Pitch count/history in ASB?

[FatPitcher]

There's nothing original or outstanding in ASB, so why bother? Outside of a few animations (umpires signalling home run, etc.), everything in that game has been done by other sports games, and almost everything has been done by other baseball games. And in quite a few instances, it's been done better, too. Honestly, aside from my short time with the game, we've only looked at it for a couple specific things, like crowd (not impressed) and home run collision walls (not impressed).

Here's a list of things I didn't like after 1 day of the game (plus 2 hours a couple months ago):

- Runners returning to 2nd don't stand on the base, they stand next to it
- Numerous commentary bugs, saying there's two strikes when there's only one, saying after a diving catch that the guy "got up and made the play" when the ball was caught with no one even on base, commentary playing out of order, etc.
- Animations popping all over the place, especially on double plays...the guy covering second is in a catch position then the next frame his arm is throwing the ball, which is now magically in his hand.
- you can't run and throw at the same time, at least with infielders.
- no controllable instant replay (which I am sure would reveal a lot more problems)
- Derek Jeter
- throws not properly backed up
- Hit and run doesn't work right because you can't adjust to the pitch
- check swing commentary plays a lot because you have to start your swing on every pitch, then let up if it's not where you wanted it
- franchise mode commentary always refers to the 2001 season as "last year", continues to talk about that season several years down the road
- can get out of pickles 100% of the time
- no way to view pitch count
- stamina drain unrealistic when compared to pitch count
- stamina modeling for pitchers with lower stamina is terribly unrealistic
- viewing overall player ratings is uninuitive (trade screen?) and viewing complete player ratings is impossible
- stupid lineup generation (it was playing a D- rookie at DH over Juan Gonzalez, and kept putting him there every chance it got). Injuries are handled badly.
- unbalanced player creation. If you're going to limit it by points, bunting should not cost as much as power (for example)
- tags don't tag people; the guy puts his glove on the base instead of the player
- too many hits to the wall are singles
- baserunning controls are a bitch, and unresponsive too
- no option to save seasons to memory card instead of hard drive? (couldn't find it, maybe it's there)
- commentary about "award-winning ASB2003" and "the great folks at Acclaim" and such. Gimme a freakin' break.
- some dumb baserunning AI (getting thrown out at home by 45 feet is one example)
- pitchers catching everything hit up the middle no matter how hard it's hit
- crowd is not something to emulate
- batting is not realistic. I don't care if you played high school baseball and you think it's realistic; at least read one of the many books written by pro hitters to get an idea of how they react to pitches before you claim to be an expert
- too many home runs, even on hardest settings I hit 5-7 a game
- simulator problems (Delino Deshields hitting 4 HRs in a game? Bierbrodt pitching 10.2 innings of scoreless relief in a 4-3, 23 inning victory? no pinch hitters or defensive subs?)
- pop flies stay in the air too long
- no idle animations...after a play is over, the fielders just stand around in the "I'm taking a dump" stance
- no cutscenes except the one batter walk-up
- ball warping into glove (this is mostly a result of not having enough fielding animations, glove collision is widened to make up for it)
- pitching is boring (most baseball games, including WSB, suffer from this, but it's especially bad in ASB)
- trading sucks
- rookie draft?
- free agent signing/player negotiation sucks
- stat tracking not very comprehensive
- career stats don't have year by year
- record book is not for modern baseball, has all those crazy ones like 660IP in a season
- franchise only lasts 20 years
- menus not particularly intuitive (loading a game, for example)
- tilting cursor causes problems (CPU/other player can't use a sinker to get ground balls, for one thing)
- no ball/strike audio. At least put something on the screen when it happens, rather than making me wait till the next pitch to see the count.

There are, of course, things in ASB that I would like to have (awards, easter eggs, nice box scores, pictures of ourselves), but those things were in other games before ASB, we knew about them before they were in ASB, and we would have come up with them ourselves if they weren't. All the suggestions on this board, all the features in other games--there's nothing there we haven't thought of in our many years of playing and making baseball and other video games. That's our job, so it would be strange if it were otherwise. You can't wave a magic wand and make features appear in your game, though, and even if you could, you'd have to modifiy them to work well and be enjoyable within the context of your game.

[Will]

Note to any any future game developers here: Make good game, THEN bash competition, not other way around. Works much better.

[FatPitcher]

I have a much longer list of things I don't like about WSB, by the way, plus another list of things I personally don't care about but that other people don't like.

In an amazing stroke of luck, though, reviewers and customers as a whole both like WSB better. I can only hope that someday it deserves the recognition it's gotten. Maybe I can catapult it to greatness by taking insults from people who have never made a video game in their lives.

First make a game, then give advice to future game developers.

[Will]

I'm just sarcastically pointing out how you're bashing one game even though many people out there feel your game could have been much, much better.

[LetsGoPitt]

Methinks we've had this discussion before.....

Please allow me to opine on a few things:

1. Calling FatPitcher on being the only developer on WSB is pointless. Besides, if they HAD "used some great features from another game" (to paraphrase), someone would have simply claimed that WSB ripped off ASB.

2. "I'm just sarcastically pointing out how you're bashing one game even though many people out there feel your game could have been much, much better." True, and there are others out there (myself included) who -- are you sitting down? -- actually like the game DESPITE ITS FLAWS. As was already discussed, there are many flaws in ASB as well. Correcting flaws is a major reason why there will be another release next year. (as is the case with 99.5% of all sports games).

3. This is my opinion During those "X talks about baseball" commercials, there is one where Frankie Muniz talks about playing videogames as Milwaukee. During the commercial, they show ASB clips. Having played exclusively WSB for several months now, I was shocked at how primitive the graphics seemed on the commercial. This may be due to the translation to the TV, but the difference was still very striking.

3. I applaud FatPitcher for admitting that there is a list of things he didn't like about WSB -- something to address for next year.

4. I think if you took 45% WSB, 45%ASB, 10%HRK, 0%TP, you'd have a great baseball game.

5. Proof that not all in ASB is accurate: through the season I had going with the Pirates, Derek Bell was hitting close to .400

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"Derek Bell was the ultimate pirate. He lives on a boat and he steals money"

[FatPitcher]

It sure could have, I don't think anyone would argue with that. However, I disagree that my spending time with ASB would make WSB any better. If ASB was the "Madden of baseball," and WSB was the "Gameday of baseball," then sure, we'd play it a bunch and try to figure out what makes it fun, why people like it better, etc. That's not the position we've been in. We know what's fun, what would be cool, what people like, etc., we just haven't made the game we want to make yet. There's no one to catch up to, no king of the hill like FIFA or Madden, no proven formula. I think that WSB's formula and ASB's are different, that they don't mix well, and (of course) that WSB's will eventually be decidedly better.

I'm going to get back to work now

[BaseballGuru]

FatPitcher,

You come onto these forums acting like God's gift to baseball games, when it couldn't be further from the truth. ASB has an attention to detail that you've repeatedly mocked, and it is this attitude that will forever keep your game at #2 or #3 in the baseball market.

It is laughable that you spent all of that time to come up with your "Things I Hate About ASB" list... perhaps you should spend less time worrying about what people on an internet forum think and more time worrying about your game. You are complaining about ASB's baserunning, when your game has the worst baserunning AI of them all... including Triple Play! Give me a f'ing break. Do you think before you spew this crap, or are actually this dumb?

It is also ridiculous for someone who worked on WSB to judge ASB in the way that you just did. You claim that ASB ripped off most of it's features from other games, and then you said they didn't do it very well... interesting. Your game is a complete ASB wannabe, a complete and utter rip off of it, and it doesn't play as well. It is neither as fun nor as deep as ASB, yet you judge it like you pulled a golden baseball game right out of your arse. Shhhhh... I'm going to tell you something... your game isn't that good. ASB is better. Sorry if that hurts your feelings, but someone had to tell you the truth.

Perhaps things like the vacuum glove of ASB could have been fixed if all of it's hits were scripted like in WSB. Perhaps... but it doesn't take away from the overall gameplay experience, which is much deeper and rewarding in ASB. You say your game will eventually be better than ASB, and I doubt it. How can it be when you're just waiting to see what features ASB adds, then implement them one year later? You will always be a day late and a dollar short when it comes to the great baseball console race.

I have to leave this thread now before I get myself in trouble. It's clear that you only played ASB for a few hours... it's also clear that you have no sense of baseball, either historically or in it's modern form.

[snowmizer]

Is it just me, or do others have less hope for WSB's future evolution every time they finish reading one of FatPitcher's posts?