You're gonna patch the playerbase away

[Counter Punch]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

We can agree to disagree then. I stand by my opinion because I know people personally who are either going through it now or have gone through that same line of thinking. I've even played against spammers online and asked them why they play that way, a handful said basically what I said. Someone did it to them enough that they just got sick of it and started doing it to others.

Also none of those games you just mentioned are as complicated as EA UFC 3. Not even close. Yes there are intricate mechanics you can use to pull of more complex things in all of those games, but for the most part if you know how to move, pass, shoot, etc. you can play fairly well. The route to victory isn't blocked off by all these deeper systems and mechanics like it is in EA UFC 3. The submission game, the ground grappling, the clinch, the head movement, lunges, blocking, combos, stationary strikes, stamina... There are so many things to manage to even be moderately good at this game, much less expert level. I have friends who are proficient gamers across the board who can't make it out of the WFA in career because of how many different things you have to manage at once in this game. And it's only gotten deeper with every iteration, meaning that if you've never played ANY of them, not a fight night, not a combat sports game period, it would take an astronomic amount of time to be competitive.

I've never picked up an MLB, NFL, or NBA game with zero idea of what to do with the controls, but I've watched full grown adults have that struggle with EA UFC. Football, Basketball, and Baseball have a much clearer path to victory. There are a certain number of points regularly scored for this specific thing. It's not that way in MMA AT ALL. The same person can land the same kind of strike and it be scored differently based on so many other factors. Rounds won with no takedowns, rounds lost with three takedowns. It's just so much more to manage, and adding a simple control scheme OFFLINE does very little to remedy that problem once you end up online and the scheme switches.

Definitely agree to disagree. However, the idea that Madden isn’t about 100x more complex than UFC 3 is ridiculous.

Edit:

Be honest, you have no more than a surface level understanding of any of these sports gsmes youre talking about do you?

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

But bro if you are online the changes to the patch and tutorial videos are right there ...right there in UI .

Man I don't know about you but the easy to learn other sporting games really depends on the person . Sometimes you learn from the actual sport itself ...sometimes more from the game . I've learnt more about MMA from UFC 2 than I have from watching actual MMA ...why because I have access to ea UFC games than actual live UFC footage . These yeah I watch a lot more on YouTube or wherever .

But for me in my country soccer is the everyday thing so FIFA is easy for me to understand but not any easier to master .

I pick up an NBA game and I have no idea of what I'm doing . But because I'm into MMA and I was willing to put the time in I learnt it.

We are Basically a very small community ...here with respect to how many people play the game compared to any other sport .

MMA itself is complicated ...grappling alone has so many levels to it . How that translates to an easy control scheme is beyond me .





Sent from my Infinix Zero 4 using Operation Sports mobile app

[Counter Punch]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

But bro if you are online the changes to the patch and tutorial videos are right there ...right there in UI .

Man I don't know about you but the easy to learn other sporting games really depends on the person . Sometimes you learn from the actual sport itself ...sometimes more from the game . I've learnt more about MMA from UFC 2 than I have from watching actual MMA ...why because I have access to ea UFC games than actual live UFC footage . These yeah I watch a lot more on YouTube or wherever .

But for me in my country soccer is the everyday thing so FIFA is easy for me to understand but not any easier to master .

I pick up an NBA game and I have no idea of what I'm doing . But because I'm into MMA and I was willing to put the time in I learnt it.

We are Basically a very small community ...here with respect to how many people play the game compared to any other sport .

MMA itself is complicated ...grappling alone has so many levels to it . How that translates to an easy control scheme is beyond me .





Sent from my Infinix Zero 4 using Operation Sports mobile app

They already translated grappling to an easy control scheme its called EA Sports UFC 3. And most people on here seem dissatisfied with ground game.

OP is advocating we do the same thing with the stand up.

I just hate it when people suggest dumbing the game down.

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

Do I want more of friends to pick up UFC 3 yes . Hell yeah .

But I don't walk into their houses and expect to learn mortal Kombat easily ...as I have no interest in it . Even though I bought the game myself when it came out.

As a matter of fact the appeal of UFC games is actually the easy learning curve ...tho the current scheme is harder to pull off than ufc 2

Sent from my Infinix Zero 4 using Operation Sports mobile app

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

They already translated grappling to an easy control scheme its called EA Sports UFC 3. And most people on here seem dissatisfied with ground game.

OP is advocating we do the same thing with the stand up.

I just hate it when people suggest dumbing the game down.

Yeah it seems uniform and safe the grappling ...but in a couple of months and more updates we should see some definitive changes .



Sent from my Infinix Zero 4 using Operation Sports mobile app

[YourFatZebra]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

They already translated grappling to an easy control scheme its called EA Sports UFC 3. And most people on here seem dissatisfied with ground game.

OP is advocating we do the same thing with the stand up.

I just hate it when people suggest dumbing the game down.

No no no man, I am not saying that at all.

I'm making a much more nuanced point about the reality of this game. I'm not saying anyone needs to do anything, I explicitly started this post by saying that. I said upfront I am not complaining about the patch, or anything like that at all.

I know people personally who are afraid to try this game because of it's complexity. People that understand MMA, still don't think they could handle the game. Whereas I've never watched a game of Football, yet I have routinely beat diehard Madden fans without owning one of the games myself. Familiarity is important, as dude stated above, I can't deny that. But considering I'm American, I can only speak from my own perspective and where I live, all the sports you named are far more mainstream and better understood than MMA. Not to mention that Madden, NBA 2k, and FIFA are staples in gaming by now. We're three entries into the EA UFC series and the first one was so awful that a good portion of us have only played two.

Even in a real life sense, MMA is vastly more complicated than these other sports. Like I said, a predictable amount of points is scored every single time a certain action is completed, it is not that way in MMA at all. So the mechanics of the game and the route to victory is much easier to explain in Football or Basketball. Also with the games being team sports, the AI teammates provide extra assistance that isn't there in UFC, not saying it should be. You don't have to run the bases, make the outfielders catch the ball, call picks and whatnot. You CAN, but you don't HAVE to, it can be automated and that isn't an option in UFC.

I think you've just confused my point, brotha. I'm not saying the game needs to be made easier or they need to rollback anything they've done. I'm just saying we need to be very careful WHAT we change, WHY, and HOW we let people know about it. The in game tutorials do not do an adequate job of explaining this, if they did I wouldn't have so many people message me on FB asking how to do various things in the game. I bought NBA 2K last year with not much modern basketball knowledge and having not owned a basketball game in years, had no issues understanding the controls. Everything was very intuitive and simple, because the sport itself is simple. Is there depth to the game? Of course. Are there advanced movements you can learn? Of course. But the key difference between UFC and NBA 2K is that EA UFC 3 is unplayable without detailed explanation. Beyond moving your character and possibly throwing the basic 4 strikes (jab, straight, leg kicks) none of the games features are easy to understand when you compare them to something like NBA 2K. There are like, four or five things you have to do in TOTAL on NBA on either side of the ball. Shoot, pass, block/steal, run. Those are one button press. You're seriously trying to say that's comparable to the multitude of complex mechanics that you have to learn to even win one fight in UFC 3? I never had to learn any of the advanced movements in NBA and I did just fine offline and online. Try fighting a high level player in UFC 3 with just the 4 basic strikes I laid out. You won't have relative success to what I had in NBA doing the equivalent, and I'm not Lebron.

So I'm not saying that they need to "dumb the game down". Please do not misrepresent my argument, that is not what I'm saying at all. I am saying, however, that if we continue to make the game more complicated there will be several unintended consequences for that. I already laid all those out multiple times, I would rather not restate them. Me pointing all these things out isn't me attempting to have them changed, I'm simply pointing them out because I haven't seen anyone posit these same ideas here. I don't see how me lining those consequences out, in what I felt was a pretty objective manner, is such an awful thing to do. You literally went from praising me for posting it to saying you hate when people like me say this kind of thing.

Do I want more of friends to pick up UFC 3 yes . Hell yeah .

But I don't walk into their houses and expect to learn mortal Kombat easily ...as I have no interest in it . Even though I bought the game myself when it came out.

As a matter of fact the appeal of UFC games is actually the easy learning curve ...tho the current scheme is harder to pull off than ufc 2

Sent from my Infinix Zero 4 using Operation Sports mobile app

Mortal Kombat is ludicrously simple in comparison to UFC, I don't know why you guys think otherwise. They fit that entire games controls on an arcade machine. Can you even imagine what the **** a UFC arcade machine would look like? I don't know a better way to illustrate that point. I have never heard anyone claim these games have an easy learning curve. I don't know if the devs themselves would even say that. That's just patently ridiculous.

[Counter Punch]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

No no no man, I am not saying that at all.

I'm making a much more nuanced point about the reality of this game. I'm not saying anyone needs to do anything, I explicitly started this post by saying that. I said upfront I am not complaining about the patch, or anything like that at all.

I know people personally who are afraid to try this game because of it's complexity. People that understand MMA, still don't think they could handle the game. Whereas I've never watched a game of Football, yet I have routinely beat diehard Madden fans without owning one of the games myself. Familiarity is important, as dude stated above, I can't deny that. But considering I'm American, I can only speak from my own perspective and where I live, all the sports you named are far more mainstream and better understood than MMA. Not to mention that Madden, NBA 2k, and FIFA are staples in gaming by now. We're three entries into the EA UFC series and the first one was so awful that a good portion of us have only played two.

Even in a real life sense, MMA is vastly more complicated than these other sports. Like I said, a predictable amount of points is scored every single time a certain action is completed, it is not that way in MMA at all. So the mechanics of the game and the route to victory is much easier to explain in Football or Basketball. Also with the games being team sports, the AI teammates provide extra assistance that isn't there in UFC, not saying it should be. You don't have to run the bases, make the outfielders catch the ball, call picks and whatnot. You CAN, but you don't HAVE to, it can be automated and that isn't an option in UFC.

I think you've just confused my point, brotha. I'm not saying the game needs to be made easier or they need to rollback anything they've done. I'm just saying we need to be very careful WHAT we change, WHY, and HOW we let people know about it. The in game tutorials do not do an adequate job of explaining this, if they did I wouldn't have so many people message me on FB asking how to do various things in the game. I bought NBA 2K last year with not much modern basketball knowledge and having not owned a basketball game in years, had no issues understanding the controls. Everything was very intuitive and simple, because the sport itself is simple. Is there depth to the game? Of course. Are there advanced movements you can learn? Of course. But the key difference between UFC and NBA 2K is that EA UFC 3 is unplayable without detailed explanation. Beyond moving your character and possibly throwing the basic 4 strikes (jab, straight, leg kicks) none of the games features are easy to understand when you compare them to something like NBA 2K. There are like, four or five things you have to do in TOTAL on NBA on either side of the ball. Shoot, pass, block/steal, run. Those are one button press. You're seriously trying to say that's comparable to the multitude of complex mechanics that you have to learn to even win one fight in UFC 3? I never had to learn any of the advanced movements in NBA and I did just fine offline and online. Try fighting a high level player in UFC 3 with just the 4 basic strikes I laid out. You won't have relative success to what I had in NBA doing the equivalent, and I'm not Lebron.

So I'm not saying that they need to "dumb the game down". Please do not misrepresent my argument, that is not what I'm saying at all. I am saying, however, that if we continue to make the game more complicated there will be several unintended consequences for that. I already laid all those out multiple times, I would rather not restate them. Me pointing all these things out isn't me attempting to have them changed, I'm simply pointing them out because I haven't seen anyone posit these same ideas here. I don't see how me lining those consequences out, in what I felt was a pretty objective manner, is such an awful thing to do. You literally went from praising me for posting it to saying you hate when people like me say this kind of thing.



Mortal Kombat is ludicrously simple in comparison to UFC, I don't know why you guys think otherwise. They fit that entire games controls on an arcade machine. Can you even imagine what the **** a UFC arcade machine would look like? I don't know a better way to illustrate that point. I have never heard anyone claim these games have an easy learning curve. I don't know if the devs themselves would even say that. That's just patently ridiculous.

The fact that you can beat someone at madden has no bearing on the complexity of madden. Just look at all the different ways to pass/catch, all the plays, all the audibles, line adjustments, hot routes, all the positions, all the rules.

In NBA 2k, you can throw a bounce pass, and regular pass, a lob pass, an icon pass, a lead pass, a handoff, an alley oop, an alleyoop off the backboard, an alleyoop to yourself. To shoot, you csn use the button or the right stick. You hold away on the right stick and turbo while letting go of the left stick stick to shoot a floater, which you have to time the release of. You shoot all different types of runners and step back. You csn double tap the right stick opposite your ball hand on a drive to eurostep. You can double tap square while holding turbo to do a spin step layup. You control which hand you dunk or shoot layups with. You can shoot reverses by holding the right stick to the baseline. Do i need to go on? Thi doesnt even get into dribbling or the post game.

And people say this control scheme is “daunting”? They would kill for the player base of 2k.

The issue is this game is too simple. It doesnt look anything like the sport its emulating. Thats what turns people off.

Your whole point is that you know people who are put off by the complexity of the game. Then I say those people shouldn’t play the game.

[YourFatZebra]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

The fact that you can beat someone at madden has no bearing on the complexity of madden. Just look at all the different ways to pass/catch, all the plays, all the audibles, line adjustments, hot routes, all the positions, all the rules.

In NBA 2k, you can throw a bounce pass, and regular pass, a lob pass, an icon pass, a lead pass, a handoff, an alley oop, an alleyoop off the backboard, an alleyoop to yourself. To shoot, you csn use the button or the right stick. You hold away on the right stick and turbo while letting go of the left stick stick to shoot a floater, which you have to time the release of. You shoot all different types of runners and step back. You csn double tap the right stick opposite your ball hand on a drive to eurostep. You can double tap square while holding turbo to do a spin step layup. You control which hand you dunk or shoot layups with. You can shoot reverses by holding the right stick to the baseline. Do i need to go on? Thi doesnt even get into dribbling or the post game.

And people say this control scheme is “daunting”? They would kill for the player base of 2k.

The issue is this game is too simple. It doesnt look anything like the sport its emulating. Thats what turns people off.

Your whole point is that you know people who are put off by the complexity of the game. Then I say those people shouldn’t play the game.

So much of what you just said isn't necessary to win the game in NBA or Madden. I didn't even know half of what you just said and I've played both games fine forever. How does that not prove my point alone? I've never had to know how to dribble correctly, or what play to pick when, and it's not really mattered when actually playing.

You can't say the same about this at all. If you don't know say, how to do grapple defense you'll get whomped by even a basic grappler. Say you can't move your head correctly, you'll get KO'd by normal CPU. Don't understand the sub UI? Getting tapped out first time, guaranteed. That one mistake also ends the entire fight, one bad play doesn't end the entire game you still have minutes and quarters to make it up.

All the stuff you just laid out, I've never had to do once. So how integral was it really to the experience if I've played multiple titles in the series ONLINE against people who played all of them, and didn't need to know any of it? Again I say, I was able to play NBA and Madden just fine with the basic inputs. I know several others that do as well. But there is absolutely, positively, no way you could play EA UFC 3 with just the basic inputs and have relatively similar success to those other games. Just can't happen man.

EDIT: My point is not just that I know people that "cant handle the game". Your dismissal of those nonexistent people is literally what I'm talking about. Why have that kind of mentality? Why be so exclusionary? You must not have read or understood anything that I said about not wanting the game to just be 50 something hardcores playing each other back and forth all day. That's precisely why I titled this "You're gonna patch the PLAYERBASE AWAY" and not "You're gonna patch the fun out of the game" or "My friend can't play it's too complicated."

I should never log into a AAA game licensed from a billion dollar sports league in 2018 and see 700 people online. To act like everything I've said here has no bearing on that is just being delusional.

SECOND EDIT: Anybody that could clarify what "total players online" is really referring to, that'd be great. Is that players in the mode I'm in? Is that players searching for a match? Or is that total people playing EA UFC 3 period on Xbox, offline or online?

[Sivo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

this is a point i have brought up and couldn't get anyone on here to agree other than mcgowan i believe, this forum believes that making the game more complex just like real life will make the game better, which may be the case but does it make it more accessible if the game is to be succesful and pull in a wider audience. I'm not getting into this again as u will find out if u keep raising these concerns its pointless as everyone just wants the game THEY want regardless of whether it sells well and more ppl play it, there might be 1 or 2 ppl on here who care about the game pulling in more players and keeping them, no one else cares or just assumes if they make the game more complex(real) more ppl will play which is a ridiculous view point if ppl never get past the first few fights because its too complex.

edit: My assumption has always been players online is everyone online, UT, Ranked, Unranked,

edit2: My view has always been that the base game need to be simple enough for anyone to pick up and play(which is difficult) and then add layers of advanced attacks/defence/footwork which allows better players to beat ppl using the basic techniques. My worry is currently the base game is way too complex especially with current block breakdown mechanics where in order to work your away thru the block u use jabs/straights which are the most commonly used strikes for new players and add to that the walking forward block breakdown mechanic new players wont have any idea wats going on or why they're block keeps getting destroyed on top of the being overwhelmed with the clinch/ground mechanics

Too all the ppl who say u can just look at the videos in game to understand the changes, 1=it doesnt have all the changes and 2=if u dont have a basic understanding of the game mechanics already then little videos wont help at all. 3= How many ppl actually look at the in game videos? when i play i just click straight into whichever game mode i want and ignore the rest of the main menu

[YourFatZebra]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

this is a point i have brought up and couldn't get anyone on here to agree other than mcgowan i believe, this forum believes that making the game more complex just like real life will make the game better, which may be the case but does it make it more accessible if the game is to be succesful and pull in a wider audience. I'm not getting into this again as u will find out if u keep raising these concerns its pointless as everyone just wants the game THEY want regardless of whether it sells well and more ppl play it, there might be 1 or 2 ppl on here who care about the game pulling in more players and keeping them, no one else cares or just assumes if they make the game more complex(real) more ppl will play which is a ridiculous view point if ppl never get past the first few fights because its too complex.

edit: My assumption has always been players online is everyone online, UT, Ranked, Unranked,

edit2: My view has always been that the base game need to be simple enough for anyone to pick up and play(which is difficult) and then add layers of advanced attacks/defence/footwork which allows better players to beat ppl using the basic techniques. My worry is currently the base game is way too complex especially with current block breakdown mechanics where in order to work your away thru the block u use jabs/straights which are the most commonly used strikes for new players and add to that the walking forward block breakdown mechanic new players wont have any idea wats going on or why they're block keeps getting destroyed.

Too all the ppl who say u can just look at the videos in game to understand the changes, 1=it doesnt have all the changes and 2=if u dont have a basic understanding of the game mechanics already then little videos wont help at all. 3= How many ppl actually look at the in game videos? when i play i just click straight into whichever game mode i want and ignore the rest of the main menu

Exactly.

I was literally sitting beside my friend Josh when he attempted his career playthrough. He's an MMA fan in real life who generally prefers grapplers (His favorite fighter is Khabib) and wanted to play that way in career. I attempted to show him how the grappling works in practice. This is somebody who plays Overwatch competitively and went to school for philosophy, not an idiot. But the mechanics of the grappling were too cumbersome for him to figure out. Even when he started getting the hang of it, the hit or miss nature of the game physics turned him off once he started fighting. I think as fans of the series, we're a little jaded to some of the bull**** that happens in the game. Strikes that don't connect doing damage or vice versa, takedowns you should have blocked, etc. Those things don't bother us as much because we're used to it.

But dropping a new player in that environment is totally different. Had I not been beside Josh during that first fight he would have stood no chance, and that's not a knock on him at all. Even knowing how to throw all the possible strikes he had (I showed him head kicks, overhands, all that), knowing how to move his head, knowing how to block, he still couldn't defeat the normal AI. The first WFA opponent.

Josh is not an anomaly by any stretch of the imagination. I could name ten people I know personally who had that same experience or a similar one, and I would imagine that there are a lot more like him. Wanting to play the game and not being able to because there's no way to actually learn aside from spending hours in practice mode by yourself drilling like a real damn fighter. Someone like me already does that to begin with, but someone like Josh who's just trying to get into the series doesn't have the want or time to spend hours doing combos and **** in practice mode.

Was UFC 2 complex? Yes, it was. But it wasn't so complex that a new player could never be competitive. I started playing these games with UFC 2 (I played the undisputed series but UFC 2 was the first EA title) and was able to be ranked in the top 500 by the end of it's lifespan. I just don't know if that kind of thing is possible inside UFC 3. I'm not saying it can't happen, but almost all of my opponents I remember from UFC 2, and the playerbase dropping to the numbers that it has goes hand in hand with this idea. You can't attract new players to an everchanging game with a community this toxic. I'll be trying to convince someone to get the game, we'll play a few fights and have some fun. But they inevitably see me play online and witness the bull**** that I have to deal with and are turned away forever.

That's why I get so up in arms about those kind of players. The people who break the game and make it annoying instead of fun. Because it hurts the game as a whole and makes it less likely to be picked up by a new player when all the pro's aren't even enjoying their time with it.

Why would you buy a game that isn't even enjoyable for the people who play it all the time?
Why would you put the time in to be skilled at something when you see the skilled players struggling to beat dudes just spamming ****?
Why wouldn't you just get the game, pick the best characters, and do the common exploits to get wins?

I feel like this is so obvious. Not even trying to be an ***, I just feel like this is easy to understand.

[Sivo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

With regards to other sports games, i started playing NHL while waiting for ufc 3 to be released which is a sport i dont watch and havent played a NHL game since 1994 ish, within 2 hours i was able to do most things in the game, except advanced techniques. When i started playing UFC1 it took me 8+ hours to get the absolute basics down of the ground/clinch/standup and i played abit of fight night so got the punches down quickly(i had never played another mma game before) but the rest was very difficult, if ppl wont admit that is a problem for new players then i don't know what to say or how to explain it better to them.

[YourFatZebra]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

With regards to other sports games, i started playing NHL while waiting for ufc 3 to be released which is a sport i dont watch and havent played a NHL game since 1994 ish, within 2 hours i was able to do most things in the game, except advanced techniques. When i started playing UFC1 it took me 8+ hours to get the absolute basics down of the ground/clinch/standup and i played abit of fight night so got the punches down quickly(i had never played another mma game before) but the rest was very difficult, if ppl wont admit that is a problem for new players then i don't know what to say or how to explain it better to them.

Dude above suggested that my success playing Madden or NBA against people who play it regularly, despite having no knowledge of the deeper physics, has no bearing on the games complexity.

Doesn't make any sense to me. If a brand new player who's never played UFC before dropped into a fight with Kinetic or someone like that, he'd be mollywhopped in epic fashion. Yet I picked up NBA last year and played online with no problem, not knowing any of the intricate controls he laid out. I was still able to play competently with people who DID know those inputs and it didn't really matter. Come to think of it, most people I know have no trouble playing NBA or Madden without knowing all of those controls. I can think of one or two dudes I know who probably know those deeper mechanics, and yeah they are known to be the NBA dudes in our town. Doesn't mean they're undefeated, doesn't mean the skill gap between them and me would be the same as a noob and Kinetic. I can't think of a better way to illustrate that point.

[doubleblastdubble]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

Dude above suggested that my success playing Madden or NBA against people who play it regularly, despite having no knowledge of the deeper physics, has no bearing on the games complexity.

Doesn't make any sense to me. If a brand new player who's never played UFC before dropped into a fight with Kinetic or someone like that, he'd be mollywhopped in epic fashion. Yet I picked up NBA last year and played online with no problem, not knowing any of the intricate controls he laid out. I was still able to play competently with people who DID know those inputs and it didn't really matter. Come to think of it, most people I know have no trouble playing NBA or Madden without knowing all of those controls. I can think of one or two dudes I know who probably know those deeper mechanics, and yeah they are known to be the NBA dudes in our town. Doesn't mean they're undefeated, doesn't mean the skill gap between them and me would be the same as a noob and Kinetic. I can't think of a better way to illustrate that point.

complexity isn't an on or off switch.

Some games have incredibly high skill floors with low ceilings. Some have incredibly high skill ceilings with high floors. some have skill ceilings that are high but floors that are low. most sports games have low skill floors but super high ceilings.

Fighting games generally have the highest floors. Even then, UFC is one of the easiest fighting games out there, if you can consider it that.

[bmlimo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

this is a point i have brought up and couldn't get anyone on here to agree other than mcgowan i believe, this forum believes that making the game more complex just like real life will make the game better, which may be the case but does it make it more accessible if the game is to be succesful and pull in a wider audience. I'm not getting into this again as u will find out if u keep raising these concerns its pointless as everyone just wants the game THEY want regardless of whether it sells well and more ppl play it, there might be 1 or 2 ppl on here who care about the game pulling in more players and keeping them, no one else cares or just assumes if they make the game more complex(real) more ppl will play which is a ridiculous view point if ppl never get past the first few fights because its too complex.

edit: My assumption has always been players online is everyone online, UT, Ranked, Unranked,

edit2: My view has always been that the base game need to be simple enough for anyone to pick up and play(which is difficult) and then add layers of advanced attacks/defence/footwork which allows better players to beat ppl using the basic techniques. My worry is currently the base game is way too complex especially with current block breakdown mechanics where in order to work your away thru the block u use jabs/straights which are the most commonly used strikes for new players and add to that the walking forward block breakdown mechanic new players wont have any idea wats going on or why they're block keeps getting destroyed on top of the being overwhelmed with the clinch/ground mechanics

Too all the ppl who say u can just look at the videos in game to understand the changes, 1=it doesnt have all the changes and 2=if u dont have a basic understanding of the game mechanics already then little videos wont help at all. 3= How many ppl actually look at the in game videos? when i play i just click straight into whichever game mode i want and ignore the rest of the main menu

I guess the problem is just this the game don’t have a identity it is in a middleground between realistic and arcade... so we have realistic features like damage, strikes distance and combo physics ... and unrealistic thing like block shield, ultra sonic combo speed, stamina based on body strikes or opponent making u miss... all those things turn the game more complex that it should be...so in my point of view... if they decided to put the focus on realism the game would be better, if they decided to made it full arcade it would be better than it is now too...the problem is this middleground that some aspects works as an arcade game and somethings works as a realistic game...people will talk about balance bla bla bla... but how to archive balance if the game want to entertain 2 kinds of players... realistic players will always find it unbalanced because of the arcade aspects and the arcade gamers will think is unbalanced because realistic players can win by strategies not by full gaming skills...

[Sivo]

Re: You're gonna patch the playerbase away

Fighting games generally have the highest floors. Even then, UFC is one of the easiest fighting games out there, if you can consider it that.

forgetting the complexity of the ground/clinch/standup mechanics, name me 1 fighting game where u have as complicated a control scheme as this one?

I can pick up and play any fighting game and get a grip on the controls and distance management etc in a couple of hours, not mastered but get the basics's. I have no doubt other fighting games have a much high skill level at the top but ufc has by far the most complicated entry level gaming i have played. I had never played an mma game before picking up ufc 1 and as i stated before it took me 8 hours + to get the basics and that was without the current headmovement and the extra mechanics added since ufc 1.

I dont believe i'm the best gamer out there but i like to think i'm good at picking up games and if i struggled to get the game down i can only imagine how difficult it must be for a more casual players to have this as there first mma/boxing game but I may just be asking for things that are not possible and that this game may just be a niche sports game that can never move out of that space because of the complexity and depth that comes along with the sport irregardless of it becoming a realistic sport sim or an arcade fighter