The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

How big a TV are you watching these movies on, Blzer?

Very small.

TV: Samsung LN-T2353H 32" LCD
Audio: Samsung HT-AS720S HTiB w/ HDMI input

Like I said, maybe I'm a picky person, or maybe I just have that "eye," but even on my screen, these things are simply noticeable. Wanted looks reference, Cloverfield sounds reference... The Dark Knight looks and sounds terrific (sounds better than it looks), and while I think sound may actually be reference, it's more or less front-heavy and dialogue among actors is inconsistent (nobody's fault, just the way they had to capture their voices I guess, especially). The video, however, leaves much to be desired.

Don't take my word for it, see for yourself. I'll see if there are any screen captures online for proof.


EDIT: Let's keep something in mind: this is my favorite movie. Ever. I am not about to put it down because of some pre-conceived agenda I have set out for Nolan or Warner (though, after seeing what they did to the Ocean's series and The Matrix, I now know that they always seem to tweak the transfers somehow in a way that most don't necessarily approve). I want for this movie to look as good as they have invested in it already. This is the biggest movie of the millennium, and for it to not look the part on Blu-ray is inexcusable. It should at least be on par with something like Wanted, which it is not.

Oh well, I'm getting this for Christmas, and I'm renting it tonight at midnight as well. I love the movie to death, but you can't say that it's reference material when you have Apple trailers as proof that it's not (again, not in the colorization, since they normally do change for theatrical release after the trailers are first released).

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Okay, here are a few good examples:










I mean look at the cop:










If that's not daunting, I don't know what is (I'm referring to the halos).






Some more:









Look at the halo under the table.











You see, here, the Joker's face has this "muddy" look, lacking in definition. Compare that to The Prestige:







All of Nolan's movies have a soft look to it, and this looks much more like it was originally intended. The extra sharpening in the other shots give it a processing look that is undesirable IMO.




If you think these are just bad screen grabs, these are the same screen grabs that were used for the following IMAX shots. Just look how much better they get:













And of course, compared to the BB prologue intro:
































I'm being picky, yes... but when reviewing Blu-ray titles, being picky is a must. It's a technological thing that, I believe, all transfers should be 100% from the original source, as the director initially intended it to look. Anything extra removes detail from the picture.

When I think of the term reference, I don't think beautiful looking, I think there weren't any alterations from its original form. This had alterations, this is not reference.

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

This one here is another person's screen-grab, so his colors are different. But he shows a good example of the transformation from the original look of the movie (seen from the Apple trailers), and how a bit of contrasting and edge-sharpening makes it look exactly like the Blu-ray, also proving that it is non-reference material:




Original Apple trailer shot:






After contrast increase:






After unsharp mask:






Now compared to the Blu-ray:








Quite the same, and it's very tough on the eyes.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

What the f... Geono... CANDYMAN?!





Anyway, I'd say it's far from reference. I'm no reviewer like you are and I just jumped into Blu-ray, but, though I'm not a fan of Wanted, I managed to see the Blu-ray, and that's reference material. Perfect digital transfer. The Dark Knight has many halos, especially with darks against whites. I haven't seen it in a few days now, but from what I remember, wide shots were the worst (the 35 mm ones, at least).

Take a look at the scene where the mayor is speaking for the death of the commissioner. Then compare it to the Apple trailers that we got of that same shot. Not really the color difference, but the halos all over.

There is also some bad DNR as well. Look when the Joker crashes Wayne's party, and his face is simply a smearfest. That, compared to the trailer, is also quite different to keep it away from being "reference."

IMO, somebody at Warner just felt like all Blockbuster titles need to be "improved" with more "pop," but it really doesn't help the scenes that are trying to compare to the IMAX shots, which if you recall, I said are also the least bit EE'd as well. Watch the opening on the Batman Begins BD then watch TDK. You'll see what I mean. Either way, the IMAX shots are simply beautiful. The other shots are not only not reference, but they are inconsistent.


That is not to say this title looks great, but I think a re-release can make this looks superior... reference.

I'm questioning his TV and his sound system now.

highdefdigests's review.

Everyone that has seen this on BD and other reviewers I have talked to didn't have many bad things to say about this disc. I don't get why Blzer continues to look for issues in all product, LOL! The print is not perfect, but it is reference material. Those IMAX scenes are breathtaking. Even the darker scenes are well done with proper lighting which a lot of films can't get right so they end up looking bad in high definition.

I'm running my setup through a Panasonic BD35 with a 1080p 50' DLP using a Onkyo 606 which decodes both TrueHD/DTS-HD MA.

Blzer, not to sound like a jerk...........but please quit quoting others with some of the issues that you are finding. I've read many similar comments that you have posted here based off of comments others said on the SAW boards and now AVS.

[Candyman5]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Everyone that has seen this on BD and other reviewers I have talked to didn't have many bad things to say about this disc. I don't get why Blzer continues to look for issues in all product, LOL! The print is not perfect, but it is reference material. Those IMAX scenes are breathtaking. Even the darker scenes are well done with proper lighting which a lot of films can't get right so they end up looking bad in high definition.

I'm running my setup through a Panasonic BD35 with a 1080p 50' DLP using a Onkyo 606 which decodes both TrueHD/DTS-HD MA.

Blzer, not to sound like a jerk...........but please quit quoting others with some of the issues that you are finding. I've read many similar comments that you have posted here based off of comments others said on the SAW boards and now AVS.

Well hello there..... Whats ya been up to?

I am also getting this movie, dont know if I will get Blu-Ray or regular DVD. The movie itself is awsome but I dont have a HD TV yet. XD

[JohnnytheSkin]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Blzer, not to sound like a jerk...........but please quit quoting others with some of the issues that you are finding. I've read many similar comments that you have posted here based off of comments others said on the SAW boards and now AVS.

I was thinking the same thing. Many of those comments sounded very familiar.

I can't wait to watch this tomorrow night on my setup, should be fan-freakin-tastic!

[ezekiel55]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Blzer, I think your nitpicking a bit too much.

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Candyman, I saw this BD before reading a single review, and noticed these things myself. The only term I used similar to a member on AVS was "muddy," and I quoted it because it wasn't my term and I couldn't think of another way to put it. I haven't been reading posts in that thread before until this morning. As for Saw, all of my thoughts are just that, my thoughts. Those "similar" things that you read must either be coincidence or they are a continuation of something that I already posted. I don't steal thoughts to make myself look better, it's too easy to get caught on the Internet.

As I said, I grabbed those screen shots from elsewhere (which happen to be AVS). I've learned these terms through Wikipedia, and have been using them ever since I've been an avid Blu-ray watcher. Anything that I said that resembles something that has been said on AVS is pure coincidence, nothing more. I do not like to stoop down to plagiarism and I like to have my own thoughts. I went to Google, typed "the dark knight edge enhancement halos," and AVS came up with that thread. That's where I got the grabs as well as the term "muddy." Anything else from there is just a coincidence, as my buddy and I got to see this for ourselves.

And again, you and I may see the word "reference" differently. Reference, to me, means a direct, untouched transfer (Ratatouille comes to mind). I think the way you see "reference" is as "demo material," which TDK very well is. However, that doesn't mean that it can't look better.



And zekey, I know that I'm nitpicking, I've already pointed that out. But that's exactly what Blu-ray, as well as next-gen gaming, sets us up to do. We expect the best that it can possibly give us, and when it falls short, we tend to nitpick. Does the picture look good? It's absolutely gorgeous! However, can it look better? Oh, yes it surely can. The thing is, we sometimes blind ourselves into thinking that, without anything to compare to, it's the best that it can possibly be (we did so with DVDs, we're doing so with Blu-rays, etc.). I just hope that, someday, they re-release it with a different transfer. Until then, I will be completely satisfied with my Christmas gift and watching it every day the entire month following.

[Candyman5]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Candyman, I saw this BD before reading a single review, and noticed these things myself. The only term I used similar to a member on AVS was "muddy," and I quoted it because it wasn't my term and I couldn't think of another way to put it. I haven't been reading posts in that thread before until this morning. As for Saw, all of my thoughts are just that, my thoughts. Those "similar" things that you read must either be coincidence or they are a continuation of something that I already posted. I don't steal thoughts to make myself look better, it's too easy to get caught on the Internet.

Is this for the Candyman that used to be Candyman or the Candyman that still is his self? :wink:

[Kashanova]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Where did you happen to find it? As I said, my friend got it early from a site online (posted the page a few threads back). Did you find it in a retail store, or online?

Also, did you happen to notice some of the artifacting and processing looks on the 35 mm shots? Any noticeable edge-enhancement (like ringing or halo effects)?

FYE but I'm NYC

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Is this for the Candyman that used to be Candyman or the Candyman that still is his self? :wink:

I'm sorry, I meant Gears.

[jmood88]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

I'm questioning his TV and his sound system now.

highdefdigests's review.

He really watched it at a station that Best Buy set up.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

He really watched it at a station that Best Buy set up.

[Blzer]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

He really watched it at a station that Best Buy set up.

Good one, but not quite.

[bigfnjoe96]

Re: The Dark Knight Discussion **CONTAINS SPOILERS**

Though many including HDD give this title a perfect score for picture quality, the reality is Warner didn't do a great job with mixing the IMAX Scenes with the non-IMAX Scenes & chose to add EE & DNR to the process.

For the normal J6P that technique would go un-noticed, but for afficianado's like many here & over @ other sites it's very noticable.

Personally I think Warner did the best they could with the IMAX Scenes. I bet the authoring for this title was a P-I-T-A....