The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

[kingkilla56]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

At this point I think you are just trolling, either that or you don't watch NXT and you have no clue what's going on with the women's division there.

And you know exactly what I meant by my statement; but just incase I'll explain it. You said "Hope AJ is always around to make Paige better" (trollish might I add) and my simple response was an add on; generally speaking that when the NXT ladies arrive to the main roster, they get actual pushes and feuds like they've had in NXT; not the five on five total divas tag match that was thrown together for the sake of a segment for total divas.

So Im trolling by saying if the nxt divas are as boring as Paige has been on Raw we have nothing to look forward to? What did we just witness with Paige the past 3 months? If they come in like that, then they will flounder the same or they will find a way to make it work. It doesnt matter how many cheers they get in NXT. Paige was loved in NXT, what did that do for her? Dont tell me Im trolling when Im just calling it what it is.

And the total divas treatment means 5 on 5 tag matches? We havent seen those in a minute. And Paige has been involved in none of them. Neither has Emma btw (another flounder). When you said the total divas treatment I thought you meant lose on PPV to AJ for the title. Since that is what they have all been doing on TV since total divas became a thing. And its something Paige is gonna be doing the next few weeks.

And again it doesnt matter what these people are doing in NXT, that goes for the men too btw. I said "on Raw" a million times because what happens on Raw is where they make their bread. So Bayley Sasha Banks, Charlotte, Alexa, Cindy, Maddie, Marley, Cherry, Bobby anybody down can be the second coming of Moolah in NXT. If they cant get over on national tv (for whatever reason you want to say) then tough ****.

But I must be trolling.

[TheShizNo1]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

in almost every feud her opponent outshined her in some capacity whether in character or actually ENTERTAINING wrestling.

This is funny. In her matches with Fox and Naomi I commented more on Fox's improvement and Naomi's athleticism. Idc what y'all say about the chic, but she's been boring since she's been on RAW. Even with the mic time against AJ it was just "yawn". Not saying she doesn't have talent, but if she doesn't have to take on any responsibility for her boring run, then idk what to tell you.

the zeb colter/lana segment was a classic, I can't stop watching it on youtube.

Hell yeah! Every thing about that was great. Rusev is beginning to grow on me.

I can't believe you guys have spent so much time talking about women's wrestling.

Paige is interesting and a great wrestler and hot but in the end she's still part of a division that nobody will ever care about.

Well, can you really say that when people actually did care about it at one point? Or were you just talking currently?

[King_B_Mack]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Honestly the divas division is a joke because WWE doesn't care to keep it from being a joke.

I'm not even one of these Paige dudes since I don't watch NXT, but she got a pretty ****ty deal. Monday was the first time that she touched a microphone since her debut against AJ. How exactly are you supposed to prove to not be boring when you don't even get to talk? She didn't even get backstage segments like the Bellas and Naomi etc do. She just came out, wrestled, got beat down most the match, won and left. She got on commentary that one time before Money in the Bank but that's all the talking she did, it's insane.

Then as usual, WWE booking proves how complete **** it is. They put us through this whole damn string of Paige matches against divas beating the **** out of her and her getting it done to prove that she did belong only to undo all of that because she lost to AJ proving that it was a fluke that she beat her that night. All they had to do was execute their double turn by having AJ return the way she did and go one of two ways. Either have Paige say what she said, "they don't want to see a title match tonight right?" The crowd erupts the way it did in favor of a title match and she completely ignores it saying "see, like I said, they don't want to see that" and literally walk out to the back. Double turn is done and now you can run with stories of AJ trying to get her to agree to a title match every week and Paige getting progressively more heel in her responses.

Or if you wanted to have the match, do what they did, but have her go over on AJ. A) It was so obvious that AJ was going to win that match, that if Paige had actually won, that crowd would have been pissed. Instant heel heat for Paige to carry forward. B) You still have a story as face AJ is chasing heel Paige who has now officially proven she belongs and continues to rub that into everybody's faces. But of course, you'd need a competent creative team to pull off something like this and WWE hasn't had one of those for quite some time.

[reyes the roof]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

It's be awesome if Paul Heyman distracted AJ with Cm Punks music and introduced paige as a Heyman girl.

I'd love it he was paired with her. He could talk about how his client is the one that conquered AJ's record setting streak as Divas Champion

[WWF80sKid]

The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

This is where I stopped reading your post. 3 months being booked as a weak wrestler who gets lucky wins to maintain a championship is NOT her fault, and it's definitely the least she's capable of.

It's hilarious how one person can 'save a division.' If you truly believed that than SMH. She needs someone else that can maintain a feud with her and actually put on a program. They only Diva that has been booked that strong was AJ Lee, but the problem was AJ took her vacation right as Paige got called up. Just wait to see this feud between the two, it will change your mind.

(and Charlotte is nowhere near Paige's wrestling ability)

I like you.

And yes, the double turn could have been done so much better. Paige says no. Superkicks AJ. Says okay. Wrestles her and loses. Maybe attacks her from behind after the match.

It just seemed like they thought, "Paige isn't getting the reaction we wanted, let's kill her".

If Triple H is as proud of NXT as he acts, he will find a way to get Paige over.

[StevenSD]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

So Im trolling by saying if the nxt divas are as boring as Paige has been on Raw we have nothing to look forward to? What did we just witness with Paige the past 3 months? If they come in like that, then they will flounder the same or they will find a way to make it work. It doesnt matter how many cheers they get in NXT. Paige was loved in NXT, what did that do for her? Dont tell me Im trolling when Im just calling it what it is.

And the total divas treatment means 5 on 5 tag matches? We havent seen those in a minute. And Paige has been involved in none of them. Neither has Emma btw (another flounder). When you said the total divas treatment I thought you meant lose on PPV to AJ for the title. Since that is what they have all been doing on TV since total divas became a thing. And its something Paige is gonna be doing the next few weeks.

And again it doesnt matter what these people are doing in NXT, that goes for the men too btw. I said "on Raw" a million times because what happens on Raw is where they make their bread. So Bayley Sasha Banks, Charlotte, Alexa, Cindy, Maddie, Marley, Cherry, Bobby anybody down can be the second coming of Moolah in NXT. If they cant get over on national tv (for whatever reason you want to say) then tough ****.

But I must be trolling.

Really? It took you this long to actually have a post with some friggin explanation in it?

All I'll reply to is the talent can only do so much as booking allows; if you seriously think Paige was booked right, or booking set her up to be showcased as the bad *** she really is and was built to be in NXT, then I can understand your gripe. IMO she did the best she could when told to go out there, smile a lot, and get lucky wins, all done with absolutely no mic time.

[Reed1417]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

I can't believe you guys have spent so much time talking about women's wrestling.

Paige is interesting and a great wrestler and hot but in the end she's still part of a division that nobody will ever care about.

I think the fact that we spent so much time talking about it means that we care. I know I do. We don't live in a perfect world and no one is going to get treated the same I'm aware of that. However, when you clearly have the ability to do so and you don't that's my problem.

I've said it before my problem is the way they treat the women. It's all for eye candy and not about the wrestling. Most of these women are beautiful let's get that out of the way now, that doesn't mean that's all they are. If you give them time to put on good matches (see NXT) I'm sure more people will care. Just my viewpoint.


Reed is comin' atcha!!

[Hooe]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Frankly the quality of everything in the women's division in general - particularly the actual matches - is better than it's been in years, so I'm not surprised that it's drawing more attention and ergo more criticism.

[BDKiiing]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

I can't believe you guys have spent so much time talking about women's wrestling.

Paige is interesting and a great wrestler and hot but in the end she's still part of a division that nobody will ever care about.

Because the potential is there. They have great talent, but Vince is an idiot pervert who doesn't care if the women wrestle. NXT has a great women's division. Women's wrestling is really entertaining if done right. TNA's strongest part is their women's division. Wrestlers like Sara Del Rey, Cheerleader Melissa, Britani Knight, Jessica Havok, Madison Eagles all made big names for themselves on the indie circuit. Women's wrestling is unique, and when given time is real entertainment. It's change of pace that hopefully Hunter brings back one day. It's similar to how the women have become a big deal with UFC, the card for both will always be filled with men working, but when you throw in that change of pace, when done right, it's really refreshing and entertaining.

[kingkilla56]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Really? It took you this long to actually have a post with some friggin explanation in it?

All I'll reply to is the talent can only do so much as booking allows; if you seriously think Paige was booked right, or booking set her up to be showcased as the bad *** she really is and was built to be in NXT, then I can understand your gripe. IMO she did the best she could when told to go out there, smile a lot, and get lucky wins, all done with absolutely no mic time.

Well no Ive gone on record saying WWE was failing Paige in booking. My gripe came when people put all the blame on WWE. Paige was a part of her bad run. But it seems like nobody wants to hold her at any fault in this.

Maybe they have been bidding their time for AJ's return and now they have a big bag of tricks for a heel Paige.

What they should have done was have Paige agree to the match, but blindside and beat the **** out of AJ before the bell rang and left the ring laughing and holding up her title. Having her lose the belt there was pretty weak. I think AJ will murder her in promos. I also think AJ will win this feud and that wont help Paige at all. Id rather her lose to AJ in a showcase match on PPV to help get her over. Her match with Naomi at MitB was a strong showing but they killed that the next night with AJ.

[st0rmb11]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Paige's gimmick from day 1 has been that of the lucky kid who pulled sneaked away with a huge upset.

In her "feuds" afterwards, that's how she was booked. She was booked to take a beating, then win with one or two moves. That isn't her fault. She never had any opportunity to show anything other than..perseverance, maybe?

For whatever reason, she was used as an afterthought in her two biggest "feuds". She never had a chance to show any character against Alicia Fox because some genius thought we needed to see Alicia Fox throw temper tantrums after each match, immediately taking the spotlight away from Paige. That's got nothing to do with a lack of charisma or ability to get over on Paige's part. That almost seems like someone deliberately trying to get Fox over at Paige's expense. And then the matches with Cameron & Naomi were more about Cameron & Naomi. Paige was just a spoke in the wheel for that stuff.

She was never given an opportunity to deliver. She was booked to take a beating for 2 or 3 minutes, then win on a couple of moves. Impossible to show charisma when you never have the opportunity.

[Trevelyan]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Just compare the women to the men and you'll see how bad the booking is in certain situations. For example, Bray Wyatt is insanely over, and it doesn't have much to do with his wrestling. If you took his promo time away from him when he came up, he'd be dead in the water too.

[TheMatrix31]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Paige has done more for my interest in women's wrestling than probably any other women's wrestler to com around in a long, long time.

Before Paige, I spent 10 years fast-forwarding probably every women's match I saw except for the one with Maria Menounos at Wrestlemania.

I'd say that's a good bit of progress there, even if the feuds haven't been booked really nicely. Her work on NXT was cool and it made me interested more but in the end it's still one big who cares.

[philliesfan136]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

I was happy with Paige/Naomi, think Naomi put on a solid performance. She's a worthy opponent now in that division. And I mean they let Paige do a cradle DDT as the finish, that's kinda impressive for these days.

I think Paige/AJ will make matches watchable in the future given the right amount of time.

[philliesfan136]

Re: The "There's No Raw Thread Yet" Raw Thread - 6/30/2014

Paige's gimmick from day 1 has been that of the lucky kid who pulled sneaked away with a huge upset.

In her "feuds" afterwards, that's how she was booked. She was booked to take a beating, then win with one or two moves. That isn't her fault. She never had any opportunity to show anything other than..perseverance, maybe?

For whatever reason, she was used as an afterthought in her two biggest "feuds". She never had a chance to show any character against Alicia Fox because some genius thought we needed to see Alicia Fox throw temper tantrums after each match, immediately taking the spotlight away from Paige. That's got nothing to do with a lack of charisma or ability to get over on Paige's part. That almost seems like someone deliberately trying to get Fox over at Paige's expense. And then the matches with Cameron & Naomi were more about Cameron & Naomi. Paige was just a spoke in the wheel for that stuff.

She was never given an opportunity to deliver. She was booked to take a beating for 2 or 3 minutes, then win on a couple of moves. Impossible to show charisma when you never have the opportunity.

This is true. She really got involved on commentary with Cameron, which is whatever.

It comes back to the bad babyface booking overall these days. Rose probably hasn't done more than 5 moves yet either. Sandow looked better at MITB and the fans were cheering him.

And about Fox, I think Kevin Dunn is the culprit. Apparently very high on the weirdo character and I bet he was shilling it to Vince over Paige.