Neil Young - Living With War

[Jackdog]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I have never agreed with you more. Damn Jimmy Buffett and his "pro-margerita, pro-cheeseburger" platform he's forcing down my throat. Same with the Beach Boys and their obvious bias toward "California Girls", as if "Montana Girls" aren't equally worthy of praise(if they don't have sufficent info on the girls of EVERY state, they are incapable of writing about ANY state's girls). Ditto Van Morrison. Keep your damn opinions about what constitutes a favorable eye color for women and just entertain me. Beatles, why should I HAVE to "Let It Be"?!?!? Perhaps I don't want to let it be, I want to make a change. Van Halen, why "Jump" and go to "Panama" when I could just as easily sit in Miami? Damn all of you for having opinions that are reflected in songs you wrote.

[roadman]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

What about Al Franken and his Air America family or Keith Oberman? Does your question only apply to people on the "Right"?

No, your right, I should have included Franken. I don't know enough about Oberman , but I get the point.

[SportsTop]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

Not trying to "debate", just trying to make sure I have this straight:

1. You dislike a "blind sheep" mentality, correct?

2. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a "sheep" or "blind sheep" could be described/defined as-A group of people/ a person who lacks the capacity for careful consideration, imagination, or individual thought, who thusly go with group

and/or

mindless following and proliferation of a popularly espoused thought, without personal determination/stance

3. It is a good thing if people deny an individual determination/stance for the sake of an outer display of unity, and here's the kicker-"good OR bad"

4. Again, you dislike a SHEEP mentality-to the point where you mock another poster for having one?

I can only assume you forgot to include some steps in your reasoning, so please, clarify.

Unless, wait....are all sheep created equal, or is there a sheep hierarchy? Are some herds better than others?

Damn, logic is pesky.

I'll close my discussion on this topic stating this:

A lot of you don't even know what you don't know. It isn't your fault, but that's just the way it is and you and the country are probably better off for it.

Sometimes I envy how blind some people are (by choice or not) and wished I lived in your euphoric world. In the end though, I'd rather be armed with all the information and make an educated decision, rather than being fed snippets of information and led to believe things a certain way.

[Silverstring]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I'll close my discussion on this topic stating this:

A lot of you don't even know what you don't know. It isn't your fault, but that's just the way it is and you and the country are probably better off for it.

Sometimes I envy how blind some people are (by choice or not) and wished I lived in your euphoric world. In the end though, I'd rather be armed with all the information and make an educated decision, rather than being fed snippets of information and led to believe things a certain way.

This non-answer speaks for itself. Thank you.

[Skerik]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

This non-answer speaks for itself. Thank you.

Thank you for not disappointing me in this thread. Like a moth to a flame.... :y4:

[Jackdog]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I'll close my discussion on this topic stating this:

A lot of you don't even know what you don't know. It isn't your fault, but that's just the way it is and you and the country are probably better off for it.

Sometimes I envy how blind some people are (by choice or not) and wished I lived in your euphoric world. In the end though, I'd rather be armed with all the information and make an educated decision, rather than being fed snippets of information and led to believe things a certain way.

I know where you have been and I understand and agree with your point.

[Silverstring]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

Thank you for not disappointing me in this thread. Like a moth to a flame.... :y4:

Sue me, I'm attracted to a complete lack of logic and reason, and when people fail to flesh out THEIR VERY OWN POINT.

I'm sure glad we didn't have too many midsets like these when the first settlers came to America.

"Why leave England? We don't have all the information! I'm SURE they have our best interests at heart! Yeah guys, if we show dissent, it doesn't say much for our UNITY, does it?"

Another thing: I don't know where you "came from", but EVERY experience has a filter. It's the non-sheep that try to cut through the wool.

Back on topic, perhaps the new Neil Young record is good, perhaps it is not. I will still listen to it, because I don't believe insulating yourself from a multiplicity of perspectives is a way to gain understanding.

[p2xgamers]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

Before this gets locked...

I agree with Squint and Sherik in a small way. I think majority of entertainers don't know anything about politics (except I have to give props to George Clooney, he has gone there and he has researched the Sudan situation, he knows what he is talking about) and usually just go by there political party when they speak (democrat? hate on republican president, republican? hate on democrat president) and really don't know what they are talking about.

However the whole thing basically that they should not say this stuff in "a time of war" is going way over, thats a little too much. They have there first amendment right and unless they go overboard I could careless, I just think most of them should research and do something like Clooney where they go there (ex. Iraq) before they speak.

I could go on specifically about Niel young but I don't want to get that political. (since this topic will be locked soon)

[Silverstring]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I think the problem is that people AUTOMATICALLY write off entertainers, as if it's IMPOSSIBLE for them to be informed.

Regardless if they are or not, I don't look to them to be "leaders", nor do I hold them up as examples. I make my own opinion. However, that dosen't mean they can't add their voice to the discussion.

[SportsTop]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I think the problem is that people AUTOMATICALLY write off entertainers, as if it's IMPOSSIBLE for them to be informed.

Regardless if they are or not, I don't look to them to be "leaders", nor do I hold them up as examples. I make my own opinion. However, that dosen't mean they can't add their voice to the discussion.

It's the irresponsibility of doing so when their opinion is formed without all the facts.

And believe me, no "entertainer" ever has all the facts.

[p2xgamers]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

I think the problem is that people AUTOMATICALLY write off entertainers, as if it's IMPOSSIBLE for them to be informed.

Regardless if they are or not, I don't look to them to be "leaders", nor do I hold them up as examples. I make my own opinion. However, that dosen't mean they can't add their voice to the discussion.

Aside from a select few I can't see many that are actually educated. Without going into it look at Charlie Sheen.

Like I said though, they have there first amendment right to do so.

[Fresh Tendrils]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

It's the irresponsibility of doing so when their opinion is formed without all the facts.

And believe me, no "entertainer" ever has all the facts.

Aside from yourself and the leaders of this country, who has all the facts? Since none of us normal citizens know the "facts", we're all blind, irresponsible citizens, so why can us normal joes voice our opinions and try to influence as many people as we can, yet entertainers cannot. This whole mindset of bar-none unity is hilarious to me. We have rights, but as the old adage goes "say something nice, or don't say anything all." Without dissidents, where would this nation be. 150 years of equal rights campaigning would go down the toilets. Perhaps the reason why so many people don't know the facts is because our leaders hide them as best as they can from us. Our leaders try to paint us out to be some dumb hillybilly, slack-jawed yokels who are better left in the dark than knowing what those elected officials are doing. They're working for us, we shoud know what the hell they're doing. When the rare time comes when a "fact" is revealed, there's so much damn lawyerspeak invovled that you would have major in literary-analysis to understand it. From the words of John Lennon

I’m sick and tired of hearing things
From uptight, short-sighted, narrow-minded hypocritics
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
I’ve had enough of reading things
By neurotic, psychotic, pig-headed politicians
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth

[BGarrett7]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

That isn't (and won't ever be) the case, so we'll never know.

Like I stated before, there is something to be said about showing unity and solidarity as a nation ESPECIALLY during a time of war.

But there are pro-Bush and pro-war songs and albums out there. Thus nullifying your argument that "that isn't the case." Look at someone like Toby Keith, who is a huge supporter of both Bush and the war, that has written an entire album's worth of material which voice his opinion on how things currently are in our country.

Is it "weak" that he is "using his celebrity" to "force [his] political views/beliefs" on me?

[BGarrett7]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

Sometimes I envy how blind some people are (by choice or not) and wished I lived in your euphoric world. In the end though, I'd rather be armed with all the information and make an educated decision, rather than being fed snippets of information and led to believe things a certain way.

So, because we aren't hypocrites when it comes to what artists are allowed to voice their opinion on, we are "blind"? Yeah, that seems like a totally fair, unbiased assessment.

To take this in another direction, however, I would like to throw out a question to the rest of the gallery, not just Squint:

Do you have to share an artist's beliefs in order to enjoy a work in which they are expressing their viewpoint? Are enjoyment of a work and belief in what is being expressed exclusive, or can they co-exist seperately? Would it be acceptable for a Neil Young fan to enjoy and support this release, even if they had a differing opinion on the matter of content?

[TimmeH]

Re: Neil Young - Living With War

Do you have to share an artist's beliefs in order to enjoy a work in which they are expressing their viewpoint? Are enjoyment of a work and belief in what is being expressed exclusive, or can they co-exist seperately? Would it be acceptable for a Neil Young fan to enjoy and support this release, even if they had a differing opinion on the matter of content?

Good question.

I wouldn't say it's necessary to share the same belief as the artist, however I do tend to enjoy music that I can relate to or agree with more than music that I don't. And in the same sense, if a song is about something that I'm completely against or don't agree with, I think I'm alot less likely to listen to it.

In alot of ways, I think the music I listen to is a representation of myself(with the exceptions of a few songs which I think are just fun to listen to), which is probably why I care about what the songs I listen to mean.