What's the best defensive team you can build right now

[KyrieAbuser]

Yeah that all defense team means nothing to a cheese who just gonna outscorr you with bombing 3's or 5 out you to death and force you have to help someone because the only defense stats that really matter online it seem is steals, since you can spam the steal button with no regard. So only defensive players I'll fear is Stockton or pippen since those the only ones with Hof pick pocket so far.

[harryl]

Quote: Originally Posted by Scramz718

The advantage you'll get defensively for taking defense as a absolute priority isn't worth taking the hit on the other end. You'll be basically handicapping your O for a couple of +2s or 3s on defensive ratings that won't make a huge difference. Going back to my initial point, you don't have to sacrifice shooting when building a defensive squad.

Again: I am being totally literal when I talk about having to sacrifice shooting IF defense is your absolute #1 priority, without regard to offense.

Yes...one doesn't have to sacrifice shooting to build a very good defensive squad. I wasn't referring to finding a sensible optimization of balance between defense and offense. I was talking about defense first.

If you take defense as an absolute priority, then you have to have Ben Wallace in the lineup. Probably Diamond Mutombo. Maybe Diamond Russell. Maybe Amethyst Rodman. For most people, probably Amethyst MRR.

[Scramz718]

Quote: Originally Posted by sk8board

In 2k, offense wins. 3s takeover every game mode. In park, 3s win the game and in MTO you hit 2 threes and get 1 stop then you're up 6 which is pretty big in a 24 minute game where the average score is 50-55 points. You can stop him 2/3 times and if he knocks down 1 three that is 1 point less than you if you manage to score 2/3 times and 1 point more than you if you go 1/3. Now, let's not forget there is a greater chance of you going 0/3 rather than 3/3 with a defensive team. now let's not forget about the amount of stupid fouls in this game for playing good defense. Even when they do not make a three they can get fouled and get an and 1 or three free throws.

3s are easier to defend than inside scoring tbh. I haven't lost to a 3 pt bomber all year. Drop steps is harder stop than Curry bombing threes. You can get away with that in the early leagues but you aren't going to win most of your game in the higher leagues gunning threes.
And just because somebody has a defensive lineup doesn't mean they're only going for 2s.

Quote: Originally Posted by KyrieAbuser

Yeah that all defense team means nothing to a cheese who just gonna outscorr you with bombing 3's or 5 out you to death and force you have to help someone because the only defense stats that really matter online it seem is steals, since you can spam the steal button with no regard. So only defensive players I'll fear is Stockton or pippen since those the only ones with Hof pick pocket so far.

Yes offense out weights defense in this but let's not act like you can completely disregard defense. We also aren't talking about using one dimensional defensive lineups.

Like, Mo Checks, Tony Allen, Tayshaun Prince, Dennis Rodman & Ben Wallace.

We're talking about using lineups with elite defenders that also have multiple offensive threats.

You can run a bunch of 5 out defensive lineup too.

PGs Walt, MRR, GP, Magic and Big

Wings Dumars, Klay, Kawhi, RIP, Jimmy, Prince....

Biggs M Gasol, AD, Josh & D Rob

[Bubba13laze]

There are a lot of great 2 way players with elite defending. Having someone like Hakeem is a fantastic defender and one of the top low post threats in the game. John Stockton has the purple pickpocket badge, can defend the perimeter excellent, and is a top playmaker with a good jump shot.

Pippen is the best wing in the game Imo and he can do it all.

Other wings like kawhi and butler, can round out a pure defensive lineup where everyone still remains a scoring threat. There is no reason a team like this would starve offensively.

[Scramz718]

Quote: Originally Posted by harryl

Again: I am being totally literal when I talk about having to sacrifice shooting IF defense is your absolute #1 priority, without regard to offense. Yes...one doesn't have to sacrifice shooting to build a very good defensive squad. I wasn't referring to finding a sensible optimization of balance between defense and offense. I was talking about defense first. If you take defense as an absolute priority, then you have to have Ben Wallace in the lineup. Probably Diamond Mutombo. Maybe Diamond Russell. Maybe Amethyst Rodman. For most people, probably Amethyst MRR.

My original point was, you don't have to sacrifice shooting to build a lockdown defensive squad. Which is a fact.

Now, are these not very good defensive squads?

Budget
MRR, Dumars, Prince, Josh, Mutombo

Limitless
Walt, Kawhi, Pippen, PD Tim, D Rob



WHY completely ignore offense or sacrificing shooting, when you can build just as good or better defensive squad with guys that can play both sides of the ball.



You don't have to have Ben or Rodman. You're probably looking at things on paper rather than in game.

Is Ben Wallace a better defender than D Rob?

Is Rodman defensively a better than PD Duncan?


With your backcourt MRR & Cooper

D Rob, Timmy, Mutombo

Vs

Ben, Rodman, Mutombo

Hmmm....in game which will be the better defensive team?

[anditbeg1ns]

Quote: Originally Posted by sk8board

In 2k, offense wins. 3s takeover every game mode. In park, 3s win the game and in MTO you hit 2 threes and get 1 stop then you're up 6 which is pretty big in a 24 minute game where the average score is 50-55 points. You can stop him 2/3 times and if he knocks down 1 three that is 1 point less than you if you manage to score 2/3 times and 1 point more than you if you go 1/3. Now, let's not forget there is a greater chance of you going 0/3 rather than 3/3 with a defensive team. now let's not forget about the amount of stupid fouls in this game for playing good defense. Even when they do not make a three they can get fouled and get an and 1 or three free throws.

I find 3's much easier to defend this year. In previous years, open 3's are automatic, but in higher leagues this year, open 3's are 50/50 unless you have you have the momentum on your side. As mentioned earlier, opponents generally shoot less than 40% from 3's on 10-15 attempts in my last 70 games or so. Very few had done better than that.

If you have a superb defensive team and you are a good defensive player, there is no way someone can beat you by mainly shooting 3's with the difficulty settings this year. As Scramz said, I find post moves like drop steps or cut to baskets harder to defend this year.

[anditbeg1ns]

Quote: Originally Posted by AsYouSwish

So then what happens if you run an all defense lineup (say MRR/Kawhi/Pippen/Big Ben/Robinson) vs. an all offense lineup (let's say Curry/Harden/Wilkins/Cousins/Ewing). Who do you think wins over the course of a game? (side note: even just typing this I changed that offensive lineup 3 times as I think it's harder to decide who's best offensively depending on your style but I went with players who are generally offensively oriented even if there are some great two way players)

Do people still use Curry these days? Bigger pg's like Magic or Penny would destroy him.

Best offensive team for my style right now is Magic/Penny, Harden, Kobe, Haywood, and Robinson

[harryl]

Quote: Originally Posted by Scramz718

My original point was, you don't have to sacrifice shooting to build a lockdown defensive squad. Which is a fact.

Yes, I know what your point was. I don't disagree. I merely made the point that, if you want to absolutely prioritize defense, with no thought toward offensive ramifications, you will sacrifice shooting.

I'm not saying that this is advisable.

Quote:

WHY completely ignore offense or sacrificing shooting, when you can build just as good or better defensive squad with guys that can play both sides of the ball.

Sure. I don't disregard offense/shooting. And with very few exceptions, only use "two-way" players.

Quote:

You don't have to have Ben or Rodman. You're probably looking at things on paper rather than in game. Is Ben Wallace a better defender than D Rob? Is Rodman defensively a better than PD Duncan?

Yes, Ben Wallace can be a better defender than Robinson. Or PD Duncan. It depends on the matchup.

Wallace is faster and way more explosive than the other two. Also has elite Lateral Quickness, even higher than Robinson. You can put Wallace onto a guard and, especially if you put a Speed/Accel shoe on Wallace, he can keep up even in transition, or if that player swings wide off a screen.

Not the same with Robinson, as incredible as he is.

Even if someone is using someone like LBJ or Giannis at the 4, I'd rather have Wallace on him, instead of Robinson, because of speed/acceleration.

Now...if we're talking about defending a Center, then no, of course I'd rather have Robinson in that situation.

We don't really disagree, in the end. I'm not arguing with your main point.