MLB Off-Topic

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

It's not about figuring out whether or not things are good necessarily, its about figuring out which individual statistic gets to the point quickest. No it's not hard to figure that out, but it doesn't tell you that much because OBP doesn't weigh more valuable hits against each other, it doesn't tell you that the purpose of baseball is creating runs and there are different ways to do that. It doesn't give you as much information as WRC+ does with its number.

I agree.

I was simply responding to your vague arguments that keep going back and forth.

In one post it's about finding out the most valuable stat and now in this post it's not about finding out whats good or not.

I'm not the one who created this silly analogy. I'm just responding.

[SPTO]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

When it comes to offense in baseball these are the stats I look at mostly:

AVG, HR, RBI, OBP, OPS, OPS+ and WAR


It gets more difficult with pitching and defensive metrics but I believe if you look at the stats that give the best GENERAL idea than you can't go too far wrong. If you try digging deeper well, you're really into it and are a stats geek. I don't think the general population has the will to go so far under the hood.

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

I agree.

I was simply responding to your vague arguments that keep going back and forth.

In one post it's about finding out the most valuable stat and now in this post it's not about finding out whats good or not.

I'm not the one who created this silly analogy. I'm just responding.

What are you talking about? You asked me if OBP is a number I said yes but not the best number. The point is to find the stat the best boils down what's important into a number, that's what I said from the beginning. So if OBP isn't that number, it doesn't matter whether the 5th best OBP in the league is good or not, because that was never the question I was trying to answer, Im trying to find out who is the best hitter.

And what analogy?

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

When it comes to offense in baseball these are the stats I look at mostly:

AVG, HR, RBI, OBP, OPS, OPS+ and WAR


It gets more difficult with pitching and defensive metrics but I believe if you look at the stats that give the best GENERAL idea than you can't go too far wrong. If you try digging deeper well, you're really into it and are a stats geek. I don't think the general population has the will to go so far under the hood.

Oh that's all? You must be a casual fan. *holds nose*

How can you not look at VORP^2/((wRC+/54)+WAR^(1/3)) ??

Spoiler

Completely joking!

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

What are you talking about? You asked me if OBP is a number I said yes but not the best number. The point is to find the stat the best boils down what's important into a number, that's what I said from the beginning. So if OBP isn't that number, it doesn't matter whether the 5th best OBP in the league is good or not, because that was never the question I was trying to answer, Im trying to find out who is the best hitter.

Nah, you said OBP would be futile to describe, not that it wasn't the best number:

Describing OBP to someone who doesn't understand what a walk is would be futile. I just think it's more useful to be able to understand a number. You're talking about describing it like people need to know how to calculate it, but they don't, it's a stat, a measurement, they just need to know what it measures.

And analogy isn't the right word but I'm referring to whoever brought up the original point of "describing the best hitter to a non baseball fan."

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Nah, you said OBP would be futile to describe, not that it wasn't the best number:




And analogy isn't the right word but I'm referring to whoever brought up the original point of "describing the best hitter to a non baseball fan."

That was me, I was asking a question lol.

And yeah it would be difficult to describe OBP to someone who doesn't understand walks, would it not? My point was that it's all words to someone who literally knows nothing about the game. But what's more useful? A number that tells me the rate at which someone gets on base or a number that measures someone's total contribution to the offense?

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

That was me, I was asking a question lol.

And yeah it would be difficult to describe OBP to someone who doesn't understand walks, would it not? My point was that it's all words to someone who literally knows nothing about the game. But what's more useful? A number that tells me the rate at which someone gets on base or a number that measures someone's total contribution to the offense?

Would someone who doesn't understand baseball know the difference?

Again, I'm not interested in arguing which stats are more meaningful than others. All I did was respond to the original question.

When I think of someone who knows nothing about baseball asking who the best hitter is, they aren't going to care about what metric you use to give them your answer.

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Would someone who doesn't understand baseball know the difference?

Again, I'm not interested in arguing which stats are more meaningful than others. All I did was respond to the original question.

When I think of someone who knows nothing about baseball asking who the best hitter is, they aren't going to care about what metric you use to give them your answer.

No they won't care... Because they don't know. That is the job of the person giving the stat to best determine which one answers the question. Since that's me, I chose. I'm not sure what you're interested in arguing in the first place. I said I wanted the best stat, and I have one, and it's an advanced stat. That's it.

[kehlis]

MLB Off-Topic

No they won't care... Because they don't know. That is the job of the person giving the stat to best determine which one answers the question. Since that's me, I chose. I'm not sure what you're interested in arguing in the first place. I said I wanted the best stat, and I have one, and it's an advanced stat. That's it.

Obviously I agree since I said the same thing several posts ago but I guess you missed it:

I guess what I'm saying is YOU can use whatever stat you want to use to tell him who the best hitter is.



But describing said stat to someone who doesn't understand the intricacies of baseball is futile even if the individual wants to understand.

[DrJones]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

If I knew a non-baseball fan who wanted to learn more about the game, the first thing I'd do is make sure he or she stayed far away from this thread.

[AC]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Telling them about the stats is the completely wrong way to go about it imo. People hate math and attaching a number to things makes them awful. Math sucks, man.

My s/o wanted to learn baseball this summer. The first thing I taught her was DIPS. But I didn't teach her how to calculate xFIP. I taught her that all that mattered in pitching is how many strikeouts you got, how many walks you gave up, and how many grounders you got/flyballs you limited. I explained what the alternate viewpoint was (ERA), and why I felt it was flawed (and warned her beforehand I wasn't going to attempt being partial).

I didn't bother explaining hitting because conceptually everyone agrees on hitting. Homer > triple > double > single. A new fan isn't going to care any more about slugging than wRC+, despite them both being founded on this (and the math being better on the latter), so why bother?

Learning the concepts is the right way to go imo. The worst thing I see is experienced fans quoting FIP and having no idea what it means. You teach someone what to look for, and then if they haven't fallen asleep yet, how to look for it (what the stats are). But that comes later.

[Money99]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Man, I love baseball, but these 4-hour marathon games are terrible.
The Dodgers and Nats had a 4.5 hour game earlier and last night's game was over 4 hours as well.
And these are 9 inning games. Ridiculous.
But that's what happens when you call for a new arm between pitches.

I'd be all for MLB making a rule stipulating that a pitcher has to see x-amount of batters before they can be pulled.

For decades most teams would employ no more than 3 or 4 pitchers a night. Now we see that before the 5th inning.

Enough already. Stop over-managing.

"Back in the day", most games were done in 2 to 2.5 hours.
It's time to get back to that. We need a pitch clock so Pedrioa can't stretch his face and check his straps 23x between every freakin' pitch.
And we need to limit the amount of pitchers being used in a game. Heck, an inning!

[Blzer]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

That was a problem in last night's game, but it wasn't the problem.

I was listening to parts of the game on the radio while driving, and this number was thrown out there: in the top of the 8th inning between 8:23 and 8:41 PM (PST), Pedro Baez threw a total of 20 pitches.

How in the hell does this happen? I understand the different replays and such, but he was just far too deliberate going to the plate in this inning.

There are other big pace-of-play issues (especially surrounding replay), and the IBB is not one of them.

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

I would hate to see managers hands tied behind their back and strategy stifled because games are running long. I don't know the answer, but that isn't it IMO. It's funny because we're seeing the pitching changes because the managers want the best match ups. You'd think fans would want to see the best match ups as well. It's going to be interesting how they settle it for the people who are having that problem. Every Yankees game is "long" so I don't even notice anymore.

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

If the MLB ever starts to micro manage the managers it would lose me as a fan.

There is nothing wrong with a four game if that's how a game plays out.