Phil Jackson on Kobe

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  • iromerliciousi
    Rookie
    • Apr 2004
    • 444

    #16
    Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

    Phil Jackson was more of a Shaq guy which was why he kept bitchin to give the ball to Shaq. Phil basically lost his job because of Kobe. It all adds up.Not surprised here.*




    FIGHT ON!


    Comment

    • iromerliciousi
      Rookie
      • Apr 2004
      • 444

      #17
      Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

      Phil Jackson was more of a Shaq guy which was why he kept bitchin to give the ball to Shaq. Phil basically lost his job because of Kobe. It all adds up.Not surprised here.*




      FIGHT ON!


      Comment

      • ludacris06
        Banned
        • Sep 2003
        • 1527

        #18
        Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

        Wow, Kobe is really a bad person from what I have read and seen over the years. Hopefully that court case slowed him down a bit because he's living too fast.

        Comment

        • ludacris06
          Banned
          • Sep 2003
          • 1527

          #19
          Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

          Wow, Kobe is really a bad person from what I have read and seen over the years. Hopefully that court case slowed him down a bit because he's living too fast.

          Comment

          • fsquid
            Banned
            • Jul 2002
            • 17635

            #20
            Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

            Originally posted by iromerliciousi
            Phil Jackson was more of a Shaq guy which was why he kept bitchin to give the ball to Shaq. Phil basically lost his job because of Kobe. It all adds up.Not surprised here.*

            If some of this is untrue, wouldn't Mitch speak up about it since he's named more than once?

            Comment

            • fsquid
              Banned
              • Jul 2002
              • 17635

              #21
              Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

              Originally posted by iromerliciousi
              Phil Jackson was more of a Shaq guy which was why he kept bitchin to give the ball to Shaq. Phil basically lost his job because of Kobe. It all adds up.Not surprised here.*

              If some of this is untrue, wouldn't Mitch speak up about it since he's named more than once?

              Comment

              • 23
                yellow
                • Sep 2002
                • 66469

                #22
                Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                a bit more

                Link

                Comment

                • 23
                  yellow
                  • Sep 2002
                  • 66469

                  #23
                  Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                  a bit more

                  Link

                  Comment

                  • Dynasty4Kobe
                    MVP
                    • Apr 2003
                    • 2769

                    #24
                    Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                    *Peers inside thread* . . . is ok for me to come in here?

                    Anyway, here is my attempt of breaking down the whole thing from the start:

                    First lets start with the three personalities:
                    Shaq - he loves attention, that's who is. He wants all the attention, he loves to have be quoted in papers with his jokes and on t.v. doing his stunts.
                    Phil - great coach, but a very stubborn man, his defiancy of ditching the triangle at parts of this year is proof
                    Kobe - secluded person, not the most social person, and is not used to the joking manner and personality of Shaq

                    So in 1996, Shaq has left Orlando and is making his way towards LA. Shaq in Hollywood. That is big news right there and the media is going crazy, just the way Shaq likes it. Coincidently, the Lakers also pick up this high school prodigy by the name of Kobe Bryant, who of course is made out to be the next Jordan by the media. Right off the back, Shaq doesn't like it. Shaq, who is a proven player, has gotten to the Finals, and is already the best Center in the league has to share his spot light with with an unproven kid who is getting things hand feeden to him by the media. The sponsors the glory, Kobe's not the one that called up the media, the media calls him up because he is their next big story.

                    So, anways, it was already said by Tex Winter that Shaq never liked Kobe from the start. He had this grudge against him to the point where the other veterans on the team also built up this hate for the 18 year old *star*. Now Kobe is already a person who doesn't usually fit in well, but right away in his first season, the rest of the team, behind Shaq started to seclude him and distance themselves from him (all but D-Fish). So here we already have the outcast of our show: Kobe Bryant.

                    In comes Phil Jackson, greatest coach in the NBA, 6 rings, coached Scottie Pippen, Dennis Rodman, and the great Michael Jordan. Again, Tex Winter stated that Shaq is the guy that needs attention to stay happy (remember the whole 'I don't get ball, I don't play defense' thing). So Phil feels that for the better of the team, it would be wise to keep Shaq happy. Phil spent most of his time with Shaq, talked to Shaq, and actually *coached* him. He never made the same effort with Kobe. Kobe played for him, but that was about it. Phil even said that. They never built a strong relationship. Phil also said in the past, that (he thought) Kobe could take criticism, Shaq couldn't. You criticize Shaq, then he'll lash out through the media. Phil said that throughout the years, he constantly nailed Kobe with all sorts of criticism, like he did with Michael Jordan. He told Kobe to be playmaker, than scorer, than defender, then defer to Shaq, all of this stuff, thinking Kobe could handle it.

                    There was one problem with all of this, Kobe in his early 20s is not as mature as Jordan in his prime years. Kobe felt that Phil never tried to actually *coach* him like he did Shaq, but instead just told him to do all of this stuff. And again, Phil stated here that he always had this anger towards Kobe, this sort of grudge.

                    So finally it comes to this:

                    Kobe does not understand Shaq's laid back personality and how blows off offseason workout and practices.
                    Shaq does not like Kobe's seriousness and lack of personality,

                    Result: Kobe vs. Shaq

                    Phil prefers to take Shaq's side of things and leaves Kobe out of it.
                    Kobe never builds the trust for Phil, and gives up building that player-coach relationship.

                    Result: Phil vs. Kobe

                    The organization (including fans) sees Kobe as the future of the franchise and takes his side of things, which is opposed to Shaq's side.
                    Shaq is on bad terms with Buss and Kupchack/West

                    Result: Shaq vs. Lakers organization


                    I got alot of this from SportCentury: Kobe Bryant and these articles.

                    I've got the SportsCentury vid by the way, just don't know how to upload it.
                    Last edited by Dynasty4Kobe; 10-12-2004, 05:49 PM.

                    Comment

                    • Dynasty4Kobe
                      MVP
                      • Apr 2003
                      • 2769

                      #25
                      Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                      *Peers inside thread* . . . is ok for me to come in here?

                      Anyway, here is my attempt of breaking down the whole thing from the start:

                      First lets start with the three personalities:
                      Shaq - he loves attention, that's who is. He wants all the attention, he loves to have be quoted in papers with his jokes and on t.v. doing his stunts.
                      Phil - great coach, but a very stubborn man, his defiancy of ditching the triangle at parts of this year is proof
                      Kobe - secluded person, not the most social person, and is not used to the joking manner and personality of Shaq

                      So in 1996, Shaq has left Orlando and is making his way towards LA. Shaq in Hollywood. That is big news right there and the media is going crazy, just the way Shaq likes it. Coincidently, the Lakers also pick up this high school prodigy by the name of Kobe Bryant, who of course is made out to be the next Jordan by the media. Right off the back, Shaq doesn't like it. Shaq, who is a proven player, has gotten to the Finals, and is already the best Center in the league has to share his spot light with with an unproven kid who is getting things hand feeden to him by the media. The sponsors the glory, Kobe's not the one that called up the media, the media calls him up because he is their next big story.

                      So, anways, it was already said by Tex Winter that Shaq never liked Kobe from the start. He had this grudge against him to the point where the other veterans on the team also built up this hate for the 18 year old *star*. Now Kobe is already a person who doesn't usually fit in well, but right away in his first season, the rest of the team, behind Shaq started to seclude him and distance themselves from him (all but D-Fish). So here we already have the outcast of our show: Kobe Bryant.

                      In comes Phil Jackson, greatest coach in the NBA, 6 rings, coached Scottie Pippen, Dennis Rodman, and the great Michael Jordan. Again, Tex Winter stated that Shaq is the guy that needs attention to stay happy (remember the whole 'I don't get ball, I don't play defense' thing). So Phil feels that for the better of the team, it would be wise to keep Shaq happy. Phil spent most of his time with Shaq, talked to Shaq, and actually *coached* him. He never made the same effort with Kobe. Kobe played for him, but that was about it. Phil even said that. They never built a strong relationship. Phil also said in the past, that (he thought) Kobe could take criticism, Shaq couldn't. You criticize Shaq, then he'll lash out through the media. Phil said that throughout the years, he constantly nailed Kobe with all sorts of criticism, like he did with Michael Jordan. He told Kobe to be playmaker, than scorer, than defender, then defer to Shaq, all of this stuff, thinking Kobe could handle it.

                      There was one problem with all of this, Kobe in his early 20s is not as mature as Jordan in his prime years. Kobe felt that Phil never tried to actually *coach* him like he did Shaq, but instead just told him to do all of this stuff. And again, Phil stated here that he always had this anger towards Kobe, this sort of grudge.

                      So finally it comes to this:

                      Kobe does not understand Shaq's laid back personality and how blows off offseason workout and practices.
                      Shaq does not like Kobe's seriousness and lack of personality,

                      Result: Kobe vs. Shaq

                      Phil prefers to take Shaq's side of things and leaves Kobe out of it.
                      Kobe never builds the trust for Phil, and gives up building that player-coach relationship.

                      Result: Phil vs. Kobe

                      The organization (including fans) sees Kobe as the future of the franchise and takes his side of things, which is opposed to Shaq's side.
                      Shaq is on bad terms with Buss and Kupchack/West

                      Result: Shaq vs. Lakers organization


                      I got alot of this from SportCentury: Kobe Bryant and these articles.

                      I've got the SportsCentury vid by the way, just don't know how to upload it.

                      Comment

                      • iromerliciousi
                        Rookie
                        • Apr 2004
                        • 444

                        #26
                        Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                        In comes Phil Jackson, greatest coach in the NBA, 6 rings, coached Scottie Pippen, Dennis Rodman, and the great Michael Jordan. Again, Tex Winter stated that Shaq is the guy that needs attention to stay happy (remember the whole 'I don't get ball, I don't play defense' thing). So Phil feels that for the better of the team, it would be wise to keep Shaq happy. Phil spent most of his time with Shaq, talked to Shaq, and actually *coached* him. He never made the same effort with Kobe. Kobe played for him, but that was about it. Phil even said that. They never built a strong relationship. Phil also said in the past, that (he thought) Kobe could take criticism, Shaq couldn't. You criticize Shaq, then he'll lash out through the media. Phil said that throughout the years, he constantly nailed Kobe with all sorts of criticism, like he did with Michael Jordan. He told Kobe to be playmaker, than scorer, than defender, then defer to Shaq, all of this stuff, thinking Kobe could handle it.
                        My point exactly, Phil was always a Shaq-Guy, never a Kobe guy.*




                        FIGHT ON!


                        Comment

                        • iromerliciousi
                          Rookie
                          • Apr 2004
                          • 444

                          #27
                          Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                          In comes Phil Jackson, greatest coach in the NBA, 6 rings, coached Scottie Pippen, Dennis Rodman, and the great Michael Jordan. Again, Tex Winter stated that Shaq is the guy that needs attention to stay happy (remember the whole 'I don't get ball, I don't play defense' thing). So Phil feels that for the better of the team, it would be wise to keep Shaq happy. Phil spent most of his time with Shaq, talked to Shaq, and actually *coached* him. He never made the same effort with Kobe. Kobe played for him, but that was about it. Phil even said that. They never built a strong relationship. Phil also said in the past, that (he thought) Kobe could take criticism, Shaq couldn't. You criticize Shaq, then he'll lash out through the media. Phil said that throughout the years, he constantly nailed Kobe with all sorts of criticism, like he did with Michael Jordan. He told Kobe to be playmaker, than scorer, than defender, then defer to Shaq, all of this stuff, thinking Kobe could handle it.
                          My point exactly, Phil was always a Shaq-Guy, never a Kobe guy.*




                          FIGHT ON!


                          Comment

                          • SPTO
                            binging
                            • Feb 2003
                            • 68046

                            #28
                            Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                            Originally posted by TarHeelMan
                            I'm sure this will be construed as piling on by the Kobe apologists here, but there was an article on Kobe in ESPN Magazine, and it detailed some incidents where you really have to question this guy's character. It seems he was sent to China fully comped by adidas. He decides to bring along his personal barber, as part of his entourage. The barber's mother is allowed to come along as well. It seems Kobe decides he wants a haircut while the barber is out sightseeing with his mother. Since he's not there when Kobe wants, Kobe has his people pack up their stuff and put them on the next flight to the US. I read that, and I was disgusted. What an arrogant self centered prick. I like Chris Childs even more for tapping his jaw that one time.
                            WHAT THE? You'd think he'd go to a local barber or something. Man that's just cold. If I were the barber i'd punch Kobe for that. I don't think Kobe will slow down as one poster hopes he does. The reason being is that he probably now thinks he can get away with anything since he got off scott free with the rape case.
                            Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                            "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

                            Comment

                            • SPTO
                              binging
                              • Feb 2003
                              • 68046

                              #29
                              Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                              Originally posted by TarHeelMan
                              I'm sure this will be construed as piling on by the Kobe apologists here, but there was an article on Kobe in ESPN Magazine, and it detailed some incidents where you really have to question this guy's character. It seems he was sent to China fully comped by adidas. He decides to bring along his personal barber, as part of his entourage. The barber's mother is allowed to come along as well. It seems Kobe decides he wants a haircut while the barber is out sightseeing with his mother. Since he's not there when Kobe wants, Kobe has his people pack up their stuff and put them on the next flight to the US. I read that, and I was disgusted. What an arrogant self centered prick. I like Chris Childs even more for tapping his jaw that one time.
                              WHAT THE? You'd think he'd go to a local barber or something. Man that's just cold. If I were the barber i'd punch Kobe for that. I don't think Kobe will slow down as one poster hopes he does. The reason being is that he probably now thinks he can get away with anything since he got off scott free with the rape case.
                              Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                              "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

                              Comment

                              • 23
                                yellow
                                • Sep 2002
                                • 66469

                                #30
                                Re: Phil Jackson on Kobe

                                Kobe is respected as far as his skills, but his ego, personality, team attitude are horrible. Remember him telling Tex Winters "you coach stupidly"? Things like such. The man is not beyond teaching and he wouldnt be the player he is without Phil and Shaq.

                                Kobe plain and simple only cares about winning if it's him that is doing it. Why complain about playing next to Shaq if you are winning rings?

                                Sadly once Kobe decided to take it upon himself to be the main option instead of deferring to Shaq they lost.

                                One thing you forget to add D4K is that Phil and Shaq are gone and Kobe not wanting to be there or liking them has much to do with it.

                                Comment

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