Is EA/Tiburon Committed To Making Madden 13's Player Ratings "True To The NFL"?

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jimi XIII

I've been saying this for years...Madden needs more distance in there ratings, I think that's one of the things that made NFL2K5 so great. They weren't afraid to give players a 50 or 60 overall rating. But the thing was, that didn't mean they were really that bad, they just didn't have a particular strength in a key area but maybe in another. A lot of key ratings need to be given more separation in Madden. They seem to try too hard to make certain players that may just be good (but not great) high ratings still just to please the crowd that only looks at overalls. Hopefully the dev's understand just how much this can effect the sim experience now, the ratings have just been way too bunched in for too long. A good player doesn't need to be in the 80s while the great players are just 10 att. pts. away in the 90s, that's not enough space to really differentiate them.

Exactly. Just because Madden has a scale from 0-100 doesn't mean the best in the league have to be close that 100. lol

How about 100 being super human and something no one has ever achieved, even the best ever. With respect to skill ratings, 92-99 only be achievable when "in the zone"/on a hot streak and 85-92 being something that players can only maintain at the height of their careers for a limited window?

According to Madden, why the Helen would Brady, Brees and Manning ever retire when they can still have 95+ THP/THA/AWR/INJ etc, after 20+ years in the league? lol Most players retire because they have to, not because they want to, They can't play at a high level anymore and they, along with potential teams, know it.

[Smoke6]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

I was originally going to ask this question in the CD thread but I think it really needs to standout. After reading over some threads about how gamers are finding improvements for M12 by adjusting the ratings, I realized it seems we haven't heard anything about this from the ratings team. I read about DCEBB getting an interview but I don't think his OS name is EA colored, so I don't know what happened with that. It seems like everything I read about Madden's ratings, aside from that thing about a former Olineman working on Oline ratings, is about how hard Donny Moore works. Now, while I don't question his work ethic, I do question the results and the arcadey impact they seem to have on the game. I am concerned that whatever legacy football issues the developers may be able to address in Madden's code, can potentially be lessened or undone by seemingly subjective player ratings. So in an era of Madden where most things seem to be signaling a commitment to NFL authenticity, did the Madden ratings "team" get the memo this year?

Plain and simple NO!

Casual crowd gets their way each and every year, Freestyle players (shouldnt exist) get their way each and every year. Madden is Arcade to the fullest even when you try to play in a SIM environment. We all here saying the same thing for the past 10 or so years and I still havent heard anything concrete on if and when EA has finally seen the light!

They are plenty of games outside of madden that ARE NOT for the casual, but you dont see these games or devs dumbing down their game to cater to these guys outside of the options provided in the difficulty menu of the game.

Step it up EA, i dunno how long this "hype train" tactic is gonna work every year like it has. But if someone from CD day who feels the way I do about the game says something thats not appealing, IM OUT!

[BezO]

I can't be sure I have a problem with the ratings until some major animation & related AI work is done.

I do feel EA wants the game to be realistic, for the most part, but it only shows in the scores/stats. To get those scores/stats, the ratings, or at least the results of the ratings have to be what they are.

For example, there was a post a while back about DBs tackling better than their real life counterparts. A video was shown of a CB taking down Hillis, one on one. I agree, not too many CBs can do that unless they cut his legs out. But I don't believe EA can have realistic tackling ratings until they implement engaged player mobility & contain assignments. As it stands, engaged defenders can't flow towards the ball. They are stuck in mud, fighting with the blocker until someone wins. That, along with the lack of contain AI, ruins the spacing on the field, leaving way too much room to run outside. If not for the high tackling ability, there'd be too many big runs.

The unrealistic footwork plays a part in this as well.

I think most of the gameplay complaints on OS are related to bigger issues: Lack of realistic footwork, lack of engaged player mobility & lack of gap/contain assignments.

I haven't seen DCEBB2001's work, so I don't know how it looks. If it makes for better results, great. Unfortunately, my problem is not with the results. How you get there is a problem.

[schnaidt1]

they are not....they were a few years ago. but they arent anymore. if they gave us more control with editing rosters and sharing them. it wouldnt be such a huge deal.

i wrote a blog on this. no matter what madden does with the gameplay, commentary, graphics, features etc. the game will not stick with so many players rated so freakin high! not to mention how every player has A or B potential it seems.

they have to spread the ratings out. ALOT!! and put a cap at 90 so mut legends actually mean something.

as 2k has shown. players in the 60's can perform and be solid. there is absolutely no reason we cant have the majority of players in the game rated in the 60's and 70's with potential mostly ranging between D and B-. this will ensure players progress properly. allow potential to change. it shouldnt be locked in forever.

this should change at the end of the year based on performance in relation to his peers, based on system, coaches, and team/player morale and chemistry (something that needs to be added)

as bedwardsroy19 has proven with nba 2k12. its not the ratings that necessarily matter (because we use slider sets anyway) its tendencies.

so even if all the players are over rated cuz madden team is so concerned what the nfl players think...then fine. give us a global editor!!

but no matter what you do add more tendencies! position specific!!! at a minimum 20 position specific tendencies. with a 1-100 scale which can fluctuate through the season with dpp or as they improve or regress from year to year.

this will be good for penalties also....

[mpeterso]

After playing Madden extensively on the ps2 platform from 2003-2010, I started playing the current gen version of Madden in the past year (Madden11 and Madden12) and one big difference I've noticed between the two platforms is the PS3 roster player ratings are waaaaaay more spaced out than they ever were on the ps2 - especially when compared to the later editions of the ps2 game. Therefore, I think EA has done a pretty good job moving in this direction. For example, in just looking at team rosters on Madden 12 there are LEAST 10-20 players rated below 70 on almost all of them. In the old ps2 world there would be maybe 5 players per team rated that low. On the flip side, there used to be many more players rated in 80's-90's on the ps2 rosters than there are now. Now there are more starters in the 70's and even the occasional one in the 60's.

Regardless, player ratings are SUBJECTIVE. What you think a players ratings should be can vary greatly from what I think. Therefore, all I ask is to be able to edit all the players I want (which I've done with both great fury and pleasure over the years, as I literally edited EVERY single player on my madden05-08 rosters as well almost the entire NCAA 08 roster - 7000+ players on that file but I digress) and be able to tailor the game to how I think the players play. Seeing that EA now allows gamers to edit players at any point in franchise is one of the best innovations to the series in years. Therefore, the bottom line to me isn't the ratings themselves, but other issues that have been touched on in this thread like player foot work, interactions, change of direction etc. Improving these areas will likely yield the greatest and most noticable improvements to the game.

[mpeterso]

Another thing, regardless of how spaced the ratings are between players, the best players in the game still stand out imo. I can play one game against the Packers and one against the Cardinals, and the difference between Aaron Rodgers performance and that of John Skelton's is noticeable and some times staggering.

Same goes with using the Saints over the Seahawks - Drew Brees is way more user friendly than Tavaris Jackson. It wouldn't matter much if Brees was rated a 99 ovr and Jackson a 79 in ps2 world, or Brees 95 and Jackson 75 in the ps3 - the results would still be similar. Anyone who finds playing with Jackson comparable with playing with Brees probably has game play style / slider issues that no player ratings regime can fix without doing something extreme.

[DUDERMAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by mpeterso

After playing Madden extensively on the ps2 platform from 2003-2010, I started playing the current gen version of Madden in the past year (Madden11 and Madden12) and one big difference I've noticed between the two platforms is the PS3 roster player ratings are waaaaaay more spaced out than they ever were on the ps2

You are right, it is better than the last generation games. However, you said you started playing this gen with Madden 11... In Madden 10, they scaled back all the players and spaced them out. It was great but they have slowly gone back to their old ways over the past two years. Now in the last roster update there are like 8 99 OVR players... That should never be.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by mpeterso

After playing Madden extensively on the ps2 platform from 2003-2010, I started playing the current gen version of Madden in the past year (Madden11 and Madden12) and one big difference I've noticed between the two platforms is the PS3 roster player ratings are waaaaaay more spaced out than they ever were on the ps2 - especially when compared to the later editions of the ps2 game. Therefore, I think EA has done a pretty good job moving in this direction. For example, in just looking at team rosters on Madden 12 there are LEAST 10-20 players rated below 70 on almost all of them. In the old ps2 world there would be maybe 5 players per team rated that low. On the flip side, there used to be many more players rated in 80's-90's on the ps2 rosters than there are now. Now there are more starters in the 70's and even the occasional one in the 60's. Regardless, player ratings are SUBJECTIVE. What you think a players ratings should be can vary greatly from what I think. Therefore, all I ask is to be able to edit all the players I want (which I've done with both great fury and pleasure over the years, as I literally edited EVERY single player on my madden05-08 rosters as well almost the entire NCAA 08 roster - 7000+ players on that file but I digress) and be able to tailor the game to how I think the players play. Seeing that EA now allows gamers to edit players at any point in franchise is one of the best innovations to the series in years. Therefore, the bottom line to me isn't the ratings themselves, but other issues that have been touched on in this thread like player foot work, interactions, change of direction etc. Improving these areas will likely yield the greatest and most noticable improvements to the game.

But they don't have to be and they shouldn't be, imo. Every NFL player has hard unbiased numbers/data that can be used, in a standard formula, to create player ratings in Madden. If that was done, the only thing subjective would be the parameters of the standard formula, not the ratings themselves, which is potentially less controversial and easier to acquire a consensus around.

For example, if according to the standard formula, each player's top three 40 times are averaged and converted into a Speed rating on a universal scale of 0-100, with 0 being a 30.00/sec 40 and 100 being a 3.00/sec 40, Speed in Madden would no longer be subjective, it would be universally scaled.