The Allen Iverson Saga

[P2K]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Louis Williams > Andre Miller > Allen Iverson.

Youth and rebuilding > mediocre with an aging ballhog

[Cebby]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

allen iverson is too good to be coming off the bench... he is still an all-star... what nba all-star comes off the bench?

He's not an All Star based on anything he's doing on the court

[DakkoN]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

allen iverson is too good to be coming off the bench... he is still an all-star... what nba all-star comes off the bench?

Iverson is good at offense, he's a complete and utter liability on defense. Those types almost always come off the bench (JR Smith, Ben Gordon until this season, Leandro Barbosa, Jason Terry, Eddie House, Jason Kapono), there's no reason that he shouldn't either. All of those guys except Eddie House are good enough to be starters on their team and they come off the bench. Iverson refuses to be a PG and he's too small to be a SG just like Terry, House, and Barbosa. The difference is those players know their role and come off the bench.. Iverson is the the only player in the NBA that needs the team built around him.

[DC]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Iverson's 3 ball isn't comparable to any of those dudes that yu named though. But he can and SHOULD be able to pull off this role.

[o_capone]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

He's not an All Star based on anything he's doing on the court

so basically you are judging him based on what he was able to do in detroit? rewind one year and you will see someone putting up what 26 points and 7 assist.. in detroit everyone had bad years because they had an idiot coach... i swear people act like allen iverson has just been on a decline for years, dude had ONE bad year out of his whole career and all of a sudden he is garbage LOL, that's hilarious...

[o_capone]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Iverson is good at offense, he's a complete and utter liability on defense. Those types almost always come off the bench (JR Smith, Ben Gordon until this season, Leandro Barbosa, Jason Terry, Eddie House, Jason Kapono), there's no reason that he shouldn't either. All of those guys except Eddie House are good enough to be starters on their team and they come off the bench. Iverson refuses to be a PG and he's too small to be a SG just like Terry, House, and Barbosa. The difference is those players know their role and come off the bench.. Iverson is the the only player in the NBA that needs the team built around him.

not ONE of the players you just named are NBA superstars, not ONE of the players you just named have ever even made an all-star team... why would you compare them to Iverson?

[DC]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Because they ALL are undersized SGs. That is what they all have in common. Cept for Kapono

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

All I know is AI is pretty much in a win/win situation with Memphis and their low expectations.

If they have marginal success, AI wins and probably gets most of the credit for leading a young team to greener lands.

If they continue to look like the Memphis Grizzlies post Pau Gasol, then it's just another case of AI not having a "good situation" around him.

AI would have to dedicate 1000% to committing career suicide. He's in a great situation to line himself up for redemption and one more go round as being "relevant".

[JerzeyReign]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Youth and rebuilding > mediocre with an aging ballhog

The Sixers have been rebuilding since 1996!! That's how they got AI anyway!! Don't mention those lames, well Louis is decent but Miller? Last time I seen him some rookie from Chicago was putting him on his a**!!

I'm not really in this conversation in a neutral mindframe, All I wanted was for AI to retire a 6er, point blank period.

[o_capone]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Because they ALL are undersized SGs. That is what they all have in common. Cept for Kapono

and that's where the comparison ends... none of them belong in the same sentence as Allen Iverson... those guys don't have even 1 all-star season combined...

[Stumbleweed]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

And JR's not undersized at all (prototypical 6'6" SG with good strength and a 220 lb frame)... also, he'll be starting this year once his suspension is over unless something crazy happens.

[DakkoN]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

not ONE of the players you just named are NBA superstars, not ONE of the players you just named have ever even made an all-star team...

And Iverson has won NOT ONE championship. Eddie House has, and I didn't mention him in the list, but Manu was unarguably a huge piece in the Spurs championship teams, especially when they beat the Cavaliers, in which he came off the bench for 36 out of 75 games. I guess Manu's too good to come off the bench, since you know, he was on the '05 All-Star team.

why would you compare them to Iverson?

Because they are all 1 dimensional players that are mostly liabilities on the defensive end. There's no point of Iverson being in the starting lineup when he gets torched for 30 every night. Just thinking of Iverson guarding Kobe, Roy, Joe Johnson, or Wade right now is pure comedy.

You keep bringing up Iverson being an All-Star. For some strange reason, you're not considering the teammates he's had during those All-Star years. The best player he had on his team in Philly was Jerry Stackhouse.... That's like the equivalent of Kobe Bryant going and playing for the Kings...

Fact is, if Iverson would get over his ego, he'd be the best sixth man in the NBA by a mile... Instead, he insists on being a now mediocre starter. He can't put up 30 or even 25 points a game anymore without playing 45 minutes...

Just for fun.... 08-09 season...
Iverson: 17.5 PPG/36.7 MPG = 2.10 points per minute
Smith: 15.2 PPG/27.7 MPG = 1.77
Gordon: 20.7 PPG/36.6 MPG =
Ginobili: 15.5 PPG/26.8 MPG
Robinson: 17.2 PPG/29.9 MPG
Barbosa: 14.2 PPG/24.4 MPG
Terry: 19.6 PPG/33.7 MPG
House: 8.5 PPG/18.3 MPG
Kapono: 8.2 PPG/22.9 MPG
Murray: 12.2 PPG/24.7 MPG
Maggette: 18.6 PPG/31.1 MPG

All those guys considered 6th men except Ben Gordon. Ben Gordon even led the Bulls in points scored as a 6th man in 04-05, 05-06, and 06-07. 6th man is not the same role it was 10 years ago. You're telling me that Iverson wouldn't be more productive and helpful to the team by coming off the bench for 30 minutes a game and being matched up with bench players for 20 minutes a game, instead of being matched up with Kobe/Wade/Roy for 35 a game? It's not about how many all-stars you've won in your career, it's about what you can do to help the team in the game that revolves around player matchups. Iverson would be a perfect 6th man piece on a championship contending team, not trying to be the leader of a team that barely makes it to the playoffs.

[o_capone]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

there are plenty starters in the NBA who are not LOCKDOWN defenders... and yes I did say MANU is too good to come off the bench, but I also said that because that is a championship team it's worth the sacrifice... but MANU still is no Allen Iverson...

you mentioned Eddie House having a ring, so does Darko... does this mean that maybe Dwight Howard should accept the same role as Darko because Darko has a ring? Or maybe Lebron should accept the role of Manu because Manu has a ring?

You listed what Iverson did in that Detroit disaster, why don't you go back a year to when anything he did on the court actually mattered? Detroit was a disaster for everyone involved man... Not just Allen Iverson.

I can GUARANTEE you that if Detroit was not stupid enough to put Allen Iverson on the bench, none of the people on forums saying Allen Iverson needs to come off the bench would ever have that rediculous idea in their head.

Before Allen Iverson was traded to Detroit people would have slapped you if you said a man averaging 26 points and 7 assist should be coming off the bench...

I can't wait til this season starts so Iverson can prove to these people that he still got it, I don't know what makes anyone think he lost it...

[P2K]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

The Sixers have been rebuilding since 1996!! That's how they got AI anyway!! Don't mention those lames, well Louis is decent but Miller? Last time I seen him some rookie from Chicago was putting him on his a**!!

I'm not really in this conversation in a neutral mindframe, All I wanted was for AI to retire a 6er, point blank period.

And he will...when he signs that one day contract.

Until then, he's not needed or wanted.

[zfinley]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

And Iverson has won NOT ONE championship. Eddie House has, and I didn't mention him in the list, but Manu was unarguably a huge piece in the Spurs championship teams, especially when they beat the Cavaliers, in which he came off the bench for 36 out of 75 games. I guess Manu's too good to come off the bench, since you know, he was on the '05 All-Star team.




Because they are all 1 dimensional players that are mostly liabilities on the defensive end. There's no point of Iverson being in the starting lineup when he gets torched for 30 every night. Just thinking of Iverson guarding Kobe, Roy, Joe Johnson, or Wade right now is pure comedy.

You keep bringing up Iverson being an All-Star. For some strange reason, you're not considering the teammates he's had during those All-Star years. The best player he had on his team in Philly was Jerry Stackhouse.... That's like the equivalent of Kobe Bryant going and playing for the Kings...

Fact is, if Iverson would get over his ego, he'd be the best sixth man in the NBA by a mile... Instead, he insists on being a now mediocre starter. He can't put up 30 or even 25 points a game anymore without playing 45 minutes...

Just for fun.... 08-09 season...
Iverson: 17.5 PPG/36.7 MPG = 2.10 points per minute
Smith: 15.2 PPG/27.7 MPG = 1.77
Gordon: 20.7 PPG/36.6 MPG =
Ginobili: 15.5 PPG/26.8 MPG
Robinson: 17.2 PPG/29.9 MPG
Barbosa: 14.2 PPG/24.4 MPG
Terry: 19.6 PPG/33.7 MPG
House: 8.5 PPG/18.3 MPG
Kapono: 8.2 PPG/22.9 MPG
Murray: 12.2 PPG/24.7 MPG
Maggette: 18.6 PPG/31.1 MPG

All those guys considered 6th men except Ben Gordon. Ben Gordon even led the Bulls in points scored as a 6th man in 04-05, 05-06, and 06-07. 6th man is not the same role it was 10 years ago. You're telling me that Iverson wouldn't be more productive and helpful to the team by coming off the bench for 30 minutes a game and being matched up with bench players for 20 minutes a game, instead of being matched up with Kobe/Wade/Roy for 35 a game? It's not about how many all-stars you've won in your career, it's about what you can do to help the team in the game that revolves around player matchups. Iverson would be a perfect 6th man piece on a championship contending team, not trying to be the leader of a team that barely makes it to the playoffs.

Funny how all the players you listed here have been with their teams more than one year and also had training camp practice. Most of them also have decent coaches who know how to use their players curry was a rookie head coach It's been mentioned enough times to actually understand the guys was a true idiot I don't care If Iverson loses 20 steps you never sit a guy down with his ability for a nobody named stucky and will bynum that was just ridicules...

People forget Iverson went to detroit as humble as he could possible be thinking the pistons was looking to really compete a week later im watching a video and dumars is talking about how they wanted him for more cap space and how he they asked him to stop taking 20 shots a game and more like 12-14. I know Iverson doesn't have the highest fg% but just a year before last year him and kobe was shooting the same exact same FG%.
It's sad that people are dumb enough to not notice when a player is just in a bad system.

Source for fg% and proof that they shot the same mid range and also looks nearly the same on inside shots.

http://www.82games.com/0708/07DEN4A.HTM - Iverson - 19 attempts/ 26.4 PPG / 7 APG / FG%.458

http://www.82games.com/0708/07LAL7A.HTM - Kobe

- 20.6 attemps/ 5.4 APG/ FG%.459


That same year kobe got mvp while Iverson cleary had the better stats and was taking less attempts and getting more assists.