Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

[kjcheezhead]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

As a graphic designer, it's been a lot of fun creating custom logos for friends on NCAA 14. I'm definitely hoping the customization aspects of the game can stand alone as it's own platform, as well. By doing so, it puts the onus on the community to use whatever tools it can find as opposed to adding one more task for the development team to have to create and implement said tools.

Many people on OS state copyright infringement limitations when it comes to implementing a similar Team Builder-like mechanic in new football IPs, yet I still wonder how NCAA Team Builder got around the legality of uploading trademarked logos. No one has ever seemed to have a definitive answer there.

NCAA is an EA game. Since they have the NFL license, they aren't going to sue themselves. It always comes down to the NFL. I doubt marvel or dc cares if you put a superhero logo on a helmet. To them it's just free advertising.

[grabursock55]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

NCAA is an EA game. Since they have the NFL license, they aren't going to sue themselves. It always comes down to the NFL. I doubt marvel or dc cares if you put a superhero logo on a helmet. To them it's just free advertising.

On the same page though.... You could upload any NFL logo you wanted no problems, but you could not use NFL names unless altered IE "Dalas Cowboys" or something like that. There must have been some sort of copyright issues there.

[FaceMask]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Backbreaker overall was a terrible game, but the physics were great. I made this video when the devs were talking about what the game could do.

https://m.youtube.com/?rdm=1f9f0z2ur&client=mv-google#/watch?v=2m8pwDhf5w8

They got a lot of player interactions right. Chip blocks, double teams, tackles involving multiple defenders,players stretching for the goal line or first downs , mid air collisions. The post plays needed a lot of work and pretty much everything else was terrible, but I've always thought Euphoria physics had a ton of potential.

JMF 16 can steal the physics, the logo creator, and possibly the right stick passing from backbreaker (although I prefer 2ks route based button passing)... just keep everything else out.

Sure, it had its share of good moments and Euphoria is a well-produced RTPe. Even Madden's Infinity Engine has its share. But most of these things can be done without real-time physics, it's just that it's going to lack the level of variation that you'd get adding in RTP.

Interestingly enough, Infinity Engine demonstrates a lack of variation. Despite what an RTPe is inherently supposed to do, much of the RTP interactions in Madden repeat themselves constantly in the exact same way.

Going with standard mocap-only means that either you'll produce good animations or bad animations, but you have a better chance at consistency (consistently bad or consistently good or consistently mediocre). Adding in RTP, you're gambling with a larger variable that's not as easily controlled; going the route NM went, you're giving over massive amounts of control to that variable and having a greater potential for ugly outcomes. Now, if you don't mind the negative potential then it's worth it and it comes down a matter of balance.

Me personally, I'd take the animation consistency that All-Pro Football gave me. And, I argue that even though the physics in that game were not real-time, they were fantastic. The collision accuracy is still better than what I've seen from Infinity or even Madden's standard animation base. Also, APF's standard animations had really strong fidelity considering the tech at the time. The fidelity of Madden's animations generally isn't great today and was total crap all of last generation, and BB's standard animation base was just plain awful. I remember the throwing animation prior to the BB patch; it was just inexcusably bad. With the patch it improved... and still was just plain awful.

[kjcheezhead]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Sure, it had its share of good moments and Euphoria is a well-produced RTPe. Even Madden's Infinity Engine has its share. But most of these things can be done without real-time physics, it's just that it's going to lack the level of variation that you'd get adding in RTP.

Interestingly enough, Infinity Engine demonstrates a lack of variation. Despite what an RTPe is inherently supposed to do, much of the RTP interactions in Madden repeat themselves constantly in the exact same way.

Going with standard mocap-only means that either you'll produce good animations or bad animations, but you have a better chance at consistency (consistently bad or consistently good or consistently mediocre). Adding in RTP, you're gambling with a larger variable that's not as easily controlled; going the route NM went, you're giving over massive amounts of control to that variable and having a greater potential for ugly outcomes. Now, if you don't mind the negative potential then it's worth it and it comes down a matter of balance.

Me personally, I'd take the animation consistency that All-Pro Football gave me. And, I argue that even though the physics in that game were not real-time, they were fantastic. The collision accuracy is still better than what I've seen from Infinity or even Madden's standard animation base. Also, APF's standard animations had really strong fidelity considering the tech at the time. The fidelity of Madden's animations generally isn't great today and was total crap all of last generation, and BB's standard animation base was just plain awful. I remember the throwing animation prior to the BB patch; it was just inexcusably bad. With the patch it improved... and still was just plain awful.

I agree with you that APF animated the best and was the most consistent. Games don't need physics to be good. I think the physics can really add to a game if done right though.

Backbreaker had the best physics, but all it's mo capped animations were bad. The game only looked good when euphoria kicked in. The post physics was bad too with lifeless bodies all laying on their backs. That needed to be cleaned up too.

Madden has bad animations too. Not backbreaker bad, but bad. Then they added a bad physics engine on to that. They ended up with really no physics actually affecting players momentum, just weird contortions after bad tackle animations which made the game look worse.

I think APF caliber animations and euphoria physics could be amazing. If either the animations or physics are poor, it won't work tho.

[gr18]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Not that it has any relevence necessarily but Borderlands 2 used Unreal Engine 3 and Gearbox Software was the developer and 2k was the publisher.Borderlands the Pre-Sequel also used the same engine and 2k's Australia studio was involved.

Take-Two owns Rockstar North which is in Edinburgh,Scotland and can be considered northern England.

[FaceMask]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

I agree with you that APF animated the best and was the most consistent. Games don't need physics to be good. I think the physics can really add to a game if done right though.

Backbreaker had the best physics, but all it's mo capped animations were bad. The game only looked good when euphoria kicked in. The post physics was bad too with lifeless bodies all laying on their backs. That needed to be cleaned up too.

Madden has bad animations too. Not backbreaker bad, but bad. Then they added a bad physics engine on to that. They ended up with really no physics actually affecting players momentum, just weird contortions after bad tackle animations which made the game look worse.

I think APF caliber animations and euphoria physics could be amazing. If either the animations or physics are poor, it won't work tho.

Great points. Agreed 100%.

[Anners]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Not that it has any relevence necessarily but Borderlands 2 used Unreal Engine 3 and Gearbox Software was the developer and 2k was the publisher.Borderlands the Pre-Sequel also used the same engine and 2k's Australia studio was involved.

Take-Two owns Rockstar North which is in Edinburgh,Scotland and can be considered northern England.

Yeah, it can't. Scotland is a different country.

[Gridiron]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

I agree with you that APF animated the best and was the most consistent. Games don't need physics to be good. I think the physics can really add to a game if done right though.

Backbreaker had the best physics, but all it's mo capped animations were bad. The game only looked good when euphoria kicked in. The post physics was bad too with lifeless bodies all laying on their backs. That needed to be cleaned up too.

Madden has bad animations too. Not backbreaker bad, but bad. Then they added a bad physics engine on to that. They ended up with really no physics actually affecting players momentum, just weird contortions after bad tackle animations which made the game look worse.

I think APF caliber animations and euphoria physics could be amazing. If either the animations or physics are poor, it won't work tho.

Good points and all player, but arent you a little worried about a new team tryna tackle somethin that NM and EA couldn't get right? I mean, NMs whole company revolved around realtime physics and even they had problems. EA got crazy money and resource and look at Infinity. Yeah Euphoria was better than Madden's physics, but you still got WWE stuff enough in BB that made you laugh.

I saw a QB get choked slammed on his head in BB. Dude woulda been dead in real life, lol.

[MajorSupreme]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Good points and all player, but arent you a little worried about a new team tryna tackle somethin that NM and EA couldn't get right? I mean, NMs whole company revolved around realtime physics and even they had problems. EA got crazy money and resource and look at Infinity. Yeah Euphoria was better than Madden's physics, but you still got WWE stuff enough in BB that made you laugh.

I saw a QB get choked slammed on his head in BB. Dude woulda been dead in real life, lol.

We should all have that worry. And we should also not expect a 9/10, 8/10, or even 7/10 out the box let alone in the game's first year. They'll be bugs, issues, glitches, etc. They'll be new concepts, ideas, representations that we'll like, and those we won't like. We're getting something completely new. And hell, we don't even know if this is absolutely a console game. But man, doesn't it make you tingly?

[gr18]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Yeah, it can't. Scotland is a different country.

Excuse me for my ignorance but I know both England and Scotland are part of the U.K.I do know they're different countries but just thought that some referred to Scotland as northern England even though technically not right.

[kjcheezhead]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Good points and all player, but arent you a little worried about a new team tryna tackle somethin that NM and EA couldn't get right? I mean, NMs whole company revolved around realtime physics and even they had problems. EA got crazy money and resource and look at Infinity. Yeah Euphoria was better than Madden's physics, but you still got WWE stuff enough in BB that made you laugh.

I saw a QB get choked slammed on his head in BB. Dude woulda been dead in real life, lol.

I'm worried about a first year game like we all should be. It's almost a miracle that another developer is trying an unlicensed football game. But I liked the euphoria physics. If natural motion is behind the physics, I feel better about what the game can do and I'm willing to laugh off a wwe moment if they are rare in order to get the things I pointed out in my video.

I'm bracing for an average to poor first try, but APF caliber game with better graphics and physics that keeps the game unpredictable could be surprisingly good if you ask me.

On a side note, when Damon tweeted about demoing the game at the super bowl, he talked about how "sick" the wr/db interactions were. Idk, it might not be anything, but to me that's someone who is watching a physics based game where both players are fighting, interacting and unpredictable collisions are happening. At least I hope so.

[kcsam]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Damon responded to a tweet earlier from someone asking him to watch his NFL2K5 video where he discusses what should be included in JMF16. He acknowledged the tweet and said he watched the video. That's cool. Hopefully when the forum is opened he'll be interacting with us on there as well.

[HighAlert]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Just dont get your hopes up.

EA taught me that.

to be fair this isn't EA. BUT, if this is a console game my hopes will be through the roof.

[TemplateR]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Damon responded to a tweet earlier from someone asking him to watch his NFL2K5 video where he discusses what should be included in JMF16. He acknowledged the tweet and said he watched the video. That's cool. Hopefully when the forum is opened he'll be interacting with us on there as well.

Which NFL2k5 Video? Do you have the link for the respond?

[kcsam]

Re: Joe Montana Football 16 Looks to be a Mobile Game, Utilizing Unreal Engine 4

Which NFL2k5 Video? Do you have the link for the respond?

Here's the tweet containing the YouTube link:

@DamonGrow and @ShutdownSafety youtube.com/watch?v=s71tcm… check this out please