Some Madden NFL 18 Game Style Details Revealed - Arcade, Simulation, Competitive

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jarodd21

From what I'm seeing for each mode you can still adjust the skill level. I was afraid if I choose simulation I would be stuck with Pro or All-Pro. It looks like I can put it on Simulation and crank it up to All-Madden which we would be a great thing for me. I have yet to play a Madden game where All-Pro resulted in a challenge for me personally.

This is the key for me...

IF we can choose Simulation Mode AND crank it up to All Madden difficulty AND have the sliders be functional, it would FINALLY afford us the ability to play a realistic, yet challenging game of video football...

Anything short of the above is just "same ole", IMHO...

[ODogg]

Quote: Originally Posted by DeuceDouglas

He also said he still doesn't get how fumbled snaps would be fun.

It wouldn't be fun if it happened to you. But you know what, it'd be more realistic and if you overcame it and won you'd feel more accomplished than if it hadn't happened.

See that's the problem if EA is looking at it like that. Fun is a large part of why people play games but so is realism. Unpredictability is a part of football. Having things happen outside of your control is a part of football. It's why games can take a huge turn the other way and it's why upsets can happen. It's also something that can make games interesting.

Right now if you're up 14-7 in Madden and there's not a lot of time left then you've 99% got it in the bag. In real football weird stuff like bobbled snaps happen meaning that if you're up 14-7 late in the game you're likely to win but it's not 99% likely to win like it is in the video game because hey, bobble snap and.."HOLY COW IT'S RECOVERED AND RETURNED FOR A TD..FOLKS...WE GOT OURSELVES A BALL GAME!!"

This line of thought of "well why would that be fun" really misses the idea that although it may not be fun for that particular play (if it happened to you) it'd make the game overall a lot more fun to play because it would be less predictable, less stale and thus much more exciting and dynamic..

[DeuceDouglas]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

This line of thought of "well why would that be fun" really misses the idea that although it may not be fun for that particular play (if it happened to you) it'd make the game overall a lot more fun to play because it would be less predictable, less stale and thus much more exciting and dynamic..

And hopefully that line of thought starts changing within the devs now that we have separate settings. Clint saying he still doesn't get why they would be fun is looking at it through the H2H prism. When I look at it and I'm sure a lot of sim guys would agree, it's the replication that is fun. I enjoy dropped passes, high, wide, and botched snaps, inaccurate throws, missed FG's, and the laundry list of things that the average user hates because it replicates what I see on Sunday. Is it fun? In the moment, not really. But the overall experience is more enjoyable and the game is much better because it adds to the dynamic of what could happen and that's what I think is more fun. Plus if the CPU happens to go all Philip Rivers on MNF and sends a game to OT where you win for a spot in first place, then the fun is off the charts.

[CM Hooe]

Here are some things I think wrt fumbled snaps:

1 - adding random fumbled snaps would absolutely not be fun by my definition of fun. For me, fun in a video game is defined as the sense of fulfillment derived from learning and subsequently mastering some sort of video game system or mechanic. I don't want to lose because the CPU literally decided I should lose; a random fumbled snap is literally a dice roll. I have zero control over that and I would feel A - robbed if it happened to me, and B - bewildered and cheap if I benefitted from one. Sure, it's "sim", but I do not care about that, it's a video game first. If fumbled snaps are introduced into the game, I personally would only approve of it as a game mechanic around snapping the football.

2 - adding a game mechanic for snapping the football is probably going to make the game more tedious than fun; it'd have to be easy-to-learn and easy-to-master (because how often do fumbled snaps happen, really?), which would make the exercise of game-ifying the snap at all unnecessary and tedious.

3 - It's also not like a fumbled snap game mechanic adds much new complexity to the game; adding a mechanic there and succeeding at it literally achieves the same result as just pressing A / X right now. It literally adds nothing from a game mechanics perspective. It adds from an authenticity perspective, sure, but I don't think it adds enough value there to overcome that lack of value from a game mechanic standpoint, so I could never justify spending time making a snapping mechanic to that end.

4 - if anything, I think that a snapping mechanic might only have significant value in performing long snapping duties on field goals and punts, as to increase the still rather mechanically banal kicking game. Even then I'd probably only limit it to high / low / inaccurate snaps, as to increase chances of blocked kicks.

[TheBleedingRed21]

You realize dice rolls are all over this game right?

Tackles, fumbles, catches, etc.

Obviously it would factor in center rating. This would keep people from playing out of position as a penalty.

I don't care if I seen it one time in a whole cycle I play as long as I have a center who is rated decent.

[jfsolo]

Quote: Originally Posted by ODogg

It wouldn't be fun if it happened to you. But you know what, it'd be more realistic and if you overcame it and won you'd feel more accomplished than if it hadn't happened. See that's the problem if EA is looking at it like that. Fun is a large part of why people play games but so is realism. Unpredictability is a part of football. Having things happen outside of your control is a part of football. It's why games can take a huge turn the other way and it's why upsets can happen. It's also something that can make games interesting. Right now if you're up 14-7 in Madden and there's not a lot of time left then you've 99% got it in the bag. In real football weird stuff like bobbled snaps happen meaning that if you're up 14-7 late in the game you're likely to win but it's not 99% likely to win like it is in the video game because hey, bobble snap and.."HOLY COW IT'S RECOVERED AND RETURNED FOR A TD..FOLKS...WE GOT OURSELVES A BALL GAME!!" This line of thought of "well why would that be fun" really misses the idea that although it may not be fun for that particular play (if it happened to you) it'd make the game overall a lot more fun to play because it would be less predictable, less stale and thus much more exciting and dynamic..

Quote: Originally Posted by DeuceDouglas

And hopefully that line of thought starts changing within the devs now that we have separate settings. Clint saying he still doesn't get why they would be fun is looking at it through the H2H prism. When I look at it and I'm sure a lot of sim guys would agree, it's the replication that is fun. I enjoy dropped passes, high, wide, and botched snaps, inaccurate throws, missed FG's, and the laundry list of things that the average user hates because it replicates what I see on Sunday. Is it fun? In the moment, not really. But the overall experience is more enjoyable and the game is much better because it adds to the dynamic of what could happen and that's what I think is more fun. Plus if the CPU happens to go all Philip Rivers on MNF and sends a game to OT where you win for a spot in first place, then the fun is off the charts.

Unfortunately since we're in the extreme minority opinion in terms of thinking that these things would actually add a lot of long term value to the game, especially in CFM, utilitarian designs will win out over the implementation of many of the snafu plays that make football so interesting.

[OhMrHanky]

Yeah, for me, the bobbled snap would add that extra level of realism. And, no, they would not make a mechanic for it, there is no need. And, I would say, they should toggle this type of 'miscue' as a slider. Meaning, I think even on sim, some guys may not want it. But, for me, this def adds realism. It's not just about being a 'fun' video game, it's about replicating what u see on Sunday. And, here, you've got another chance to tighten up your roster with a good center. And, don't forget, it's also on the QB. Anyone remember Dave krieg? I think he was the QB fumble master and/or bobbled snap master. Lol. Used to bobble em all the time. And, legit, could've been a reason to get rid of him. So, u mix center ability with QB fumble, u give it a dice roll with an extremely low chance, in general, of happening, and bang, u got something closer to real life football. Because, again, while, yes, madden is a video game, the ultimate creation of this video game was to replicate football. So, the more, the merrier, I say. And, sure, if u absolutely lose a game because of this, that's tough, but that's football. And, more hopefully, it happens at a time in the game where u have a chance to comeback. As others have said, it gives u that sense of satisfaction coming back from adversity. Same thing if u get called for a penalty on 3rd and 10 after scoring a TD. Having it called back to 3rd and 20, and seeing if u can overcome it. Overall, it would simply add more realism, but as I said should ABSOLUTELY be a toggle!! Lol.


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[SoxFan01605]

Quote: Originally Posted by CM Hooe

Here are some things I think wrt fumbled snaps: 1 - adding random fumbled snaps would absolutely not be fun by my definition of fun. For me, fun in a video game is defined as the sense of fulfillment derived from learning and subsequently mastering some sort of video game system or mechanic. I don't want to lose because the CPU literally decided I should lose; a random fumbled snap is literally a dice roll. I have zero control over that and I would feel A - robbed if it happened to me, and B - bewildered and cheap if I benefitted from one. Sure, it's "sim", but I do not care about that, it's a video game first. If fumbled snaps are introduced into the game, I personally would only approve of it as a game mechanic around snapping the football. 2 - adding a game mechanic for snapping the football is probably going to make the game more tedious than fun; it'd have to be easy-to-learn and easy-to-master (because how often do fumbled snaps happen, really?), which would make the exercise of game-ifying the snap at all unnecessary and tedious. 3 - It's also not like a fumbled snap game mechanic adds much new complexity to the game; adding a mechanic there and succeeding at it literally achieves the same result as just pressing A / X right now. It literally adds nothing from a game mechanics perspective. It adds from an authenticity perspective, sure, but I don't think it adds enough value there to overcome that lack of value from a game mechanic standpoint, so I could never justify spending time making a snapping mechanic to that end. 4 - if anything, I think that a snapping mechanic might only have significant value in performing long snapping duties on field goals and punts, as to increase the still rather mechanically banal kicking game. Even then I'd probably only limit it to high / low / inaccurate snaps, as to increase chances of blocked kicks.

Well, I certainly agree that it shouldn't be completely "random," but that also doesn't mean it needs a specific game mechanic tied to it to be fair or beneficial to the experience.

You also don't have full control of when fumbles happen, every time a player drop balls, if a play is misread, etc. Yet these things are part of the game and are all represented to varying degrees in Madden.

Make it a rating (or trait) or, even simpler, tie the odds of it's occurrence to position (would force some real decision making for OL), situation, etc (even to the point of it only having the chance of occurring under such circumstances).

It could also be made an option (similar to balks in The Show-though that is specifically tied to a user mechanic and doesn't impact AI, so it's not a perfect comparison, obviously).

The point being is that there are more ways to look at this than random vs tedious mechanic.