Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

[daflyboys]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

Steroids don't make you a good hitter.

Then what's the point of messing with them?

[duke776]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

So I don't know if they've done it yet, but I imagine ESPN will have to run their "Manny being Manny" top 10 highlights at some point because of this. I'm going to have to look for that, some memorable moments like high fiving fans in the middle of a play

[CabreraMVP]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

I always loved him, probably because he wasn't on my team. He could rake like very few others in the history of baseball. He has one of the nicest swings I've ever seen.

[Highroad214]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

Then what's the point of messing with them?

They help your body recover, and stay strong. Which means you play more, which means you cheat compared the rest of the guys who play the game the right way.

Screw Manny, and I hope they never talk about him again unless it's in the same light as Bonds, Clemens, and McGwire.

[slickdtc]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

Sweetest swing, clutchest hitter, it doesn't matter now. Because he'll be defined by one word: cheater. As he should be.

As they say in baseball, "YOU'RE OUT!"

[rsox]

Re: Manny Ramirez retires

Hmm, that's surprising, the Rays must be trying to keep his service time down.

Kotchman may have an "out-clause" in his contract that would allow him to become a free agent after a certain date if not added to the big league roster. That's my guess anyway. You are probably right about them wanting to keep Jennings service time down as well.

[N51_rob]

"One of the greates RH hitters in the game." Common sentiment from fellow players.

He will never make the hall. He will get a lower % than Big Mac and Bonds.



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[daflyboys]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

They help your body recover, and stay strong. Which means you play more, which means you cheat compared the rest of the guys who play the game the right way.

Screw Manny, and I hope they never talk about him again unless it's in the same light as Bonds, Clemens, and McGwire.

Hmmm.... that doesn't explain Lyle Alzado.

[JBH3]

Its impossible to not bring into question his entire career pre-Mitchell report era. Sucks....because he was a great hitter.

Crap like Manny makes me respect guys like Pujols and Ryan Howard THAT much more.

[Sportsforever]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

I keep hearing people compare Manny to McGwire and Palmerio. I don't think it's a good comparison. First off, Palmerio isn't even is either McGwire or Ramirez league. Even if Palmerio had never been linked to PED's, I'd have a hard time calling him a HOF'r (I know he would have been based on his numbers, but he was the ultimate accumulator...never really the best at anything or led the league at anything and an .885 OPS).

McGwire was a better hitter than Palmerio, but he wasn't the hitter Ramirez is. Bottom line is I think Ramirez is significantly a better player than McGwire and Palmerio. The voters will penalize him, but I think he ultimately gets in.

[OSUFan_88]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

I'd be stunned...STUNNED if Manny even maintained the 5% to stay on the ballot, let alone get into the HOF.

[JBH3]

I keep hearing people compare Manny to McGwire and Palmerio. I don't think it's a good comparison. First off, Palmerio isn't even is either McGwire or Ramirez league. Even if Palmerio had never been linked to PED's, I'd have a hard time calling him a HOF'r (I know he would have been based on his numbers, but he was the ultimate accumulator...never really the best at anything or led the league at anything and an .885 OPS).

McGwire was a better hitter than Palmerio, but he wasn't the hitter Ramirez is. Bottom line is I think Ramirez is significantly a better player than McGwire and Palmerio. The voters will penalize him, but I think he ultimately gets in.

I don't think "accumulating" should be a slight to one's career. However, I do think that if that player is linked to PEDs then it should, because that disenchants the idea that the steady/consistent accumulator did so with the aide of drugs.

Playing long enough to accumulate numbers, while never being the absolute best, but also not having a steep decline is great in its own right and definitely HOF worthy.

[42]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

The voters will penalize him, but I think he ultimately gets in.

LOL, really?

It'll never happen - I'm sure there was a slim chance (maybe) BEFORE the news broke yesterday but now? Not a ****ing chance.

[N51_rob]

Crap like Manny makes me respect guys like Pujols and Ryan Howard THAT much more.

Don't forget Ken Griffey Jr. Guy looks better and better every day as a clean player during the "steroids era".

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[DrJones]

Re: Rays' Manny Ramirez to retire

The problem is, we don't KNOW that all of the "clean" players (Griffey, Thome, Thomas, Schilling, etc.) were really clean. Is Pettitte automatically excluded for "three days' use"? What about players like Bagwell, Piazza, Kent, Pudge, even Pedro? Common sense, if not proof, would lead one to believe that one or more of that group was using. Keep 'em all out? Only the ones mentioned in Canseco's book? Flip a coin?

At some point in the next decade or so, someone will get voted into the HoF that will later be revealed to have used PED's. Then what? Does that player get kicked out, even though his offence (unlike Charlie Hustle's or Shoeless Joe's) doesn't call for a permanent ban according to baseball's rule book? The whole thing's gonna fall apart.

There will continue to be huffing and puffing by media, fans, and former players for the next 10 years or so, but it's just too big a mess to properly judge who deserves enshrinement and who doesn't. Too many players used, probably a few that we'd never suspect. It's my opinion that at some point people are just going to throw up their hands and judge players solely by their numbers. Most of the prominent 'roiders (Bonds, Clemens, A-Rod, Manny, McGwire, possibly Sosa, Sheffield, and Palmeiro) will get in the HoF eventually. Though by "eventually", I mean 15-25 years from now, probably through a version of the Veterans Committee.