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  • TheMatrix31
    RF
    • Jul 2002
    • 52906

    #916
    re: Off-Topic

    Originally posted by kehlis
    I wouldn't necessarily consider it a red flag, you have to remember that recruiting generally has little to no wiggle room with offers and things they can do to entice the deal.

    It's not a surprise that she would have to check with someone to change what the offer is because generally they work with a set of guidelines that can be altered here and there but not drastically.
    Yeah, I'm sure they have certain parameters they have to work within. She's a senior vp so higher than recruiting though. But I know whatever they have to do they have to do. Was speaking more about the job title wishy-washy "confusion" stuff regarding the red flag comment.

    I guess if it sucks I can leave.

    Comment

    • Hooe
      Hall Of Fame
      • Aug 2002
      • 21554

      #917
      re: Off-Topic

      Had to read a few posts to get the whole story, forgive me if I missed anything.

      @Matrix - I'm probably stubborn in this regard, but my general philosophy is that if a company really wants you and they value what you bring to the table for a given position, that company will make some concrete effort to accommodate your concerns you bring up in response to a contract offer. That philosophy has served me reasonably well in the past.

      To me, it doesn't appear that this company is making much effort to alleviate your concerns at all. If I've caught up on your story correctly, this company has given you a job offer far below what you determined to be market value for your skill set and how well it fits the advertised position. This despite that the company has very clearly already determined that you are a good fit for the advertised position based on the fact that these negotiations are happening at all.

      If this potential new company won't yield an inch on your concerns, and also if you have the financial wherewithal to do so, I would strongly consider declining the offer and looking for a position at a firm which will demonstrate that they value what you bring to the table. Honestly, the fact that you applied for one position with a particular title and now your contact is downplaying that position description to push your salary lower bugs me a lot. You clearly applied for the original position and passed through interviews for the original position, so you should value your skill set at whatever value the original position is.

      At the very least: if you really need any career progression right this instant, just want to get the hell out of your current gig, or if this one you're negotiating with is your dream job, I'd push harder to get the additional vacation time in writing. Someone please correct me if I'm offering bad advice here, but I've been told in the past that negotiating better benefits is more palatable to firms than negotiating better salary. Also, absolutely do not bank on "promised" raises offered only in handshake agreements. I've been burned on those before. Even if you do take the job, I'd keep looking for new places to work.

      Comment

      • TheMatrix31
        RF
        • Jul 2002
        • 52906

        #918
        re: Off-Topic

        Originally posted by CM Hooe
        Had to read a few posts to get the whole story, forgive me if I missed anything.

        @Matrix - I'm probably stubborn in this regard, but my general philosophy is that if a company really wants you and they value what you bring to the table for a given position, that company will make some concrete effort to accommodate your concerns you bring up in response to a contract offer. That philosophy has served me reasonably well in the past.

        To me, it doesn't appear that this company is making much effort to alleviate your concerns at all. If I've caught up on your story correctly, this company has given you a job offer far below what you determined to be market value for your skill set and how well it fits the advertised position. This despite that the company has very clearly already determined that you are a good fit for the advertised position based on the fact that these negotiations are happening at all.

        If this potential new company won't yield an inch on your concerns, and also if you have the financial wherewithal to do so, I would strongly consider declining the offer and looking for a position at a firm which will demonstrate that they value what you bring to the table. Honestly, the fact that you applied for one position with a particular title and now your contact is downplaying that position description to push your salary lower bugs me a lot. You clearly applied for the original position and passed through interviews for the original position, so you should value your skill set at whatever value the original position is.

        At the very least: if you really need any career progression right this instant, just want to get the hell out of your current gig, or if this one you're negotiating with is your dream job, I'd push harder to get the additional vacation time in writing. Someone please correct me if I'm offering bad advice here, but I've been told in the past that negotiating better benefits is more palatable to firms than negotiating better salary. Also, absolutely do not bank on "promised" raises offered only in handshake agreements. I've been burned on those before. Even if you do take the job, I'd keep looking for new places to work.

        Thanks for the reply dude. The position title thing is weirder than what you described. The initial job listing was for an assistant level position. That's what I was assuming and that's the level I'm at right now so I felt comfortable with that. In the official job offer though, she put specialist. So I did my research based on that and that's what I countered based on because I don't want to leave money on the table if there's a "specialist" title involved, right? Then when she called today she said that she just put specialist in there as a bit of a boost for my sake since it's a new position but she didn't really put any science or data behind it and reiterated that it *is* more of an assistant-style position. If I accept the offer, I'll make sure that specialist is still the title involved so I can receive an added boost for other opportunities.

        It just rubs me the wrong way that there's this much confusion/aloofness and a total reluctance to budge and I'm trying to figure out if that's reflective of her or the company overall and whether it's a good place to work. I understand business and I realize that budgets are the way they are and rules are the way they are. I know that maybe they can't offer more money at all, despite what I countered. I said can't you at least bump a little bit just to make it more attractive to leave my job? I understand that even a "little bit" is still thousands of dollars to a company. She was basically saying "oh well we know you're pretty maxed out potential-wise at your current place so coupled with that and the slightly higher pay anyway and the inclusion of benefits we feel that's enough." And it is, really. But if they can change this thing on the fly, then what else can they change and be confused about and be ****ty about?

        If I accept the job, I'll of course make sure the "bonus structure" thing she mentioned is in the agreement before signing. There already is stuff about year-end bonuses and how they're given out but not necessarily guaranteed (of course) but I presume this "bonus structure" based on performance is something else entirely. And if she's able to make some of the days that will be unpaid for my upcoming already-scheduled vacations as paid days (she said she doesn't know if that's allowed because it could be preferential treatment given they detail vacation days for employees as a company-wide policy thing, but I've never heard of that being a barrier since people get extra vacation days as benefits all the time) then I'll be sure to put that in the agreement before signing as well.

        It's not that I need the job. I'm lucky enough to have a pretty good comfortable gig right now and I don't particularly want to leave, but I just feel like it's time to start having a real life. I would not be able to provide for any potential family of mine going forward on either the job I have right now nor this potential one, but this potential one just might allow me a better step up to do so in the future even if it's a total lowball ****show with way more responsibility than I have now. I'm just happy an offer came my way after quite a long while of nothing/bad luck derailing things, so I'm hesitant to let this one go and wait for something else a bit more.....coherent, you know? I'm still trying to weigh whether to go to my current boss and say hey look, there's this offer and I'm not planning on leaving and I'd like more responsibility here so how about I take on a couple more things here, start coming in with some structured hours, and a little bump in pay and just continue rolling with this until I find something else. Just don't know how dangerous that'd be. For what it's worth, my immediate boss thinks it's a good idea to talk to the main boss about this.
        Last edited by TheMatrix31; 05-08-2018, 06:02 AM.

        Comment

        • Speedy
          #Ace
          • Apr 2008
          • 16143

          #919
          re: Off-Topic

          Originally posted by CM Hooe
          Spoiler
          This is very sound advice. It is not best to go into a job thinking you should be at a higher level, be paid more or given better benefits because the chances are...you won't ever get into a spot that you feel you are properly compensated. That in turns means that when things get difficult at your job, you can't fall back on the "well, at least I get paid well" or "at least my benefits outweigh the bad" to somewhat even out the job...rather, dissatisfaction at your job will grow to the point you dread it.
          Originally posted by Gibson88
          Anyone who asked for an ETA is not being Master of their Domain.
          It's hard though...especially when I got my neighbor playing their franchise across the street...maybe I will occupy myself with Glamore Magazine.

          Comment

          • WaitTilNextYear
            Go Cubs Go
            • Mar 2013
            • 16830

            #920
            re: Off-Topic

            Originally posted by TheMatrix31
            It's not that I need the job. I'm lucky enough to have a pretty good comfortable gig right now and I don't particularly want to leave, but I just feel like it's time to start having a real life. I would not be able to provide for any potential family of mine going forward on either the job I have right now nor this potential one, but this potential one just might allow me a better step up to do so in the future even if it's a total lowball ****show with way more responsibility than I have now. I'm just happy an offer came my way after quite a long while of nothing/bad luck derailing things, so I'm hesitant to let this one go and wait for something else a bit more.....coherent, you know? I'm still trying to weigh whether to go to my current boss and say hey look, there's this offer and I'm not planning on leaving and I'd like more responsibility here so how about I take on a couple more things here, start coming in with some structured hours, and a little bump in pay and just continue rolling with this until I find something else. Just don't know how dangerous that'd be. For what it's worth, my immediate boss thinks it's a good idea to talk to the main boss about this.
            And if the main boss is amenable, then I think you would talk to Seung-Hwan Oh.
            Chicago Cubs | Chicago Bulls | Green Bay Packers | Michigan Wolverines

            Comment

            • TheMatrix31
              RF
              • Jul 2002
              • 52906

              #921
              re: Off-Topic

              Originally posted by WaitTilNextYear
              And if the main boss is amenable, then I think you would talk to Seung-Hwan Oh.
              Man, that guy was pretty disappointing. But he's gonna get another shot now with Osuna being punished.

              Comment

              • Scott
                Your Go-to TV Expert
                • Jul 2002
                • 20031

                #922
                re: Off-Topic

                So today we have the home inspection for the sale of the home. Hopefully everything goes well, since the house was only built 2 years ago...
                PSN-Shugarooo
                Steam-ScottM.816
                Twitch.tv/Shugarooo
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                Comment

                • Majingir
                  Moderator
                  • Apr 2005
                  • 47496

                  #923
                  re: Off-Topic

                  LOL, Best Buy changes their logo for the first time in almost 30 years.



                  Spoiler

                  Comment

                  • Caulfield
                    Hall Of Fame
                    • Apr 2011
                    • 10986

                    #924
                    re: Off-Topic

                    Originally posted by Majingir
                    LOL, Best Buy changes their logo for the first time in almost 30 years.



                    Spoiler
                    Would have garnered more attention if it was Best But.
                    OSFM23 - Building Better Baseball - OSFM23

                    A Work in Progress

                    Comment

                    • BurghFan
                      #BurghProud
                      • Jul 2009
                      • 10043

                      #925
                      re: Off-Topic

                      I give it 2 thumbs down
                      Steelers : IX, X, XIII, XIV, XL, XLIII
                      Penguins : 1990/91, 1991/92, 2008/09, 20015/16, 2016/17
                      Pirates : 1909, 1925, 1960, 1971, 1979
                      Panthers (FB): 1915, 1916, 1918, 1929, 1931, 1934, 1936, 1937, 1976
                      Panthers (MBB): 1927/28, 1929/30

                      Comment

                      • WaitTilNextYear
                        Go Cubs Go
                        • Mar 2013
                        • 16830

                        #926
                        re: Off-Topic

                        Originally posted by Majingir
                        LOL, Best Buy changes their logo for the first time in almost 30 years.



                        Spoiler
                        Dumb. Other than Scott selling the hell out of product in South Carolina, their logo might've been the best thing going for them.
                        Chicago Cubs | Chicago Bulls | Green Bay Packers | Michigan Wolverines

                        Comment

                        • TheShizNo1
                          Asst 2 the Comm Manager
                          • Mar 2007
                          • 26341

                          #927
                          re: Off-Topic

                          Originally posted by WaitTilNextYear
                          Dumb. Other than Scott selling the hell out of product in South Carolina, their logo might've been the best thing going for them.
                          *GCU

                          Sent from my SM-G950U using Operation Sports mobile app
                          Originally posted by Mo
                          Just once I'd like to be the one they call a jerk off.
                          Originally posted by Mo
                          You underestimate my laziness
                          Originally posted by Mo
                          **** ya


                          ...

                          Comment

                          • countryboy
                            Growing pains
                            • Sep 2003
                            • 52726

                            #928
                            re: Off-Topic

                            Not a fan of the new logo.
                            I can't shave with my eyes closed, meaning each day I have to look at myself in the mirror and respect who I see.

                            I miss the old days of Operation Sports :(


                            Louisville Cardinals/St.Louis Cardinals

                            Comment

                            • Fresh Tendrils
                              Strike Hard and Fade Away
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 36131

                              #929
                              re: Off-Topic

                              Power went out at the office yesterday after a tremendous storm. Boss sent us home with our laptops. Power is still out so I get to work from home today. A new experience here.



                              Comment

                              • jeremym480
                                Speak it into existence
                                • Oct 2008
                                • 18198

                                #930
                                re: Off-Topic

                                Originally posted by Fresh Tendrils
                                Power went out at the office yesterday after a tremendous storm. Boss sent us home with our laptops. Power is still out so I get to work from home today. A new experience here.
                                Here's a live look in at Fresh working from home.

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