*****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I understand what you are saying. Basically the game is programmed to get what it deems a realistic result, and sliders will skew how it goes about doing that.

Well heck, I might as well just play on default then lol.

I would alter that to say "extreme slider adjustments" may skew how the game plays.

When you got to one extreme or another with a slider (max it out, minimize it), you may skew the game, depending on how sensitive the slider is and how integral it is to performance.

When I first played default sliders, I expected an onslaught of solid hits to ruin the game and make it feel arcadish. It wasn't. There were quite a few solid hits, but also a lot of routine grounders (even a few tappers). When the solid hits were hit to the OF, I understood why they position them so deeply and give them the ability to cover a lot of ground. I was able to blast a double over an OF's head (directly over his head, as did the AI), which was something I had not seen with solid hits at 0 or 1. I did see balls hit off the wall, down the line, and in the gap ... just nothing directly over the OF's head (unless you take speed down to zero, which also can create issues).

The big thing I noticed was the reduction in foul balls (thank God). There wasn't an 11-pitch at bat every 2 or 3 innings. (11-pitch at bats aren't really that common, although they do happen). If a game has a large number of foul balls, it seems to artificially inflate pitch counts and S%. So, when trying to attain a good mix of pitcher control, the problem could be "too many foul balls" (or weaker contact) rather than "the pitchers throw too many strikes". So many variables.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I would alter that to say "extreme slider adjustments" may skew how the game plays.

When you got to one extreme or another with a slider (max it out, minimize it), you may skew the game, depending on how sensitive the slider is and how integral it is to performance.

When I first played default sliders, I expected an onslaught of solid hits to ruin the game and make it feel arcadish. It wasn't. There were quite a few solid hits, but also a lot of routine grounders (even a few tappers). When the solid hits were hit to the OF, I understood why they position them so deeply and give them the ability to cover a lot of ground. I was able to blast a double over an OF's head (directly over his head, as did the AI), which was something I had not seen with solid hits at 0 or 1. I did see balls hit off the wall, down the line, and in the gap ... just nothing directly over the OF's head (unless you take speed down to zero, which also can create issues).

The big thing I noticed was the reduction in foul balls (thank God). There wasn't an 11-pitch at bat every 2 or 3 innings. (11-pitch at bats aren't really that common, although they do happen). If a game has a large number of foul balls, it seems to artificially inflate pitch counts and S%. So, when trying to attain a good mix of pitcher control, the problem could be "too many foul balls" (or weaker contact) rather than "the pitchers throw too many strikes". So many variables.

yikes...variables indeed. I just want play lol

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

yikes...variables indeed. I just want play lol

I hear ya. There are folks that just wanna play and enjoy the game, and there's there's people like me whose brain is going to do the calculations and analyze observations whether I want it to or not. It's great for work and for analyzing pitching charts and baseball stat trends, but it can be a pain in the butt for entertainment ... with trying to make all the pieces fit together in a certain way. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. *grin*

Dude, if my buddies knew I was having these conversations, I'd never hear the end of it.

[mizzouj]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I hear ya. There are folks that just wanna play and enjoy the game, and there's there's people like me whose brain is going to do the calculations and analyze observations whether I want it to or not. It's great for work and for analyzing pitching charts and baseball stat trends, but it can be a pain in the butt for entertainment ... with trying to make all the pieces fit together in a certain way. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. *grin*

Dude, if my buddies knew I was having these conversations, I'd never hear the end of it.

Ah, the beauty of being able to post anonymously on message boards!

That said, your posts on here seem to be the most entertaining (I promise not to tell your buddies) and tend to mirror my frustrations. In the end, I just want a game that over the course of a season somewhat statistically resembles reality.

I think a lot of people fall into the trap of over analyzing slider combinations and trying to make the perfect game, where a lot of the time on a high quality game like The Show it's probably best to just play on default and make minor corrections. Baseball has so many variables as you said, tweaking one thing significantly almost forces to to tweak something else as a result. Then you start a never ending train of adjustments and forget to just enjoy the game. In conclusion, you have me thinking about just saying screw it and play on default with a few minor adjustments.

[ParisB]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I would alter that to say "extreme slider adjustments" may skew how the game plays.

When you got to one extreme or another with a slider (max it out, minimize it), you may skew the game, depending on how sensitive the slider is and how integral it is to performance.

When I first played default sliders, I expected an onslaught of solid hits to ruin the game and make it feel arcadish. It wasn't. There were quite a few solid hits, but also a lot of routine grounders (even a few tappers). When the solid hits were hit to the OF, I understood why they position them so deeply and give them the ability to cover a lot of ground. I was able to blast a double over an OF's head (directly over his head, as did the AI), which was something I had not seen with solid hits at 0 or 1. I did see balls hit off the wall, down the line, and in the gap ... just nothing directly over the OF's head (unless you take speed down to zero, which also can create issues).

The big thing I noticed was the reduction in foul balls (thank God). There wasn't an 11-pitch at bat every 2 or 3 innings. (11-pitch at bats aren't really that common, although they do happen). If a game has a large number of foul balls, it seems to artificially inflate pitch counts and S%. So, when trying to attain a good mix of pitcher control, the problem could be "too many foul balls" (or weaker contact) rather than "the pitchers throw too many strikes". So many variables.

Sliders aren't extreme nor do they greatly skew the results. It's almost like you have a misunderstanding and are completely set to be anti-slider. They do exactly what they're supposed to, fine tune the individual User's experience. If you see everything play perfectly on Default, then so be it, good for you. A lot of people do and a lot of people don't. Not everybody will see the same results; whether it's on Default, maxed, minimized, or anything in between.

I was able to get a better game for myself by tweaking the sliders and fully understanding what they do and what else they affect. Tweaking them isn't going to throw the game out of balance or whacked out. It has given me not only better stats/results, but a better "feel" too. Something that wouldn't happen on Default.

p.s.- Fielder arm strength doesn't affect catchers, it's in the Slider description.

[rondoman]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

Sliders aren't extreme nor do they greatly skew the results. It's almost like you have a misunderstanding and are completely set to be anti-slider. They do exactly what they're supposed to, fine tune the individual User's experience. If you see everything play perfectly on Default, then so be it, good for you. A lot of people do and a lot of people don't. Not everybody will see the same results; whether it's on Default, maxed, minimized, or anything in between.

I was able to get a better game for myself by tweaking the sliders and fully understanding what they do and what else they affect. Tweaking them isn't going to throw the game out of balance or whacked out. It has given me not only better stats/results, but a better "feel" too. Something that wouldn't happen on Default.

p.s.- Fielder arm strength doesn't affect catchers, it's in the Slider description.

Exactly. There seems to be some confusion regarding sliders here. They dont throw anything out of whack. I dunno where some people get this stuff.

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

Sliders aren't extreme nor do they greatly skew the results.

'Extreme' refers to any far position of the spectrum ... such as making a slider 0 or 10. Is it going to 'ruin' the game? No. Will it affect it significantly? Perhaps. Most likely , yes.

I never made a positive assertion that they did. I did say "may". Actually, I said "may" repeatedly, and I specifically used "may" instead of "does" as the two words have different meanings in regards to "degree of certainty".

It's almost like you have a misunderstanding and are completely set to be anti-slider.

Far from it. I've been highly involved with sliders, most recently with Modded MVP (PC) and the 2K series. I will say that the Show's default sliders are "better" than MVP's default and the out of the box setting with 2k ... but that's no surprise. You seem to be reading something into my words that is not there.

They do exactly what they're supposed to, fine tune the individual User's experience. If you see everything play perfectly on Default, then so be it, good for you.

I stated is that I played 2 (TWO, only two) games on default, and posted the results (very different games). Half of the commentary is directed at something I never said. I cannot control what people infer.

What I did say was that I should have (and am) going to play 20 games with default, track the stats and compare to MLb average to see what direction I would need to move in order to tweak for more realism (if needed).

But, we all understand that taking fielder arm speed to zero doesn't mean they will "roll it to 1B, right?" (Yes, of course). But, if one does lower it to zero, without altering anything else one would expect a possible significant reduction of DP's, and a possible increase of IF hits and FC's. Now, I don't know what the exact quantity of "significant" is because I've never lowered arm strength to zero.

I do know that sliders are highly individual, especially those that primarily affect user influence/skill/experience.

Tweaking them isn't going to throw the game out of balance or whacked out.

I wouldn't think that they would. I do think that extreme sliders (depending on the slider) significantly affect the game. For example, for me, taking solid hits to zero, takes both team's offenses way down ... resembling baseball in the 60s. That's been the only assertive statement I have really made, and I displayed 23 games worth of slider results as some degree of evidence (even if it only pertains to my games).

I have requested that folks post some of the career stats in their profile to show how their results v. default (or starting point) compared to their results after the tweaks, so they can display how they made the game more realistic. Most folks just go by "feel" or "imprssion", as evident by all of the comments in any slider thread about how great each slider set (all that means is the game itself is really good and does not require drastic slider overhuls to make it playable). I completely understand that, not everyone enjoys getting nerdy about sliders. I am not stating this as some sort of challenge to anyone's credibility, only as a point of assessing what each slider does, and to what degree with each "click" left or right.

[darthyankee13]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

Love these sliders. Was struggling with batting went to bp and just now in the second month in my season have I started to hit. Had one game against baltimore hit 6 team homeruns (thank god started to worry me). Practice paid off.

[ParisB]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

Love these sliders. Was struggling with batting went to bp and just now in the second month in my season have I started to hit. Had one game against baltimore hit 6 team homeruns (thank god started to worry me). Practice paid off.

If you're struggling a bit, sometimes it's better to simply turn down pitch speed so you can read the pitches better. Just one click to the left can help you read it better, and even going down to 3. I wouldn't suggest anything lower, because then fastballs and changeups start becoming indistinguishable (to me at least).

[darthyankee13]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

To be honest I am starting to hit. Just got done playing boston. Beat them thanks to a slumping swisher. I like that I have to try. On rookie I did not even try. I have to try now. The only thing I notice is I am giving up more hits with my starting pitchers. Era is around 3.06. Keep in mind it was lower till I quit playing rookie. Seems like I give up 1~2 hits per inning. No big deal just have to spot my pitches better.

[JayD]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I just had a 20 hit 13 run game as the Braves vs the Cubs!

[abcabc]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

If you're struggling a bit, sometimes it's better to simply turn down pitch speed so you can read the pitches better. Just one click to the left can help you read it better, and even going down to 3. I wouldn't suggest anything lower, because then fastballs and changeups start becoming indistinguishable (to me at least).

paris, you find anything <3, you swing more well ahead of a changeup?

[darthyankee13]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I just had a 20 hit 13 run game as the Braves vs the Cubs!

I just had a 17 hit 15 run game yankees vs red sox game. Beckett was nasty first 3 innings then he lost it. The bo sox bullpen is god awful right now in my season.

R. H. E
Yanks. 15. 17. 1

Sox. 3. 10. 0

What's the main difference between vet. And allstar for hitting?

[gman2774]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

I'm not a big fan of asking for opinions based on how someone remembers something or how they feel about it, because hum,an memory and emotion can be very unreliable (including my own).

I do, however, collect data (quickly and easily).

Here's what I have experienced in my franchise playing as the White Sox ...



The "CC11" sliders are basically the Pefect sliders with these adjustments:
[1] Solid Hits = 1
[2] IF Reaction Time = 4
[3] OF Arm = 3

If I didn't turn down OF arm strength Carlos Quentin was going to make people forget Roberto Clemente.

As you can see in the slider comparison, no matter what sliders you use, you'll get a decent amount of realism because the game's engine is good. For me, the sliders resulted in what I called "dead ball era" games. The increase in HR/G is mainly due to me giving up more homers on the mound, and the 6 HR game I just had against NYY, which my 3 HR's was a fluke (3 for NYY v. Floyd), as I likely won't do that again for a month. It was also my first game switching from guess pitch classic 1/4 to default.

The solid hits slider is zeroed out, hurting the offense. Pitcher control is turned up, as is consistency, so pitching is made better ... and IF reaction time is ten, so the defense is imporved. IMO, the perfect sliders provided (for me) exactly what they should have ... a game heavy on pitching and defense. Like I said, I play with the White Sox (CircleChange11 franchise at VSN), and that works in my advanatge, I just don't like 2-1 and 3-2 games ALL the time.

You can see the difference in runs per game in the table above.

I used perfect sliders for 13 games, CC11 (mine) sliders for 10 games.

I have also turned down (just recently) pitcher control to 5 and pitcher consistency to 6, for a little less control. I don;t really want to see Peavy go 30-0, even though it'd work in my favor (at 6 and 7, he's just a marksman).

TripleThreat1973,

Good analysis. I've used Psycho’s sliders with the three adjustments you listed in the message above. I really like the gameplay. I've had some pitching duels and I have had some games that were higher in score and hit totals. Perfect variety as far as I'm concerned. However, I've now read that you're going to experiment with default sliders for 20 games or so. Just curious as to why? What didn't you like about the adjustments you made given they were based on solid statistical research?

Not at all being critical, just curious as I have also thought about moving to default just to see what type of gameplay it brings. Thanks!!

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: *****The 'Perfect' Slider Set***** MLB 10 - The Show

Not at all being critical, just curious as I have also thought about moving to default just to see what type of gameplay it brings. Thanks!!

It's either ...

[1] ADD

or

[2] I was moving the control & consistency slider up and down, trying to get more walks and less "pinpointing" for both.

Walks are incredibly important because they (obviously) add runners without inflating the number of hits. This is one reason why I don;t mind the HBP numbers being slightly higher (they serve as walks). So, it makes it easier to get the "right" amount of runs per game, without inflating the batting averages.

At some point, I just decided to give default sliders a whirl, see what the data looked like, and go from there.

In hindsight, it's doubtful that many users will get the (combined) 6.6 walks per game. So, I would have likely achieved similar (realistic) results had I just kept using the sliders I was using.

Now, that I've played default, I really like how the game feels/looks and the results are pretty much realistic. There's less OF "slowdown" because there are more well struck balls, and the animations seem to matchup better (as if the were desgined for a faster paced game).

There are so many "other variables" that go into it (pitch speed, guess pitch, power swing or not, pci or not, etc) that it can be wacky to try and figure out what affect each thing has. As of now, I'm just having fun playing good games and presenting my franchise.