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kjcheezhead · 08-16-2011, 07:33 PM

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Originally Posted by Big FN Deal


	We completely disagree and that's cool. The things is, the average 12-14 year old, that you referred to, is already buying the game, regardless of the attention to realism, so the company already has their money. The goal of business is to increase sales, not stay stagnant. So in that case, adding defensive gap assignments and tiered play calling to bring in new football savvy gamers, seems like the best business decision. I really wish 6 years ago, it was like what you are describing because then maybe EA would have been content keeping their core consumers happy rather than courting casual gamers. I personally haven't preferred Madden since 1999 but Madden 2005 from last gen is far better at its' core than the last 6 years of next-gen Madden, imo.

We see it the exact opposite. Hardcore gamers either like Madden or find it lacks compared to games of the past. Either way EA is going to have a helluva time convincing you to change your mind. On the other hand, risking changing the way plays are called could turn out to be too difficult to the casual or EA could risk a backlash from longtime fans who have been "maddenized" in they call plays (just like they did with the strat pad)

For your second part, EA had a competitor 6 years ago. If they didn't offer the hardcore gamer what they wanted, another developer might. That isn't a concern anymore. For better or worse.

bucky60 · 08-16-2011, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjcheezhead


	On the other hand, risking changing the way plays are called could turn out to be too difficult to the casual or EA could risk a backlash from longtime fans who have been "maddenized" in they call plays (just like they did with the strat pad)

Options. Why do they have to take anything away.

kjcheezhead · 08-16-2011, 07:45 PM

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Originally Posted by bucky60


	Options. Why do they have to take anything away.

The option would be too much work. With the tiered play calling example, gamers already accept play calling the way it is and only a relatively small group would appreciate making it tiered and more realistic. Bottom line, the time and money spent to get it into the game wouldn't significantly increase sales enough to warrant it.

I don't like it anymore than you guys who are pushing for it, but it's the reality of the situation.

bucky60 · 08-16-2011, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjcheezhead


	The option would be too much work. With the tiered play calling example, gamers already accept play calling the way it is and only a relatively small group would appreciate making it tiered and more realistic. Bottom line, the time and money spent to get it into the game wouldn't significantly increase sales enough to warrant it.

I don't know if that's true or not because I'm not EA doing a cost/benefit analysis. But they would have had how many years to implement these options to spread the cost over?

IntellectualAssassin · 08-16-2011, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjcheezhead


	The option would be too much work. With the tiered play calling example, gamers already accept play calling the way it is and only a relatively small group would appreciate making it tiered and more realistic. Bottom line, the time and money spent to get it into the game wouldn't significantly increase sales enough to warrant it. I don't like it anymore than you guys who are pushing for it, but it's the reality of the situation.

That was literally the worst example you could have possibly used. Tiered playcalling. Too much work? Tiered playcalling? Resistance from braindead gamers and only appreciated by a small group? Tiered playcalling? NOT WARRANTED?!? TIERED PLAYCALLING?!?

TNT713 · 08-16-2011, 08:20 PM

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Originally Posted by bucky60


	I don't know why you keep disrespecting those that want Franchise and Gameplay changes that enhance Franchise mode. Why aren't you behind us even though you don't and never cared for the mode.

Interesting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucky60


	Instead, all I've heard from you is how we SHOULDN'T want our Franchise mode, that we should stop wanting to kill the CPU 100-0, and grow up to the big boy table and play a human. I can go look up the quote if you like. Really, I don't knock you or disrespect you because of the mode you like to play in. Why do you knock and disrespect others?

When did I say any of this stuff? Shouldn't WANT Franchise Mode? C',mon man.

Find as many quotes as you want... I stand by MY words. It's your characterization of my words I have an issue with.

I'm not disrespectful about Franchise mode nor about the people who play it. I have, however, made comments about a subset of players that play Franchise mode who just complain. That subset exists everywhere. Forgive me for implying Franchise fans are the only ones.

My feelings about the mode aren't disrespectful... I'm sure you'll pull up the quote where I say I doesn't need to be on my Madden disk - being sure to redact the portion where I also say it deserves it's own title BECAUSE of the vast differences between the reasons people play them.

I've OFTEN stated emphatically (or arrogantly) that Franchise has MATURED enough to be it's own title. How is that disrespectful?

Are you referring to the time I said that "if Franchise were missing, I wouldn't notice." That's not disrespectful. Maybe a little more colorful than "I don't play Franchise mode," but being colorful isn't a crime. OK... Maybe a wee bit disrespectful. But still true.

Don't confuse my inability to understand the appeal with a lack of respect for it. Simple truth is, it's becoming more and more difficult for EA to satisfy the reasons you play AND the reasons I play in a single title. The reasons we play are diametrically opposed.

You want a rich Franchise building experience where you build a team and take it through multiple years. You desire a game that has a smarter AI because the way you play relies heavily on how the AI performs it's purpose to create realistic stats, trades, cuts, etc. You crave a game that emphasizes long-term planning and you need a challenge every SEASON.

I want a game day experience where I mix it up against another human's football knowledge and video game skill. I desire a game that has tools available to reproduce the on-field strategy, planning, execution of football X's and O's, and intensity of football. I crave a game that emphasizes short term planning, user skill, and need a challenge every SNAP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucky60


	The difference is, I believe the AI could be smart enough to make competitive games with realistic stats, and should. You believe the AI can't and that we shouldn't ask for it or even want it. I can dig up quotes with some of this as well (please don't make me, I don't have the energy to hunt stuff down).

Here again... we have different visions for what the AI is capable of... You envision an AI that can be programmed to reach a tangible goal. The AI, in the sense that you mean it can be programmed to deliver more accurate stats. But the AI could NEVER reach the status of being an actual human - which is the only reason I play. I need another human on the sticks or the game isn't any fun...

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucky60


	That's GREAT. I really think that's great. I feel the beauty of football is building your franchise over the years through drafts, trades, and free agency, staying within money constraints. And playing the games out to see how well you put the team together. I thought MVP05 or MVP04 (I forget which one) had the best financial system I've seen in a sports game. Would like some of that included in Madden. I'm also allowed to try and get EA/TIB to add/enhance/change my favorite mode so that it is infinitely more enjoyable.

We agree in principle, just not in method. I feel Franchise fans and head-to-head fans would be better served with each being a separate title. Not for a lack of respect, but because I think Franchise is now more than a 'mode;' it's a GAME BY ITSELF.

If that's disrespectful, I need to brush up on my English.

Later

bucky60 · 08-16-2011, 08:55 PM

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