Individual team player/playing styles

[Tomba]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Ive seen if you mess with coaching profiles this yr it makes the game play irratic. Its best to keep EVERYTHING at default and play on Super Star

[donkey33]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

I really hope they can get something in this year and soon as I'd love to play this game more but team styles and player differentiation is huge for me.

[donkey33]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Ive seen if you mess with coaching profiles this yr it makes the game play irratic. Its best to keep EVERYTHING at default and play on Super Star

I wonder if the defensive options work.

There seem to be so many more defensive options compared to offensive. From what I've seen, coaching defensive options and then throughout the game, individual defensive options.

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Yeah I'm looking at the playbooks and coaches right now. All you can do is view plays in the playbook. That is the only option.

Under coach options you only have the following:

Offense:

Offensive rebound tactic
Tempo
Default formation - only 2 formations to choose from

Defense:

on ball pressure
off ball pressure
ball screens
force direction
off ball screens
In post
Double team perimeter
Double team post

very limited options....

was hoping they at least included 6-8 set plays you could assign for each team...

Live 07 I believe had a killer playbook and would have been awesome to have in Live 15.

have you seen anyone play some zone defense like Dallas?

If you get a chance bump up the difficulty to Super Star and see if the game plays better and the AI starts to play different.

[WTF]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

All I play is superstar. Game plays really well to me. Ball still stops somewhat though.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

I would say CPU teams with 2 games of Synergy play better then teams with no games or 1 game of synergy. I played against the Mavs a hell of a lot. Just now they played better then they did on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday early evening.

This the Mavs current synergy after 2 games.



Thank goodness I didn't see Tyson Chandler posting up at the low blocks. I saw Dirk down there though a few times. The top 3 highest percentages is what you saw the CPU controlled Mavs try to do the most. However if plays broke down instead of just running another play they just resorted back to ISO.

And like I said yesterday, the CPU is hell bent on getting people their stat averages. Some times they force it in an unrealistic way. Like they will call a foul on you, even though you made no contact with them or they will let the player bull doze over people in the lane without a charge just for he can score and meet his stat average.

Ball movement still isn't consistent though. About once every 3 plays the AI will just start off in an ISO and he will just stand there for a good 10 seconds dribbling almost like he is day dreaming. I would like to see EA tone down that down the middle of the lane lay up cheese. It just seems scripted because when the CPU needs to score, that is there go to move and they don't ever miss. 1/3 of the time they draw a foul on the play and get an AND 1.

Synergy is making the game get better, SLOWLY. But I find the game too play ground, free style heavy. Off ball movement needs to improve big time. Too much standing around goes on, even with automotion turned on and the motion is the same generic motion for every team, so it is very easy to tell when they are and aren't running plays.

So EA needs team specific motion, team specific plays, team specific formations. Maybe EA can patch that in.

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

good to hear Chandler wasn't posting up that game....

Here's the highlights from the Jazz game and this is how TC is used but it will be hard to replicate his game in Live if the PG's don't throw lob passes to him when he rolls to the basket.....same thing with B.Wright in terms of tendencies.

http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=400578311

They did run some ISO with Dirk tonight mid post and high post but even then you still see how the Mavs offense shows movement & space the floor with their sets.

If it gets better with more games under the teams belt then great....it's definetly something to monitor (synergy) this year.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

So far I don't think I seen the CPU throw a lob out of all the games I played in NBA Live 15. In NBA 2K15 however you see a lot of lobs being thrown by the CPU by players who are known to throw lobs. But then again that game has specific ratings and sliders for it.

Due to very few ratings and tendencies in this game you would assume court vision and pass rating would control it. But I would say I don't see CPU players rolling hard to the basket on pick n rolls, nor do I see them cutting hard on cuts to the basket.

Basically there is no urgency with the movement. I can tell you now, in Live 15 if a guard gets that deep down the lane like in that highlight clip, they aren't passing it off, they going for the lay up every time.

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Top 5 passers were listed here

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...5-passers.html

All these PG's are excellent lob passers and they all have 90+passing rating so I'm shocked their ability to execute a lob pass despite having elite rating for passing has been handicapped do to the game not have a passing tendency rating.

This means you could play a 82 game season and not see one CPU AI lob pass during your games.

I don't know if this can be patched or fixed but this is a huge omission from the game for the CPU AI players IMO.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Top 5 passers were listed here

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...5-passers.html

All these PG's are excellent lob passers and they all have 90+passing rating so I'm shocked their ability to execute a lob pass despite having elite rating for passing has been handicapped do to the game not have a passing tendency rating.

This means you could play a 82 game season and not see one CPU AI lob pass during your games.

I don't know if this can be patched or fixed but this is a huge omission from the game for the CPU AI players IMO.

I hope it is patched. I remember one of the Lives in the past where players refused to dunk, I forgot which Live that was.

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

I hope it is patched. I remember one of the Lives in the past where players refused to dunk, I forgot which Live that was.

That was a flaw in Live 07.....

But when you Edited the players (Dunk vs Layup Frequency) rating they would dunk more in the games.

In regards to Tendencies I went back and looked up the top 5 alley oop dunks (total) from last year and I'm shocked this isn't already part of their Synergy or Ratings coming into this years game:

Most Alley Oop dunks during 2013/14 season
DeAndre Jordan-133 (I haven't seen a single video posted of this dude (CPU) throwing down a Lob dunk)
Dwight Howard-92
Andre Drummond-86
Tyson Chandler-64
Brandan Wright-48

I'm still searching for the numbers on assisted alley oop dunks for individual players....

In this day and age with these Powerful Gamming systems there should be no excuse these two tendencies couldn't be included more often in NBA game.

You could go back and play College Hoops 2K8 and see more CPU AI alley oop action......

Probably not a big deal to others or just those who want to pick up and play the game but for crying out loud it's actually apart of the games we watch on TV so can't you can't proclaim realism or SIM in your game if you omit these two common Player Tendency Traits from the CPU AI.

[TarHeelPhenom]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

The difference between the two companies and how they approach their two basketball games are simple...

2k came to the OS and NLSC communities and hired guys from here and there to their team. They hired Czar, he's the mastermind behind the freelance offense. They hired one of the well respected roster makers to be in charge of roster updates. They hired a couple of guys whose specialty was modding and they put them on their team...in addition to Mike Wang. The result...an awesome basketball game.

EA could easily do the same thing...especially with their football games...hire guys like Skills, Playmakers...guys who spend countless hours digging into the core of the game and come from the gaming community and I guarantee you would see a huge difference in gameplay. But I honestly don't believe that EA would ever do that. To make matters worse , you take the ability to make the game better away by removing editing and sliders. SMH moment...

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Interesting post Tarheels

I didn't realize that Czar was hired by 2K....but then again I haven't even played a B-Ball game in like 2-3 years (NBA 2K11).

But Czar is one of the best in the business in breaking down these NBA games (wish EA would have signed this guy 1st) and I know some people on here may think I'm hard on EA but I just find it hard to believe getting teams and players just to mirror their real life tendencies and playing style can't be done better than the job being done right now at it's current state especially with all the DATA as you mentioned available to these companies.

I get the feeling that because Live 15 is new there are things that we should just look the other way and not gripe about....

But in reality these are things which has been hit or miss for several years now and just because EA decided to start over again on a 3 year plan shouldn't excuse them from getting basic things in a basketball game right from Day 1.

I have nothing against 2K B-Ball the animations I've seen over the years in that game are just jaw dropping....some of the player mannerism on the courts is incredible and for the most I was happy with the CPU AI because it at least tried to capture the tendencies of most players.

But I'm just more comfortable with the NBA Live series...

However having said that I've never felt that way about Live in terms of capturing team(s) style of play or player tendencies...

You'll get a few guys who will defend the game at all cost but IMO that doesn't help Live become the game we all want to see especially on the Next Gen consoles now....

We aren't asking for a perfect game but we should expect a game that captures most of the things we see in the NBA today.

To make hooks shots more frequent than alley oop dunks isn't apart of todays NBA game.

To make Chris Paul's passing skills irrelevant in the game just rubs me the wrong way....if you give the man a 90+ passer rating then why on earth doesn't he feel like a threat to kill you with that rating?

I've read several complaints of BIG's who have no business posting up yet that is the same GENERIC basic play calling that EA has used going all the way back to Live 07.

I've never seen Dallas post up B.Wright or T.Chandler with their back to the basket yet every video I've seen of Dallas has that logic coded into the game.

Does anyone with this years game fear the Spurs ball movement (and I mean actual ball movement in the Spurs manner)?

There are ratings like Off Ball Movement, Passing and Court Vision that could be utilized to make San Antonio a dangerous team and force you to scramble on defense and closeout on their shooters.

[WTF]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

Interesting post Tarheels

I didn't realize that Czar was hired by 2K....but then again I haven't even played a B-Ball game in like 2-3 years (NBA 2K11).

But Czar is one of the best in the business in breaking down these NBA games (wish EA would have signed this guy 1st) and I know some people on here may think I'm hard on EA but I just find it hard to believe getting teams and players just to mirror their real life tendencies and playing style can't be done better than the job being done right now at it's current state especially with all the DATA as you mentioned available to these companies.

I get the feeling that because Live 15 is new there are things that we should just look the other way and not gripe about....

But in reality these are things which has been hit or miss for several years now and just because EA decided to start over again on a 3 year plan shouldn't excuse them from getting basic things in a basketball game right from Day 1.

I have nothing against 2K B-Ball the animations I've seen over the years in that game are just jaw dropping....some of the player mannerism on the courts is incredible and for the most I was happy with the CPU AI because it at least tried to capture the tendencies of most players.

But I'm just more comfortable with the NBA Live series...

However having said that I've never felt that way about Live in terms of capturing team(s) style of play or player tendencies...

You'll get a few guys who will defend the game at all cost but IMO that doesn't help Live become the game we all want to see especially on the Next Gen consoles now....

We aren't asking for a perfect game but we should expect a game that captures most of the things we see in the NBA today.

To make hooks shots more frequent than alley oop dunks isn't apart of todays NBA game.

To make Chris Paul's passing skills irrelevant in the game just rubs me the wrong way....if you give the man a 90+ passer rating then why on earth doesn't he feel like a threat to kill you with that rating?

I've read several complaints of BIG's who have no business posting up yet that is the same GENERIC basic play calling that EA has used going all the way back to Live 07.

I've never seen Dallas post up B.Wright or T.Chandler with their back to the basket yet every video I've seen of Dallas has that logic coded into the game.

Does anyone with this years game fear the Spurs ball movement (and I mean actual ball movement in the Spurs manner)?

There are ratings like Off Ball Movement, Passing and Court Vision that could be utilized to make San Antonio a dangerous team and force you to scramble on defense and closeout on their shooters.

The last game I played against Dallas after a few updates, they weren't posting Tyson Chandler period. PERIOD.

And yes, if you've not played against the Spurs on Superstar, then you haven't played an opponent that will pick you apart with crazy ball movement. They sent me scrambling, and jumping at would have been perimeter jumpers, only to have them pump fake, drive making me rotate, only to find the offense one pass away for a wide open jumper. They beat me by 22 as the Cavs on Superstar.

Find a way to play the retail game with updates before you make your final judgement based on videos that you watch. If I watched some of the guys that I've watched, I wouldn't enjoy the game period. But when I get on the sticks, and start playing, I see things differently.

Even if you have to rent it, or do whatever. CP3 uses a lot of flashy passes, threading the needle, etc. I've just not seen oops yet. I know they're there, because they were overutilized earlier.

The Spurs are relentless, and the game and players are playing MUCH closer to their counterparts now. It's not an excuse to not use last years Synergy data out of the box, but overall, I'm seeing a lot more movement.

The one thing that I want, is for the CPU to initialize the offense quicker, so there's not just 13 seconds left on the clock. I'm passing along all information, so this stuff isn't falling on dead ears too.

The "push" hooks, I disagree completely with your assessment that they aren't being used in the real NBA. I've watched a ton of games thus far this year, and I see it a ton each game. Not a "sweeping" sky hook, but then again, I'm not seeing them happen in Live at an alarming rate. I do one every now and then with Lebron, but the CPU hardly ever breaks one out. The straight push jump hook though, isn't out of place to me.

[Playmakers]

Re: Individual team player/playing styles

WTF are you aware that the gameplay flaw where you could leave a man wide open and the CPU PG not recognize him being open is still in the game?

I've seen on a few occasions now through videos where guys have left their man wide open and the CPU PG not even get the ball to him...instead they proceeded to make the pass that the offense called upon them to make.

It seems like Court Vision rating isn't working properly from what I seen...

Basically you just leave a guy wide open on purpose and don't do anything defensively and watch the CPU PG ignore the open man more often than not.

This is the same gameplay flaw I've pointed out to EA for the past few versions of Live.....

I don't think anyone on the boards really do this kind of testing with the AI ratings but apparently it's still in the game even on Next Gen consoles.