Boxing Off-Topic

[allBthere]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Is it possible AJ's power is overrated? There are plenty of guys built like Greek gods who lack power. Tim Bradley is the first who comes to mind.

AJ knocked down Klitschko -- big whoop. So did a bunch of guys before Manny Steward taught Wlad to fight safety-first. Klitschko has a weak chin, just like Joshua. And I'm not convinced Joshua has great power for a man his size.

Everyone compliments Ruiz's fast hands and feet, and rightfully so. But why is no one complimenting his power? He put the giant Joshua on the canvas four times in one fight. Weak chin or not, power plays some part in that.

I think it's possible that Ruiz and Fury are the two most complete active heavies. Both know how to box and have good footwork, something Wilder and Joshua lack because of their thin amateur records.

Wilder-Joshua might be the most attractive matchup on paper, but I think that will be a terrible fight in the ring. Joshua will do everything possible to avoid Wilder's right hand and fight in a total safety-first fashion. Wilder will do his usual pawing jab followed by a bunch of wild attempts to land his atomic right, with zero head movement or footwork. The guy has no clue how to box.

It will be a sh*t fight between a lousy, overaggressive boxer and a lousy, safety-first boxer. Not to mention that it will be overmarinated by approximately two years. Plan on a Mayweather-Pacquiao type of disappointment, fight fans.

I would FAR rather see Ruiz-Wilder. I think Ruiz could give Wilder fits with his fast hands and boxing skill, much like Fury did. But Ruiz's hands are even faster. He could expose Wilder's utter lack of boxing skill even more than Fury, who was robbed by receiving a draw in his fight with Wilder.

I wouldn't say Joshua's power is 'over-rated' - 21 of his 22 wins are by ko/tko. And those include some decent names and overall opposition records. I think Ruiz actually has an incredible chin. I'm also not saying AJ has Tyson (Iron Mike) power either though, but he can hit, let's be real here.

I still think Wilder is 'wildly' over-rated overall (not by you) ... like you mentioend, he's not a good boxer, doesn't move well, and something about his neck/head is off, like his neck is too long and his head is small - I think he could be ko'd pretty badly because of that, but who know's.

To me Fury/Joshua is interesting because everyone talks about what a great boxer he is, but to me, he has ZERO power. They're physics line up well and that fight might be exciting like the Ruiz/Wilder matchup could be. Who do you think wins that one?

I still want all of them to fight, and AJ still has the best resume to me imo

I'd also like to see Fury lose-out because he's an extremely boring heavyweight w/ no power and is awkward. One fight with Wilder doesn't make up for a lousy career in terms of entertainment value - I mean he's had some awful snoozers and you don't even get the excitment coming from a typical heavy where 'things can change with one punch'..because they can't.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

The heavyweight division could give us some tantalizing style matchups -- if not for promotional and political conflicts -- because each of the four main players are different.

Fury -- No power, excellent boxer, awkward technique, good chin, big size.
Joshua -- Solid power, lousy boxer, average technique, bad chin, big size.
Wilder -- Atomic power, terrible boxer, terrible technique, average chin, very light despite height.
Ruiz -- Average power, very good boxer with fast hands, excellent technique, excellent chin, short and fat.

Ruiz-Wilder is a fascinating matchup. Ruiz is such a better boxer, and we how a good boxer in Fury completely flummoxed Wilder except for one huge right hand. Ruiz is an even better boxer with faster hands.

But Wilder has all-time power in his right hand -- we're talking Tyson, young Foreman, Liston and Marciano TNT. So if Wilder caught Ruiz, I think the lights would be out. But can such a crude boxer catch Ruiz?

Ruiz-Wilder is a 50-50 fight. Both are promoted by PBC. Should be a no-brainer once Ruiz finishes his rematch with Joshua. Even if Ruiz lost closely to Joshua in the rematch, I still would rather see him fight Wilder next instead of Joshua.

I'm convinced Joshua-Wilder will be the biggest letdown in boxing since Mayweather-Pacquiao. Just a lousy style matchup, especially since Joshua will fight safety-first for the rest of his career, much like Wlad Klitschko did after Sanders and Brewster knocked him out.

[allBthere]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

The heavyweight division could give us some tantalizing style matchups -- if not for promotional and political conflicts -- because each of the four main players are different.

Fury -- No power, excellent boxer, awkward technique, good chin, big size.
Joshua -- Solid power, lousy boxer, average technique, bad chin, big size.
Wilder -- Atomic power, terrible boxer, terrible technique, average chin, very light despite height.
Ruiz -- Average power, very good boxer with fast hands, excellent technique, excellent chin, short and fat.

Ruiz-Wilder is a fascinating matchup. Ruiz is such a better boxer, and we how a good boxer in Fury completely flummoxed Wilder except for one huge right hand. Ruiz is an even better boxer with faster hands.

But Wilder has all-time power in his right hand -- we're talking Tyson, young Foreman, Liston and Marciano TNT. So if Wilder caught Ruiz, I think the lights would be out. But can such a crude boxer catch Ruiz?

Ruiz-Wilder is a 50-50 fight. Both are promoted by PBC. Should be a no-brainer once Ruiz finishes his rematch with Joshua. Even if Ruiz lost closely to Joshua in the rematch, I still would rather see him fight Wilder next instead of Joshua.

I'm convinced Joshua-Wilder will be the biggest letdown in boxing since Mayweather-Pacquiao. Just a lousy style matchup, especially since Joshua will fight safety-first for the rest of his career, much like Wlad Klitschko did after Sanders and Brewster knocked him out.

what about Fury/Joshua - who would you pick?

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Ruiz-Wilder is a 50-50 fight.

I don't think it's 50-50 yet but it's a tantalizing matchup. Of course, Ruiz-Joshua 2 will set or upset the table for a lot of things.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Fury was entertaining considering he fought a glorified club fighter. I hope Schwarz got a good payday because he is now irrelevant.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

what about Fury/Joshua - who would you pick?

Fury. A far better boxer, and I don't think AJ has the kind of atomic power as Wilder, which causes foes to change their strategies in fear of getting nailed.

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

I don't think it's 50-50 yet but it's a tantalizing matchup. Of course, Ruiz-Joshua 2 will set or upset the table for a lot of things.

Why? Only because of Wilder's right hand? Understandable, but he is such a PATHETIC boxer. I think Ruiz could tie Wilder into knots with his boxing skill, just like Fury did.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Why? Only because of Wilder's right hand? Understandable, but he is such a PATHETIC boxer. I think Ruiz could tie Wilder into knots with his boxing skill, just like Fury did.

Among other things a 50-50 fight implies the betting public views it as such and that wouldn't be the case at hypothetical fight time-without benefit of Ruiz-Joshua II results Wilder would still be in the 4-1 favorite range (educated guess and I might be going too conservative).



The other thing I consider is Joshua's mental state pre-fight and what if it was a Wilder right hand instead of a Joshua hook that landed on Ruiz?



I want to see it though.



Nothing on the rematch?

[edaddy]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

I don't think it's 50-50 yet but it's a tantalizing matchup. Of course, Ruiz-Joshua 2 will set or upset the table for a lot of things.

I agree my man while I give Ruiz much respect for his win he fought against a mentally frail fighter with defensive flaws and a suspect chin..While Wilder is a flawed boxer his power and physical intangibles make him.a different fighter than Joshua and the fact that he is bombs away will put Ruiz on the defensive and make him way more cautious than he was in the Joshua fight..Wilder is way too long for Ruiz and has decent hand speed with a warrior mentality..I think Ruiz is now being overhyped at this point..if Joshua gets his mind right he can win the rematch I just think Joshua doesnt have the fire in him.****iz needs to stay away from Fury and Wilder at all costs..both are a different animal than Joshua..

[pk500]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

I agree my man while I give Ruiz much respect for his win he fought against a mentally frail fighter with defensive flaws and a suspect chin..While Wilder is a flawed boxer his power and physical intangibles make him.a different fighter than Joshua and the fact that he is bombs away will put Ruiz on the defensive and make him way more cautious than he was in the Joshua fight..

That also will make Wilder far more susceptible to being hit by Ruiz's quick counters.

Wilder is way too long for Ruiz and has decent hand speed with a warrior mentality.

Wilder doesn't use his length at all because he doesn't know how to use the jab. Plus his hands are not as fast as Ruiz's.

If we're talking overhyped, let's talk Wilder. Other than the win over an older-than-we-think and non-roided Luis Ortiz and a draw against Tyson Fury, what big scalps has he taken during his illustrious career? Bermane Stiverne twice? Cris Arreola? Artur Szpilka? Gerald Washington? Malik Scott?

People act like Wilder has fought Murderers' Row when, in reality, he was the most overprotected heavyweight in boxing until 2018. His gaudy record is supported by balsa wood.

[edaddy]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

That also will make Wilder far more susceptible to being hit by Ruiz's quick counters.



Wilder doesn't use his length at all because he doesn't know how to use the jab. Plus his hands are not as fast as Ruiz's.

If we're talking overhyped, let's talk Wilder. Other than the win over an older-than-we-think and non-roided Luis Ortiz and a draw against Tyson Fury, what big scalps has he taken during his illustrious career? Bermane Stiverne twice? Cris Arreola? Artur Szpilka? Gerald Washington? Malik Scott?

People act like Wilder has fought Murderers' Row when, in reality, he was the most overprotected heavyweight in boxing until 2018. His gaudy record is supported by balsa wood.

Lol trust me Ruiz will be more worried about not getting hit than landing quick counters and Ruiz does get hit..Wilder uses his jab when needed but that quick right hand is all the speed he needs..You just named two of the top 4 heavyweights he fought including knocking out one of them roided or not..Personally I think Fury is the best heavyweight but he knows he can be touched and knocked out by Wilder..Not saying he has a great history of great opponents but he did step up and fight 2 legit heavyweights and showed tremendous guts and proved that his power will overide alot of his technical definciences..what else can he do?.****iz did a great job but he had the perfect storm against a opponent who had been kod in sparring and truly was overhyped with a fragile mindset....But it is what it is..

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

Wilder doesn't use his length at all because he doesn't know how to use the jab. Plus his hands are not as fast as Ruiz's.

He's always too anxious to throw the right or a wild combo but those height and reach advantages are still there if not maximized.

Deontay is going after Ortiz again-he must figure he's got his number because that seems to be a dangerous bout. You really have the Big Five right now if you throw King Kong in there.

[sheredia]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

He's always too anxious to throw the right or a wild combo but those height and reach advantages are still there if not maximized.

Deontay is going after Ortiz again-he must figure he's got his number because that seems to be a dangerous bout. You really have the Big Five right now if you throw King Kong in there.

ruiz has sneaky speed and power......joshua underestimated him and mentally wasn't there in that fight. now joshua has to agree to ruiz demands for a rematch (possibly mexico?) when he seems invincible fighting on his home turf in england. not only that, ruiz took joshua's punches pretty well. right now, i'm looking forward to fury-wilder II and ruiz-joshua II with the winners facing off against each other. this basically sells itself for ppv, sorts out the heavyweight division AND could set up the biggest heavyweight ppv bout since tyson-lewis. the heavyweight division is alive and well, my friends.

[JayBee74]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

now joshua has to agree to ruiz demands for a rematch (possibly mexico?) when he seems invincible fighting on his home turf in england.

I'm not sure Ruiz has enough leverage to set the fight in Mexico, particularly since Joshua is leaning toward MSG rather then home cooking in England.


Hearn recently reported that the date of the fight will fall between November 16 and December 14.

[edaddy]

Re: Boxing Off-Topic

[QUOTE=JayBee74;2049817352]I'm not sure Ruiz has enough leverage to set the fight in Mexico, particularly since Joshua is leaning toward MSG rather then home cooking in England.

Absolutely right my man..Not only does he not have enough leverage but I am pretty sure rhat Hearn and Joshua control every aspect of the rematch due to the rematch clause and its stipulations..Joshua needs to fight him again at MSG to minimize the stigma of him losing and to nulify alot of innuendo that he lost due to more stringent drug testing and Theraputic Exemption rules in
the US ...