2010 MLB midseason awards...

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by jth1331

He's had 2 rough outings due to illness, and now everybody wants to backlash the guy. The guy was freakin dominant essentially for 14 out of his 16 starts. I'd say if he pitches like his dominant self next start, you gotta go with him for now.

Even before his latest two starts, he wasn't top 3 in the NL in xFIP and FIP, the two of the best pitching metrics out there. In fact, he actually has the 4th-largest disparity between his ERA and his FIP in the NL.

Throw in his relatively mediocre K/9, BB/9, and K/BB ratio and I'm having trouble buying the hype.

Good pitcher, but he's been getting lucky this year.

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sportsforever

I didn't even look at his record or ERA honestly...I looked at the fact he's given up almost a hit an inning and has a whip of about 1.3.

That's probably because of a ridiculously high .355 BABIP (1st in the AL and significantly above his career average). Chalk it up to bad luck.

As for my WAR data...http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...n=2010&month=0

[jth1331]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

Even before his latest two starts, he wasn't top 3 in the NL in xFIP and FIP, the two of the best pitching metrics out there. In fact, he actually has the 4th-largest disparity between his ERA and his FIP in the NL. Throw in his relatively mediocre K/9, BB/9, and K/BB ratio and I'm having trouble buying the hype. Good pitcher, but he's been getting lucky this year.

Have you watched him pitch? Or are you just looking at statistics?

The fact is, Ubaldo pitched well, and made pitches to the point to get outs that he needed(as in ground balls). Yes, I will give you his walk ratio is rather poor for a supposed premier pitcher, but geez, it really is kinda annoying when people bust out stats and say a guy has just been lucky this year. Luck is a thing in sports whether people want to admit it or not. It can be lucky to have a wide strike zone in a game, or have Pujols just miss a hanger and then get him on the corner looking next pitch. Luck is a part of the game. Ubaldo has been great, and of course has gotten lucky.

[Sportsforever]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

That's probably because of a ridiculously high .355 BABIP (1st in the AL and significantly above his career average). Chalk it up to bad luck. As for my WAR data...http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...n=2010&month=0

I wonder why fangraphs and bbr differ on the WAR stats? That's odd...as for Liriano, I understand his high BABIP and that he's had bad luck, but the fact remains he has given up those hits. I think the Cy Young should be given to the guy who had the best year, not the guy who "would have had the best if year if not for his luck".

[Sportsforever]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

That's probably because of a ridiculously high .355 BABIP (1st in the AL and significantly above his career average). Chalk it up to bad luck. As for my WAR data...http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...n=2010&month=0

BTW...you could also say he's been incredibly lucky with that miniscule HR/FB%.

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by jth1331

Have you watched him pitch? Or are you just looking at statistics?

I watch as much NL West baseball as anyone I know, so the answer is yes.

Quote:

The fact is, Ubaldo pitched well, and made pitches to the point to get outs that he needed(as in ground balls). Yes, I will give you his walk ratio is rather poor for a supposed premier pitcher, but geez, it really is kinda annoying when people bust out stats and say a guy has just been lucky this year. Luck is a thing in sports whether people want to admit it or not. It can be lucky to have a wide strike zone in a game, or have Pujols just miss a hanger and then get him on the corner looking next pitch. Luck is a part of the game. Ubaldo has been great, and of course has gotten lucky.

Of course it is, but would you rather reward a pitcher who was legitimately great or a pitcher who looked great simply because some factors out of his control went his way? The latter has undeniably been the case for Jimenez.

There's no reason to reward inferior, yet lucky performance.

[snepp]

Quote: Originally Posted by jth1331

Have you watched him pitch? Or are you just looking at statistics?

Have you watched every start for every NL pitcher? Or are you just ignoring all the contrary data because it doesn't support your subjective opinion?

The "have you seen them play" line makes for a very, very poor argument.

[snepp]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sportsforever

BTW...you could also say he's been incredibly lucky with that miniscule HR/FB%.

That's very true. You'd expect him to have allowed 7 or 8 HR's at this point rather than just the 2.