ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

[JackB]

I have played both the past 2 weeks and neither game really gets me excited about playing another game. ASB is not real baseball because there are so few groundballs. I can go a whole game and hit 2 grounders and that is with the classic cursor. I also hate the sluggish feeling of the fielders and the pitching mechanics put me to sleep. HH plays a smarter brand of baseball....the AI is MUCH better in HH than ASB. When I play HH it feels much quicker than ASB. When I play ASB, I am dragging (mentally) by the time I get to the 6th inning. Overall, ASB04 is better than ASB04, but if I had to pick out of these 2, I would go with HH.

[EaglesFan]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Lets have a civilized debate here. I rented ASB, and have played both games quite a bit. Having played baseball my whole life, simulation and gameplay is the most important part of video game baseball for me.

All that being said, I cannot imagine how anyone can consider ASB gameply remotely close to good. In my opinion, HH04's gameplay is far and away better in every aspect.

As far as the franchise, graphics and other options like expansion, ASB has really got some innovative ideas. But, once it comes down to playing the game, I can't get passed the poor gameplay.

What is it that you guys see in this gameplay? How do you play to maximize the realism? I just cannot get it.

I'd love to hear and see some thought on this so I can better understand why I dislike this gameplay so much.

[EaglesFan]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Lets have a civilized debate here. I rented ASB, and have played both games quite a bit. Having played baseball my whole life, simulation and gameplay is the most important part of video game baseball for me.

All that being said, I cannot imagine how anyone can consider ASB gameply remotely close to good. In my opinion, HH04's gameplay is far and away better in every aspect.

As far as the franchise, graphics and other options like expansion, ASB has really got some innovative ideas. But, once it comes down to playing the game, I can't get passed the poor gameplay.

What is it that you guys see in this gameplay? How do you play to maximize the realism? I just cannot get it.

I'd love to hear and see some thought on this so I can better understand why I dislike this gameplay so much.

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

I don't know, maybe I'm just strange, but I have no problems with the gameplay, I don't think the players are sluggish either, and I think the pitching animations are right with what a pitcher does. Personally, I think ASB does a great job simulating baseball, I have lots and lots of trouble with the middle level, stats are very accurate. I tried HH for the first time this year, and I took it back, I just didn't like it. This is only my second year to play ASB, so its not like I'm an ASB homer. I guess thats why there are 4-5 baseball games out this year, something for everyone.

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

I don't know, maybe I'm just strange, but I have no problems with the gameplay, I don't think the players are sluggish either, and I think the pitching animations are right with what a pitcher does. Personally, I think ASB does a great job simulating baseball, I have lots and lots of trouble with the middle level, stats are very accurate. I tried HH for the first time this year, and I took it back, I just didn't like it. This is only my second year to play ASB, so its not like I'm an ASB homer. I guess thats why there are 4-5 baseball games out this year, something for everyone.

[Dick_Smalls]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Sorry have to disagree...I own both too, ASB 2004 XBOX, HH 2004 PC. I feel ASB's AI is either right on par with HH or even a bit better at handling alot of baseball's infinite situations. However, they both play a smart game, I just feel that a bit more AI depth was written into ASB to interperet the 'big picture' in a game. For example, this week, I witnessed the CPU replace it's catcher in the bottom half of the ninth to protect a 1 run lead it just gained in the top half of the inning by putting in a better defensive, stronger throwing armed catcher. Also I have seen the CPU pitch around some of my hot hitters and even walk them to avoid having to face them and take the chance of getting burned again.....The CPU will also walk a potentially better batter with an open base more often to get to my weaker hitters......And something I seen tonight, impressed me that alot of other games would have simply used a basic ' replacement logic' for. The CPU Braves built a 4 run lead on me in the top of the 9nth and was still batting with 2 outs......John Smoltz, the releiver was scheduled up and the cpu decided to actually let him bat because it calcuted a lead which it felt it could protect, It weighed Smoltz's excellent pitching performance the prior inning and wanted to stick with it's closer. ASB seems to base it's AI decisions on alot more variables rather than simply just employing a very thin cookie cutter style AI for each situation. It feels more human.....I have seen it pitchout more often when I have speedy guys on base and I have seen the surprise drag bunt when an opportunity presents itself.

I have been playing HH alot over the last few days and enjoy it as an arcade game with very responsive controls that plays a fundamentally correct game of baseball but my main problem with the game ( other than it's horrific interface ) is the lack of depth it seems to capture between the Pitcher and Batter. There was a time a few years ago when I loved the way it portrayed this area of the game but since playing ASB, I have grown a much better appreciation....and respect to the realism of this aspect of the game. Quite simply, ASB feels more real, it forces you to be patient and doesnt freely give you the entire strike zone to own. If your settings are right, you really have to wait for your pitch and drive it....its a much more rewarding experience to get that one pitch and drive it into the gap or down the line in ASB....especially off of some of the better pitchers in the league which really make the task challenging. In ASB, you can see the pitchers hit their grooves and really start to dominate a game and frustrate you one day and come up flat the next. You can also start to see a pitcher slowly unravel and lose his concentration and command and his pitches will start to flatten and hang over the plate. His breaks wont be as sharp or his fastballs will lose their velocity and location....It's truly marvelous.

In HH, I never felt dominated by a pitcher....even with the pitch speeds maxed out, Randy Johnson was no match for me. Also pitch physics seem over exaggerated and seem to follow prescripted and limited flight paths.....Not to mention some extremely unnatural sharp breaks that feel very wiffle ball like in their flight. Altho Hitting is fun in HH, it's really no challenge and the way in which pitchers determine their pitches and try to set you up seem to follow no real strategy.

I dont want to rip HH, because it can be a fun game to play...especially when your not in the mood to get into a serious game and totally concentrate, But to say ASB is inferior to it, I cannot agree at all. I feel ASB captures Baseball in its truest form better than any game to date....It doesnt try to compensate any of the games realism for added excitement or over the top fun....it captures it as close to the sport as any game I have ever played in my 20 years of video game baseballing.......sometimes less is more, and ASB doesnt overload your sensory with flash to achieve an exciting game but rather..... it forces you to think and excecute to achieve it.

[Dick_Smalls]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Sorry have to disagree...I own both too, ASB 2004 XBOX, HH 2004 PC. I feel ASB's AI is either right on par with HH or even a bit better at handling alot of baseball's infinite situations. However, they both play a smart game, I just feel that a bit more AI depth was written into ASB to interperet the 'big picture' in a game. For example, this week, I witnessed the CPU replace it's catcher in the bottom half of the ninth to protect a 1 run lead it just gained in the top half of the inning by putting in a better defensive, stronger throwing armed catcher. Also I have seen the CPU pitch around some of my hot hitters and even walk them to avoid having to face them and take the chance of getting burned again.....The CPU will also walk a potentially better batter with an open base more often to get to my weaker hitters......And something I seen tonight, impressed me that alot of other games would have simply used a basic ' replacement logic' for. The CPU Braves built a 4 run lead on me in the top of the 9nth and was still batting with 2 outs......John Smoltz, the releiver was scheduled up and the cpu decided to actually let him bat because it calcuted a lead which it felt it could protect, It weighed Smoltz's excellent pitching performance the prior inning and wanted to stick with it's closer. ASB seems to base it's AI decisions on alot more variables rather than simply just employing a very thin cookie cutter style AI for each situation. It feels more human.....I have seen it pitchout more often when I have speedy guys on base and I have seen the surprise drag bunt when an opportunity presents itself.

I have been playing HH alot over the last few days and enjoy it as an arcade game with very responsive controls that plays a fundamentally correct game of baseball but my main problem with the game ( other than it's horrific interface ) is the lack of depth it seems to capture between the Pitcher and Batter. There was a time a few years ago when I loved the way it portrayed this area of the game but since playing ASB, I have grown a much better appreciation....and respect to the realism of this aspect of the game. Quite simply, ASB feels more real, it forces you to be patient and doesnt freely give you the entire strike zone to own. If your settings are right, you really have to wait for your pitch and drive it....its a much more rewarding experience to get that one pitch and drive it into the gap or down the line in ASB....especially off of some of the better pitchers in the league which really make the task challenging. In ASB, you can see the pitchers hit their grooves and really start to dominate a game and frustrate you one day and come up flat the next. You can also start to see a pitcher slowly unravel and lose his concentration and command and his pitches will start to flatten and hang over the plate. His breaks wont be as sharp or his fastballs will lose their velocity and location....It's truly marvelous.

In HH, I never felt dominated by a pitcher....even with the pitch speeds maxed out, Randy Johnson was no match for me. Also pitch physics seem over exaggerated and seem to follow prescripted and limited flight paths.....Not to mention some extremely unnatural sharp breaks that feel very wiffle ball like in their flight. Altho Hitting is fun in HH, it's really no challenge and the way in which pitchers determine their pitches and try to set you up seem to follow no real strategy.

I dont want to rip HH, because it can be a fun game to play...especially when your not in the mood to get into a serious game and totally concentrate, But to say ASB is inferior to it, I cannot agree at all. I feel ASB captures Baseball in its truest form better than any game to date....It doesnt try to compensate any of the games realism for added excitement or over the top fun....it captures it as close to the sport as any game I have ever played in my 20 years of video game baseballing.......sometimes less is more, and ASB doesnt overload your sensory with flash to achieve an exciting game but rather..... it forces you to think and excecute to achieve it.

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Well said Small Dick. I agree.

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Well said Small Dick. I agree.

[Graphik]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Its almost a toss up for me. I currently own both and I love HHs gameplay second to none. But ASB franchise keeps me coming back. Allthough HH may have better gameplay ASB feels IMO more like a baseball game.

The big differences in gameplayfor me are the baserunning AI-HHs AI is the best to play against, they play exactly how you would play. They stretch hits, work the bunt, and steal when you're sleepin. The AI in ASB is some slow idiotic mofos. Nuff said.
But ASB still plays a god game of baseball and has some of the illest graphics I ever seen. Stadiums and all. Matter of fact, ASB whips HHs *** in every department except gameplay.
But for me, the franchise in ASB is the greatest thing on earth for a stat freak such as myself. I know HH has the stats, but not as much info as ASB. And its easier to get to.
So my pick would be and is ASB. For now.

[Graphik]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Its almost a toss up for me. I currently own both and I love HHs gameplay second to none. But ASB franchise keeps me coming back. Allthough HH may have better gameplay ASB feels IMO more like a baseball game.

The big differences in gameplayfor me are the baserunning AI-HHs AI is the best to play against, they play exactly how you would play. They stretch hits, work the bunt, and steal when you're sleepin. The AI in ASB is some slow idiotic mofos. Nuff said.
But ASB still plays a god game of baseball and has some of the illest graphics I ever seen. Stadiums and all. Matter of fact, ASB whips HHs *** in every department except gameplay.
But for me, the franchise in ASB is the greatest thing on earth for a stat freak such as myself. I know HH has the stats, but not as much info as ASB. And its easier to get to.
So my pick would be and is ASB. For now.

[EaglesFan]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

I don't consider ASB's idea of not being able to see the pitched ball realistic, fun, or anything special at all. After playing as high as AA ball, pitch speed is not like that.

As far as substitutes pitching around guys, that stuff happens in every game of HH. Pitching around a batter with an open base is something that happens exactly when it's supposed to happen in HH. That is where HH totally outshines any baseball game. It's real baseball.

A coach once told me: Its easy to coach against a good coach because you know what he'll do, its hard to coach against an a-hole because you never know what stupid moves he'll make.

That's how I feel about these two games, HH is the good coach and ASB is the a-hole. In my opinion, that is exactly where ASB is horrific.

[EaglesFan]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

I don't consider ASB's idea of not being able to see the pitched ball realistic, fun, or anything special at all. After playing as high as AA ball, pitch speed is not like that.

As far as substitutes pitching around guys, that stuff happens in every game of HH. Pitching around a batter with an open base is something that happens exactly when it's supposed to happen in HH. That is where HH totally outshines any baseball game. It's real baseball.

A coach once told me: Its easy to coach against a good coach because you know what he'll do, its hard to coach against an a-hole because you never know what stupid moves he'll make.

That's how I feel about these two games, HH is the good coach and ASB is the a-hole. In my opinion, that is exactly where ASB is horrific.

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Yea,big league pitches are more like HH....with ball trails...lmao, whatever!

[nikeford]

Re: ASB04 vs HH04 (Ps2)

Yea,big league pitches are more like HH....with ball trails...lmao, whatever!