Most idiotic online game ever

[DarthLeon]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Personally, I'm not so bothered by cheese because of its lack of realism, but because we simply don't have adequate tools to combat it. The rampant 3pt barrages wouldn't bother me one bit if setting your defenders to tight coverage actually resulted in tight coverage. The offensive rebounding wouldn't bother me if it was because I genuinely got beat, not because all of my defenders have a sudden onset of dementia. And the constant steal spamming wouldn't bother me at all if I had some defense against it. The lack of counters to these tactics isn't just unrealistic, it's also bad design.

I don't care if people want to play in a crazy, unrealistic manner. It's their game too, after all. All I want is tools of my own that I can use against them.

[BigJizzle]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

I'm not the OP...This thread was not started by me...and No it wasn't one specific game...Its a culmination of what I'm normally seeing online..,Just so II'm clear there was no specific game...its not about cheesers...Its just after playing numerous online games I'm seeing some disturbing game play trends that are not representative of what you might expect from a game that is a simulation. This is not isolated to this year either...For a while 3pt shots were bad last year online along with online stability and connectivity. For the first week or two I can recall not even being able to play online because every game would disconnect...It was a global problem that many online gamers experienced. Its kinda like how people feel about Madden...same ish every year, right?...It gets old after a while and with all the improved tech and money we spend on these games I think its reasonable to want a simple simulation experience by simply picking up the game, inserting into tray and pushing play.

Does anyone here remember NFL2k5?...Great football game, right?...except for one fatal flaw...The QB Spy Glitch..***ined the game because there was no way to spy the QB. Hence you had Peyton manning running for 100yds a game and even when people weren't cheesing the mere fact that the QB can take off and it not be prevented was just a plain game killer. IMO the shot quality and 3pt shot effectiveness online with absolutely no respect for rhythm or flow is comparable to the QB Spy Glitch because even when people are trying not to cheese...Its there and can have an unintentional impact on the game whether we like it or not. I mean QB's do run so you can't be mad when a guy makes all his reads...then decides to tuck and be out. Its just an unfortunate thing that in 2K hoops this same problem has plagued online year after year...hell I remember the year people complained about not being able to make mid-range shots or jumpshots in general...So all games ended up with crazy amounts of points in the paint.

Last year after several patches they had online playing decent but it seems like every-time they tune the game something else goes wrong. If its not online stability and connectivity its the issue with the 3 ptr's or some other area that needs tweaking or overhauling like rebounding and players standing around like zombies not going after rebounds...Or standing out of bounds to receive a pass or attempting to save a ball they shouldn't even be going after...Some of the online stuff that happens just leaves you scratching your head.

I'm actually tolerant and easy to please...I just would like to see them fix it and have a playable decent online experience...The game has too many good qualities to let this one issue keep it on my table as a drink coaster. Cheers

U hit da nail on da head wit dis! I totally agree wit u on dis. My online record is 85-5 and I have retired from playing online for now due to da fact I'm just tired of seeing all of da foolishness dat go on online. I've always said 2k is a Ferrari car wit a pinto engine.

[spankdatazz22]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Maybe I'm naïve to what is/isn't doable online but so far I haven't heard of any issues like the euro-step glitch or people being able to dunk with impunity with certain players. I hate mentioning them because again - these were ONLINE issues that some ONLINE PLAYERS abused. Offline I never had a problem, and truth be told when I played online I only saw either of the issues every so often. Yet you had people come on the boards and complain incessantly, because they wanted to play any and all comers and felt cheated when they'd lose to someone using these tactics. 2K addresses these issues and others, and here are some of the online guys complaining about something else. And like every year previous condemning the game as a whole because of it. It's a never-ending cycle - you're playing an imperfect game you're trying to hold to a perfect (simulation) standard imo.

For all this talk about how games need to be a pure simulation online, I used to wonder how many of those people who say they want this pure sim experience would be willing to play full 12min quarters and dedicate 90min or so of their time to an online game. I think very few. Just as most people don't want to take the time to learn/call plays, don't want to have to make adjustments, don't want to have to manage substitutions, etc. Personally I hate when people go in and set all their defensive settings a certain way. But if I choose to play a random I understand that may be what I'm going to experience. It's not like it's unbeatable, it's just I prefer not to have to do what's necessary to beat it. But I'm not going to cry that they need to remove the ability to adjust online offensive/defensive settings.

Someone mentioned earlier that some of you act like you want the equivalent of a true flight simulator, where you find enjoyment needing to spend two hours prepping a plane just to take off. And even then, it's not real life. Most people would hate it if needing to call plays were forced on them, having to deal with random injuries, etc. Imo the vast majority of people that play NBA2K aren't at some arcade or pure-sim needy extreme - they're somewhere in the middle. Seeing as how they make up the vast majority that play the game I don't see why it's them that need to adjust to your sensibilities instead of vice versa.

[dat swag]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Maybe I'm naïve to what is/isn't doable online but so far I haven't heard of any issues like the euro-step glitch or people being able to dunk with impunity with certain players. I hate mentioning them because again - these were ONLINE issues that some ONLINE PLAYERS abused. Offline I never had a problem, and truth be told when I played online I only saw either of the issues every so often. Yet you had people come on the boards and complain incessantly, because they wanted to play any and all comers and felt cheated when they'd lose to someone using these tactics. 2K addresses these issues and others, and here are some of the online guys complaining about something else. And like every year previous condemning the game as a whole because of it. It's a never-ending cycle - you're playing an imperfect game you're trying to hold to a perfect (simulation) standard imo.

For all this talk about how games need to be a pure simulation online, I used to wonder how many of those people who say they want this pure sim experience would be willing to play full 12min quarters and dedicate 90min or so of their time to an online game. I think very few. Just as most people don't want to take the time to learn/call plays, don't want to have to make adjustments, don't want to have to manage substitutions, etc. Personally I hate when people go in and set all their defensive settings a certain way. But if I choose to play a random I understand that may be what I'm going to experience. It's not like it's unbeatable, it's just I prefer not to have to do what's necessary to beat it. But I'm not going to cry that they need to remove the ability to adjust online offensive/defensive settings.

Someone mentioned earlier that some of you act like you want the equivalent of a true flight simulator, where you find enjoyment needing to spend two hours prepping a plane just to take off. And even then, it's not real life. Most people would hate it if needing to call plays were forced on them, having to deal with random injuries, etc. Imo the vast majority of people that play NBA2K aren't at some arcade or pure-sim needy extreme - they're somewhere in the middle. Seeing as how they make up the vast majority that play the game I don't see why it's them that need to adjust to your sensibilities instead of vice versa.

I'm not even asking for Ultra-realism or a stringent approach to a simulation basketball game...I realize that asking for such would limit players and how they express themselves on the game...Heck...I'm even saying let the cheesers cheese while not claiming to be the guy who points the finger because I don't roll like that.

All I'm hoping for in Next Gen is that improved AI and Gameplay resolves some of the issues that takes the game in the right direction online. I don't think its a daunting task to make a game that pays more homage to play that is clooser to probable realistic outcomes as opposed to a game that virtually has disregard for the latter. Moreover, I don't want to have the player that is more committed to creating an unrealistic play environment be rewarded while at the same time dictating how I'll have to play to be competitive. personally I think that logic should be reversed. let a so-called cheeser keep cheesing while letting a so-called sim players adherence to realistic play shine.

Another example for ya...Remember when Madden would allow players to hike the ball then sprint straight backwards either left or right and complete passes all day? That Tactic became the norm and it made every game unrealistic and not a fun experience. Then EA fixed that about the game making it no longer an advantage because of less favorable outcomes when using that tactic...They didn't take it out of the game though...What then happened?...people stopped doing it to the point that you rarely see it. Its still in the game but because the GAME no longer rewards or caters to that tactic it policed itself...This is what I'd like to see in 2K...Don't eliminate the tactic of people jacking unrealistic 3's because that's not possible...I want to see and feel AI that has some regard for probabilities and outcomes based upon a users having some regard for probable simulation outcomes. Like the hot streak...That's a great feature but I shouldn't even be able to get hot unless I am taking and making good shots that have rhythm and flow applicable to my player. If a crazy contested 3 goes in from time to time...That's not a problem but when the game simply becomes a highlight reel of guys taking 48 3pt shots in one game and making 39% on the regular despite tight perimeter D...Houston...we have a problem.

BTW...a week or so ago I actually captured a pic on my phone and posted it here on the site in a thread showing the 48 3's...I've seen this quite a few times...I looked at NBA box scores one day and the range on taking 3's in a real NBA game is anywhere from a low of 11 to a high at 33. Keep in mind we have guys playing 6 minute qtrs with minimal clock stoppage jacking over 40 3's per game with the shot clock not under 15 seconds. Again...I don't care if people do that...I want the game to recognize what the probabilities are that make it unlikely that someone doing that game after game could be consistently successful.

[MilesTeg]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

This game is so absurd to me; I need to write it down to make sure I'm getting it right.

The way I see it, there are 2 different games in NBA 2K14:

1) The game that most people seem to play. This consists of selecting a player you like, moving forward, and randomly tilting the right stick until the ball goes in the basket or you get free throws.
This seems to be the reality of the game for a majority of players.

What I don't understand is... where is the fun in that? Who likes playing this way? I've never met someone who likes a game about moving a character forward and pressing a button.
But that's beside the point. Obviously it sells well every year, and professional reviewers are giving it a high score, so I am probably wrong not to like it.


2) The game that some people on this website seem to try to play. This game is about ball movement, defense, getting the best shot and denying your opponent a good shot.
And to those people I ask... where did you even get the idea that the game was supposed to be played this way?
Does the game even try to teach you those concepts? For instance did it teach you how to play defense? There's no information on that anywhere in the game. Are you're supposed to hold the left trigger, or the right one, or maybe both? Should you use the right stick? This is really confusing for new players. Of course they spam the steal button, this is the only type of defense that gives you an immediate, positive feedback.

No one tells you how to rebound either. Turns out holding the left trigger makes everyone in your team box out. Good thing we knew that already from a previous game, because it doesn't make any sense, and isn't taught anywhere.

Basically, this is my question: Is there anything in this game that even hints at the level of precision or depth we're asking for? If the answer is no... then why are we trying?
Why are we even here?
Why is there always a honeymoon period every time a game comes out, when we all have to pretend we like the new game?

This game just isn't for us. We're living in a fantasy world.

[dat swag]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

For the recprd: I never complained or had a problem with spin dunks and as an avid online guy I can't even remember it being a problem...If someone was doing it to me I probably didn't even notice or care. This is probably because in past iterations of the game you would get a reward for actually attempting to play sim.

Its possible to play this game and never run a play but still play simulation. Pick and roll and ball movement are often all you need to do coupled with appropriate isolation or an in/out game. I'm not even suggesting that people run plays. Heck..I'm asking for the bare minimums in simulation play...not the house and the farm...Just the basics.

[Melbournelad]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Dat swag, do you run any plays?

[dat swag]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

This game is so absurd to me; I need to write it down to make sure I'm getting it right.

The way I see it, there are 2 different games in NBA 2K14:

1) The game that most people seem to play. This consists of selecting a player you like, moving forward, and randomly tilting the right stick until the ball goes in the basket or you get free throws.
This seems to be the reality of the game for a majority of players.

What I don't understand is... where is the fun in that? Who likes playing this way? I've never met someone who likes a game about moving a character forward and pressing a button.
But that's beside the point. Obviously it sells well every year, and professional reviewers are giving it a high score, so I am probably wrong not to like it.


2) The game that some people on this website seem to try to play. This game is about ball movement, defense, getting the best shot and denying your opponent a good shot.
And to those people I ask... where did you even get the idea that the game was supposed to be played this way?
Does the game even try to teach you those concepts? For instance did it teach you how to play defense? There's no information on that anywhere in the game. Are you're supposed to hold the left trigger, or the right one, or maybe both? Should you use the right stick? This is really confusing for new players. Of course they spam the steal button, this is the only type of defense that gives you an immediate, positive feedback.

No one tells you how to rebound either. Turns out holding the left trigger makes everyone in your team box out. Good thing we knew that already from a previous game, because it doesn't make any sense, and isn't taught anywhere.

Basically, this is my question: Is there anything in this game that even hints at the level of precision or depth we're asking for? If the answer is no... then why are we trying?
Why are we even here?
Why is there always a honeymoon period every time a game comes out, when we all have to pretend we like the new game?

This game just isn't for us. We're living in a fantasy world.

I certainly understand someone coming to those conclusions...I just want to be more hopeful and optimistic...For me every game gets a honeymoon period. I still have hope they will tweak online play now but until they do it...I won't be playing the game anymore...I'll just wait for the next Gen game and hope they do a much better job with online play.

[dat swag]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Dat swag, do you run any plays?

Sure...not every time down the floor though...and sometimes they work quite well...But online its more difficult to run plays when your defender is constantly swiping and disrupting the flow of the play. First of all for some reason the PG runs away from the ball...No problem I just click on and bring him back...I then call a play before I even get to the other side of the court...But yes...I do run plays...I do attempt to play inside out and use pick and roll and move the ball around. Am I a perfect committed simulation guy...No...But let he who is without sin cast the 1st stone. I am far from perfect.

When I play buddies who keep it real..this game is absolutely almost perfect IMO...But I don't think I should only be relegated to playing people who play and think like me...I want to play the cheesers and anyone else who enjoys the game. I just want AI to be solid enough to respect simulation and represent simulation play. So I am disagreeing and rejecting the premise that you should only play people you know because it shouldn't matter who you play when a game is a sim...its a sim.

[Stargyallis]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Tbh, cheesers will be cheesers but the gameplay that makes them benefit from it is just stupid. The 1st week this game launched was perfect, the big man isnt stripped as soon as he touches the ball in the post, contested shots dont gonon 80% of the time, reach in fouls were actually called on chris paul......

What I see in Online quick match now- Offball defense, deny ball, double team as soon as you walk up the court, jimmuy butler shooting more than derrick rose,kevin durant is unguardable, joakim noah and boozer are the best big man pair in the game, kyrie irving is jesus, lebron has a 85 3pt shot, wade making more 3s than harden yes, dwayne wade. This may happen like every 1/5 games which I dont mind at all

What I see in myteam- All the same bull**** but happens 4/5 games and is amplified x10. People just play offball, double team the bigs or even triple, double team your guard as soon as they pass halfcourt so running plays is useless, It seems u can easily pass out of the double team but for some reasonpeople have the arms of mr fantastic and swat it there way for an auto basket. As far as i am concerned, this isnt sim.

If 2k went back to the first week of release where I seen little to nobodu complain, that would be great

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

This game is so absurd to me; I need to write it down to make sure I'm getting it right.

The way I see it, there are 2 different games in NBA 2K14:

1) The game that most people seem to play. This consists of selecting a player you like, moving forward, and randomly tilting the right stick until the ball goes in the basket or you get free throws.
This seems to be the reality of the game for a majority of players.

What I don't understand is... where is the fun in that? Who likes playing this way? I've never met someone who likes a game about moving a character forward and pressing a button.
But that's beside the point. Obviously it sells well every year, and professional reviewers are giving it a high score, so I am probably wrong not to like it.


2) The game that some people on this website seem to try to play. This game is about ball movement, defense, getting the best shot and denying your opponent a good shot.
And to those people I ask... where did you even get the idea that the game was supposed to be played this way?
Does the game even try to teach you those concepts? For instance did it teach you how to play defense? There's no information on that anywhere in the game. Are you're supposed to hold the left trigger, or the right one, or maybe both? Should you use the right stick? This is really confusing for new players. Of course they spam the steal button, this is the only type of defense that gives you an immediate, positive feedback.

No one tells you how to rebound either. Turns out holding the left trigger makes everyone in your team box out. Good thing we knew that already from a previous game, because it doesn't make any sense, and isn't taught anywhere.

Basically, this is my question: Is there anything in this game that even hints at the level of precision or depth we're asking for? If the answer is no... then why are we trying?
Why are we even here?
Why is there always a honeymoon period every time a game comes out, when we all have to pretend we like the new game?

This game just isn't for us. We're living in a fantasy world.

1) This post is a load of garbage. First, where do you get your numbers? "Most" people? Based on what data dude? You make everyone sound like mindless drones, but you are the expert. If they don't play the way you do, they are mindless simpletons. If so many people, as you claim, play and enjoy that style, who are YOU to dismiss it?

2) Where do we get that idea? Why not ask that question in your first bullet? If you say the game does a poor job of teaching, that we can agree on. But the style of play is left to the user. And there is nothing in the game that, by design, teaches anything outside of sim play. It IS a video game. Don't get it twisted. It IS controlled through a controller and needs to provide a simpler interface for people to replicated more complex and realistic functions. You can't get around that. But to imply the game purposely doesn't try to steer the user to a more sim experience is a load of crap. As for teaching you how to play, go to the tutorial mode. Shows you what you need to know, and none of it is gear toward any particular play style. The box out trigger does NOT control all of your teammates. Speaking of which, why would there be a box out mechanic at all if sim wasn't the goal. So, yes, there are a TON of things that strive for the sim experience. You're just choosing to dismiss them due to some perceived inadequacy. That's fair. But if you TRULY believe the game isn't for you, answer your own question; why ARE you here?

[spankdatazz22]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

Its possible to play this game and never run a play but still play simulation. Pick and roll and ball movement are often all you need to do coupled with appropriate isolation or an in/out game. I'm not even suggesting that people run plays. Heck..I'm asking for the bare minimums in simulation play...not the house and the farm...Just the basics.

But that's the thing - it still comes down to you wanting other people to play the game the way you think it should be played. I've seen these threads where online guys argue over whether playing offball is "sim" or not. Some people feel one way, others feel differently. What if you play a guy that has taken the time to learn all the playbooks, calls plays diligently, etc. - should he gain an advantage over the person that chooses not to call plays because he's "more sim"? Real pro coaches have found they can be successful using the Hack-a-Shaq strategy to put a team's worst free throw shooter on the line - what if people were allowed to do that consistently online, how much fun would that be?

There are a thousand scenarios that could exist like the ones I mentioned. And there's no way for 2K to somehow manage any possible scenario, because in the end people in the game and in real life are going to do whatever it takes to win. 2K has shown a willingness to try to fix egregious problems when they've come up. But someone shooting 39% from three and figuring he can be more successful if he jacks up 60+ shots - that's his prerogative. You sitting back and saying "I'm playing more within [what you think is the spirit of the game], I should get a bonus" doesn't make much sense because at some point it becomes arbitrary. If you're playing on a pro team and a guy is getting away with holding and you choose not to hold yourself, I'd think your coach would curse you out. At the end of the day, this is a videogame. That plays excellently offline. You're never going to be able to control people's behavior online unless you greatly restrict what can be done. It's hard to get a consensus on this board as to how the game should play online, so how can you expect that the masses should be forced to playing the way you think they should play?

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

BTW...a week or so ago I actually captured a pic on my phone and posted it here on the site in a thread showing the 48 3's...I've seen this quite a few times...I looked at NBA box scores one day and the range on taking 3's in a real NBA game is anywhere from a low of 11 to a high at 33. Keep in mind we have guys playing 6 minute qtrs with minimal clock stoppage jacking over 40 3's per game with the shot clock not under 15 seconds. Again...I don't care if people do that...I want the game to recognize what the probabilities are that make it unlikely that someone doing that game after game could be consistently successful.

I can't find that post. Tapatalk ftl...

[Optik]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

He's saying that everyone thinks they are playing "sim", when they are not. So, if the game doesn't reward them, it must not be sim. There's TOO much truth to that.

How would he know? Sorry, but I'm not one that believes that people have the ability to mind-read. Statements like that are completely meaningless.

[OneDrop]

Re: Most idiotic online game ever

To be honest, if playing sim isn't rewarding you it's because you're not doing it well. I haven't lost a game because I got rewarded for playing sim. Trust me, I've faced a guy who was 60 - 3 or something along those lines and he tried all the cheese in the book, but these guys have a pattern they keep following. Adjust your defensive settings and watch them throw up brick after brick and get more annoyed and then they start to make mistakes. Keep playing your game. I run a play about 9 outof 10 times and they really work well this year. 2K13 was a better game for cheesers in my honest opinion.