The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Just read his stuff on Wikipedia, he would be perfect!

[wwharton]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Jonah has even stated Dent/Two-Face is dead.

If Two-Face does come back in the next film, I think it takes away a lot from the closing of The Dark Knight as it would make a lot of things pointless.

I don't know man, I've seen A LOT of movies... and A LOT of sequels, lol. I think you guys are overestimating things a bit. A stretch on realism? Batman was shot in the gut and had the same fall but got up and walked away? 2face was fine with 75% of his face removed and the other 25% just chillin out in the elements? I could go on. These type of movies are about stretching reality. Can't be too much of a stickler on one little element of it with no visual evidence of a broken neck or even him getting an autopsy or something. Hell it's a movie... usually when they want a villain to stay dead they blow em up or shoot him 100 times or have him fall on an object that sticks through his body. This was too convenient and simple for it to be 100% that he's dead just b/c the commissioner said he was dead.

[jmood88]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Well Batman had bulletproof armor on which would explain the shot to the stomach.

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Well Batman had bulletproof armor on which would explain the shot to the stomach.

I do recall Fox saying with the new lightweight suit he is now penetrable to bullets, though I'm sure there's still some cushioning the blow under that suit.

As for the fall... I used to be a pretty intense skater. I attempted to ollie a five foot wide gap with about an eight foot drop. Well I fell short enough for my nose to hit the ledge and my trucks/wheels to create impact, I flew forward and my hands broke my fall, but fell off to the right and dooown I go. Break my fall with the right side of my body. I got up, no problems. Sure it hurt, but no bumps, bruises, or battle scars. Stupidly enough I did it again, but thankfully I nailed it. Well then there was a time when I idolized Rodney Mullen so much that I tried to replicate his tricks. So I tried to flip into a primo, but hit the edge of the board too hard with my heel. I inflamed my bursa sac and was "out" for over two months.


These aren't even close to being comparable mishaps, so why does the last one result in a worse injury? It's just the way you fall. If not that, it's just the luck of the draw. Supposedly Dent snapped his neck on the way down, and Batman probably fell on his legs or back just the right way. I fell on my back just the right way once when I was six years old and climbing a tree. I was at least up to the height of the second story of my house (which I was right next to). I tried to swing on a small twig, it snapped, and down I went and onto dirt on my backside. I cried and it was painful, but again... no real injuries, especially death.

[Beantown]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

I do recall Fox saying with the new lightweight suit he is now penetrable to bullets, though I'm sure there's still some cushioning the blow under that suit.

Fox actually said that there were open spots where the armor was not connected - since he split it up to make it lighter and more flexible - that were open to bullet fire, but the actual armor itself was still bullet-proof.

[Salhus]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Seen the film 6 times, but I still have some questions. Here's is just one: Fox did resign? He claimed that as long as the "sonar machine" was at Wayne Inc. he wouldn't be. I know he typed his name in, but I thought I saw the computers sparking and apparently broken when Fox was walking out (with a smile on his face). Am I right? Or wrong?

[jmood88]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

I do recall Fox saying with the new lightweight suit he is now penetrable to bullets.

Nah he didn't say that. It's more vulnerable to bullets and knives because there are individual plates instead of one already put together suit.

[dossier]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Nah he didn't say that. It's more vulnerable to bullets and knives because there are individual plates instead of one already put together suit.

Im pretty sure your wrong jmood as I remember the exact same thing Longhorn said

[Beantown]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Im pretty sure your wrong jmood as I remember the exact same thing Longhorn said

...

I said the same thing as JMood, in just more words.

[Fresh Tendrils]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Seen the film 6 times, but I still have some questions. Here's is just one: Fox did resign? He claimed that as long as the "sonar machine" was at Wayne Inc. he wouldn't be. I know he typed his name in, but I thought I saw the computers sparking and apparently broken when Fox was walking out (with a smile on his face). Am I right? Or wrong?

The machine was destroyed so Fox didn't resign.

[wwharton]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Well Batman had bulletproof armor on which would explain the shot to the stomach.

As mentioned, Fox said that the new suit was more vulnerable to bullets and knives. In true movie fashion, I'm sure that was significant to a later scene of him wearing it and then getting shot. I'm pretty sure he was actually shot too as earlier scenes had bullets bouncing off of him without even a flinch but this one had him grabbing his stomach and collapsing... I'm pretty sure he was holding the wound when he got up after the fall too.

I do recall Fox saying with the new lightweight suit he is now penetrable to bullets, though I'm sure there's still some cushioning the blow under that suit.

As for the fall... I used to be a pretty intense skater. I attempted to ollie a five foot wide gap with about an eight foot drop. Well I fell short enough for my nose to hit the ledge and my trucks/wheels to create impact, I flew forward and my hands broke my fall, but fell off to the right and dooown I go. Break my fall with the right side of my body. I got up, no problems. Sure it hurt, but no bumps, bruises, or battle scars. Stupidly enough I did it again, but thankfully I nailed it. Well then there was a time when I idolized Rodney Mullen so much that I tried to replicate his tricks. So I tried to flip into a primo, but hit the edge of the board too hard with my heel. I inflamed my bursa sac and was "out" for over two months.


These aren't even close to being comparable mishaps, so why does the last one result in a worse injury? It's just the way you fall. If not that, it's just the luck of the draw. Supposedly Dent snapped his neck on the way down, and Batman probably fell on his legs or back just the right way. I fell on my back just the right way once when I was six years old and climbing a tree. I was at least up to the height of the second story of my house (which I was right next to). I tried to swing on a small twig, it snapped, and down I went and onto dirt on my backside. I cried and it was painful, but again... no real injuries, especially death.

My real point about the shot, the fall, etc. is that there are plenty of explanations for why Batman can be alive and Dent dead... even real life explanations, but you don't seem to want to consider the alternatives for 2face still being alive, whether realistic or not. It was never said that his neck was broken in the movie, that's in the script when read and probably a thought of Commissioner Gordon. In a movie put together so well, I'd think it'd be clearer exactly how he's dead. Watching super hero shows, movies, reading comics, etc. this ending is pretty much in line with the idea that the villain may resurface at some point and not really be dead like we're lead to believe.

I haven't followed the Batman story of comics and graphic novels for some time now, but I'm pretty sure it's in line with that too as everyone thinks Dent is dead but Batman who runs into him occasionally, and battles with the thought of having to take him down b/c of the amount of respect he once had for him.

[jmood88]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

As mentioned, Fox said that the new suit was more vulnerable to bullets and knives. In true movie fashion, I'm sure that was significant to a later scene of him wearing it and then getting shot. I'm pretty sure he was actually shot too as earlier scenes had bullets bouncing off of him without even a flinch but this one had him grabbing his stomach and collapsing... I'm pretty sure he was holding the wound when he got up after the fall too.

More vulnerable because of the seperate parts. Even if someone is wearing a bulletproof vest they will still feel a gunshot, especially if it's from point blank range. He wasn't bleeding after the shot he just fell down.

[dossier]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

my bad jmood I read it wrong.

In the actual comics, how did Gotham react to Dent becoming a villain?

[wwharton]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

More vulnerable because of the seperate parts. Even if someone is wearing a bulletproof vest they will still feel a gunshot, especially if it's from point blank range. He wasn't bleeding after the shot he just fell down.

He may have been, bottom line is he was fine... or at least good enough to take a bad fall afterwards, get up and run away. Not really trying to argue the specifics of the scene, but that it's very possible that 2face is alive. It's possible that he's dead too, but based on the lack of explanation in the movie, history of these type of things, etc. I'd be disappointed if he were dead. I'd say a bit anticlimactic considering the detail put into all other areas of the movie and how long it already was. Hell, it was never even actually said in the movie that he was dead... definitely not that he broke his neck on the fall. And the fall didn't make it obvious that he landed in a way in which his neck would've been broken.

I'm playing devil's advocate a bit with blzr's explanation, but I really can't imagine them leaving so many holes in the ending scene... but I'm also considering how close the entire thing seems to try to play to the comic and not from a stand alone movie perspective (in which case I'd be disappointed that they just dropped him a few stories and called it a day).

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

I understand what you're saying, wwharton... that Dent is dead and Two-Face is alive. But in Nolan's batuniverse as I'll call it, I can't see the figurative sense becoming a reality, if that makes sense.