Athlete all Ds

[speedtrucker]

Quote: Originally Posted by blkrptnt819

Lets say I come in as a WR and got switched to DB. Will i not be able to catch as well? No, I'd get balls other dbs wouldnt be able to catch. If I play LB is bigger, sronger faster not the expectation when I leave? I wouldn't force on weight I would let it happen naturally

that's just it, if you were a WR that switched to CB in college you would never go through WR drills in practice. your strength and conditioning would be different, your studies would be different. your read and recognition assignments would be different, your time wouldn't be spent on jugs machines or working on timing with your QB. your catching drills would be based off of importance, ie if you can't catch it, knock it down, break it up, make the tackle.

yes you would still be able to catch a pass but would you after spending an offseason as a CB be able to then turn around in 1 game and be able to be just as effective a WR?!? it is unlikely. that is what I'm saying, look I'll make an example that sort of agrees with both of us.

antwan randle-el, QB in college but WR in NFL. the kid was a pretty dang good at Indiana and even played Bball for bobby knight. set indiana record books, finished in top 5 for Heisman, won MVP of the big10. goes to Pitt and is converted to WR. that doesn't mean that he couldn't throw the ball anymore, he has 7 career passing TDs including one in SB XL. however I'd venture to say that his QB skills as a whole would be sorely lacking compared to his WR skills, I'd also say that while maybe his "throwing power" might still be high, his "throwing accuracy" might have taken a hit as time went on. meanwhile his "release", "route running" and even "catching" ability have probably improved from his rookie season.

just because I learned how to ride a bike when I was 7, learned to mountain bike when I was 21 and was rock-hopping at 23 doesn't mean that when I'm 33 and been only roadbiking for 2 years that I'll still be a top notch rockhopper, sure I'll remember how to do it but there will be skill degradation due to lack of use.

[MidMajorMania]

Just recruited a 4-star athlete #18 in my dynasty. He had all D's. I was hoping for a stud fullback, but I ended up with a 67 overall K/P. What a waste. Thankfully no other schools were recruiting him, so I didn't have to dump in a lot of recruiting time on him.

I've also recruited an "Athlete" with who ended up being a QB with mid-50's Speed.

Also, I've noticed that none of these athletes are able to play both sides of the ball. You have your WR/RB athletes and CB/FS/SS athletes, but no WR/CB athletes. It wasn't always like that.

[CuseGirl]

Speedtrucker

The athletes should come in with a handful of skills, maybe one ELITE skill/physical attribute (for the top 5 or 10 athletes) and when you select their primary position (which will end up being their only position anyway), the game will keep the neccessary skills and degrade (not nerf but lower) the skills they aren't going to use. If you recruit a CB/WR athlete, and select receiver, his zone coverage, press, and play recognition SHOULD decrease. Because he's not going to use them.

[blkrptnt819]

Quote: Originally Posted by CuseGirl

Speedtrucker The athletes should come in with a handful of skills, maybe one ELITE skill/physical attribute (for the top 5 or 10 athletes) and when you select their primary position (which will end up being their only position anyway), the game will keep the neccessary skills and degrade (not nerf but lower) the skills they aren't going to use. If you recruit a CB/WR athlete, and select receiver, his zone coverage, press, and play recognition SHOULD decrease. Because he's not going to use them.

That's his skill set why would it just drop all of a sudden? It makes no sense my coverage should not go from 83 to 67 because they moved to WR. Some skills are just instinct. This is why users should have control of training. I move u to a certain position because of the skills he possess. If I move SS to WLB they still better cover. That's the whole reason I moved them.

[blkrptnt819]

Quote: Originally Posted by speedtrucker

that's just it, if you were a WR that switched to CB in college you would never go through WR drills in practice. your strength and conditioning would be different, your studies would be different. your read and recognition assignments would be different, your time wouldn't be spent on jugs machines or working on timing with your QB. your catching drills would be based off of importance, ie if you can't catch it, knock it down, break it up, make the tackle. yes you would still be able to catch a pass but would you after spending an offseason as a CB be able to then turn around in 1 game and be able to be just as effective a WR?!? it is unlikely. that is what I'm saying, look I'll make an example that sort of agrees with both of us. antwan randle-el, QB in college but WR in NFL. the kid was a pretty dang good at Indiana and even played Bball for bobby knight. set indiana record books, finished in top 5 for Heisman, won MVP of the big10. goes to Pitt and is converted to WR. that doesn't mean that he couldn't throw the ball anymore, he has 7 career passing TDs including one in SB XL. however I'd venture to say that his QB skills as a whole would be sorely lacking compared to his WR skills, I'd also say that while maybe his "throwing power" might still be high, his "throwing accuracy" might have taken a hit as time went on. meanwhile his "release", "route running" and even "catching" ability have probably improved from his rookie season. just because I learned how to ride a bike when I was 7, learned to mountain bike when I was 21 and was rock-hopping at 23 doesn't mean that when I'm 33 and been only roadbiking for 2 years that I'll still be a top notch rockhopper, sure I'll remember how to do it but there will be skill degradation due to lack of use.

You just made my point. McRandle-El will still be able to throw a good ball. If he spent time back at QB he would probably get it back.

[CuseGirl]

Quote: Originally Posted by blkrptnt819

You just made my point. McRandle-El will still be able to throw a good ball. If he spent time back at QB he would probably get it back.

He didn't make your point. Randel-El would not throw the ball in the NFL as well as he did in college after go thru a handful of training camps, weekly practices and full games as a receiver. Come on man....

Quote: Originally Posted by blkrptnt819

That's his skill set why would it just drop all of a sudden? It makes no sense my coverage should not go from 83 to 67 because they moved to WR. Some skills are just instinct. This is why users should have control of training. I move u to a certain position because of the skills he possess. If I move SS to WLB they still better cover. That's the whole reason I moved them.

Yes, it makes perfect sense. Maybe not as dramatic as 83 (average) to 67 (well below average). But I'm sorry, when you don't do something for a long time AND put effort into something else, those other skills diminish. That's common sense.

Users can have control of training but you're not going to be able to hone skills on both sides of the ball or hone receiver skills AND runningback skills with a stud athlete. It's just not going to happen unless you want to upset the balance of the game.

I agree that athletes should come in with at least 2 identifiable positions they CAN play with the appropriate physical skills. But it is not realistic to maintain ALL of those skills once you select a position.

[blkrptnt819]

Quote: Originally Posted by CuseGirl

He didn't make your point. Randel-El would not throw the ball in the NFL as well as he did in college after go thru a handful of training camps, weekly practices and full games as a receiver. Come on man.... Yes, it makes perfect sense. Maybe not as dramatic as 83 (average) to 67 (well below average). But I'm sorry, when you don't do something for a long time AND put effort into something else, those other skills diminish. That's common sense. Users can have control of training but you're not going to be able to hone skills on both sides of the ball or hone receiver skills AND runningback skills with a stud athlete. It's just not going to happen unless you want to upset the balance of the game. I agree that athletes should come in with at least 2 identifiable positions they CAN play with the appropriate physical skills. But it is not realistic to maintain ALL of those skills once you select a position.

Not that much that quick. Nobody drops that much in one offseason. Until I have control over what my team works on I really don't like the idea degression because it will be in areas I find important though EA may not.

[speedtrucker]

Quote: Originally Posted by blkrptnt819

You just made my point. McRandle-El will still be able to throw a good ball. If he spent time back at QB he would probably get it back.

... do you not see what you just said yourself?

if he spent time back at QB he would probably get it back. meaning that he would have lost some skill.

I'm in agreement with the few post after about maybe not a giant loss of points and an Athlete having 2 positions they could choose from or even switch during off seasons. an ATH that could play CB or WR doesn't need "cover" skills to either be an 85 or drop to 65 depending on the position choice, but maybe that 85 will begin to drop each year that they play WR. so by his senior season at WR his "cover" skills are now a 73(or whatever) because he never played CB, his tackling skills would drop over time much like his WR skills would grow over time. I'm not saying he would get slower or whatever just because he picked CB over WR, but certain skills would degrade over time due to lack of use.

Cusegirl made 2 strong points about ATHs coming in with the potential for multiple positions, certain ELITE skills would define their potential like the ATH has ELITE skills that would translate to a decent WR or above average CB. upon position selection said player would then begin his "advancement" & "degradation" of skills that fall into either position.