  Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                  Originally posted by Potatoes002
                  I just have a problem seeing a guy hitting .315, but then losing 15 points in contact/power/discipline etc. over the course of a year. There is no reason for that being so severe when they are producing. You don't see high rated players in MLB 14 THE SHOW who had great years in 2014 lose that much of their rating over to this year's game. Production does matter a little in regression in this year's game, but not near enough.

                  I'm okay with physical attributes like speed being depleted over time, as that is realistic with age/injuries.

                  Because making a roster based on the past and predicting the future (progression/declining) are two different things.

                  What if it goes the other way? In real life, the player falls apart but in your franchise, he's still going strong? Jay Bruce is an example. In my franchise in 2017, he's still an All-Star - in real life, he hit .217 in 2014 and is hitting .223 now and has fallen into bad habits at the plate according to some scout reports I've read (too uppercut pull happy, etc) - so who knows what he'll be in 2017.

                  He's also doing this (irl) at 28 - a "prime" year.

                  As far as physical ability - how many NON-physical abilities are their in ratings? Vision, Discipline, and Clutch. Everything else relates to a physical skill. Power? Bat speed? Bat control? Range? Control? Movement? Velocity? Those are all physical abilities.
                  "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

                  Comment

                  • KBLover
                    Hall Of Fame
                    • Aug 2009
                    • 12172

                    #69
                    Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                    Originally posted by MLB Bob
                    What are their stats? If the ratings arent translating to a massive decrease in stats, the overalls or individual ratings arent a big deal. Its what the player can do all together. So what was his stats before and after decline?

                    Not to mention that Dickey still looks useful. His /9 are iffy, but his pitches (Velocity/Control/Movement) still look serviceable as a long reliever.

                    His OVR is suffering because his fielding abilities are trash and if he's playing with Dickey, that 41 HR/9 doesn't even matter (HR/9 has no impact on played games, only simmed games), which is also hindering his OVR.

                    Speaking OVR, I'd take Dickey over Colon even though they are both 67.
                    "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

                    Comment

                    • thescottyglasgow
                      Rookie
                      • Mar 2013
                      • 175

                      #70
                      Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                      Originally posted by KBLover
                      Because making a roster based on the past and predicting the future (progression/declining) are two different things.

                      What if it goes the other way? In real life, the player falls apart but in your franchise, he's still going strong? Jay Bruce is an example. In my franchise in 2017, he's still an All-Star - in real life, he hit .217 in 2014 and is hitting .223 now and has fallen into bad habits at the plate according to some scout reports I've read (too uppercut pull happy, etc) - so who knows what he'll be in 2017.

                      He's also doing this (irl) at 28 - a "prime" year.

                      As far as physical ability - how many NON-physical abilities are their in ratings? Vision, Discipline, and Clutch. Everything else relates to a physical skill. Power? Bat speed? Bat control? Range? Control? Movement? Velocity? Those are all physical abilities.
                      That would be great for me if some guys would flame out before 28 some random players would just never be good and are just awful... but the point has nothing to do with any of the ratings or who is better or worse or how they are performing for you. It is the progression/regression being extremely drastic at certain ages no matter what and having nothing to do with reflecting the players real time performance in the franchise at all. I think that is the best way I can sum it up.
                      Last edited by thescottyglasgow; 06-08-2015, 11:58 AM.

                      Comment

                      • jlindzzz
                        Just started!
                        • Jun 2015
                        • 1

                        #71
                        Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                        honestly players start regressing after they reach their max potential. if they keep doing well at their max potential they may plateau for a couple of years. if they are struggling, they will see downgrades. to me, it's really annoying as an avid franchise mode player as when I get into the 2020s, players like Trout and Kershaw are diminishing. for example there is no reason an age 28 Trout should be 87 overall... granted of course, anything can happen, but truly, it diminishes what these players can do in their careers in franchise mode as they are left to die in free agency by the age of 33 or so, when in reality they have a good 3-7 years left in the tank. I really hope MLB the Show addresses this in the future, as this mountain-effect in player progression has really begun to grind my gears.


                        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                        Comment

                        • cmutat17
                          Banned
                          • Apr 2015
                          • 127

                          #72
                          Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                          Originally posted by MLB Bob
                          What are their stats? If the ratings arent translating to a massive decrease in stats, the overalls or individual ratings arent a big deal. Its what the player can do all together. So what was his stats before and after decline?

                          Bartolo Colon: 13-8, 2.79 (ERA), 128 (K), 210.1 (IP) 67 overall at the end of the season


                          RA Dickey: 8-17, 4.31 (ERA), 126 (K), 200.2 (IP) 67 overall at the end of season.

                          Comment

                          • MLB Bob
                            MVP
                            • Jan 2011
                            • 1008

                            #73
                            Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                            Originally posted by cmutat17
                            Bartolo Colon: 13-8, 2.79 (ERA), 128 (K), 210.1 (IP) 67 overall at the end of the season


                            RA Dickey: 8-17, 4.31 (ERA), 126 (K), 200.2 (IP) 67 overall at the end of season.
                            So besides the K's being low, wheres the issue? You dont like seeing the overall number? The stats seem fine from what youre showing which is very limited. Colons ERA is actually really good. W-L is meaningless but seems realistic. Number of innings seems about right for both.

                            So the drop in over all from this limited amount of info doesnt translate to a players stats falling off a cliff just the meaningless overall number and estaic of that falling off a cliff..but people want more stats but base everything on overall? Im still very confused on what the issue is now.

                            I was expecting to see them with 6.0 ERAs and a million hits and no K's and everything tanking..seems like everything is ok though

                            Comment

                            • thescottyglasgow
                              Rookie
                              • Mar 2013
                              • 175

                              #74
                              Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                              Originally posted by MLB Bob
                              So besides the K's being low, wheres the issue? You dont like seeing the overall number? The stats seem fine from what youre showing which is very limited. Colons ERA is actually really good. W-L is meaningless but seems realistic. Number of innings seems about right for both.

                              So the drop in over all from this limited amount of info doesnt translate to a players stats falling off a cliff just the meaningless overall number and estaic of that falling off a cliff..but people want more stats but base everything on overall? Im still very confused on what the issue is now.

                              I was expecting to see them with 6.0 ERAs and a million hits and no K's and everything tanking..seems like everything is ok though
                              It really matters. How is it not a problem if someone pitching like that is going to drop 10-15 every month and not be able to crack a major league roster unless you are manually putting him in your rotation. The computer will have him in AA. If you do not care about the overalls then do not play franchise because the whole thing is based on them. He will probably retire due to ability after the next year.

                              Comment

                              • MLB Bob
                                MVP
                                • Jan 2011
                                • 1008

                                #75
                                Re: From a 92 rating to 74 just because he's 34??

                                Originally posted by thescottyglasgow
                                It really matters. How is it not a problem if someone pitching like that is going to drop 10-15 every month and not be able to crack a major league roster unless you are manually putting him in your rotation. The computer will have him in AA. If you do not care about the overalls then do not play franchise because the whole thing is based on them. He will probably retire due to ability after the next year.
                                Youre right, I am ok with that..they will be 40+ retirement is a very strong possibility. I also dont have a problem with a decline in ratings if the stats arent tanking with them.

                                And no player is dropping 10-15 a month. Maybe 15-20 a year...but players arent droping 60-90 points a season, which is 10-15 a month
                                Last edited by MLB Bob; 06-09-2015, 11:58 AM.

                                Comment

                                Working...