M13 KILLER SLIDERS FOR OFFLINE CCM... GUARANTEED CPU RUN GAME

[Tigey75]

Just played a good game as the Ravens vs the Rams. The only problem I noticed was I had an incredibly tough time rushing. Couldn't run outside at all and inside I averaged 1-3 yards. Passing seems nice though, once in awhile robo QB reared his ugly head but the overall numbers were beautiful. I like this set though, maybe just some loosening up on the human run game is in order. Ps. I tried the "Barry sanders" change and still got slammed on every handoff.

Thanks wiz

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by deezyskillets

Wiz, I'm trying to figure out your logic. So from what I've understood so far from reading this thread is that, the reason for the CPU O-line holding on to their blocks for so long (in the run game)is that of the offsides slider? I don't understand why?!?! Wouldn't the offside slider affect them jumping offsides? Wouldn't the CPU run block slider affect the run blocking? What am I missing? Let's say I lower the point value of the CPU RUN Block slider. What else would that affect? I have a problem with the CPU D-linemen breaking off of their blocks as soon as the RB takes the hand off. Which ends up with me having a avg of 2.3 a touch. Also, with the CPU O-linemen they are literally stuck to my D-line/LBers. I noticed that everyone of my D-line was glued to the CPU O-line 5 yrds. after the run passes the line This is an all the time thing. In the pass game is pretty good. But, The CPU safeties seem dumb, even Troy paloblamblamblam. I am playing with Payton tho.... But I'm also pretty good at reading coverages. Which way the safeties roll, C3 , C2 , C4 and so on. I've been studying that itsh (coverages)for about three years. Because my pass game sucked in the past. Well, wiz, that's my concern. I'm going to stick with this sliders because I appreciate your hard work and your quick actions with all the labing you do. Pay another night so we can have this perfect sliders going!!!!! Nah j/k. Hold it down Wiz!!!

Thanks for the props peep....

Yeah the issue of the CPU running game around the tackles I am on.... I believe I know where the problem lies....

Let me see if I can give you guys a quick lesson on slider tuning 101 for the CPU run game....

The issue is that the CPU O-LINE cannot seal off the HUM DE's or pick up blocks on the second level LB's, thus causing the RB to run horizontally (ie. too wide) to avoid the DE or LB peeling off a block, at which point, the RB will be met by safeties or linebackers for a loss of yards...

Factors that impact this are:

1) HUM RUN REAC
2) HUM BLK SHED
3) Offsides penalty slider
4) Roughing the kicker penalty slider
5) CPU RUN BLK
6) CPU BRK TKL

1) The RUN REAC slider, controls when defenders can do an "insta-shed" of their block. This slider works on DT's on inside running plays and LBs and DEs on outside plays. What it "triggers" when set high is that the defender being blocked, will quickly shed their blocks as the RB initially gets the ball from the QB. With Reaction Time set high, defenders would break their blocks in a way that put them closest to the RB.

When set lower, defenders stay blocked until AFTER the RB passes them. With Reaction Time set high, defenders would break their blocks in a way that put them closest to the RB. When set low, defenders would have a hard time breaking out of blocks.
This slider highlights the following player attributes: AWR, PRC, BLOCK SHED and to some degree AGI, ACC and SPD


2) The BLK SHED SLIDER, controls how well defenders can beat blocks by using a rip or spin move away from the blocker blocking them. THIS IS NOT THE SAME ANIMATION OR ISSUE AS "INSTA-SHED" under RUN REAC SLIDER. Think of it this way, RUN REAC SLIDER controls the SPEED AT WHICH YOU SEPARATE from your blocker, in other words, how QUICKLY you lose a block. RUN REAC SLIDER starts the MOMENT THAT THE RB has the ball.... BLK SHED SLIDER IS NOT PREDICATED (ie triggered) by a timing mechanism that begins when the RB touches the ball... In other words BLK SHED, sheds blocks in a way that doesn't take into account of where the RB is relative to the line of scrimmage or being handed the ball. This slider causes a blocked defender to rip or spin off a blocker but not necessarily be in the hole or path of the RB.

This slider highlights the following player attributes: STRENGTH, POWER MOVE, FINESSE MOVE and to some degree POWER HIT and BLOCK SHED


3) OFFSIDE PENALTY SLIDER - If you set this sucker at 100, the D-line for both HUM and CPU can shed their blocks with a lot more ease... When you set this slider and RUN REAC, too high, you basically will not be able to do runs to the outside, since the blocked defenders will be able to shed their blocks with ease...

4) ROUGHING THE KICKER PENALTY SLIDER - This is one is a REAL GEM... And this is why "slider tuning" is actually part science, part an art form, part madness, part dumb luck, and certainly not just anybody can sit down and slide a few sub-sliders around and think that they are da sh1t.... In fact, I can say with relative certainty and confidence that the majority of the peeps (Vet slider tuners aside of course) that throw up a slider set this year, have NO CLUE what they are doing and are wasting the time of poor Maddenites that are looking for guidance on how to make M13 hum for them.... When you lower this penalty too much, it makes defenders MORE AGGRESSIVE in going after the ball carriers, again affecting the running game, number of fumbles off big hits, yada, yada, yada..

5) CPU RUN BLK - This slider controls the movement of the O-line.... By raising it high, the O-line "syncs" up, and the animation looks as if the O-line men move in unison / lock step together.... Set it high enough and you can see the O-line "surge" when the the ball is being run and creates more pancakes. When set low, you don't see any surge, and defensive linemen appear to have an easier time shedding the block when the RB gets close. This slider has a direct correlation with BRK TKL slider for the opposing defense and is a very loose complement to RUN REAC...

This slider highlights the following player attributes: RUN BLK, IMPACTBLOCK (the surge), AWR and to some degree STR, AGI, ACC, SPD

6) CPU BRK TKL - This slider controls how the RB breaks tackles and/or AVOIDS TACKLES (ie with stiff arms, juking, trucking, one-cuts to the hole, finding the edge, hurdling, etc). When set high, you will see the RB breaking more tackles through special moves like stiff arms and juking. DO NOT CONFUSE this animation with a RB breaking one-arm tackles, IT IS NOT THE SAME THING!!!! That animation is predicated by the opposing defenses tackling slider being TOO LOW...

This slider highlights the following player attributes: AWR, JUKE, TRUCK, BACK FIELD VISION (the one-cut and finding the edge attribute), and to some degree STR.


At this point you are probably asking yourself, "Why all the explanation Wiz?" Welllll, I want to make sure that you know that when you ask a question in this thread that asks for my logic, that YOU have the confidence in my talents and that you come away knowing that I know what I am doing and that there is a method to my MADDEN-NESS....

Now... getting back to your concern regarding the CPU running game.... How would YOU propose the problem be solved? And therein my son lies the rub... Solution to our "perfect game" require "mucho" tinkering under the hood.... Sometimes your tinkering is just right and sometimes it is back to the drawing board...

Ultimately what you will realize is that IT IS QUITE POSSIBLE that a perfect TRUE MADDEN SLIDER set is not realistic due to the limitations imposed by the "75 & Under" rule.... In other words, on the HUM side, you run out of "slider flexibility" to make the game "hummmmm" better.... And it is at this point that you have to make sacrifices and pick and choose what to try to perfect and what to just accept as is.... This MAY EXPLAIN WHY EA, POST PATCH, gave us an ALL-MADDEN setting of 350 units RATHER THAN the typical 300 units.... Just a thought....And based on this hunch, I built a CUSTOM ALL-MADDEN slider set where I kept the HUM sub sliders under 345 units, and let me tell you, that slider set has brought me many, many hours of fun, not as competitive as these bad bosy of sin, but nevertheless a lot of fun....

It's kinda settling down with a dame.... Ultimately you have to decide what dame makes a good wife and what dames are just for fun... In other words, pick your poison and learn to live with it!

The lab is open and humming... The task at hand is making the outside running more effective.... In order of testing, this is what is going to be futzed with:

1) Roughing the kicker penalty
2) RUN REAC SLIDER for HUM and CPU
3) CPU & HUM RUN BLK

I am going to leave OFFSIDES slider alone at this point, since it is a penalty that is not called anyways, and the issue at hand IS NOT the shedding of blocks, but rather, HOW TO SEAL OFF DEFENDERS to allow the RB to get to the corner and turn it up hill....

Wiz out.




Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Cleanest Genius

Wiz, when you say you stunt your linemen and send your LBs on loop blitzes, do you mean on the plays you choose? Or do you audible presnap? Also, I usually control the LBs or Safeties but I've started controlling my linemen and it seems like everytime I try a move around my blocker, I end up on the ground. Only time I'm able to break loose from a block is when I just move my LS all the way to the left/right. I have yet to see my linemen beat a blocker with a swim/spin/rip/bull rush.

The loop blitzes, stunts that I choose, I choose pre-play or have them saved as one of my audibles... Regarding the BREAK TACKLE moves that you are trying to perform with the left stick, the issue is that the block shedding slider is much too low for the HUM sliders to pull it off.... You would need to move the HUM BRK TKL slider to at least 50 to start to get the animations that you desire.... However by doing this, you ONLY leave 25 units for RUN REAC slider and TKL slider.... Depending on how you split up the remaining units in this sub-slider, it could affect runs to the outside, and tackling.... Just sayin'....

Stay tuned as I try to address CPU and HUM outside rushing.... I may just deal with your conundrum as well...

Wiz out...



Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.

[Tigey75]

Thanks for the wonderful explanation wiz. The problem I always have is consistency. I want to be able to run outside, but not every time. That's the toughest thing about these damn sliders. I love running outside for a gain of 8 but then trying again later and getting stuffed for a loss. Making each play unique is a delicate balance of tinkering. Obviously you're a capable slide man so I will await your tinkering and plug them in accordingly. So far I think passing is nailed down to perfection, I'm getting realistic numbers across the board in that area.

[MarketingWiz]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tigey75

Thanks for the wonderful explanation wiz. The problem I always have is consistency. I want to be able to run outside, but not every time. That's the toughest thing about these damn sliders. I love running outside for a gain of 8 but then trying again later and getting stuffed for a loss. Making each play unique is a delicate balance of tinkering. Obviously you're a capable slide man so I will await your tinkering and plug them in accordingly. So far I think passing is nailed down to perfection, I'm getting realistic numbers across the board in that area.

Thanks brah..... I agree passing is very acceptable, and I am moving on from passing and onto fixing the running game .....

The problem that I am running into with the running game is that BECAUSE we are playing a TRUE ALL-MADDEN slider set, the RUN REAC slider, even at "0" does not seal off the edge as it should... What this means is that pitches and sweeps will not be as successful as counter runs and or power runs outside the tackles... If y'all can live with this, then we can wrap up some solid CPU/HUM run sub-sliders in the next few days.... Y'all decide..


Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.

[MarketingWiz]

Boys..... Without wanting to sound like a broken record..... I have figured it out....

Wiz's trademark, THE GUARANTEED RUN GAME is BACK, with a vengeance!!!!!!!

Shhhhhheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeooooooot..... Actually started to stress it, that I had lost my MIDAS touch, but ALAS, we are merely a week of testing away from what I believe will be the BADDEST M13 SIM SLIDERS ON THE PLANET.....

I am in the lab right now, and have the solution to all the griping about the RUN GAME for CPU and HUM.... Y'all GONNA LOVE what I cooked up for us.....






In fact, I am going to gloss myself, Wiz, as in, Slider Wiz.

So from here on out ladies, just refer to me as Wiz, Slider Wiz (to be pronounced in the same cadence as "Bond, James Bond").....

Not Sir Wiz, or Mr. Wiz, or da Wiz, and certainly not Cheese Wiz ....

Just..... Wiz, Slider Wiz.....




So the plans are that tomorrow I drop you the patch for the Turkey Slider Reboot Holy Grail Set....A lot of the sub sliders, penalties, fatigue, auto-subs, speed thresh were futzed with .... So if you think that you have tried Wiz's best sliders, you have not tried diddly squat until you DIAL these sucka's in...

Make sure that you block out a lot of time to play these bad boys, in fact, you may need to call in "sick" on Monday.

Stay tuned...



Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening!

the Gospel of Madden has spoken.

[The Cleanest Genius]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarketingWiz

The loop blitzes, stunts that I choose, I choose pre-play or have them saved as one of my audibles... Regarding the BREAK TACKLE moves that you are trying to perform with the left stick, the issue is that the block shedding slider is much too low for the HUM sliders to pull it off.... You would need to move the HUM BRK TKL slider to at least 50 to start to get the animations that you desire.... However by doing this, you ONLY leave 25 units for RUN REAC slider and TKL slider.... Depending on how you split up the remaining units in this sub-slider, it could affect runs to the outside, and tackling.... Just sayin'.... Stay tuned as I try to address CPU and HUM outside rushing.... I may just deal with your conundrum as well... Wiz out... Keep playin'! Keep postin'! Keep Maddening! the Gospel of Madden has spoken.

When you say break tackle, do you mean block shedding? I will give your Holy Grail sliders a shot right now and come back with some more input (if I'm not too frustrated lol)

Also, I appreciate your help but there's no need to put my issues into consideration when tuning your sliders as I am sure that most people who use your sliders are far more skilled than I am. Example, the CPU has no issue with running, let alone to the outside, vs me.

[Steelers23]

Looking forward to these Slider Wiz! Drop these asap, the suspense is killing me. Thanks again for the hard work.