NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

[tougias24]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

agreed with that^ should be working on individual attributes not just player overalls

[mattg123]

Hey guys, first I want to say that I think this roster sharing thing is awesome. I couldn't believe it when it was taken out for PS3. Anyhow, I want to give my two cents on the matter.

I see people arguing that so-and-so should be rated 90 and this guy shouldn't be over 88 whereas that guy needs to be no higher than 81. I disagree with all of that because I think almost all of those ratings are too high. Why? Because there are faulty sliders in this game (pass reception ease) and the ratings of the players should be adjusted to help combat that. Now, by lowering attribute sliders players' overall rating will naturally come down. But the overall rating only means something when there are other ratings to compare it to. If Sidney Crosby is an 80 then surely Manny Maholtra would be a 60, for instance.

People get way too caught up with what the overall rating is and they should be more focused on individual attributes. I saw one guy complaining that Gaborik shouldn't be an 89, he should be a 90. First of all, oh my god what a huge difference! Secondly, what should be more important is that Gabby's skating, speed, shot accuracy, shot power, deking and agility are high. Should his aggression be bumped up just to make him hit 90 overall? How about his shot blocking? We all know how big of a shot blocker he is, right? (Here's a tip: He isn't).

Furthermore, and I hope this is reflected in matt's update, almost every player in this game is rated and plays exactly the same. No one has any specific skill because all the 3rd and 4th liners are rated in the low 80s or mid 70s for everything. David Tyrell and Mike Duco may as well be the same player but surely they have their own specific strengths and weaknesses.

Well, those are my thoughts. I'll be playing some games with these rosters tonight and even though I might not fully agree with the method I am 100% certain that they will be better than the bullcrap EA gave us.

Yes I agree and like your enthusiasm. I did take a lot of the and consideration for the Xbox version. However only did a base in two days just to put something out a little better than default

We will get to that and I am very interested for u to help out a bit. Once I get 0.8 from captain Kidd I would be more than happy to let u work on this for a bit and see what u got. At least a few teams or high end players.
Please get back to me

We could run a big test with this for sure.... Or at least a side project on accurate / realism. But this will take some time. Please I would like your help.

[Steven547]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Not sure if this would help us, but what if ALL the passing accuracy attributes were drastically lowered? Would that make a difference? I ask, because I'm using these rosters with pass accuracy slider at 0, CPU Diff at 0, and Tuner 1.01. Guess what? CPU still has a pass completion % of 75 or more each game.

Now, I'm not sure if it's that the game is just not calculating it correctly, because some games it appears the CPU misses on quite a few passes....then I check stats, and they are at 80% completion.

If we lowered the player indiv passing attributes, would this give us the "game" we've been wanting with the CPU actually making errors?

[tougias24]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...S&pli=1#gid=33

this sheet has a few teams done and is great for specific attributes for players, i think it is a great base to start on for those if someone is helping matt with the rosters. (i did the bruins roster)

[jkra0512]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Hey guys, first I want to say that I think this roster sharing thing is awesome. I couldn't believe it when it was taken out for PS3. Anyhow, I want to give my two cents on the matter.

I see people arguing that so-and-so should be rated 90 and this guy shouldn't be over 88 whereas that guy needs to be no higher than 81. I disagree with all of that because I think almost all of those ratings are too high. Why? Because there are faulty sliders in this game (pass reception ease) and the ratings of the players should be adjusted to help combat that. Now, by lowering attribute sliders players' overall rating will naturally come down. But the overall rating only means something when there are other ratings to compare it to. If Sidney Crosby is an 80 then surely Manny Maholtra would be a 60, for instance.

People get way too caught up with what the overall rating is and they should be more focused on individual attributes. I saw one guy complaining that Gaborik shouldn't be an 89, he should be a 90. First of all, oh my god what a huge difference! Secondly, what should be more important is that Gabby's skating, speed, shot accuracy, shot power, deking and agility are high. Should his aggression be bumped up just to make him hit 90 overall? How about his shot blocking? We all know how big of a shot blocker he is, right? (Here's a tip: He isn't).

Furthermore, and I hope this is reflected in matt's update, almost every player in this game is rated and plays exactly the same. No one has any specific skill because all the 3rd and 4th liners are rated in the low 80s or mid 70s for everything. David Tyrell and Mike Duco may as well be the same player but surely they have their own specific strengths and weaknesses.

Well, those are my thoughts. I'll be playing some games with these rosters tonight and even though I might not fully agree with the method I am 100% certain that they will be better than the bullcrap EA gave us.

Yeah, that was me you're talking about there. I agree with your assessment, I was merely pointing out that he needs to be in the same realm as Claude Giroux and other who are in the upper echelon. I don't know if you edit players, but to move a player like Gaborik up to 90 overall means many of his offensive attributes need to be moved up.

I agree that across the board, players are overrated. But, until those overalls are brought down across the board, then we need to give those players who deserve a higher rating so they are comparative to those around him.

If you don't agree, it's no skin off my back. To each their own...

[Steve Danger]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Yeah, that was me you're talking about there. I agree with your assessment, I was merely pointing out that he needs to be in the same realm as Claude Giroux and other who are in the upper echelon. I don't know if you edit players, but to move a player like Gaborik up to 90 overall means many of his offensive attributes need to be moved up.

I agree that across the board, players are overrated. But, until those overalls are brought down across the board, then we need to give those players who deserve a higher rating so they are comparative to those around him.

If you don't agree, it's no skin off my back. To each their own...

Nope, I agree 100%. As I said before, overall ratings are relative. They only mean something when there are other ratings to compare them to.

I'm glad you guys so far have agreed that players, on a whole, are overrated in this game. Again, it's all relative. If EA made 90 passing less accurate than it is then it would still be 90, blah blah blah, I'm sure you get what I'm saying. As it stands, a player having 90 passing means he will never miss a pass, ever. That's dumb. Henrik Sedin is one of the best passers in the league and he doesn't connect on all of his, not by a long shot. Therefore, individual attribute ratings need to be brought down.

There also needs to remain superstars in the game, so an across the board reduction wouldn't work, in my opinion. A superstar would be like any other player, he excels in a few different areas, only the superstar is even better at those things. Henrik Sedin, for instance, would keep a very high pass rating (in relation to other ratings throughout the game, of course). His balance would be high as would his offensive awareness. Where he's not so good is at things like shot blocking, hitting and aggression. Those would need to come down, way down, but in this game it seems the developers artificially inflated NHL players' attributes just to get their overall rating higher.

Furthermore, there are role players who may not be superstars or even stars, but they excel in one or two certain areas. Staying with the Canucks lets talk about Manny Malhotra. His faceoff stat would be high. As would his defensive awareness (still not as high as, say, Pavel Datsyuk). That's where he excels. His skating, shooting, deking, passing, all that stuff would be low. His overall rating would be pretty low but that doesn't matter, what matters is the stuff he's good at is rated correctly. Using him in a game you wouldn't put him on a powerplay or on a top offensive line anyway, you would work to his strengths.

And yes, matt, I'd be glad to help. I've already come up with a kind of formula for changing a player's ratings but I would certainly love some input on it.

[mattg123]

Nope, I agree 100%. As I said before, overall ratings are relative. They only mean something when there are other ratings to compare them to.

I'm glad you guys so far have agreed that players, on a whole, are overrated in this game. Again, it's all relative. If EA made 90 passing less accurate than it is then it would still be 90, blah blah blah, I'm sure you get what I'm saying. As it stands, a player having 90 passing means he will never miss a pass, ever. That's dumb. Henrik Sedin is one of the best passers in the league and he doesn't connect on all of his, not by a long shot. Therefore, individual attribute ratings need to be brought down.

There also needs to remain superstars in the game, so an across the board reduction wouldn't work, in my opinion. A superstar would be like any other player, he excels in a few different areas, only the superstar is even better at those things. Henrik Sedin, for instance, would keep a very high pass rating (in relation to other ratings throughout the game, of course). His balance would be high as would his offensive awareness. Where he's not so good is at things like shot blocking, hitting and aggression. Those would need to come down, way down, but in this game it seems the developers artificially inflated NHL players' attributes just to get their overall rating higher.

Furthermore, there are role players who may not be superstars or even stars, but they excel in one or two certain areas. Staying with the Canucks lets talk about Manny Malhotra. His faceoff stat would be high. As would his defensive awareness (still not as high as, say, Pavel Datsyuk). That's where he excels. His skating, shooting, deking, passing, all that stuff would be low. His overall rating would be pretty low but that doesn't matter, what matters is the stuff he's good at is rated correctly. Using him in a game you wouldn't put him on a powerplay or on a top offensive line anyway, you would work to his strengths.

And yes, matt, I'd be glad to help. I've already come up with a kind of formula for changing a player's ratings but I would certainly love some input on it.

Sounds good I will send u off the roster next when I get it back

[AngelPingu]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Nope, I agree 100%. As I said before, overall ratings are relative. They only mean something when there are other ratings to compare them to.

I'm glad you guys so far have agreed that players, on a whole, are overrated in this game. Again, it's all relative. If EA made 90 passing less accurate than it is then it would still be 90, blah blah blah, I'm sure you get what I'm saying. As it stands, a player having 90 passing means he will never miss a pass, ever. That's dumb. Henrik Sedin is one of the best passers in the league and he doesn't connect on all of his, not by a long shot. Therefore, individual attribute ratings need to be brought down.

There also needs to remain superstars in the game, so an across the board reduction wouldn't work, in my opinion. A superstar would be like any other player, he excels in a few different areas, only the superstar is even better at those things. Henrik Sedin, for instance, would keep a very high pass rating (in relation to other ratings throughout the game, of course). His balance would be high as would his offensive awareness. Where he's not so good is at things like shot blocking, hitting and aggression. Those would need to come down, way down, but in this game it seems the developers artificially inflated NHL players' attributes just to get their overall rating higher.

Furthermore, there are role players who may not be superstars or even stars, but they excel in one or two certain areas. Staying with the Canucks lets talk about Manny Malhotra. His faceoff stat would be high. As would his defensive awareness (still not as high as, say, Pavel Datsyuk). That's where he excels. His skating, shooting, deking, passing, all that stuff would be low. His overall rating would be pretty low but that doesn't matter, what matters is the stuff he's good at is rated correctly. Using him in a game you wouldn't put him on a powerplay or on a top offensive line anyway, you would work to his strengths.

And yes, matt, I'd be glad to help. I've already come up with a kind of formula for changing a player's ratings but I would certainly love some input on it.

As much as I agree with what you're saying, doing such things would simply **** up Be a GM mode. The reason is simple : EA made the game so that the prospects can grow and progress each after year. So, you'll see a bunch of prospect getting grades like A B B or even A A- A- even if they had B's or B-'s everywhere - The contrary happens too -. That means that these players will probably get in the high 90s in their attributes when at their peak, therefore becoming way, way better than the players you might have edited.
I tried something similar with my rosters. I made players like Crosby only 92, and Hall was just a 83 B- C B-, which should've make him around 87-88 at his peak - the same level as players like Parise or Marleau. I then launched a franchise, and within a few years, great middle-aged (26-30) players nowadays (Perry, Getzlaf, Parise, Semin, etc.) had a tough time finding a spot on a 1st line, and sometimes, on the 3rd line.
That's the consequences of a poorly thought system. If I were EA, I would've made the game so that good players like Crosby would only be 83-85, but it's too late. To keep with the way the game is built, you have to keep the Sedins around 92-93 if you want the game to be realistic. It only takes a few years to see a bunch of prospects develop to get around the 90s...

[mattg123]

As much as I agree with what you're saying, doing such things would simply **** up Be a GM mode. The reason is simple : EA made the game so that the prospects can grow and progress each after year. So, you'll see a bunch of prospect getting grades like A B B or even A A- A- even if they had B's or B-'s everywhere - The contrary happens too -. That means that these players will probably get in the high 90s in their attributes when at their peak, therefore becoming way, way better than the players you might have edited.
I tried something similar with my rosters. I made players like Crosby only 92, and Hall was just a 83 B- C B-, which should've make him around 87-88 at his peak - the same level as players like Parise or Marleau. I then launched a franchise, and within a few years, great middle-aged (26-30) players nowadays (Perry, Getzlaf, Parise, Semin, etc.) had a tough time finding a spot on a 1st line, and sometimes, on the 3rd line.
That's the consequences of a poorly thought system. If I were EA, I would've made the game so that good players like Crosby would only be 83-85, but it's too late. To keep with the way the game is built, you have to keep the Sedins around 92-93 if you want the game to be realistic. It only takes a few years to see a bunch of prospects develop to get around the 90s...

Like I said once we get to 1.0 update. We can do a side project with this. So we have 2 rosters going. Plus maybe chl players would need changed too which equals a lot of work but maybe danger can help in a BIG way

[mattg123]

Guys who wana to help make caps. No replies so far!

[Steve Danger]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Like I said once we get to 1.0 update. We can do a side project with this. So we have 2 rosters going. Plus maybe chl players would need changed too which equals a lot of work but maybe danger can help in a BIG way

If we go with the attribute edits like I've suggested it would mean editing every single player in the game in a similar way. NHL players get edited down a certain amount, AHL get edited down a certain amount and junior players get edited down even more. If everything is moved down relative to everything else then everyone should progress at the same rate, no? For instance, and I'm just pulling numbers out of my butt right now to make a point, but say a junior player has a rating of 70 for passing. His offensive potential is A and in 3 years his rating will rise by 10. So now it's 80. If we edit him down to 60, theory is in 3 years he'll hit 70.

The example mentioned of Crosby should only be 85 doesn't make a difference if the attritbute ratings are implemented properly. A player can be a 95 if EA made the ratings a little tamer. The editing I'm suggesting is simply (or not so simply) a way to counter attack the broken sliders and ultra-boosted skills the ratings give a player.

The game considers a 90 pass rating as someone who never ever misses a pass. The game considers a 70 pass rating as someone who makes mistakes while passing. As an example, if we capped passing at 80 so that no player in the game can go above that, we can assure great passers are still great but will make mistakes, and those who aren't great passers suffer noticeably for it.

Anyway, this is all a theory. I think it will work but a good point is brought up with the BaGM comment. Maybe the game will screw up everything we try, I don't know. An easier fix would be if EA actually made sliders that worked.

[AngelPingu]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

If we go with the attribute edits like I've suggested it would mean editing every single player in the game in a similar way. NHL players get edited down a certain amount, AHL get edited down a certain amount and junior players get edited down even more. If everything is moved down relative to everything else then everyone should progress at the same rate, no? For instance, and I'm just pulling numbers out of my butt right now to make a point, but say a junior player has a rating of 70 for passing. His offensive potential is A and in 3 years his rating will rise by 10. So now it's 80. If we edit him down to 60, theory is in 3 years he'll hit 70.

The example mentioned of Crosby should only be 85 doesn't make a difference if the attritbute ratings are implemented properly. A player can be a 95 if EA made the ratings a little tamer. The editing I'm suggesting is simply (or not so simply) a way to counter attack the broken sliders and ultra-boosted skills the ratings give a player.

The game considers a 90 pass rating as someone who never ever misses a pass. The game considers a 70 pass rating as someone who makes mistakes while passing. As an example, if we capped passing at 80 so that no player in the game can go above that, we can assure great passers are still great but will make mistakes, and those who aren't great passers suffer noticeably for it.

Anyway, this is all a theory. I think it will work but a good point is brought up with the BaGM comment. Maybe the game will screw up everything we try, I don't know. An easier fix would be if EA actually made sliders that worked.

This might work with the players already in game, although I'm still sceptic.
I've seen plenty of players drafted with a rating of 67 and B's everywhere get around 85. Sure if you make him so that he only has A C C potential, it might work and he could get around 80. But then, you have to consider that after any year, his potential could go up to A B- B-, then A B B, then A A- B before dropping, which would make him a 88 overall player with godlike offensive attributes.
Also, I'm sure that a higher potential means more experience for the player during the offseason that the AI distributes in his stats. If it works that way, then a A potential with an attribute of 60 will grow more (In term of difference) than the same potential but an attribute of 70.
Finally, like I said, it might work for the players in game, but it must not be forgotten that the game CREATES players for the draft, and I don't think they're created using the other players in the game to determine their attributes and potential. If the players created were clones, like in EHM, this would work, but the way they're created, which looks very random, would not fit with such rosters. I've drafted franchise players that had 90+ everywhere in the offensive categorie, for instance. Or players that are 75 overall with A- A- A- potential.
Anyways, like Matt said, there could be 2 rosters, one for Be a GM and one for playing exhibition games with friends. But is the work really worth it, when this issue could probably adressed by tweaking the sliders ?

[porky14]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

Matt, why don't U copy Goalie gear from 2nd Xbox update to PS3

[mattg123]

Matt, why don't U copy Goalie gear from 2nd Xbox update to PS3

Goalie is done for ps3 I just haven't released it yet. Other work still in progress

[AngelPingu]

Re: NHL 12 Ultimate Comeback Roster 1.0 for PS3

By the way Matt, I could do some CAPs, but I prefer to wait until all the players already in the game are fully edited for comparison though (NHL, CHL, SEL, SML, etc). Also, I can't make more than 5 caps per day because it makes me feel so bored. It takes a lot of time and it's not something that is really fun to do. I have a list of players I want to make though, which I think is complete, but could be better. Tell me (By PM preferably) when I can start if you don't mind me doing just a few at a time. I don't want to make sure all the equipment is correct for every single CAP though, I suck at recognizing everything from picture. Anyways, here's my list, if you have any suggestions, feel free.
http://tinyurl.com/nhl12capslist
(Heights are in cm and weights in kg... don't blame me for being french )
Oh, and I don't have a lot of knowledge about any of the listed players though. I search for quick scouting reports and comparisons when making them, so I don't know if that's an issue.