My frustration has finally happened

[Comduklakis]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

Legitimate question: Does it bother anyone that the CPU plays incredibly poorly at times?

Because it seems like everything is about "me/user" can't do this and can't do that against the CPU. Or that everything seems to go the CPU's way. For those that have gripes, do you ever analyze the situation where you were able to abuse the CPU or do you simply let that slide because you actually were successful? When things go your way, do you question it, or are you thrilled?

I've seen random highlight videos posted by users where they were able to abuse the cpu, and everybody thumbs up the video, but when you actually break down the video, the CPU was less than intelligent.

I was extremely disappointed when I had a wide open three. Something was wrong, went into replay mode and knew why I got the wide open shot. I didn't like it at all. CPU HOF, default sliders.

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I get your point but in your specific example, that happens IRL. A player makes a bad choice to go guard what they think is an unguarded cutting player. Should it happen every play? Absolutely not. But it does happen now and then during games.

That said, it would have been better to see Oladipo take a few steps towards the cutting Taj Gibson, realize that someone had him, then try and scramble back to Butler. THAT is the next level we need to see on D and defensive awareness. Mistakes happening, but happening fast so you have to exploit them quickly, just as IRL

[sammy watkins]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I used to pretty much ONLY play ranked online and in online associations. Been that way since NBA 2K8. I never touched this game offline at all or any MyPlayer. However, this year the game is flat out awful, IMO. The actual game is just garbage, the online play sucks because the game sucks.



So this year for the first time in my life, I am playing MyPlayer. I'm actually having a ton of fun with this mode and I love the archetype system. I love the grind to level your player up and once I get him to a certain point I will take him online.


So for me, I found something brand new, but I feel your pain. The core gameplay of this game is just brutal.

[VDusen04]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I guess my point was that I would like to see more posts showing a user's frustration when s/he was able to straight up abuse the cpu, and call out the cpu for being completely bone-headed.

Instead of constantly hearing how the game is geared towards the CPU, I would love to see more posts when the situation goes in the user's favor and why the user him/herself didn't like the outcome.

It's also not really basketball when I can do this with Rudy Gobert (2k18)
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If I had to guess, people voicing their opinions of how they were able to abuse the CPU in 2K18 is why we have a CPU in 2K19 that seems to defy physics (Chucky Atkins' sliding recovery posted a few pages back that ensured he wouldn't give up anything off the dribble while still shutting down any attempted jumpshots) and the rules of basketball (Atkins clutching, grabbing and pulling Baron Davis from the side and behind for 55 feet before finally stripping the ball away at the rim) in order to make scoring arbitrarily harder for us in the first place.

Then again, it's also generally more maddening when people are prevented from succeeding by perceived oddities than it is when people are succeeding too much. Both can be problematic but if I had to choose one, I'd select the one where I'm doing too well in a game that follows basketball physics over one where I'm struggling in a game that adds shortcuts to make things randomly more difficult even when I make the right read and execution.

That said, I acknowledge the difficulty that comes with finding a workable balance. I wouldn't want that job. But as always, I still think it's worth bringing one's issues to the forefront when they come about.

[strawberryshortcake]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I get your point but in your specific example, that happens IRL. A player makes a bad choice to go guard what they think is an unguarded cutting player. Should it happen every play? Absolutely not. But it does happen now and then during games.

That said, it would have been better to see Oladipo take a few steps towards the cutting Taj Gibson, realize that someone had him, then try and scramble back to Butler. THAT is the next level we need to see on D and defensive awareness. Mistakes happening, but happening fast so you have to exploit them quickly, just as IRL

There's honestly no excuse for that play.

There's more to it that's wrong than just "that." Oladipo wasn't actually motioning towards Taj Gibson. Run the play over and you'll see his target was actually Teague (Point Guard) driving the paint. Notice where Oladipo ends up. Oladipo couldn't care less about Taj cutting. That's currently 2k's logic for whatever reason. Secondly, where's the helper rotation. Miles Turner (corner three defender) should have "partially" rotated when Oladipo decided to rotate to defend Teague. And no, I'm not saying Turner should have rotated off Towns, but he should at least be within distance to contest either perimeter shot, etc. Thirdly, poor intial angle by number 21 (yes, do poor angles happen in the NBA, yes, but how 2k expresses 'taking poor angles' (not just this example), but a lot is poorly done).

I'm sorry but the entire CPU defensive sequence is a mess. The execution of what should have happened should have been better. It simply looks incompetent. Mistakes happen, but this particular play did not replicate those mistakes properly.

[STLRams]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I have no problem beating the CPU on Allstar or Hall of Fame level at the moment. As I stated before, the gameplay by the CPU is just not really SIM to me and at times is downright repetitive when most of the players and teams play exactly alike, and the CPU is doing dumb and odd things on offense and defense. Usually each year I find a custom roster and sliders or slightly tweak both myself, but for 2K19 so far this feels I will have basically over haul all of the playbooks, players tendencies, sliders, play types,etc to get the game to resemble real NBA gameplay.

[TheFinalEvent97]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

Legitimate question: Does it bother anyone that the CPU plays incredibly poorly at times?

Because it seems like everything is about "me/user" can't do this and can't do that against the CPU. Or that everything seems to go the CPU's way. For those that have gripes, do you ever analyze the situation where you were able to abuse the CPU or do you simply let that slide because you actually were successful? When things go your way, do you question it, or are you thrilled?

I've seen random highlight videos posted by users where they were able to abuse the cpu, and everybody thumbs up the video, but when you actually break down the video, the CPU was less than intelligent.

I was extremely disappointed when I had a wide open three. Something was wrong, went into replay mode and knew why I got the wide open shot. I didn't like it at all. CPU HOF, default sliders.

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It really does annoy me, these 2 clips are the last 2 possessions on a HOF Difficulty MyCareer game and really showcases the AI's lack of situational awareness.
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Why is the AI double teaming after I've picked up my dribble and why is Butler recklessly reaching when I'm in the bonus and he has 5 fouls?
Then this happened
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Surely once the AI sees that I'm denying the post entry pass Teague has to try and take his man off the dribble instead of just standing there hoping to make a pass that clearly isn't there?

[CelticBalla32]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I think there's different kinds of "too hard". I typically don't mind getting beaten by better basketball. But I do have an issue when I'm beaten by programmed compensations.

In 2K17, I still have nightmares of timing a block attempt perfectly with Ben Wallace, only for the game to choose a conveniently slow jumping animation that'd allow an offensive player to narrowly slip a layup over his finger tips.

In 2K18, that compensation came in the form of nerfed point blank jump hooks and shot attempts in the paint to balance inside scoring.

So far in 2K19, perhaps in an effort to combat what some felt to be drives that were too accessible and successful in 2K18, there seems to be some over-compensation in terms of defensive sliding, limited offensive explosion, and a touch of the ol' brick wall defensive routine. Moreover, I've experienced some games so far where my point guard can't even reliably call a play without leaving the ball briefly exposed and having it poked away.

Those compensations aren't better basketball. Rather, they're just handicaps to prevent folks from being too effective. And I get it, you sort of need those handicaps when you're trying to create a balanced video game simulation of a real life activity, but they're handicaps nonetheless.

I'm still in the midst of feeling 2K19 out so I'm not ready to make any sweeping conclusions (I've been doing a lot of roster editing instead). As it stands right now, Pro seems to be way too easy of a difficulty but All-Star seems to start introducing a lot more video game fixes as opposed to improved computer basketball tendencies (Chauncey Billups suddenly can't protect the basketball and call a play at the same time on one end, defenders constantly lose their man via backdoor cut and watch the opposing point guard rifle 50-foot passes on the money for point blank layups as a result on the other).

When it's all said and done, I'm hoping I can find a suitable balance with sliders, but I can comfortably say that I don't think my issue is related to a supposed lack of basketball knowledge and understanding.

"I timed it perfectly! 2K slowed down my jumping because it knew I was going to block a shot!"

....... You probably didn't time it correctly. Lol.

[VDusen04]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

"I timed it perfectly! 2K slowed down my jumping because it knew I was going to block a shot!"

....... You probably didn't time it correctly. Lol.

I'm not entirely certain why you chose to pick one sentence from a post I made a few pages ago, nor am I sure what you're going for with the random condescension and whatnot, but for whatever it's worth, my issues with shot blocking in 2K17 came in its lack of response and consistency. Many of the interactions felt heavily skewed toward random chance as opposed to anything that had to do with my input.

It's one thing to think you've got a shot block timed out only to have an opponent double pump around you, or to watch them skirt past you on a pump fake, or for Tony Parker to rain a little tear drop out of reach, or for Zach Randolph to lean in and draw a foul. It's another thing to press Y and watch your defender remain grounded for a noticeably longer moment than usual for the given circumstances, taking the element of timing out the equation altogether on certain plays.

2K17 as a whole was an awful experience for me on account of the lack of control. 2K18, in contrast, was a breath of fresh air in that regard.

[Detroit Red]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

I can't imagine how Czar would react if he saw people saying that every team plays the same.

I think it just feels that way because the AI react and adapt so insanely fast on offense and defense, I like to run plays and create mismatches which do work from time to time but there's an element of human error missing from the AI.

[Moroccan_Boy]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

The A.i's approach towards offense and the way they execute is starting to get really predictable !

Bullet passes into the paint and backdoor cuts and worming inside the paint and scoring in heavy traffic is starting to ruin the gaming experience for me .

Nowadays its hard to get a game or 2 in myleague without getting stressed and having the ability to predict their runs around the beginning of the 3rd and end 4th ...i can predict their unstoppable runs now ...well at least my assessment got better

Wish they would invest more money and time into programming the game to be more of a simulation but i know the reason why they dont .

Even with a good slider set where i put 50 + games of work in, the CPU will still cheat hard.

[DJ]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

My people! This is by far the most I've ever been frustrated with a 2K game, for many of the reasons pointed out here.

Really wish I had held off, but I fell for the pre-release hype.

[DonWuan]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

When was the last time you folks watched cpu vs cpu gameplay?

I just watch a few quarters of random teams. Its a drag watching the cpu play out but the same things that have been said in this thread they do to each other.

Nba 2k19 is as generic as nba live. Im a fan of both games. 2k has the same simple minded cpu as Live but looks prettier doing it.

There is some pull ups in transisition, some fadeaways, etc sprinkled in here and there.

But as of today, cpu scores by backdoor cuts or spinning/crossover/slide to the basket for layup. They are not attacking they are waiting for human error/slide for scoring opportunities. Series/freestyle mean nothing.

They take at least 10-12 seconds to start the play. Comes down to the last 5 seconds of the shot clock. Either spinning/crossover/slide towards the rim, p&r jumpshot or sitting still and taking a jumpshot at last second. If they have a post player they will run the same post play over and over. Especially bigger pg-sf players.

Let me be extremely clear. Cpu does not run an offense. You kind of get the whole story once the play breaks down. They just stand there. If body sensitivity is high they keep running into the defender and eventually pass. The next person just waits for a pick in the most robotic way possible.

Warriors attempt to run an offense. Lots of motion and backdoor cuts. Switching a few teams to fast pace/shot at will changes things a little. But the half court offense isnt basketball.

If you get a chance sit back and watch the cpu play out. Without human error involved, game looks bad. All the flaws poke through.

[Gosens6]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

When was the last time you folks watched cpu vs cpu gameplay?



I just watch a few quarters of random teams. Its a drag watching the cpu play out but the same things that have been said in this thread they do to each other.



Nba 2k19 is as generic as nba live. Im a fan of both games. 2k has the same simple minded cpu as Live but looks prettier doing it.



There is some pull ups in transisition, some fadeaways, etc sprinkled in here and there.



But as of today, cpu scores by backdoor cuts or spinning/crossover/slide to the basket for layup. They are not attacking they are waiting for human error/slide for scoring opportunities. Series/freestyle mean nothing.



They take at least 10-12 seconds to start the play. Comes down to the last 5 seconds of the shot clock. Either spinning/crossover/slide towards the rim, p&r jumpshot or sitting still and taking a jumpshot at last second. If they have a post player they will run the same post play over and over. Especially bigger pg-sf players.



Let me be extremely clear. Cpu does not run an offense. You kind of get the whole story once the play breaks down. They just stand there. If body sensitivity is high they keep running into the defender and eventually pass. The next person just waits for a pick in the most robotic way possible.



Warriors attempt to run an offense. Lots of motion and backdoor cuts. Switching a few teams to fast pace/shot at will changes things a little. But the half court offense isnt basketball.



If you get a chance sit back and watch the cpu play out. Without human error involved, game looks bad. All the flaws poke through.

Hit the nail on the head with this post.

Honestly, I’ve started to play some Live 19 and I’m actually enjoying the gameplay more than I am 2K at this point. In Live, teams run plays, they use halfcourt sets, they take 3 point shots, mid range shots, it just plays like real basketball.

The AI in 2K, like you said, just bullies it’s way into the paint and throws up a ridiculously animated layup attempt that goes in more often than not


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[ksuttonjr76]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

Real talk...I don't play any of the online modes without 1-2 beers beside me.

[leszek]

Re: My frustration has finally happened

thanks OP for starting this. thought i'm alone feeling this way and am overwhelmed by how many of you see it that way, too. almost all critique here is very accurate and can be second by me. it's a shame really, because the core of the engine easily could provide a sim style play. the game itself has a lot of nice stuff in it. the worst are the backdoor and icon lead pass cheeses, followed by the constant PIP forcing off the dribble. i stop one paint play, CPU goes to another over and over again until the user cant keep up against android controls...

i can only have some fun with 2k19 if i'm playing it as a game, not a basketball simulation. thats how it was designed. wonder how all those previews and reviews praised it as sim... last time i looked up those for sports games.