Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

[CubbyFan23]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

You can use anecdotes all day...

Hamilton rakes at a higher clip, and plays better D. End of.

Uh Josh Hamilton does not play better defense than Grady Sizemore.

[B_rad13]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

This top 5 is the only one I agree with.

[B_rad13]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Also who ever think Hamilton is better defensively than Sizemore must not watch baseball ever.

[Jamal G.]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

I wasn't aware that the first two months of the season didn't count. My fault.

No, but it is your fault for failing to realize that four months are a greater sample size for evaluating a player than two.

[Marino]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Hey, where the hell is Brian Anderson?!?!?!?

I'm kidding I'm kidding

Dude Anderson is the man, my friend got his autograph when he played in Charlotte.

[JoeDog10]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

I have to somewhat disagree with the RBI argument from earlier, at least for stud players. You actually think that if A-Rod was on the Padres and was healthy, he wouldn't drive in pretty much the same amount of runs as he would with the Yankees? I don't buy that.

Outside of just being great hitters, guys that drive in a lot of runs each year do so because the hitters in front of them see better pitches, which means they are always going to have guys on base in front of them.

Take a look at Manny last year when he got traded from the Red Sox to a far more inferior offensive team like the Dodgers. In 53 games with LA he hit .396 with 17 HR's and 53 RBI's.

[CubbyFan23]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Outside of just being great hitters, guys that drive in a lot of runs each year do so because the hitters in front of them see better pitches, which means they are always going to have guys on base in front of them.

Studies have shown this is not true. I'll see if I can dig up a few later when I get home.

ARod wouldn't have close to the amount of RBI in San Diego (even excluding because of the park) as he does in New York. RBI are one of the most worthless statistics in the game. Manny drove in that many runs because he went on an insane hot streak, certainly no one thinks he's that type of hitter over 162 games, regardless of where he plays.

More often than not, good hitters have good RBI totals, but there's just better ways of evaluating good hitters than RBIs and nothing you do special is found solely in RBIs.

[WatchdogXC]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

I've been waiting for CF knowing that Sizemore would be the first Indians to make the list and probably the highest rated one as well. Sizemore is someone that just looking at stats doesn't show the whole story. His numbers at times look like anyone else and then you realize he is doing some pretty rare stuff all around from year to year. I was disappointed in his BA last season, but really that doesn't matter when you walk as much as he did and have that kind of power. I really like having him as a leadoff hitter compared to many Indian fans. I don't want him moving down as I want him batting as many times as possible.

[Jamal G.]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

I've been waiting for CF knowing that Sizemore would be the first Indians to make the list and probably the highest rated one as well. Sizemore is someone that just looking at stats doesn't show the whole story. His numbers at times look like anyone else and then you realize he is doing some pretty rare stuff all around from year to year. I was disappointed in his BA last season, but really that doesn't matter when you walk as much as he did and have that kind of power. I really like having him as a leadoff hitter compared to many Indian fans. I don't want him moving down as I want him batting as many times as possible.

Looking at the stats does tell you Grady Sizemore's whole story: he is a defensively supreme player that plays an up-the-middle position, and he is a 30/30 bat with a career wOBA and IsoD of .374 and .091, respectively - that makes him arguably the best Major League Baseball player not named Albert Pujols, Alex Rodriguez and Hanley Ramirez.

[green94]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

No, but it is your fault for failing to realize that four months are a greater sample size for evaluating a player than two.

So what you are saying is that I should take the greater of the two samples sizes and not the sum of the entire year? Got it.

[EnigmaNemesis]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Looking at the stats does tell you Grady Sizemore's whole story: he is a defensively supreme player that plays an up-the-middle position, and he is a 30/30 bat with a career wOBA and IsoD of .374 and .091, respectively - that makes him arguably the best Major League Baseball player not named Albert Pujols, Alex Rodriguez and Hanley Ramirez.

Agreed. Best CF in the game. And I hope Ellsbury can reach that status (live up to his potential), since he was being compared to Grady in some ways, which is a complement.

Giving that Ellsbury does not have to trade duties with Coco, he may just break out of his shell.

[GoBucs09]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Because nobody who enjoys the statistical analysis aspect of baseball would ever dare to argue "Fielding Percentage" in a discussion about a player's defense?

McLouth was -40 using Bill James' Plus-Minus system as a center fielder in 2008; that means he made 40 fewer plays than the league-average defender at that position (worst in baseball). Also, his UZR/150 was 14.3 runs below average (costing his team roughly one win by himself over the 2008 season) - not to mention taking into account range runs only, he was 15.9 below average. In terms of range and actually getting to the ball (which is the most important thing an outfielder can do, which is why fielding percentage is an unbelievably stupid stat to use), Nate McLouth was not only the worst center fielder in baseball in 2008, but one of the ten-worst outfielders in baseball.

Lastly, discounting his abhorrent defensive value for a second, he hit .257/.331/.437 not including the first two months of the season, he isn't that good.

Hmm, wasn't even aware of those types of stats. It does apear that McLouth was one of the worst center fielders in the league last year, but he did a whole lot better in left and right field.

This however begs the question, if he was so poor defensivly then how in the heck did he win a gold glove? I thought the gold glove was supposed to mean you had a great defensive year? Is the gold glove total BS then? If its total BS, then why the heck does the media, baseball players and fans make such a big deal about it?

Speaking of which, looking at that UZR/150 stat, Josh Hamilton was actually worse than McLouth. Think it was 16.5 or something for Hamilton.

Perhaps the Pirates need to get McCutchen to start in CF and have McLouth play right. Looks like I know what I'm doing when I start my franchise.

[lstephen]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

This however begs the question, if he was so poor defensivly then how in the heck did he win a gold glove? I thought the gold glove was supposed to mean you had a great defensive year? Is the gold glove total BS then? If its total BS, then why the heck does the media, baseball players and fans make such a big deal about it?

I like the way this article explains it: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index...ter-conspiracy

Basically, gold glovers are usually the guys who look good fielding the balls they get to, rather than the guys who get to the most balls.

[Jamal G.]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

So what you are saying is that I should take the greater of the two samples sizes and not the sum of the entire year? Got it.

Where did you get that idea? All I said from the get-go in regards to this point was that Nate McLouth's 2008 season is being overrated because from the start of June throughout the rest of the season he was basically a league-average-hitting center fielder; not the Silver Slugger-caliber player his entire 2008 lines show him to be.

Of course his entire season should be taken into account, but the fact is that he was not a consistent hitter, and his many peak and dives can't be ignored.

[Jamal G.]

Re: Top 5 Center Fielders in MLB09 The Show

Hmm, wasn't even aware of those types of stats. It does apear that McLouth was one of the worst center fielders in the league last year, but he did a whole lot better in left and right field.

This however begs the question, if he was so poor defensivly then how in the heck did he win a gold glove? I thought the gold glove was supposed to mean you had a great defensive year? Is the gold glove total BS then? If its total BS, then why the heck does the media, baseball players and fans make such a big deal about it?

Speaking of which, looking at that UZR/150 stat, Josh Hamilton was actually worse than McLouth. Think it was 16.5 or something for Hamilton.

Perhaps the Pirates need to get McCutchen to start in CF and have McLouth play right. Looks like I know what I'm doing when I start my franchise.

I think they'll have him play left field in order to avoid moving him again to make room for Jose Tabata in right field.