I'm now convinced...A.I. is broken

[mercalnd]

Quote:

I don't think AI programming is at a stage yet to be able to improvise on the plays youre calling. It feels much more like Madden AI uses a scripted way of handling situations.

It is not that hard to accomplish. Keep in mind that the CPU has access to everything you have called in the game. I'm not saying it calls plays and audibles specifically for the play you have just called, that would be major cheating but it can easily keep track of tendencies(think about the VIP system in ESPN) and adjust its playcalling. This may schock some people but there is absolutely no game that does not use this kind of trick to some extent to compensate for the fact that the human brain is more intelligent than AI and also because some well balanced cheating can provide the same results as deep AI without as much of a hit on performance. This surprised even me when I heard it from a Ubisoft AI programmer a few months ago. But the general rule is: if it's going to look the same to the player, don't tie up system resources if you can take advantage of the CPU's access to information.

[Aikman08]

I agree Coyote, I think in 2004 the comeback problem was more apparent. Not to beat a dead horse, but again, I'm playing Detroit as Dallas last night. Completely shutting down Det for three and a half quarters (comp. had 50 yards rushing about 75 passing). All the sudden around the middle of quarter four, the backup Det RB Bryson becomes Marshall Faulk squared, twice taking screen passes five yards behind the line of scrimmage, shedding my Dallas tacklers one by one (three of them behind the line of scrimmage). Also, on both occassions Bryson literally did a 360 degree turn in a speed I've never seen on Madden, in order to immediately reverse field and run for TWO 85 YARD PLUS TD SCREEN PASSES in the 4th quarter. It was by far the most arcadish plays I've seen to date. Now, that's saying a lot, considering plays like this happen in some form or another almost every damn game (against the Comp All-Pro or higher). So, I end up winning 21-17, but of course my defense now has over 300 yards passing yards against it, thus negating a great defensive performance. Stats screwed all to hell. Now I maintain my completely unrealistic Cowboy ranking of number one offense, and 21 ranked defense. And of course in both of my franchises, the KC Chiefs are ranked number one in DEFENSE! Now, someone mentioned how maybe your offense is scoring too quickly, tiring out your defense. I make it a point to milk the play clock on offense, and run the ball a lot. My defense gets plenty of rest every game, not to mention I sub fresh guys in. If this crap didn't happen almost every game, I wouldn't say a thing. But this is really bad.

[oldschool]

I dont know if anyone has said this already but i am definately convinced there is something wrong with the AI. as far as online play. I havent really played offline since i got 2005 & BB.

I played a game online last night against the falcons & although i was able to contain vick somewhat from running all over the field, he was still able to win in the last 10 sec of the game because one of my LB's watched him run in for the TD..

falcons about 15yrds from my goal line, about 7sec left in the game.. I call a 3-4 zone so vick couldn't scramble in or so i thought.

I had control of my DB and was manually shadowing price who was running & out route.
Everyone was covered, so vick made a run for it: As he ran to the outside i didnt think he would make it because my LB was covering the flat to Vicks side.

Unfortunatley my LB never made a play to stop vick, he instead backed up further in the endzone like he was throwing the game.

I was franticly trying to switch to him but it was to late.
Ok, my LB was following his assignment right?
But why didnt he tackle vick who was clearly in front of him about to score, there was no 1 else there for my LB to get but vick.
If he had made an attempt and missed the elusive vick< that i can live with but to just stand there & let him score after playing so hard to contain vick all game:

The AI is weak/ scripted. Thats my conclusion & im sticking to it.
This is the best Madden ever but the AI still needs to be fixed instead of tweaked.
Some of the things my team does online is just unreal and the min they start doing stupid stuff i know if im gonna win or not. It really feels like the games are predetermined before the coin toss. I have over 250 games played online & that is my conclusion.

EA is either too cheap or dont care, & im sick of it.
Iv'e said this plenty times over the years, it's time for them to do better by their fans. The technology & resources is there for a much better AI for the game.

If that means revamping or upgrading the game engine or charging more money for future Madden games, whatever it takes then do it already, how long do we have to wait? Another 10 years? My wish for 2006 madden is everyone boycott, maybe they will listen when sales drop & they ask why in the next survey & everyone says because we tired of spending $50 for the glitchy stupid AI Bs sloppy product.

I had to get that out: end rant.

By the way i told EA in their survey exactly that.
On the part where it ask's what can we do to improve madden :something like that.....i said" you can start by revamping the game engine already, & improving the AI by making them more intelligent instead of tweaking, loyal madden fans deserve better than a game with obvious glitche's.

[Aikman08]

Old School-
I can relate to your frustration. I have noticed some A.I. problems (just as you described, players doing dumb *** things) playing on-line. In my opinion it's not something as noticeable, or as big a prob. as playing the computer. But, def. a scripted feel at times. Seems like many others notice this A.I. problem too, especially against the comp. on All-Pro or higher. Also, there are those who love to say, well you're just not playing right, or you are no good. But, after buying and playing Madden since it first came out (1992?), I honestly feel something is really lacking in the "realism" of the game, and the only thing I can attribute it to is the A.I. When third string running backs are moon walking like Michael Jackson in order to elude your defenders, something is f-ed up. Obviously it's a video game, and will not be perfect. But, I just hope EA takes a look at this stuff, and does something about it. Believe me, I would really prefer not to bring this stuff up, because it appears that I'm just bitching. But, I know that EA does make improvements to their games through customer feedback, and hopefully they do something about this, too.

[oldschool]

Well i finally played the comp for the first time today. I decided to play a franchise season on all madden level.
Im using the Jags, original roster except for a few created players..1 CB, (99)
1 MLB,(95)
1 HB,(94)
1 WR,(97)
and i picked up about 6 FA players OL & 3rd string TE.
Maybe it's me but allmadden is like playing on steriods.
Maybe im too used to playing allpro online or something.
I could barely score 14 pts on 5min qtrs against the bills, who blew me out 3 diff times cause i kept starting over..lol.

My cb hasn't done anything special in fact he gets out played by Moulds.

My Mlb is the biggest factor on D, he does a good job of containing the run when he's in postion to make the play, going to test him against vick soon.lol.

My Hb seems solid, he should be at 240lbs & 90 speed, 97 brktkl, but i was still unable to run with any real success.

My WR seems good but for some reason is never able to catch the ball because of lack of seperation, ( at 97 speed, 95 cth, 74 str, 95 agl, 97acc, 90awr,) but he is the only 1 to score finally.

And leftwich who i have solid completions with online cant seem to throw accurate enough for a 10 yd pass.

might have to tweak the sliders, which i dont like doing.
And the stats , dont even ask, - 5 yds rushing by the time it was over.

I'll try allpro sometime but i always played on allmadden level & dont really want 2 do allpro.

All Madden level is very aggressive, i like that but at the same time im not so sure if it's just the poor blocking im getting from the OL.

need 2 play some more of the fran before i pass judgement but so far i think your right.

Online is def slower paced, & off is like turbo mode , at least that what it feels like to me.

Im also gonna play allmadden level online again because i dont remember it being that aggressive or fast last time i played online ( only once) but i think i would remember that.