HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

**Jgainsey** · 03-21-2011, 09:25 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" /><link href="http://dynasties.operationsports.com/css/osdyn.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"></head><body><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn" width="575"><tr class="masthead"><td align="center" colspan="13">ATL at WAS - Nationals Park</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="40%">Mar 31, 2011</td><td align="right" width="5%">1</td><td align="right" width="5%">2</td><td align="right" width="5%">3</td><td align="right" width="5%">4</td><td align="right" width="5%">5</td><td align="right" width="5%">6</td><td align="right" width="5%">7</td><td align="right" width="5%">8</td><td align="right" width="5%">9</td><td align="right" width="5%">R</td><td align="right" width="5%">H</td><td align="right" width="5%">E</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Atlanta Braves (USER)</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right" class="active">4</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">1</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>Washington Nationals (CPU)</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right" class="active">1</td><td align="right">8</td><td align="right">0</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td align="center" colspan="13"><b>W:</b> T. Hudson <b>L:</b> J. Marquis <b>S:</b> C. Kimbrel</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead"><td colspan="5">Scoring Summary</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td colspan="3" width="84%">SCORING DETAILS</td><td align="right" width="8%">ATL</td><td align="right" width="8%">WAS</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#00457C" colspan="9"><span style="color:#FFFFFF">Atlanta Braves</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">HITTERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">AB</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">RBI</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">AVG</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">33</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">5</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right"></td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>BATTING:</u></b><br /><b>2B:</b> A. Gonzalez (1), F. Freeman 2 (2)<br /><b>HR:</b> D. Uggla (1), J. Heyward (1)</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>BASERUNNING:</u></b><br /><b>SB:</b> J. Heyward(1)</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>FIELDING:</u></b><br /><b>E:</b> B. McCann</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#002C62" colspan="9"><span style="color:#FFFFFF">Washington Nationals</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">HITTERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">AB</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">RBI</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">AVG</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">34</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">8</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">8</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right"></td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>BATTING:</u></b><br /><b>2B:</b> I. Rodriguez (1)</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>BASERUNNING:</u></b><br /><b>SB:</b> R. Zimmerman</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#00457C" colspan="9"><span style="color:#FFFFFF">Atlanta Braves</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">PITCHERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">IP</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">ER</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">ERA</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>T. Hudson (W, 1-0)</td><td align="right">7.0</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">1.29</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>E. O'Flaherty</td><td align="right">0.0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>P. Moylan (H, 1)</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>C. Kimbrel</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">9.0</td><td align="right">8</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">8</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right"></td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>PITCHING:</u></b><br /><b>Pitches-Strikes:</b> Team Strike Percentage: 62%</td></tr></table><table cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" class="osdyn spacer" width="575"><tr class="masthead_alt"><td bgcolor="#002C62" colspan="9"><span style="color:#FFFFFF">Washington Nationals</span></td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td width="41%">PITCHERS</td><td align="right" width="7%">IP</td><td align="right" width="7%">H</td><td align="right" width="7%">R</td><td align="right" width="7%">ER</td><td align="right" width="7%">BB</td><td align="right" width="7%">SO</td><td align="right" width="7%">HR</td><td align="right" width="10%">ERA</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>J. Marquis (L, 0-1)</td><td align="right">5</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">5.40</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>T. Coffey</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>S. Burnett</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td>H. Rodriguez</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">2</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">9.00</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td>T. Clippard</td><td align="right">1.0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right">1</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right" class="active">0.00</td></tr><tr class="stathead"><td>TEAM TOTALS</td><td align="right">9.0</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">4</td><td align="right">5</td><td align="right">7</td><td align="right"></td><td align="right"></td></tr><tr class="evenrow"><td colspan="9"><b><u>PITCHING:</u></b><br /><b>Pitches-Strikes:</b> Team Strike Percentage: 64%</td></tr></table></body></html>

Everything looked pretty good in the first game. Hudson was dominant, which I guess is to be expected, but the final score could've easily been much higher for the Braves. I left plenty of guys on base.

The walks were there for me, but none of them were of the 4/5-pitch variety. In fact, 2 or 3 of them came after going down 0-2, or 1-2. I'm only bring it up because several people have been noticing the same trend.. hopefully things will even out a little bit over time.

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-21-2011, 10:24 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

It's about time you started one of these, JGainsey!

I have a feeling I'll be spending A LOT of time in here this Summer!

They look almost identical to mine.

How would you feel about raising fielding errors and dropping steal ability?

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-21-2011, 10:42 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Instead of posting individual box scores, I may just update in ten game stretches or so...with my slider differences.

Can't...Wait!

I've got a batch I'll post tomorrow. Some decent game variations to them as well. For instance, a 14 run and 16 hit explosion, versus a 3 hit shutout two games later. Definitely some good stuff, I'll just say that.

**Jgainsey** · 03-21-2011, 11:18 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Awesome, I'm looking forward to 'em.

To be honest, 'steal ability' is something I haven't really paid much attention to yet. Though I will be keeping track of them in my box scores from now on. My Joe Morgan instincts tell me that I feel as if I'm probably not throwing out as many base runners as I should, but I'm just not sure.

The only reason I din't already have fielding errors at 7 was because I had been using analog fielding up until now, and I was just all over the place with my errors. It probably needs to be at 7, especially with button throwing, and that will more than likely be changed after my first batch of games.

Btw, I'm not planning on posting single game box scores too often. The first one there was just kind of an example. I'll probably get into the habit of posting after every series or two, depending on how busy I am.

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 05:12 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

I'm in between buttons and just plain old auto throw. CPU errors need to go up, and I just can't keep up on analog to ensure it's all balanced. Looks like we're on the same page there.

I've got some stats I'll be posting in the next hour or so -with my slider differences- so hopefully either (a.) you see my sliders and can filter through how my stats impact my slight variations to yours, or (b.) we can come up with agreement on a few of them with the hopes of nailing some of the sliders down for Knight's launch.

We need to keep in mind that user input may keep our sets apart slightly (user control for example), but also be open to adjusting some of them (global sliders, mainly) in order to achieve a decent balance of real feeling baseball.

Be back shortly.

**jr86** · 03-22-2011, 05:39 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by Jgainsey

CPU Strike Frequency - 5
Holy Cow!! You drew 5 walks on HOF with that frequency.

I am out of my league here.....lol

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 06:15 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

I haven't been tracking my games evenly, so you'll see my last 18 games of hitting, and my last 14 games of pitching (why I haven't tracked all of my games, and why I started tracking pitching AFTER hitting, I have no idea).

HOF Pitching (Analog)
HOF Hitting (Timing Only)
Auto Fielding

Pitch Speed 4 (HD TV, to combat minimal input lag)
CPU Solid Hits 4
CPU Pitcher Consistency 2
CPU Steal Ability 4
CPU Steal Frequency 7
Throwing Errors 7
Fielding Errors 7

Everything else at Default

Hitting (18 Games)
AVG .249
Hits 8.44
2B 1.6
3B 0.22
HR 1.22
BB 3.0 (3.25 over last 8 games with a CPU Consistency below 4)
SO 8.4 (four of my last six games I had 6 or less SO, keep that in mind)
CPU Strike Percentage 62% (over last 8 games with CPU consist below 4)
Fouls per game 24.67
Misses per game 16.0

Pitching (14 Games)
ERA 4.56 (Which is odd, looking at the following numbers)
AVG .249
2B 1.93
3B 0.36
HR 1.0
BB 3.64
SO 8.0
User Strike Percentage 61.3%
Fouls 28.5
Misses 12.6

My stats for SB and Errors are pretty skewed, seeing that I've been tweaking these sliders along the way. Two things are for certain:

1. I have yet to throw out a CPU base stealer, but since turning the ability to 4, I've been thrown out twice in ten attempts (80% success rate). Steal attempts are low, so CPU steal frequency should be at least 7.

2. The CPU doesn't make errors. Period. I recently put fielding/throwing errors up, so we'll have to find some common ground on this. I wish I had done this earlier so I'd have some stats to go by.

NOTES: My Analog errors have definitely inflated my ERA, as some errors led to multiple runs...several of which counted as earned, for some reason.

As you can see, the reason I'm hesitant to lower fielder run speed is the fact that User/CPU doubles and triples are pretty good...my doubles are a bit low, while my triples are good, but CPU doubles are pretty spot on, but their triples are a tad high.

I could lower CPU control and/or Strike Frequency to 4 (where Jgainsey's are) to improve my batting average and lower my strikeouts, but my walks are already decent...with a lower CPU Consistency.

I probably should drop User Sold Hits to 4 (where Jgainsey's is) to bring down my HR's a touch.

I could lower User Control and/Consistency to 4 (where Jgainsey's are), to bring down my K's and raise CPU batting average , but my ERA is already high and CPU HR's/Extra base hits are already decent.

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 06:33 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Jgainsey/Heroesandvillians slider differences:

User Solid Hits 4/5***
User Reliever Stamina 3/5
User Control 4/5
User Consistency 4/5

CPU Reliever Stamina 3/5
CPU Control 4/5
CPU Consistency 4/2

Fielding Errors 6/7
Throwing Errors 6/7
Fielder Run Speed 4/5
Fielder Arm Strength 4/5
Steal Ability 4/5
Steal Frequency 6/7
Wind 5/3 ***

***I think I'll concede my User Solid Hits and Wind to Jgainsey.

Now, let's compare notes.

Also, convice me on Reliever Stamina. I'm open to changing this, but two things:

1. Sims are impacted by this slider this year (it's easy to change for simmed games though).

2. Will relievers get pulled too soon or inordinately beat up due to lowering it?

**jr86** · 03-22-2011, 06:35 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by heroesandvillians

I haven't been tracking my games evenly, so you'll see my last 18 games of hitting, and my last 14 games of pitching (why I haven't tracked all of my games, and why I started tracking pitching AFTER hitting, I have no idea).

HOF Pitching (Analog)
HOF Hitting (Timing Only)
Auto Fielding

Pitch Speed 4 (HD TV, to combat minimal input lag)
CPU Solid Hits 4
CPU Pitcher Consistency 2
CPU Steal Ability 4
CPU Steal Frequency 7
Throwing Errors 7
Fielding Errors 7

Everything else at Default

Hitting (18 Games)
AVG .249
Hits 8.44
2B 1.6
3B 0.22
HR 1.22
BB 3.0 (3.25 over last 8 games with a CPU Consistency below 4)
SO 8.4 (four of my last six games I had 6 or less SO, keep that in mind)
CPU Strike Percentage 62% (over last 8 games with CPU consist below 4)
Fouls per game 24.67
Misses per game 16.0

Pitching (14 Games)
ERA 4.56 (Which is odd, looking at the following numbers)
AVG .249
2B 1.93
3B 0.36
HR 1.0
BB 3.64
SO 8.0
User Strike Percentage 61.3%
Fouls 28.5
Misses 12.6

My stats for SB and Errors are pretty skewed, seeing that I've been tweaking these sliders along the way. Two things are for certain:

1. I have yet to throw out a CPU base stealer, but since turning the ability to 4, I've been thrown out twice in ten attempts (80% success rate). Steal attempts are low, so CPU steal frequency should be at least 7.

2. The CPU doesn't make errors. Period. I recently put fielding/throwing errors up, so we'll have to find some common ground on this. I wish I had done this earlier so I'd have some stats to go by.

NOTES: My Analog errors have definitely inflated my ERA, as some errors led to multiple runs...several of which counted as earned, for some reason.

As you can see, the reason I'm hesitant to lower fielder run speed is the fact that User/CPU doubles and triples are pretty good...my doubles are a bit low, while my triples are good, but CPU doubles are pretty spot on, but their triples are a tad high.

I could lower CPU control and/or Strike Frequency to 4 (where Jgainsey's are) to improve my batting average and lower my strikeouts, but my walks are already decent...with a lower CPU Consistency.

I probably should drop User Sold Hits to 4 (where Jgainsey's is) to bring down my HR's a touch.

I could lower User Control and/Consistency to 4 (where Jgainsey's are), to bring down my K's and raise CPU batting average , but my ERA is already high and CPU HR's/Extra base hits are already decent.

In Bold. WHAT?
I am seeing at least 2-3 per game. Are you telling me that you don't see the fielders overthrowing the ball to 1st base...this practically happens every game.

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 06:41 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by jr86

In Bold. WHAT?
I am seeing at least 2-3 per game. Are you telling me that you don't see the fielders overthrowing the ball to 1st base...this practically happens every game.

By the CPU? Nope, not once.

One time, the 1B missed a short hopper from a throw by the SS.

In the CPU versus CPU thread, which is good info to see for this slider, they have it at 4 and 5. So, I'm actually okay with Throwing Errors at 5.

However, all of their test sets have fielding errors at 8 and 9. We may need to at least do that much...Throwing Errors 5, Fielding Errors 8. I'd be okay with that.

Thoughts?

**jr86** · 03-22-2011, 07:01 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by heroesandvillians

By the CPU? Nope, not once.

One time, the 1B missed a short hopper from a throw by the SS.

In the CPU versus CPU thread, which is good info to see for this slider, they have it at 4 and 5. So, I'm actually okay with Throwing Errors at 5.

However, all of their test sets have fielding errors at 8 and 9. We may need to at least do that much...Throwing Errors 5, Fielding Errors 8. I'd be okay with that.

Thoughts?

Man i am honestly shocked.
I have seen so many different types of errors this year it's not true.
The one you mentioned.
SS overthrowing first and ball going into the crowd.
Catcher trying to throw the runner out after a dropped 3rd strike and overthrowing the 1st baseman and the ball going out into the corner of RF.
Stealing 2nd and the catcher overthrows 2nd baseman and ball goes into the outfield.
Linedrive out to CF and the CF guns it towards 2nd base, misses and ball heads towards the catcher
Just to name a few.......lol

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 07:09 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by jr86

Man i am honestly shocked.
I have seen so many different types of errors this year it's not true.
The one you mentioned.
SS overthrowing first and ball going into the crowd.
Catcher trying to throw the runner out after a dropped 3rd strike and overthrowing the 1st baseman and the ball going out into the corner of RF.
Stealing 2nd and the catcher overthrows 2nd baseman and ball goes into the outfield.
Linedrive out to CF and the CF guns it towards 2nd base, misses and ball heads towards the catcher
Just to name a few.......lol

Man! You're game sounds like "Bad News Bears" compared to mine!

I want a refund! LOL!!!

No, seriously, the CPU vs. CPU sliders threads should be a pretty solid take on how errors play out over the long haul. After all, the fact that we are playing against the CPU shouldn't have much of an impact on errors in general. These guys have watched literally hunderds of games. Besides, I think Jgainsey and I pretty much agree that errors need to be raised (fielding at least).

That doesn't mean you have to. It's just that him and I are trying to get something pretty much set before opening day. Feel free to stat track with your errors and post back. We'll take all of the stats we can get. But please...post the stats with your errors sliders, okay? You may be right on this one. I just haven't seen it myself.

**Snake.Plissken** · 03-22-2011, 07:35 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

I had errors up in the 8-9 range for a bit because I just wasn't seeing errors in my first handfull of games, and now I'm down to errors at 6 for both sliders. 7 is the highest you'll want to go with either slider. Fielding error stats may be down a bit just because errors aren't always charged to infielders that boot a grounder, I think the game sees them like when a fielder dives and the ball hits off the glove so it doesn't think it's an error. So, even if the stats aren't right, the game is playing properly on the field. Go too high with fielding errors and you are just going to see an epidemic of IFs and OFs booting balls that hit off the glove and go a few feet away, it just doesn't look like a professional game then.

**Heroesandvillains** · 03-22-2011, 08:01 PM

Re: HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

Originally posted by Snake.Plissken

I had errors up in the 8-9 range for a bit because I just wasn't seeing errors in my first handfull of games, and now I'm down to errors at 6 for both sliders. 7 is the highest you'll want to go with either slider. Fielding error stats may be down a bit just because errors aren't always charged to infielders that boot a grounder, I think the game sees them like when a fielder dives and the ball hits off the glove so it doesn't think it's an error. So, even if the stats aren't right, the game is playing properly on the field. Go too high with fielding errors and you are just going to see an epidemic of IFs and OFs booting balls that hit off the glove and go a few feet away, it just doesn't look like a professional game then.

That very well could be. Correct errors, just incorrect official scoring.

Maybe 7 Fielding Errors and 5 or 6 Throwing Errors? Or, I could just try out 8 and 5...not sure though.

HOF Sliders/Statistics Disscussion

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