NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

[thedream2k13]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

yeah, i get that. i get that some players can make contested shots...but how do you deal with this in a video game? i feel like they should lower the success for contested shots a bit more than in real life, in order to prevent people from using player ratings in place of strategy. i get that a real player might be able to hit contested shots all day long...but a user shouldn't be able to do that in a video game...it removes all skill/strategy/decision-making from the equation...and it just becomes about relying on player ratings for success.

maybe there could just be a new mode called "strategy mode" or something...where player ratings and sig skills are toned down and strategy/shot selection are made more important.

but the players are dictated by the ratings determine the the shot success.how do you separate and elite three point shooter from a mediocre three point shooter if you don't have ratings that determine their success probability

[Optik]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Bluesrocker,


Keep this in mind though some players actually shoot much better when contested which goes against that train of thought, it is not the majority but it happens. Then there are some players that drop off dramatically when contested like Dragic. Check the link it was from March so it should be based off pretty much 2/3 of the season but you can see the trend. At that time the average % drop for a contest across the league was like 5.4% for jumpers. I am waiting for 2K to implement something like this where they rate the players based off contest, open, spot up and off the dribble separately.


http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2014/0...a_12_twitter_L

Incomplete analysis. Pierce was shooting with Kyle Lowry contesting him. It would be far less likely for him to make it if Durant was contesting him. Also, there are clearly different levels of how contested a shot is that wasn't accounted for.

[Mintsa]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

I just want to chime in here and just say this is a great thread. Devs breaking down/clarifying a new feature. 2k gamers breaking down feedback......GREAT READ!!!!

This is what OS is all about.


Thanks....please continue.

[23]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

I've been meaning to work this into the shot system for a while but it keeps falling off the feature list. Mostly because you don't see it often on "regular" J's. And to make it look right you'd have to blend out of the normal shot pretty early, before the player even reaches the apex.

You're right Its definitely not a common shot...I thought about it happening on halfcourt heaves before anything else but nevertheless thanks for answering.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Mike the only thing I didn't see explained is does the shot meter change based off location on the court or do you just get one shot meter regardless? Example I will use Bradley Beal and Westbrook.


Westbrook is a better mid range jump shooter % wise than Beal, but Beal is much better 3PT shooter. However overall they shoot the same overall from total jumpers




Westbrook Beal
Mid range 43% 38%
3pt 32% 39%
Overall 38% 38%

The shot meter takes everything into account. Think of it this way. Take the player's real FG% from any given situation: factoring in shot defense, his range, hot/cold zones, fatigue, ratings, etc. and turn that into a target. The bigger the value, the larger the target. Now, it's your job to hit that target. So Russ' elbow jumper is much easier to time than Beal's, and vice versa at the 3pt line.

[JerzeyReign]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

The shot meter takes everything into account. Think of it this way. Take the player's real FG% from any given situation: factoring in shot defense, his range, hot/cold zones, fatigue, ratings, etc. and turn that into a target. The bigger the value, the larger the target. Now, it's your job to hit that target. So Russ' elbow jumper is much easier to time than Beal's, and vice versa at the 3pt line.

Even though you didn't answer/quote my posts - this answers my questions. This system seems like it could also lower the value of zig zag cheese shot percentages as well (hopefully footplanting was tweaked but thats a topic for another day).

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

my main concern with shot success is that open shots are rewarded with success, and contested shots are punished with missing. i just want the shot success to make sense. reward people who take the time to get open shots. by allowing too many contested/contact shots go in, it makes success feel arbitrary, and allows people to compete even with bad shot selection. don't allow player ratings to overpower "good basketball." as of now, users can use player ratings and sig skills as a crutch to make up for their bad shot selection.

one of the big questions in video game basketball is: how much should the outcome be determined by the user's choices vs. how much of the outcome should be determined by the player ratings? it is my view that the user's decisions (shot selection, strategy) should be the OVERWHELMING PRIMARY factor in determining success. I have always believed that a good user who picks a mediocre team should still be able to destroy a bad user who picks the Spurs...whoever has better shot selection should win...not whoever has more allstars.

as of now, bad users can kind of compete just by picking a good team and just jacking up random shots (because eventually the player ratings and sig skills take over and they're just going to start hitting shots no matter how bad their shot selection is). this is my main problem with the game (especially online). if a user picks a team with a bunch of allstars who can make contested/contact shots, then shot selection doesn't matter enough. it matters a bit, but i want to see shooting percentages as low as 23-29% (yes, even for the Spurs or Heat) if the user is jacking up all contested/contact shots and isn't even trying to get open (this might be an "unrealistically low" shooting percentage...but unrealistically bad basketball calls for unrealistically low shooting percentages).

Strategy and shot selection are absolutely more important than stick skills. Da Czar has proven this and caused me to have to re-tune the shot timing system several times to compensate. He knows the plays inside and out like the back of his hand and can breakdown the defense better than anyone I've seen play our game. He's no slouch on the sticks either so it was a deadly combo. We went back and forth with several iterations and I'm confident we're in a good spot with the balance. At least, I haven't heard any complaints from him recently.

If you run plays and get fantastic looks but suck at timing you can still do pretty well. If you take bad shots but are amazing at timing, you'll do okay for a while but will probably lose. If you can manage to do both like Czar you'll be vicious in 15. If you're bad at both, then you might have to bump the diff. to Rookie.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Even though you didn't answer/quote my posts - this answers my questions. This system seems like it could also lower the value of zig zag cheese shot percentages as well (hopefully footplanting was tweaked but thats a topic for another day).

Zigzag cheese is gone. We specifically put in other measures to counter it.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

What about post shots and lay ups? is it the meter there too? In other 2k iterations I always had the feeling that timing didn't matter a lot in those kind of shots...



Cheers! ;-)

The meter is active for all manually releasable shots, including post jumpers. But not layups. My shots engineer and I experimented with it and decided the world is not ready for that.

[quehouston]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Zigzag cheese is gone. We specifically put in other measures to counter it.

Thank goodness. This was a cheesers go to strategy, and there was really nothing we could do to stop it if we are dedicated on-ball defenders online having to fight against lag.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Also, the shot meter works in online games but the results you get from timing error are tuned differently from offline to compensate for latency. Online, releasing very early/late is much more forgiving than it is offline.

[JerzeyReign]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Zigzag cheese is gone. We specifically put in other measures to counter it.

Spoiler

[23]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

The meter is active for all manually releasable shots, including post jumpers. But not layups. My shots engineer and I experimented with it and decided the world is not ready for that.

Can't remember which one it was but I remember the "why do I keep missing layups" complaints on the forums..... touche'

[eko718]

Re: New Shot Meter

Yes. We use real life FGA stats to determine how quickly a player fatigues. So volume shooters can put up a lot more shots before being affected.

On your twitter you mentioned that shot fatigue also results from pounding the ball in the paint. Is this due to contact from driving in the paint?

If so, for guys who get most of their money in the paint like Lebron, Wade, etc. do they fatigue at a lesser rate when driving in the paint than guys who drive less often like Carmelo and Durant?

[quehouston]

Re: NBA 2K15 New Shot Meter Explained

Also, the shot meter works in online games but the results you get from timing error are tuned differently from offline to compensate for latency. Online, releasing very early/late is much more forgiving than it is offline.

Its there any word on what skill level and game style online will run on?