Jose Fernandez R.I.P

[SPTO]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

I assume that virtually all pro athletes, regardless of background, are into drug and alcohol use.

I think even most jaded sports fans would be stunned at the amount of stuff that never makes it into the news.

I think you may be right. The AC Greens of this world are few and far between.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

Kirby Puckett basically ate himself to death and it was ok to mourn him when it could easily be argued he did that to himself or "had it coming."

[Blzer]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

Kirby Puckett basically ate himself to death and it was ok to mourn him when it could easily be argued he did that to himself or "had it coming."

Though I do wonder if it's different that not only there were two other men aboard the boat (and were subsequently killed), but that his act also put others in danger not on the boat as well. I'd say there's less of a chance of him doing that on a boat in the middle of the night than on a public road, but even still. It's not like we can pull a Kevin Spacey from Se7en and describe Puckett's gluttony as something that is less than "innocent." What he did was essentially harmless to others.

That's obviously not the only parameter, but in my case it's definitely the largest one. Though remember, I'm still okay with having mourned Fernandez's death when all was said and done. I'm not saddened by what he did; I am saddened that he is gone.

[kehlis]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

Though I do wonder if it's different that not only there were two other men aboard the boat (and were subsequently killed), but that his act also put others in danger not on the boat as well. I'd say there's less of a chance of him doing that on a boat in the middle of the night than on a public road, but even still. It's not like we can pull a Kevin Spacey from Se7en and describe Puckett's gluttony as something that is less than "innocent." What he did was essentially harmless to others.

That's obviously not the only parameter, but in my case it's definitely the largest one. Though remember, I'm still okay with having mourned Fernandez's death when all was said and done. I'm not saddened by what he did; I am saddened that he is gone.

He wasn't driving the boat.

[Blzer]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

He wasn't driving the boat.

Thanks. Did not know this. My post before these last two stands pretty moot then.

Then for me it all comes out in the wash. I can't blame him for anything, so I can't possibly feel any less about the guy than before. I just wish he wasn't in the situation he was in.

[kehlis]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

Thanks. Did not know this. My post before these last two stands pretty moot then.

Then for me it all comes out in the wash. I can't blame him for anything, so I can't possibly feel any less about the guy than before. I just wish he wasn't in the situation he was in.

I just don't think we need to look for or seek blame.

It happened, it's tragic regardless of circumstances. You could say maybe it was his fault they were out there in the first place but that still isn't what really matters. At least to me.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

Though I do wonder if it's different that not only there were two other men aboard the boat (and were subsequently killed), but that his act also put others in danger not on the boat as well. I'd say there's less of a chance of him doing that on a boat in the middle of the night than on a public road, but even still. It's not like we can pull a Kevin Spacey from Se7en and describe Puckett's gluttony as something that is less than "innocent." What he did was essentially harmless to others.

That's obviously not the only parameter, but in my case it's definitely the largest one. Though remember, I'm still okay with having mourned Fernandez's death when all was said and done. I'm not saddened by what he did; I am saddened that he is gone.

I just think it's bizarre to finger wag at the dead. Where is the line? If he was speeding sober would that be ok? If you die on a roller coaster is that something we'd shake our heads at? Plenty of fun things to do on solid ground, ya know?

My take: people struggle with the randomness of mortality. So when something like this happens to a 24yo rich dude with his whole life ahead of him, it freaks ppl out because it just doesn't seem right. But now, NOW that we have a toxicology report folks have something they can point the blame at. "X won't happen to me because I don't do Y." Truth of the matter is, life is random and there were probably 50 ppl in Miami that weekend boating on drugs that made it home to their loved ones.

These details don't change much for me because a) I kinda assumed they weren't on that boat playing scrabble, b) these details won't change the level of grief for his family one bit and c) every single person on this forum has made a life decision that could have resulted in their death. It didn't and that's mostly because of random chance.

There's also a certain level of athlete envy in play here but that's a dissertation post I don't have time to write.

[DieHardYankee26]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

I think it's still unconfirmed whether or not he was driving the boat. There's a witness mentioned by the same attorney who implied he may have been drugged but other than that, nothing concrete.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

I just think it's bizarre to finger wag at the dead. Where is the line? If he was speeding sober would that be ok? If you die on a roller coaster is that something we'd shake our heads at? Plenty of fun things to do on solid ground, ya know?

My take: people struggle with the randomness of mortality. So when something like this happens to a 24yo rich dude with his whole life ahead of him, it freaks ppl out because it just doesn't seem right. But now, NOW that we have a toxicology report folks have something they can point the blame at. "X won't happen to me because I don't do Y." Truth of the matter is, life is random and there were probably 50 ppl in Miami that weekend boating on drugs that made it home to their loved ones.

These details don't change much for me because a) I kinda assumed they weren't on that boat playing scrabble, b) these details won't change the level of grief for his family one bit and c) every single person on this forum has made a life decision that could have resulted in their death. It didn't and that's mostly because of random chance.

There's also a certain level of athlete envy in play here but that's a dissertation post I don't have time to write.

I think the line has a lot to do with the associated risk. Some decisions are worse than others based on how likely and totally you could get wrecked as a result of them. I mean, I could get hit by lightning, but I certainly up my chances if I run outside in a thunderstorm with a giant metal rod and no shoes. If I do so, certainly others would question if that was a prudent decision. And I don't think there's anything heinous, wrong, or even abnormal about people second guessing like that. As you eloquently mentioned, talking through it helps provide context in our struggle with the randomness of mortality.

Jose was clearly playing with fire as a result of his decisions/behavior. I wag my finger at the behavior rather than the deceased person. I mostly agree with everything else in your post. It doesn't really matter what I think, but here we all are providing taeks and opinions nonetheless.

[Blzer]

Re: Jose Fernandez R.I.P

I just think it's bizarre to finger wag at the dead. Where is the line? If he was speeding sober would that be ok? If you die on a roller coaster is that something we'd shake our heads at? Plenty of fun things to do on solid ground, ya know?

My original post after the intoxication report was merely a way to expose the possible feeling both sides were trying to emote, from those who said "I can't believe I shed a tear" to those who said "These new revelations make no difference." I think I was just caught somewhere in between.

And no, I'm not sitting here trying to assign blame. I was only stating the only evidence that would have made a difference in how I felt about the circumstances surrounding his death. I also mentioned that it changed nothing about how I felt about his death itself, which I am in great agony over.

There are lines, you know that. A lot of my lines are concerning legality, as well as things I've understood what I shouldn't do while growing up. And you're right, I've made plenty of mistakes that could/should have cost me my life time to time, and should I die by one of those reasons I expect (and deserve) to be shamed for it, heh.

I guess it's just a matter of whether there's anything to talk about regarding his death anymore. If not, we should probably just reflect back at his life from hereon out and pay tribute to everything this young man did in his years on this planet.