Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

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  • BATMON
    Banned
    • Oct 2010
    • 1445

    #76
    Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

    Originally posted by Po Pimp
    LOL...I love how everyone has an opinion, but doesn't know what went on in that locker room.

    Illini bias aside, I find it hilarious how Deron Williams went from a "good smart kid who liked playing under Sloan and sought out tutelage from John Stockton to be a better PG" to "spoiled rich diva athlete" in a matter of a day.
    Big time point.

    The media has hypnotized the fans into ALWAYS siding w/ the Coach/Franchise.

    When interviewing Phil Jackson , the first thing he said was. "Coach Sloan is stubborn,......which you have to be as Coach..."

    As great as Sloan or any of the greats in the game, there is a BIG possibility that one's philosophy and/or methods can grow stale. That's not a negative its reality. Coaching shouldnt be judged any differently from playing. Your X and Os are just as important as your communication skills. One can deteriorate faster than the other (IQ vs skills).

    Look at Larry Brown. No can say he cant coach, but maybe that roster isnt the optimal situation for "teaching" coach.
    Don Nelson wore himself thin after being known as players coach.

    Monty Williams, Frank Vogel, Vinny Del Negro, and the rest of the Young Coach movement have along road ahead if them and hopefully they will have the same staying power for their generation as the coaches did before them.

    And calling Sloan quitter is just terrible.
    Terrible quick to judgement fandom. No respect at all.

    Comment

    • Dice
      Sitting by the door
      • Jul 2002
      • 6627

      #77
      Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

      Originally posted by BATMON
      And calling Sloan quitter is just terrible.
      Terrible quick to judgement fandom. No respect at all.
      You know, I talked to someone about this and asked him, "If this was Deron Williams quitting in the middle of the season, how much criticism would he got for it?"

      Sometimes we put a premium on the integrity of players BUT coaches in most cases really escape this expectation. I'm pretty sure if Williams was to do this, he'd be crucified for being a quitter. BUT yet, he'd still be one of the best PG's on the planet. That won't change.

      Sloan could be considered in the same sense. He quit BUT that doesn't change his status of being a very good coach. Why couldn't Sloan just coached out the rest of the season then stepped down? Was it too much for the 'hard nosed' tough coach? You have to look at both sides when your playing this.

      Public opinion blames a lot of what's wrong with the today's NBA game on the players. I can't argue with that. BUT coaches have there share on the faults of today's game as well.

      Now, I'm not going to be the first to call Sloan a quitter because he is a great coach and well respected...as most would say. BUT I'm not going to shoot down the argument neither because I think it's a valid point to look at.
      I have more respect for a man who let's me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil. - Malcolm X

      Comment

      • JBH3
        Marvel's Finest
        • Jan 2007
        • 13506

        #78
        Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

        Originally posted by BATMON
        Big time point.

        The media has hypnotized the fans into ALWAYS siding w/ the Coach/Franchise.

        When interviewing Phil Jackson , the first thing he said was. "Coach Sloan is stubborn,......which you have to be as Coach..."

        As great as Sloan or any of the greats in the game, there is a BIG possibility that one's philosophy and/or methods can grow stale. That's not a negative its reality. Coaching shouldnt be judged any differently from playing. Your X and Os are just as important as your communication skills. One can deteriorate faster than the other (IQ vs skills).

        Look at Larry Brown. No can say he cant coach, but maybe that roster isnt the optimal situation for "teaching" coach.
        Don Nelson wore himself thin after being known as players coach.

        Monty Williams, Frank Vogel, Vinny Del Negro, and the rest of the Young Coach movement have along road ahead if them and hopefully they will have the same staying power for their generation as the coaches did before them.

        And calling Sloan quitter is just terrible.
        Terrible quick to judgement fandom. No respect at all.
        Your Larry Brown/Charlotte Bobcats example is a perfect one for today's player. Like you said...may not be the optimal roster for "teaching", but certainly not a group of guys without room for growth. Therein lies the problem. Because Player "X" is classified as superstar, they tend to be disinterested in heeding to authority -or- believing there even is any.

        Originally posted by Dice
        You know, I talked to someone about this and asked him, "If this was Deron Williams quitting in the middle of the season, how much criticism would he got for it?"

        Sometimes we put a premium on the integrity of players BUT coaches in most cases really escape this expectation. I'm pretty sure if Williams was to do this, he'd be crucified for being a quitter. BUT yet, he'd still be one of the best PG's on the planet. That won't change.

        Sloan could be considered in the same sense. He quit BUT that doesn't change his status of being a very good coach. Why couldn't Sloan just coached out the rest of the season then stepped down? Was it too much for the 'hard nosed' tough coach? You have to look at both sides when your playing this.

        Public opinion blames a lot of what's wrong with the today's NBA game on the players. I can't argue with that. BUT coaches have there share on the faults of today's game as well.

        Now, I'm not going to be the first to call Sloan a quitter because he is a great coach and well respected...as most would say. BUT I'm not going to shoot down the argument neither because I think it's a valid point to look at.
        I don't think it's a valid point at all...that is unless you decide to only digest certain things that feed your point. When taken in context its very easy to see Sloan did not quit. He walked away. At 68 and having made a career in basketball for over 4 decades he's fullfilled.
        Originally posted by Edmund Burke
        All that is needed for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing.

        Comment

        • BATMON
          Banned
          • Oct 2010
          • 1445

          #79
          Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

          Originally posted by Dice
          You know, I talked to someone about this and asked him, "If this was Deron Williams quitting in the middle of the season, how much criticism would he got for it?"

          Sometimes we put a premium on the integrity of players BUT coaches in most cases really escape this expectation. I'm pretty sure if Williams was to do this, he'd be crucified for being a quitter. BUT yet, he'd still be one of the best PG's on the planet. That won't change.

          Sloan could be considered in the same sense. He quit BUT that doesn't change his status of being a very good coach. Why couldn't Sloan just coached out the rest of the season then stepped down? Was it too much for the 'hard nosed' tough coach? You have to look at both sides when your playing this.

          Public opinion blames a lot of what's wrong with the today's NBA game on the players. I can't argue with that. BUT coaches have there share on the faults of today's game as well.

          Now, I'm not going to be the first to call Sloan a quitter because he is a great coach and well respected...as most would say. BUT I'm not going to shoot down the argument neither because I think it's a valid point to look at.
          I think dudes are using the word too easily w/ a residual carry over from the LeBron situation.

          Being asked to step down is different from Giving Up.

          What sense of false purity does one have to want him to stay on a poisoned team until the season is over? That's idealistic IMO.
          Get out before the all star break, give the team time to do something before May.

          Comment

          • Kully
            MVP
            • Jul 2007
            • 3178

            #80
            Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

            He wasn't asked, they were trying to convince him to stay up until about 10 minutes before the news conference.

            Anyway, I use the word quit because to me "quit" and "resign" mean the same thing: to leave a job. No residual LBJ hate here, just a term some prefer to use sometimes, not in a disrespectful manner.

            Originally posted by JBH3
            Your Larry Brown/Charlotte Bobcats example is a perfect one for today's player. Like you said...may not be the optimal roster for "teaching", but certainly not a group of guys without room for growth. Therein lies the problem. Because Player "X" is classified as superstar, they tend to be disinterested in heeding to authority -or- believing there even is any.
            At some point player's growth does get stagnant. I would say that this current Utah team was stuck and probably needed a change. It's up to the coach to recognize that issue and try and correct it, however in all accounts so far Sloan wasn't the type of guy to change a system that has worked for him for years.

            It was probably building over the year with him until that Bulls game where something clicked, that made him think "this is it, I can't make this any better".

            Comment

            • Dice
              Sitting by the door
              • Jul 2002
              • 6627

              #81
              Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

              Originally posted by BATMON
              I think dudes are using the word too easily w/ a residual carry over from the LeBron situation.

              Being asked to step down is different from Giving Up.

              What sense of false purity does one have to want him to stay on a poisoned team until the season is over? That's idealistic IMO.
              Get out before the all star break, give the team time to do something before May.
              Did he step down or was he forced? According to the reports, it says that he stepped down.

              And as I asked before, would you have given Deron Williams the benefit of the doubt if he did this?
              I have more respect for a man who let's me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil. - Malcolm X

              Comment

              • BATMON
                Banned
                • Oct 2010
                • 1445

                #82
                Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                Originally posted by Dice
                Did he step down or was he forced? According to the reports, it says that he stepped down.

                And as I asked before, would you have given Deron Williams the benefit of the doubt if he did this?
                Yes.

                I'd like to wait at least a couple of days for the info to get sorted, before labeling a dude.

                I just dont think there is any way u can fault a dude like Sloan at 68.
                He gave up? Seriously? Its not like he has a chance to win it all anyways. So what's with "OMG he left the wrong way" nonsense".

                Its called Bowing Out Gracefully.....IMO.

                Comment

                • cooldude
                  Please don't go.
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 4091

                  #83
                  Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                  Originally posted by BATMON
                  Yes.

                  I'd like to wait at least a couple of days for the info to get sorted, before labeling a dude.

                  I just dont think there is any way u can fault a dude like Sloan at 68.
                  He gave up? Seriously? Its not like he has a chance to win it all anyways. So what's with "OMG he left the wrong way" nonsense".

                  Its called Bowing Out Gracefully.....IMO.
                  Seems a bit strange to do it mid-season though.

                  Comment

                  • BATMON
                    Banned
                    • Oct 2010
                    • 1445

                    #84
                    Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                    Originally posted by cooldude
                    Seems a bit strange to do it mid-season though.
                    Strange?

                    Like Larry Brown leaving or Riley taking over? Or Van Gundy Leaving?

                    If you've been watching the NBA, this isnt NEW or surprising.

                    Comment

                    • JBH3
                      Marvel's Finest
                      • Jan 2007
                      • 13506

                      #85
                      Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                      Originally posted by Kully
                      He wasn't asked, they were trying to convince him to stay up until about 10 minutes before the news conference.

                      Anyway, I use the word quit because to me "quit" and "resign" mean the same thing: to leave a job. No residual LBJ hate here, just a term some prefer to use sometimes, not in a disrespectful manner.
                      Quit to me inspires that you had no care, no emotion, no desire to proceed. That wasn't the case here given the reports stating that Sloan was visibly upset etc.

                      He saw the writing on the wall:

                      -Superstar/Coach relationship deteriorating.
                      -Players not playing up to their potential.
                      -68 yrs of age, having coached for 23 seasons.

                      Those 3 alone should be enough to seperate resigning from "quitting".

                      Originally posted by Kully
                      At some point player's growth does get stagnant. I would say that this current Utah team was stuck and probably needed a change. It's up to the coach to recognize that issue and try and correct it, however in all accounts so far Sloan wasn't the type of guy to change a system that has worked for him for years.

                      It was probably building over the year with him until that Bulls game where something clicked, that made him think "this is it, I can't make this any better".
                      What did Sloan say? He said we don't need to make a move. We need to get every ounce of talent out of our players night-in/night-out. I think w/ Al Jeff, AK-47, Deron, Bell, Miles, Price, Millsapp, and a healthy Okur they could play their way into more than just a 1st Rd exit. BUT they had to be dedicated, and play as a team and when your PG decides to start overriding the coach, and your hands are tied to bring in a Melo to compete w/ the Tradewinds that are blowing then you have no choice but to work with what you have. If what you have is unwilling to give it their all throughout the entire season then your fate is pretty much sealed.
                      Originally posted by Edmund Burke
                      All that is needed for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing.

                      Comment

                      • Dice
                        Sitting by the door
                        • Jul 2002
                        • 6627

                        #86
                        Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                        Originally posted by BATMON
                        Strange?

                        Like Larry Brown leaving or Riley taking over? Or Van Gundy Leaving?

                        If you've been watching the NBA, this isnt NEW or surprising.
                        BUT that's my whole point. We like to call Brown a 'Nomad' or these other coaches that leave mid-season. BUT as I stated before, if it was a player he'd be labeled a quitter?
                        I have more respect for a man who let's me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil. - Malcolm X

                        Comment

                        • 23
                          yellow
                          • Sep 2002
                          • 66469

                          #87
                          Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                          Sloan is the last of his kind besides Pop

                          Those kind of coaches are no longer acceptable to players because they dont want to accept responsibility.

                          The NBA has changed a great deal to this point and I can't say from what I see its always for the better.

                          The guy said he's never been selected to even coach an all star game before... thats just foul

                          Comment

                          • boomhauertjs
                            All Star
                            • Feb 2004
                            • 5373

                            #88
                            Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                            National Brats Association.

                            Comment

                            • sportyguyfl31
                              MVP
                              • Nov 2005
                              • 4745

                              #89
                              Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                              Originally posted by BlueNGold
                              Let's not act like this only happens in the NBA....

                              It doesnt, but in the NBA its much more visible.

                              An NFL team can banish a guy like T.O., Randy Moss, Vince Young, and never have to look at the guy again. You can then function with the rest of the 50-something guys on the roster.

                              You can find equal value in football, change the way you play and mask your weaknesses, easier then in any other sports

                              In the NBA you cant do that.

                              You only have 12 guys, and if your best player is disruptive, it sinks the entire ship, and you are pretty much stuck with him, because top players are damn near irreplaceable.

                              Comment

                              • HHHRVD55
                                Pro
                                • Jul 2004
                                • 522

                                #90
                                Re: Report: Jerry Sloan to resign

                                Originally posted by Kully
                                Facts are, the Jazz have lost a ton of decent/good players, they weren't contending and won't be for years. Sloan got tired and decided to quit. How much of it is because of Deron we won't know, but it's not all his fault.
                                Agree with this completely.

                                Originally posted by Dice
                                You know, I talked to someone about this and asked him, "If this was Deron Williams quitting in the middle of the season, how much criticism would he got for it?"

                                Sometimes we put a premium on the integrity of players BUT coaches in most cases really escape this expectation. I'm pretty sure if Williams was to do this, he'd be crucified for being a quitter. BUT yet, he'd still be one of the best PG's on the planet. That won't change.

                                Sloan could be considered in the same sense. He quit BUT that doesn't change his status of being a very good coach. Why couldn't Sloan just coached out the rest of the season then stepped down? Was it too much for the 'hard nosed' tough coach? You have to look at both sides when your playing this.

                                Public opinion blames a lot of what's wrong with the today's NBA game on the players. I can't argue with that. BUT coaches have there share on the faults of today's game as well.

                                Now, I'm not going to be the first to call Sloan a quitter because he is a great coach and well respected...as most would say. BUT I'm not going to shoot down the argument neither because I think it's a valid point to look at.
                                Sloan gets asked every year for probably the last 8 or so years how long he is going to coach for. And he has always said that he'll coach until it's no longer fun and he no longer has the energy for it. We always thought that he would retire at the end of a season but nobody ever thought he would step down in the middle of the season it. But, like Sloan said yesterday, what's the point of waiting until the end of the season if he has no energy for it?

                                Comment

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