2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

[tyler289]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

You guys still liking Joel Hanrahan?

Morgan has been OK here in DC. I love his effort. Before tonight (0-5) he was hitting .333 with 3 doubles, 2 walks, and 3 SB. He seems like a really good guy to have around.

Burnett is also ok. Which is what we need. I feel comfortable with him coming into the game, which is better than I can say for most of our bullpen.

Do you guys know when Milledge will be back playing in AAA? He was hurt 6-8 weeks ago and I know he was due back from his hand/wrist injury.

[ChaseB]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

You guys still liking Joel Hanrahan?

Morgan has been OK here in DC. I love his effort. Before tonight (0-5) he was hitting .333 with 3 doubles, 2 walks, and 3 SB. He seems like a really good guy to have around.

Burnett is also ok. Which is what we need. I feel comfortable with him coming into the game, which is better than I can say for most of our bullpen.

Do you guys know when Milledge will be back playing in AAA? He was hurt 6-8 weeks ago and I know he was due back from his hand/wrist injury.

Lastings should be going to Triple A soon (if not tonight). They've left him in Bradenton a little longer than expected (where he's doing fine in the GCL), presumably just to make sure he's healthy and make him feel comfortable in a new organization -- his family is down that way I believe.

Hanrahan has been on and off, but I suspected that would be the issue during the early stages. It's interesting that both times Kerrigan (the pitching coach) has gone out for mound visits, he has blown the next guy away, so I'm still thinking it's a confidence issue more than anything. His stuff is too good and his control isn't bad, so I have to think he'll turn it around.

And yeah, both the players the Nats got are high-character dudes with what you see is what you get. Nyjer probably won't hit .333, but he'll play a solid CF, and I still think Burnett is more of a lefty specialist, but he's been solid this year as well.

I'd say the trade is still a TBD in terms of how good it looks for both teams. I still say, though, that even if it doesn't work out on the Pirates end, it was still a good trade because Nyjer and Burnett are easily replaceable in the grand scheme of things.

[tyler289]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Morgan is certainly impressing us here in DC. Tonight he's 3-5 with 2 SB and a couple really nice catches. Burnett's given up 1 run in I think 5 apperances (a homer).

Hanrahan's biggest problem is definitely his confidence. He has the stuff.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Yeah, that was the only thing that kind of sucked about the Nyjer trade, he's a great clubhouse guy. The team loved him.

I don't like trading Zach Duke, he should be a guy they want for their future rotation. Maholm/Snell, I'm all for trading. It just sucks, because their MLB talent level is so low. Any MLB player they trade is going to leave a gaping hole. If Bixler wasn't the worst player ever, we could of gotten rid of Jack Wilson by now. Not that there's a great market for him, but still.

From everything I read/heard, they want to get rid of Wilson/Ad LaRoche, but there isn't a strong market for either. Nobody wants Jack's contract at all, and best you're going to get average prospect(s) for him. It's a friggin shame that he ever got that contract to begin with.

[mjb2124]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Agreed about Nyjer. Great clubhouse guy...average player IMO. I would love to him succeed and become a great player because he seems like such a great guy, but I'm not sure it will happen.

I'm not sold that Duke is a guy the Pirates want to build their rotation around. He's had 2 1/2's of a season which he's done well (2005 and the first half of this season). 2006, 2007 and 2008 he was a human pitching machine out there - his H/IP ratio was terrible. There isn't a guy in the rotation I wouldn't trade right now.

It will be interesting to see what trades happen. I've heard rumors regarding Capps, Sanchez, Wilson and Adam LaRoche. All guys that I have no problem dealing (in fact, McCutchen is probably the only guy I wouldn't trade). I wouldn't be surprised to see Grabow traded as well...haven't heard any rumors regarding him though.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

I don't think there'd be much of a market for Matt Capps. He's been possibly the worst closer in baseball.

McCutchen HAS to be untouchable in trades. He's your franchise right now, it would be moronic to trade him.

I don't blame Duke for his bad seasons. That was purely on coaching. I've said for a long time that if he gets his act together he could be a great pitcher, and he seems to of done just that. I love the way he can pound out innings. He's the only guy in the rotation who can go 9 innings every start. I think there's more of a future for him than Maholm and Snell.

When it comes to trading, they're going to have to come up with a package to offer. If they can get rid of Adam LaRoche, Jack Wilson, by packaging them with say John Grabow or Snell or something, then I'd say do it. That's the only way they're going to net another decent prospect, while getting rid of their trash in the process.

[mjb2124]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Definitely agree about Capps (although JR has left him out to dry a few too many times). I heard the Rockies were interested in him and Sanchez. That was before Capps most recent blowup against Philly though.

Yeah the Pirates have to start building somewhere and McCutchen has to be that guy. They've mortgaged the future on him.

While I agree that Tracy and crew screwed up Dukes mechanics and that can be attributed to his poor showings, I don't think we've seen enough success from him quite yet. He has sub-par stuff (kind of like Burnett), but he's been getting people out with it so far this year. He does seem to be fooling more hitters this season as compared to the past...that might be in part to mechanical changes and in part to Duke admitting he spent more time this off season on his conditioning. Time will tell, but I've never been a huge fan of Duke or his stuff. On the other hand, Snell has the stuff, but is a complete head case. Maholm has just never lived up to his draft status...he looked like he might early this season, but has come crashing down since then.

Definitely think they need to package guys since any player by his lonesome won't net much of anything in return. It should be interesting to see what happens before the deadline though.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Thinking about where they probably have the best shot at landing someone, I think it's through trading pitching. Bullpen or starting. A lot of teams in the playoff race are going to want bullpen arms, or an extra starter.

I think a good candidate right now would be someone like the Rays. They need bullpen help pretty bad. While Capps/Grabow are low to us right now, the Rays might give us a sweet package to get them, since the need is high. If Craig Hansen ever comes back, that could somewhat fill the void, it's not like either were having very effective seasons. Trades like the Nady/Marte one last season are the ones that we need to make, getting rid of guys that we don't need to a team that has a big need for them.

Are David Price and Pedro Vanderbilt buddies? [/fantasy]

I don't know though, if they offered you Paul Maholm/Matt Capps/John Grabow all together for David Price, could you say no to that?

[ChaseB]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Thinking about where they probably have the best shot at landing someone, I think it's through trading pitching. Bullpen or starting. A lot of teams in the playoff race are going to want bullpen arms, or an extra starter.

I think a good candidate right now would be someone like the Rays. They need bullpen help pretty bad. While Capps/Grabow are low to us right now, the Rays might give us a sweet package to get them, since the need is high. If Craig Hansen ever comes back, that could somewhat fill the void, it's not like either were having very effective seasons. Trades like the Nady/Marte one last season are the ones that we need to make, getting rid of guys that we don't need to a team that has a big need for them.

Are David Price and Pedro Vanderbilt buddies? [/fantasy]

I don't know though, if they offered you Paul Maholm/Matt Capps/John Grabow all together for David Price, could you say no to that?

Yes.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

shhhhh. Rays management might be watching.

[mjb2124]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

Yes.

Agreed. The sum of the individual is better then the sum of the parts IMO.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

It's a total fantasy/never going to happen, but I don't think it's like that crazy far fetched. A team that really needs a closer/bullpen help in order to compete with Boston/NY, yet they have plenty of depth at starting pitching. It would make sense for them to trade one of their starters, especially if it meant they not only get a closer and another bullpen arm, but also another solid starter. What's so wrong with that?

[mjb2124]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

I wouldn't say "crazy far-fetched". I'd think that if TB had Price out there on the trading block, a lot of other teams would offer much more than Maholm/Grabow/Capps. I view that as trying to trade quantity for quality. None of the guys the Pirates are giving up are in Price's class IMO...in other words, the sum of all 3 still doesn't merit the return of a guy like Price...regardless of need.

Just the way I see it.

[ChaseB]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

I wouldn't say "crazy far-fetched". I'd think that if TB had Price out there on the trading block, a lot of other teams would offer much more than Maholm/Grabow/Capps. I view that as trying to trade quantity for quality. None of the guys the Pirates are giving up are in Price's class IMO...in other words, the sum of all 3 still doesn't merit the return of a guy like Price...regardless of need.

Just the way I see it.

Not to mention Price's manageable contract and a whole bunch of other stuff -- not to mention Capps isn't very good and Grabow is just returning to form. Maholm also would get worked over in the AL East.

[steelcurtain311]

Re: 2009 Pittsburgh Pirates

I wouldn't say "crazy far-fetched". I'd think that if TB had Price out there on the trading block, a lot of other teams would offer much more than Maholm/Grabow/Capps. I view that as trying to trade quantity for quality. None of the guys the Pirates are giving up are in Price's class IMO...in other words, the sum of all 3 still doesn't merit the return of a guy like Price...regardless of need.

Just the way I see it.

Yeah, that's a good point. If they were seriously considering trading him or Kazmir or whoever, the Pirates would have to compete with other teams offers.

The main point I was trying to make, aside from the Price fantasy, is that I think trading some of their pitching is the only thing that's going to net them anything decent in terms of prospects at this point. It's pretty obvious Adam LaRoche/Jack Wilson aren't going to land much of anything.