Why does the player's overall rating change when I start my career?

[Caliboy626]

Quote: Originally Posted by brettmickey

This makes no sense. You wouldn't be building a "super team" when scheme doesn't change ANY ratings besides overall. It doesn't change awareness, block shedding, tackling, anything. All it changes is overall. You can't build a "super team" with DEs who have 40 block shedding and pass rush moves even if the overall says they are in the 80's.

Then why is everyone complaining? You just admitted the overall has no effect on the actual gameplay without the core stats to back it up. That's the point I was trying to make. Plus the computer basis contract talk and free agent values and trade values on the overall rating. I got Hakeem Nicks for a song and a dance because he was rated to low for the scheme he signed with in free agency, and he has made the prow bowl every year for me.

[Caliboy626]

Quote: Originally Posted by brettmickey

This makes no sense. You wouldn't be building a "super team" when scheme doesn't change ANY ratings besides overall. It doesn't change awareness, block shedding, tackling, anything. All it changes is overall. You can't build a "super team" with DEs who have 40 block shedding and pass rush moves even if the overall says they are in the 80's. To further explain my issue, Kyle Williams is an 89 overall 3-4 DE in Madden (I think it's 89 or 91, can't remember at the moment). When I start a CFM, his overall plummets to a 60. No matter what position scheme I choose (3-4 versatile, speed rusher, 4-3 pass rusher) his overall stays at a 60. This makes absolutely no sense. Kyle Williams would make a much better 3-4 versatile DE rather than a speed rushing DE. If I wanted DE's in my coach's scheme to be speed rushers, I would understand him being a 60. But 3-4 versatile fits him perfectly and he is still a 60. This is the issue I'm having.

Also, I think you missed the point brettmickey. Kyle Williams is still an 89 overall and he will play like an 89 overall for you. Consider yourself lucky cause when it comes to contract time your not going to have to pay very much for a really good player. That 60 is basically a number you should not even pay attention to.

As long as Kyle Williams strength, power moves, block shedding, pursuit and play rec ratings are high I am sure he will play reasonably well for you.

[southriver]

So what's the point of a scheme at all? If they still play like a 89 but only rated a 60 then wouldn't it just be smart to put your best players in the WRONG scheme just so when contract talks come you can sign them cheap? It would be lame as all but there dosen't seem to be a penalty for you using the wrong scheme. Or am i wrong?

[Caliboy626]

Quote: Originally Posted by southriver

So what's the point of a scheme at all? If they still play like a 89 but only rated a 60 then wouldn't it just be smart to put your best players in the WRONG scheme just so when contract talks come you can sign them cheap? It would be lame as all but there dosen't seem to be a penalty for you using the wrong scheme. Or am i wrong?

I am sorry, I didn't say clearly what I was trying to convey. You should be able to get him for cheap if you offer him a reasonable deal during the resigning period (During the season). If you fail to sign him and he gets to free agency he may get an offer from a team that values his overall high in there scheme and you WILL lose him with your lowball offer.

And no it would not be smart to put theme in the wrong scheme. The "scheme overall" rating still reflects in your overall, off, and def team ratings. So unless you play every single game when simulating it could effect your team against CPU teams and you could see some losses.

My only point is If you have a Defense with Revis, Patrick Willis, Ed Reed, and any other ALL Pro type player I do not care if there "scheme overalls" are all in the 70's and your team overall is in the low 70's on defense. That team is still going to be very dominant because the talent is still there.

Use this as a rule of thumb. Never look at overalls in the depth chart or roster menu again!!!! Instead when deciding on players look at the ratings that are relative to the position.

Example: I have two corners.

Player A)
Overall: 73
Man Cover: 89
Zone Cover: 86
Aware: 79
press: 87

Player B)
Overall: 88
Man cover:81
Zonecover: 79
aware: 76
press: 75

I do not care about the "scheme overall"!!!!! Player A is clearly better and I will start him over B. If the players overall bothers you that bad then trade corner A for a corner whos "scheme Overall" is better even if he is not as good of a player in position based ratings. But your team will suffer for it. Bottom line is in CCM player overall ratings in depth chart and roster management do not reflect how good a player actually is.

[Unlucky 13]

Quote:

So what's the point of a scheme at all? If they still play like a 89 but only rated a 60 then wouldn't it just be smart to put your best players in the WRONG scheme just so when contract talks come you can sign them cheap? It would be lame as all but there dosen't seem to be a penalty for you using the wrong scheme. Or am i wrong?

You make an excellent point.

I get the whole Idea behind the schemes and their effect on the ratings, but for those who are telling people to ignore OVR, you either have an infinate amount of time to spend on the game, or just enjoy being a bully. OVR is supposed to be a quick glance at how good a player is at his position. I would highly doubt than any NFL team would rate the same player in the 60s while another rates him in the 90s if he's playing a similar position. He would very well be less valuable to team A than to team B, but the OVR drop shouldnt be that dramatic.

Fortunately for me, the Fins players fit well with their schemes, and at least the the start of my franchise, its very easy for me to judge my roster.

[Caliboy626]

Unlucky 13,

I am neither a bully or do I have a copious amount of time on my hands. I work 50 hours a week and have a family. I personally have complained this year that it takes to long to get through 1 week in owner mode this year.

Look I am not defending the game guys (although I do like the scheme overalls, I just think it needs to be tweaked). I am simply trying to make the scheme overall make sense for you guys.

[brettmickey]

Quote: Originally Posted by Caliboy626

Then why is everyone complaining? You just admitted the overall has no effect on the actual gameplay without the core stats to back it up. That's the point I was trying to make. Plus the computer basis contract talk and free agent values and trade values on the overall rating. I got Hakeem Nicks for a song and a dance because he was rated to low for the scheme he signed with in free agency, and he has made the prow bowl every year for me.

Quote: Originally Posted by Caliboy626

Also, I think you missed the point brettmickey. Kyle Williams is still an 89 overall and he will play like an 89 overall for you. Consider yourself lucky cause when it comes to contract time your not going to have to pay very much for a really good player. That 60 is basically a number you should not even pay attention to. As long as Kyle Williams strength, power moves, block shedding, pursuit and play rec ratings are high I am sure he will play reasonably well for you.

Alright this is my other issue: how can I evaluate other players in my scheme when my scheme doesn't correctly make changes to their "overall"? If I didn't know how good Kyle Williams truly was, then I would think he fits horribly in my scheme. No matter what scheme I decided to run, Kyle Williams would look like a terrible option for my team when in fact he isn't a bad option at all when in the correct scheme. Even though the overall doesn't effect gameplay, it does effect the perception of players on my team. See what I'm saying?

If Kyle Williams was a free agent and he was down at a 60 overall, I might not even consider him for my team because he wouldn't fit in. And besides, an 89-91 overall DE that has absolutely NO player scheme they fit in to makes no sense at all! Shouldn't one of those schemes allow his overall to be close to his actual rating? Let me know if you get what I'm trying to say

Also, since players like Kyle Williams and other starters have low overalls, that's negatively affecting my fan happiness rating. If the scheme based overall worked properly, I would have no issues (last year I had no issues with it). But my entire d-line rating is a 68 which is grossly bogging down my team overall and hurting my fan happiness. It's a small issue that's causing other issues for me.

[slipknottin]

So if overall is meaningless, why is it even in the game?

Either it should have a function or it should be eliminated.