Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

[CharliePrince]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Has it ever been proven that a player's play style affects his development?

For example, if I create a defensive shooting guard and a scoring shooting guard with the same base ratings, will the one improve mostly in defensive skills while the other improves mostly his scoring skills?

Play-style doesn't just affect or determine ratings..

the truth of the matter is PlayStyle tells you how your player will play.. disregard the ratings.. it's his STYLE of play..

I'll try to give you a concrete example right now since I am well versed in this

you enter a draft and find 2 SG's, one is a SCORER the other is DEFENSIVE play styles..

even if you set all their ratings and attributes to 50, their tendencies differ vastly and will not change as shown by their PLAY STYLE

ie: the scorer will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 88, the defensive guy will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 42

even if you spend 10 years in an association, and their base ratings of 50 become 75.. their STYLES will still remain the same.. the Scorer will take more shots and score more points and possibly earn more accolades than the defensive guy. Not because of their ratings.. you can build them both up the exact same way, it won't matter..

it's weird because the Play Style doesn't really.. you're not setting anything, it just highlights his specific skills.. I've personally had players who were DEFENSIVE styled and i've spent every single training camp on their perimiter shooting to max it at 99 and they wouldn't be out there scoring 40-50 points a game.. it's not their style to do that

am i making sense? it's weird.. you just have to know that the "Play Style" is more connected to the player's "DNA" if you will, how he'll play on the court, his true essence if you will! ...his playing style

my head hurts

[Introcollapse]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Play-style doesn't just affect or determine ratings..

the truth of the matter is PlayStyle tells you how your player will play.. disregard the ratings.. it's his STYLE of play..

I'll try to give you a concrete example right now since I am well versed in this

you enter a draft and find 2 SG's, one is a SCORER the other is DEFENSIVE play styles..

even if you set all their ratings and attributes to 50, their tendencies differ vastly and will not change as shown by their PLAY STYLE

ie: the scorer will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 88, the defensive guy will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 42

even if you spend 10 years in an association, and their base ratings of 50 become 75.. their STYLES will still remain the same.. the Scorer will take more shots and score more points and possibly earn more accolades than the defensive guy. Not because of their ratings.. you can build them both up the exact same way, it won't matter..

it's weird because the Play Style doesn't really.. you're not setting anything, it just highlights his specific skills.. I've personally had players who were DEFENSIVE styled and i've spent every single training camp on their perimiter shooting to max it at 99 and they wouldn't be out there scoring 40-50 points a game.. it's not their style to do that

am i making sense? it's weird.. you just have to know that the "Play Style" is more connected to the player's "DNA" if you will, how he'll play on the court, his true essence if you will! ...his playing style

my head hurts

No, no. I get that. Assume their tendencies were also identical. Then what? My question is basically this: my defensive SG with 90 potential, will he go +5 overall in one season because of defensive stats, while the scoring SG with 90 potential goes +5 overall in one season because of offensive stats?

[wize250]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Just uploaded 2 draft classes for XBOX360, gamer tag is the same as my name for this forum (Wize250) to search for.

Hopefully these should be pretty good and have a few unique play styles for some different players.

[CharliePrince]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

No, no. I get that. Assume their tendencies were also identical. Then what? My question is basically this: my defensive SG with 90 potential, will he go +5 overall in one season because of defensive stats, while the scoring SG with 90 potential goes +5 overall in one season because of offensive stats?

the answer to your question is yes, play style will affect which attributes go up at the end of the season for progression

KEEP IN MIND THIS IS FOR ASSOCIATION .. I know nothing of My Player sorry

obviously it won't be clearcut simple black n white, but yes the scoring sg will develop more attributes related to his play style as a scorer

whereas the defensive guy may get +3 in Steal (whereas the scorer gets 0)

something like that

truth be told, I find every player different and even 2 players with the same Play Style and same potential will progress differently at the end of the season due to them having different DNA's

but then i'd be nitpicking.. like
Center1 would get +3 shot-inside +1 shot-close
Center2 would get +1 shot-inside +2 shot-close

[wize250]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Play-style doesn't just affect or determine ratings..

the truth of the matter is PlayStyle tells you how your player will play.. disregard the ratings.. it's his STYLE of play..

I'll try to give you a concrete example right now since I am well versed in this

you enter a draft and find 2 SG's, one is a SCORER the other is DEFENSIVE play styles..

even if you set all their ratings and attributes to 50, their tendencies differ vastly and will not change as shown by their PLAY STYLE

ie: the scorer will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 88, the defensive guy will have a TAKE SHOT tendency of 42

even if you spend 10 years in an association, and their base ratings of 50 become 75.. their STYLES will still remain the same.. the Scorer will take more shots and score more points and possibly earn more accolades than the defensive guy. Not because of their ratings.. you can build them both up the exact same way, it won't matter..

it's weird because the Play Style doesn't really.. you're not setting anything, it just highlights his specific skills.. I've personally had players who were DEFENSIVE styled and i've spent every single training camp on their perimiter shooting to max it at 99 and they wouldn't be out there scoring 40-50 points a game.. it's not their style to do that

am i making sense? it's weird.. you just have to know that the "Play Style" is more connected to the player's "DNA" if you will, how he'll play on the court, his true essence if you will! ...his playing style

my head hurts

Of course if this bugs you that your guy that now has high offensive skills won't take shots you can also increase their tendencies manually, but it sucks if you have a stock draft with random settings for that and computer teams get guys like that.

Its the same thing as with the commit foul tendency, the computer has a weird way of randomly assigning guys very high ratings (i.e. 80+) and if they are a star player supposed to play 40mpg they might really only play 20 unless changed.

Also out of curiosity does the contest shot rating really do a ton? because I noticed when editing draft classes that there are tons of the computer generated players with that rating at 0 (like 80%) and about 20% ranging from 10-80ish. Seems like if it is pretty important (as it reads in the description for the tendency) even defensive players are getting sent out with bad defensive play.

[Introcollapse]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Of course if this bugs you that your guy that now has high offensive skills won't take shots you can also increase their tendencies manually, but it sucks if you have a stock draft with random settings for that and computer teams get guys like that.

Its the same thing as with the commit foul tendency, the computer has a weird way of randomly assigning guys very high ratings (i.e. 80+) and if they are a star player supposed to play 40mpg they might really only play 20 unless changed.

Also out of curiosity does the contest shot rating really do a ton? because I noticed when editing draft classes that there are tons of the computer generated players with that rating at 0 (like 80%) and about 20% ranging from 10-80ish. Seems like if it is pretty important (as it reads in the description for the tendency) even defensive players are getting sent out with bad defensive play.

Exactly. My goal is to create a few deep draft classes, but I want to do it properly. Maybe I have a bare bones athletic guy that develops into a good defender over his career. Maybe a sweet shooting big that develops a post game later on.

I'm going to test it all out later. I'll report my findings.

[Introcollapse]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Here's an update. Just simmed two seasons. Two identical players (in every way. Height, weight, attributes, abilities, tendencies, hot spots) with different play styles. Same minutes per game.

Few observations so far.

One, and this is the big (disappointing) one. Play style has no effect on player development. Truly, I think it's just there for show. Because you can edit tendencies. Sucks.

Two, I notices abilities changing. They both started with "average" in everything. The majority are now "good".

Three, their tendencies are also changing. The changes aren't huge, but they're there. I set their shot tendencies to 75 in the creator. One guy has two 81s now. Also, as their abilities improve, their tendencies regarding those moves change too. This is something I've asked for for years. Glad that it's been implemented. Needs work though.

Hope this helps you guys when editing draft classes. Any questions, just ask. Going to test a few more seasons.

[CharliePrince]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Here's an update. Just simmed two seasons. Two identical players (in every way. Height, weight, attributes, abilities, tendencies, hot spots) with different play styles. Same minutes per game.

Few observations so far.

One, and this is the big (disappointing) one. Play style has no effect on player development. Truly, I think it's just there for show. Because you can edit tendencies. Sucks.

Two, I notices abilities changing. They both started with "average" in everything. The majority are now "good".

Three, their tendencies are also changing. The changes aren't huge, but they're there. I set their shot tendencies to 75 in the creator. One guy has two 81s now. Also, as their abilities improve, their tendencies regarding those moves change too. This is something I've asked for for years. Glad that it's been implemented. Needs work though.

Hope this helps you guys when editing draft classes. Any questions, just ask. Going to test a few more seasons.

imo you're just wasting your time, every player has different DNA and will develop differently even if you have him at the same position with the same playstyle

nothing is absolute, where would the fun be if all the players were just cookie cutter copies of each other

[Introcollapse]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

imo you're just wasting your time, every player has different DNA and will develop differently even if you have him at the same position with the same playstyle

nothing is absolute, where would the fun be if all the players were just cookie cutter copies of each other

The issue I have is that all attributes improve at the same rate for every position. One was defensive, one was scoring. I hoped one would improve predominantly their defensive abilities, and the other their scoring abilities. But what I found was that it really doesn't matter. All attributes are improving at the same rate for both players.

It's disappointing.

[CWSapp757]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Some interesting stuff. I'm looking forward to seeing what you find intro.

[Jukeman]

Has it ever been proven that a player's play style affects his development?

For example, if I create a defensive shooting guard and a scoring shooting guard with the same base ratings, will the one improve mostly in defensive skills while the other improves mostly his scoring skills?

This is what I want to know as well (I know it's a on going discussion about it now, I haven't read those coments yet)

Maybe it does affect development, I for one can't speak on it because I haven't spent time testing it...

But maybe this is why 2 players with the same OVR & POT progress differently?

Edit- ok now I read the post and it only confirms that nba2k should adapt college hoop's training/development system..

Man, it's alot of little details association is missing..

Play styles also could have been tied into coaching priorities for when they build a roster...

Yea it has something like that now but it's really bare bones and I doubt it really has any effect unless you drastically change it..

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[Introcollapse]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

New update: minutes play a considerable role in development. With a high potential, a player is bound to improve no matter what, but the rate is dependent on their minutes. Redid association with two exact clones. One got 36 mpg, the other 10. Both had 80 potential. 36 mpg guy went +5 in his first season. 10 mpg guy went +2.

Then, made a 65 overall guy, 70 potential. Gave him 36 mpg. Made a 75 overall guy, gave him 80 potential. 65 got 36 mpg, 75 got 10. 65 was +3 after the season. 75 was +2.

[ffaacc03]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

I also would like to add that if you choose to set player trade on, the AI would not trade for the user when you have 30 team control unlike last year...Maybe another bug?


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ouch !, lets see ... I always go 30 team control but turn on some CPU micormanagements functions, suchas trading and signings ... only leave HUM for the team I like to fully manage ... ah, also leave the roation thing HUMA for all teams ...

So, now in 2k12, those teams with trades and signings on for CPU management will not do that as I am ultimately controlling all teams ? ... can you confirm and clear this ? ... if so, this is getting worse with each find ... WOW !

[miller31time]

Re: Some info for those of you that like to go deep into your Association.....

Not sure if this has been posted (don't have the time to read through 18 pages), but the 3pt shooting attributes and tendencies are ridiculously high for almost each and every guard in the league.

Almost every guard (and many forwards) has a 3pt rating of 80-90 (no matter if they are great 3pt shooters or terrible ones), and to make matters worse, they take a crap-load of them since the tendencies are set at 70-80.

Hopefully, they tweak this in the patch because the rookies that enter the game each year in Association have the same tendencies and ratings and I sure as hell am not going to edit every rookie guard and forward that gets drafted each year - that's a ridiculous price for realism.

[Jukeman]

ouch !, lets see ... I always go 30 team control but turn on some CPU micormanagements functions, suchas trading and signings ... only leave HUM for the team I like to fully manage ... ah, also leave the roation thing HUMA for all teams ...

So, now in 2k12, those teams with trades and signings on for CPU management will not do that as I am ultimately controlling all teams ? ... can you confirm and clear this ? ... if so, this is getting worse with each find ... WOW !

I believe they still sign their players.

Im not 100% sure tho


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