The LeBron James Thread

[Bumi]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Oh, so you must?

Damn, that's not many "alphas" then.

I guess that only leaves Wade, Kobe, Duncan, and KG in the last 5 years.

No LeBron, KD, Dirk, Dwight, CP3, Rose, etc.

I guess none of those guys can ever be an "alpha" on a championship team.

You're the one that claimed LeBron has proven he can be an alpha on a championship team, despite never having done so. And even if he wins a title this season, which I believe he will, he wouldn't have done so as the Alpha. He was the Heat's best player against Chicago, but he's certainly taken a backseat on the highest stage.

As for KD, Rose, CP3, and Dwight? They're actually the alphas on their respective teams. But they aren't champions yet. And if any of them pulled the disappearing act that LeBron has no done twice, I suspect they'd receive harsh criticisms as well.

[da ThRONe]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Just like I question the hating nonsense people were spewing about LeBron. I have to question anybody who try to pass this off as just a bad game or him thinking that being that passive with that match up was best for his team.

[mKoz26]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

James has been content to let Wade carry the load from the opening tip of the Finals. True alpha's never, ever believe that anyone is better suited to being "the man" than they are...that's what makes them alpha's.

Exactly what I was about to say.

Plus this isn't the first time Bron Bron has disappeared as the "alpha" and he's doing it again when everyone was proclaiming that the Heat was now "his" team. Maybe you were fooled by his scripted made for TV speeches but Wade is the leader and "alpha" of that team and he's showing it.

Okay then. Both of you agree that Kobe cannot be an alpha on a championship team. That's cool.

You're the one that claimed LeBron has proven he can be an alpha on a championship team, despite never having done so. And even if he wins a title this season, which I believe he will, he wouldn't have done so as the Alpha. He was the Heat's best player against Chicago, but he's certainly taken a backseat on the highest stage.

As for KD, Rose, CP3, and Dwight? They're actually the alphas on their respective teams. But they aren't champions yet. And if any of them pulled the disappearing act that LeBron has no done twice, I suspect they'd receive harsh criticisms as well.

I didn't say LeBron is the "alpha" on his team. I said he can be. LeBron has showed that he can be plenty of times, including his series against Chicago and Detroit in '07. He hasn't quite fulfilled that role yet, though. I agree with that.

I'm just saying, if the Heat return to the Finals next year or whenever, LeBron can certainly be the "alpha".

And yes, all of those other potential "alphas" would be criticized if they disappeared like LeBron, but I doubt many would be saying they could never be an alpha because they have a fundamental flaw in their basketball makeups. LOL that's ridiculous. I'm not really arguing with you, just with those who say he can never be an alpha because of two games.

MJ comparisons aside, the main point here is that James has once again shown to be completely apathetic. Out of all of the recent superstars past and present, I have seen it occur maybe once in the post season for a few of them.

I have now witnessed it twice from James, and obviously this time occurring in the finals. Truly bizarre.


I don't think "LeBron being an alpha" is a discussion even worth having. But Nobody is excusing Kobe and nobody should be excusing James for now pulling this diva stunt twice. Two years in a row none the less. Lol

I don't excuse him. I gave him his criticism last night after the game. I'm not a "LeBron apologist". But the guys saying he can never be an "alpha" are ridiculous. And you're right, it's really not even a discussion worth having.

[23]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Now people are mad because LeBron is not their alpha?

Wow man this is quite degrading to see logic spin like a broken pinwheel

[coogrfan]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Now people are mad because LeBron is not their alpha?

Wow man this is quite degrading to see logic spin like a broken pinwheel

People are "mad" because it appears James doesn't want to be the Heat's alpha when it matters most.

Biiiiiiiig difference.

[da ThRONe]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

This isn't about his ability this is about his maturity. IMO his immaturity spilled on to the court during the most trying time. Just like the decision didn't get him the attention he wanted this stunt what get him that attention either.

[1Rose]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Okay then. Both of you agree that Kobe cannot be an alpha on a championship team. That's cool.

You lost me with this one.

And yes, all of those other potential "alphas" would be criticized if they disappeared like LeBron, but I doubt many would be saying they could never be an alpha because they have a fundamental flaw in their basketball makeups. LOL that's ridiculous. I'm not really arguing with you, just with those who say he can never be an alpha because of two games.

It's been more than two games. And that fundamental flaw called immaturity and having no leadership is the reason he can never be an alpha.

[mKoz26]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

You lost me with this one.

Kobe did the same thing as LeBron in the second half against Phoenix. According to coogrfan, "True alpha's never, ever believe that anyone is better suited to being "the man" than they are...that's what makes them alpha's." Never, ever. Kobe did it. Therefore, he can't be a true alpha.

And you claimed what coogrfan said was "Exactly what I was about to say."

So yeah.


Also, he only "quit" in two games. Unless you'd like to give me some other examples.

[coogrfan]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Kobe did the same thing as LeBron in the second half against Phoenix. According to coogrfan, "True alpha's never, ever believe that anyone is better suited to being "the man" than they are...that's what makes them alpha's." Never, ever. Kobe did it. Therefore, he can't be a true alpha.

And you claimed what coogrfan said was "Exactly what I was about to say."

So yeah.

I'm not entirely convinced these situations are the same.

IIRC Kobe played hard for most of that series, but eventually gave up because he wasn't getting any help. You can't really say the same about James; he's been little more than a role player in games 1-4 of the Finals.

[mKoz26]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I'm not entirely convinced these situations are the same.

IIRC Kobe played hard for most of that series, but eventually gave up because he wasn't getting any help. You can't really say the same about James; he's been little more than a role player in games 1-4 of the Finals.

By your definition Kobe can never be an alpha. Kobe decided others could have the ball and only looked to pass in that 2nd half. So if you're going to use that definition to crucify LeBron, you best believe I'm going to apply that same definition to others and expect that you'd stand by what it entails. i.e. the notion that Kobe can never be an alpha

[GaryT531]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

... except that James has done this before.

"Once is an occurance, twice is a coincidence, three times is a pattern"

We shall see.

Agreed.
Once: 2009 vs Orlando
Twice: 2010 vs Boston
Three times: Game 4 2011 NBA Finals

[23]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I'm not entirely convinced these situations are the same.

IIRC Kobe played hard for most of that series, but eventually gave up because he wasn't getting any help. You can't really say the same about James; he's been little more than a role player in games 1-4 of the Finals.

You guys are making so many arguments im not even sure what this whole conversation is about

First it was the decision

Then it was he's not clutch

Then he's not MJ

Now its because he's not dominating for us


Its laughable man, because the main reason is, some people here just dont like him

Its not that you guys care about his maturity or his mental well being at all

[mKoz26]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Agreed.
Once: 2009 vs Orlando
Twice: 2010 vs Boston
Three times: Game 4 2011 NBA Finals

2009 vs Orlando?



...

Okay then, Dan Gilbert.

[coogrfan]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

By your definition Kobe can never be an alpha. Kobe decided others could have the ball and only looked to pass in that 2nd half. So if you're going to use that definition to crucify LeBron, you best believe I'm going to apply that same definition to others and expect that you'd stand by what it entails. i.e. the notion that Kobe can never be an alpha

I believe there is a critical difference in these situations: Kobe laid down because he decided his team's cause was hopeless, not because he believed letting someone else carry the load really gave the Lakers the best shot at winning. The first is a protest directed at your front office; the second is an admission of self-doubt.

[1Rose]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Kobe did the same thing as LeBron in the second half against Phoenix. According to coogrfan, "True alpha's never, ever believe that anyone is better suited to being "the man" than they are...that's what makes them alpha's." Never, ever. Kobe did it. Therefore, he can't be a true alpha.

And you claimed what coogrfan said was "Exactly what I was about to say."

So yeah.


Also, he only "quit" in two games. Unless you'd like to give me some other examples.

Kobe did? Apparently you didn't watch that series at all. Or didn't watch the first half of that game. Kobe didn't even play the last 5 mins of the fourth because they were getting blown out. At the beginning of the fourth he had two baskets negated on charges when he was trying to attack the basket. In the 3rd he was still being aggressive and getting to the hoop. A majority of the game he was being doubled before he could even get to the paint and routinely made great passes out of the doubles that no one on his team could cash in. Didn't see LeBron doing ANY of that last night whatsoever.

Oh yea, Kobe also has 2 finals MVP's where he WAS the alpha male. As much as I hate Kobe, I at least respect him.