WW LXXIV Killer Kittens on Mount FujiMori day (GAME OVER- KITTENS WIN)

[Coffee Warlord]

I don't think the show cat will be a priority for the dogs. I think they would rather take a shot at the BG or olie not being guarded.

And the show cat really gives us no value so them being night killed would be better then the BG or Olie.

A duke role gives us no value?

Yeah, true, it more often winds up duking a villager, but c'mon now.

[Lathum]

A duke role gives us no value?

Yeah, true, it more often winds up duking a villager, but c'mon now.

I think the value it gives us is they can reveal and have it be 100% believable and un challangable.

[Passacaglia]

I think the value it gives us is they can reveal and have it be 100% believable and un challangable.

You mean it's unchallengable once we vote for him? I'd rather just vote heinz today, rather than waste a day voting for the duke.

[Lathum]

You mean it's unchallengable once we vote for him? I'd rather just vote heinz today, rather than waste a day voting for the duke.

not what I mean at all. Once the duke reveals no one can counter reveal as the same role so IMO that person is insta trusted.

[RendeR]

I don't think the show cat will be a priority for the dogs. I think they would rather take a shot at the BG or olie not being guarded.

And the show cat really gives us no value so them being night killed would be better then the BG or Olie.


The big point we're mising here is that with all these reveals we;re making it a LOT easier for the dogs to narrow down who the BG is, and thats gotta be their #1 target right now, if they nail the BG they can then pick off the KNOWN roles one after another without fear of retribution.

I'm glad yer keepin track of all of this lathum, but any more reveals basically dooms our bodyguard.

[Passacaglia]

The big point we're mising here is that with all these reveals we;re making it a LOT easier for the dogs to narrow down who the BG is, and thats gotta be their #1 target right now, if they nail the BG they can then pick off the KNOWN roles one after another without fear of retribution.

I'm glad yer keepin track of all of this lathum, but any more reveals basically dooms our bodyguard.

At this point, I don't think that's a big deal -- even if it's the BG, the wolves would be helping us by knocking off someone who isn't cleared.

[The Jackal]

I had a very busy day, just got back now and caught up. I think I'm actually going back to my day one vote. He's been pretty damn quiet and there's bound to be one wolf among us quiet folks, and I'm certainly not one.

Vote KWhit

[Passacaglia]

Thinking about the attempted kill of mccollins, I wonder if that was done to move the mob mentality to heinz. I've been pushing hard on him for trying to save PB, but it's rarely the first vote of the bandwagon that is the wolfy one -- it's the second or third. Since mccollins is looking good right now, I'm looking at KWhit. The flip side to this is: if mccollins and jeheinz are really both good, why not keep both alive, hoping we'll lynch one, then the other. Thoughts?

VOTE KWHIT

[Passacaglia]

oh shi

[The Jackal]

get out of my head pass

[Passacaglia]

I had a very busy day, just got back now and caught up. I think I'm actually going back to my day one vote. He's been pretty damn quiet and there's bound to be one wolf among us quiet folks, and I'm certainly not one.

Vote KWhit

I hate when that happens. The Jackal, you have anything more other than his quietude behind that?

[The Jackal]

I don't really think the show cat needs to reveal. I understand the merit for building a COT, but might as well keep the dogs in the dark as much as possible.

[The Jackal]

I hate when that happens. The Jackal, you have anything more other than his quietude behind that?

Not really, as he hasn't done much. I should go back and see how he voted, but its mostly a gut feeling. It's certainly not set in stone, but I don't have a better candidate at this juncture.

Do we think its possible that we hit two wolves on day 1 for two straight games? I have an eye on hoops, at the least.

[The Jackal]

And when I say we, I mean the village, since I was one of those wolves last game. ;)

[KWhit]

Not really, as he hasn't done much. I should go back and see how he voted, but its mostly a gut feeling. It's certainly not set in stone, but I don't have a better candidate at this juncture.

Do we think its possible that we hit two wolves on day 1 for two straight games? I have an eye on hoops, at the least.

Haven't done much? I'd say I've been more active in this game than you.

[Lathum]

I think KWhit is a good choice. He scares the crap out of me as a wolf. Plus he cast the second vote on Cronin day one, maybe saw a chance to take out a solid player day 1.

VOTE KWHIT

[KWhit]

Assuming noone comes out ALSO claiming they are Spartacus, I'm inclined to go with the simplest explanation: Olie is the seer, and Lathum is the fool. It fits.

Though if that IS the case, I think the seer reveal is not a real smooth move. Thinking about it in the car, I don't have a clue why she did. It's not worth revealing yourself just to clear Lathum.

The only reason I could think of, if she IS telling the truth, is she thinks I'm a wolf, and if I am, then that WOULD prove Lathum is lying.

Same here. I tend to believe both Lathum and Olie at this point.

But I don't understand why Olie is coming so hard after Lathum.

[KWhit]

Wow. So it's run on KWhit night?

[KWhit]

Thinking about the attempted kill of mccollins, I wonder if that was done to move the mob mentality to heinz. I've been pushing hard on him for trying to save PB, but it's rarely the first vote of the bandwagon that is the wolfy one -- it's the second or third. Since mccollins is looking good right now, I'm looking at KWhit. The flip side to this is: if mccollins and jeheinz are really both good, why not keep both alive, hoping we'll lynch one, then the other. Thoughts?

VOTE KWHIT


Checks something....

Ah.

Yes, you're the second vote on me.

[Passacaglia]

Checks something....

Ah.

Yes, you're the second vote on me.

;)

[Passacaglia]

Same here. I tend to believe both Lathum and Olie at this point.

But I don't understand why Olie is coming so hard after Lathum.

This has been confusing me, too, but I'm just focusing on the fact that they're probably both right, and leave it at that.

[The Jackal]

Haven't done much? I'd say I've been more active in this game than you.

Sorry if I've missed you posting or something. I had a pretty busy weekend and was lucky to be able to post this morning with that project I was working on. I'm just saying I've noticed you being much more assertive in other games, and playing style changes can often indicate not wanting to make too much noise as a wolf.

I certainly didn't mean to start a run on you.

[The Jackal]

I'll admit I was leaning towards voting for MC today, but that lolcat reveal without a counter-reveal of any sort is enough to give him a pass for now.

[The Jackal]

Anyone have a read on dang or seol? Having not played with them I don't want to make any rash judgements.

[Passacaglia]

Sorry if I've missed you posting or something. I had a pretty busy weekend and was lucky to be able to post this morning with that project I was working on. I'm just saying I've noticed you being much more assertive in other games, and playing style changes can often indicate not wanting to make too much noise as a wolf.

I certainly didn't mean to start a run on you.

So are you planning to change your vote?

[Passacaglia]

Anyone have a read on dang or seol? Having not played with them I don't want to make any rash judgements.

Sea Lion is a bit worrisome -- IIRC, he put a vote on PB Day 2, then unvoted and switched to hoopsguy. Dan has also not voted for PB.

[Passacaglia]

Sea Lion is a bit worrisome -- IIRC, he put a vote on PB Day 2, then unvoted and switched to hoopsguy. Dan has also not voted for PB.

To finish up the list of people who never voted for PB, you got heinz, RendeR, and EagleFan.

[The Jackal]

So are you planning to change your vote?

Not at this point, no. But that's only because I don't have a candidate I want to switch to at this point. I don't like rapid voting/unvoting either. I know your vote was merely coincidental but I'm surprised Lathum hopped on so fast.

[Lathum]

yeah, but can we go by who voted for PB, would the wolves know he was the chiwawa?

[oliegirl]

Sea Lion is a bit worrisome -- IIRC, he put a vote on PB Day 2, then unvoted and switched to hoopsguy. Dan has also not voted for PB.

ROFL...I'm assuming you guys are talking about Seolian :)

[Coffee Warlord]

yeah, but can we go by who voted for PB, would the wolves know he was the chiwawa?

Yes. I specifically asked if the minimutt had PM rights earlier in the thread.

[The Jackal]

Dang, Sea, and Eagle are probably hovering around my suspicion level of KWhit, so I'll be considering all of them between now and the deadline.

I'm getting a weird read off Heinz. My gut about him is usually right when he's a wolf, and I'm not feeling that way this game.

RendeR and I have been involved too much recently for me to make a move on him right now with no real evidence, so I'm not touching that. :)

[The Jackal]

ROFL...I'm assuming you guys are talking about Seolian :)

we'll call him what we want, just think of all the different ways people spell jackal. :)

[Passacaglia]

Not at this point, no. But that's only because I don't have a candidate I want to switch to at this point. I don't like rapid voting/unvoting either. I know your vote was merely coincidental but I'm surprised Lathum hopped on so fast.

What about EagleFan?

[oliegirl]

we'll call him what we want, just think of all the different ways people spell jackal. :)

I have no problem with it...it cracks me up actually. I can pretty much promise you that I'll be calling him Sea Lion at home from time to time ;)

[Lathum]

just imagine what it's like to be Saldana

[Passacaglia]

Dang, Sea, and Eagle are probably hovering around my suspicion level of KWhit, so I'll be considering all of them between now and the deadline.

I'm getting a weird read off Heinz. My gut about him is usually right when he's a wolf, and I'm not feeling that way this game.

RendeR and I have been involved too much recently for me to make a move on him right now with no real evidence, so I'm not touching that. :)

Damn, another cross-post.

[Passacaglia]

I have no problem with it...it cracks me up actually. I can pretty much promise you that I'll be calling him Sea Lion at home from time to time ;)

uh, clap asked for no pillow talk

[Coffee Warlord]

just imagine what it's like to be Saldana

I'd have boobs.

[Lathum]

I'd have boobs.

very true

[RendeR]

To finish up the list of people who never voted for PB, you got heinz, RendeR, and EagleFan.


You should check more carefully, I originally voted for PB because he was setting off my radar badly. Then he had the (in hindsight) fake-reveal and I gave him the benefit of the doubt and moved my vote.

[RendeR]

problem is, no one is really triggering my doggie-sense right now other than lathum and even I can't really vote lathum based on what evidence there is out there.


hrm...Place holder vote:

SEA LION

Just because thats one of the funniest name conversions I've seen here in a while.

[Lathum]

how could I possibly be triggering your dog radar?

I swear, it is tough always getting labeled by the man.

[claphamsa]

problem is, no one is really triggering my doggie-sense right now other than lathum and even I can't really vote lathum based on what evidence there is out there.


hrm...Place holder vote:

SEA LION

Just because thats one of the funniest name conversions I've seen here in a while.


better than passacaligula?

[Coffee Warlord]

So, since my favorite candidate is quasi-cleared for the moment, I'm looking at the people who voted hoops over PB.

That gives me EagleFan, Lathum, and Sea Lion. Crossing Lathum off the list, it's between EF and the Sea Cat. Neither of them have inspired a whole lot of confidence for me. Going back to day 1, EF was on hoops, Sealion was on me.

And I see Eagle on, so before I put a vote on him...

Eagly? Poke poke. Give me some reasons not to vote for you.

[Passacaglia]

You should check more carefully, I originally voted for PB because he was setting off my radar badly. Then he had the (in hindsight) fake-reveal and I gave him the benefit of the doubt and moved my vote.

I meant final votes -- I'm not really concerned with who you had your vote on before it counted. If anything, having your vote on PB, then taking it off makes you look MORE suspicious.

[EagleFan]

To finish up the list of people who never voted for PB, you got heinz, RendeR, and EagleFan.

My initial day one vote was on PB, and he was near the top of my suspect list. I didn't vote for him day 2 because of his reveal, now fake reveal and had suspected cronin so I initially voted for him. After it seemed that cronion was cleared I moved my vote off cronin but it was before the potential outing of the fake PB reveal so I was giving him another day as benefit of the doubt.

When I finally got back on this morning the late rush had begun on PB so I figured the vote was already decided and moving to himthen would not do anything for my standing so why bother changing t that point.

With that said I have to go with my initial suspicion of the pairs of wolves in my post last night (pretty sure it was last night as the weekend kind of blends together). If that doesn't pan out then I will have to take a serious look at hoops as something is striking me odd about his posts.


Now to respond to CW:

I can't really defend myself much here as I don't really know what else to say but I will try to put together a better list of what I think about each of the remaining players and where there allegiance may fall. I have finally begun to get a CoT and I will have their back as best I can but CW is not on that list yet so please give us a reason to not vote for you CW...

[Passacaglia]

better than passacaligula?

I dunno...cronion is a pretty good one, too.

[EagleFan]

I'll post more after the game is finished. Getting very hard to concentrate with that going on in the background.

[The Jackal]

I'll post more after the game is finished. Getting very hard to concentrate with that going on in the background.

overtimes are fun

[EagleFan]

overtimes are fun

Triple OT coming up, I almost don't want to end (even though I am not a fan of either but it's been entertaining).

[mccollins]

As I head to bed, I'll throw it out there that for now I believe the reveals and won't be voting for these players.

There have been no counters, but I see Chief Rum online now and I'm interested to hear his thoughts on all this.

[The Jackal]

Triple OT coming up, I almost don't want to end (even though I am not a fan of either but it's been entertaining).

i dont want it to end either.. i'm pretty pissed at the pens right now and i don't particularly like detroit but this has been a great game

[Chief Rum]

deadline!

and this sucks! im not a 0 anymore :(


Fear not, clap. You'll always be a 0 to me. :)

[Chief Rum]

This is a tough game to get a hold of and learn what each other is doing for sure. So much changing votes and everything, but I guess that is expected when we really dont know who is who and it changes from game to game. Does it get easier to read people the longer you play?

Didn't see anyone respond to this yet.

Yes and no. Yes, you get a feel for some players and how they play, and sometimes you can get very in tune with them. Sometimes, though, you will always get a bad read, or a bad impression. It's different for different players.

Where possible I always try to "refresh" everyone in my mind, so I can judge their actions rationally, but it's difficult to do. In some respect, you as a new player might have the best, most uncluttered view.

[Chief Rum]

you decide that Perdue brad looks like he maybe a dog pretending to be a kitten! you take him off to the pool to drown and he starts yipping! and swims across the pool, before he come out the other side, and huge LOLRUSS comes up and eats him....

PERDUE BRAD WAS THE CHIHUHUA

Wow, great job, guys! Kudos to st.cronin (I haven't gotten tot he night deadline, so I hope he's still alive).

I am guessing my coin flip theory came up tails.

[Chief Rum]

As I head to bed, I'll throw it out there that for now I believe the reveals and won't be voting for these players.

There have been no counters, but I see Chief Rum online now and I'm interested to hear his thoughts on all this.

Oh just saw this. Sorry, mccollins, I will try to respond soon, but being away all day means I have to catch up. I just got to the day deadline. I'll try to speed it up.

[Chief Rum]

Personally, no, I don't.

I mean if the stray is somehow STILL out there, now they REALLY need to come forward, but I don't think anyone but Cronin is the stray.

BTW, I'm not the stray, so as far as I know, cronin is telling the truth.

[Chief Rum]

I still am not sure what to make of CR's vote on me.

If you recall, CW, my vote really didn't have anything to do with any information or overt game actions, but where you voted and the eliminations of others from consideration for that vote alone. It wasn't that you were necessarily a good candidate, but based on what I knew and using some (now shown to be false) guesswork, you came out as the best candidate.

Now that I know PB was indeed a wolf, that blew my little analysis all to hell and gone, so the reason to vote for you is now gone. Doesn't clear you, but your clear of my faulty reasoning when I made the vote.

[Chief Rum]

I have now gotten several hours past the day deadline, when PB's doggyness was revealed, and no one has yet posted a re-analysis of the Day One vote? Are we rolling with st.cronin's take?

[Chief Rum]

Another look at day 1:

Coffee Warlord votes Hoopsguy (111)
EagleFan votes PurdueBrad (128)
KWhit votes jeheinz72 (133)
Lathum votes Coffee Warlord (135)
The Jackal votes KWhit (140)
jeheinz72 votes The Jackal (150)
st.cronin votes Lathum (157)
PurdueBrad votes st.cronin (168)
st.cronin unvotes Lathum, votes PurdueBrad (174)
oliegirl votes hoopsguy (185)
Lathum unvotes Coffee Warlord, votes PurdueBrad (187)
Coffee Warlord unvotes hoopsguy, votes oliegirl (188)
jeheinz72 unvotes The Jackal, votes hoopsguy (189)
Seolian votes Coffee Warlord (193)
EagleFan unvotes PurdueBrad (197)
Chief Rum votes PurdueBrad (201)
EagleFan votes hoopsguy (203)
dangarion votes Lathum (204)
Seolian unvotes Coffee Warlord, votes Lathum (207) ***I think this vote was ruled illegal
Alan T votes PurdueBrad (209)
mccollins votes EagleFan (218)
PurdueBrad unvotes st.cronin, votes for mccollins (232)
Lathum unvotes PurdueBrad, votes mccollins (235)
hoopsguy votes jeheinz72 (250)
jeheinz72 unvotes hoopsguy, votes st.cronin (270)
mccollins unvotes EagleFan, votes st.cronin (283)
KWhit unvotes jeheinz72, votes st.cronin (290)
st.cronin gets nervous
Passacaglia votes hoopsguy (299)
Coffee Warlord unvotes oliegirl, votes PurdueBrad (311)
PurdueBrad unvotes mccollins (313)
Lathum unvotes mccollins, votes hoopsguy (314)
hoopsguy unvotes jeheinz72, votes st.cronin (318)
mccollins unvotes st.cronin, votes Coffee Warlord (358)
PurdueBrad votes hoopsguy (364)
Lathum unvotes hoopsguy, votes st.cronin (366)
Passacaglia unvotes hoopsguy, votes PurdueBrad (367)
PurdueBrad unvotes hoopsguy, votes st.cronin (371)

Passacaglia, I think, has to be considered kitteh. PurdueBrad was under a lot of pressure, but did put a vote on hoopsguy late. He did move this vote, so I'm not sure much can be read into it. KWhit, mccollins, and jeheinz72 all moved onto me fairly late. I am guessing at least one of those is a wolf.

Oh good. :)

[Chief Rum]

Okay, I like the whittling CODT (Distrust) we got going, even if I am on it. That's a pretty fair group to go off of, and still includes a lot of people I have had suspicions about at some point or another throughout the game.

I am not liking the KWhit vote right now. When I did my analysis the other night, I went over KWhit a lot, and I just didn't buy it. He votes too soon for one thing, on Day One. Wolves don't usually vote that eitherm especially when they will be around later (he was, he changed his vote closer to deadlone).

And as I told PB (ironically) last night, I'm not a big believer in the "wolves are in the run" theory, especially when the run is so obvious. KWhit in particular, as a veteran player, would not put the third vote down in a three vote run on st. cronin if he were a wolf. So KWhit doesn't fly for me.

Passacaglia was another I was looking at, but, IMO, his vote of PB at the deadline on Day One essentially clears him. No way a wolf makes that move, even a crafty one like Pass.

It's not time to gun for the newbie UTRs, although I would not be shocked at all if at least one of dang or sea lion was a butt sniffer.

That leaves EF, Render and jeheinz. EF's recent past and how it meshes with my impressions leaves me with the belief he's fine for now. And I haven't seen anything overtly wolfish from Render.

So that leaves jeheinz with his well-timed cigarette trip. Hmm...

VOTE JEHEINZ

[Chief Rum]

"eitherm" = "early"

Nice, I not only chose a completely incorrect word in my typing haste, I also had an ugly typo.

[EagleFan]

I'll take a shot at this. Still watching the game so I hope I can connect the dots:

1.Hoopsguy
Seemed to figure out the PB fake reveal quickly. Has been active. My guess is he has a role of some sort or is a wolf. Not screaming out as a vanilla villager.

vote history:
day 1 - vote jeheinz (250)
day 1 - unvote jeheinz, vote cronin (318)
day 2 - vote PB (663) *** wonders why no PB reveal on day one

3.Kwitt
I have no real feel for his game yet. To be honest I keep forgetting that he is playing for some reason.

vote history:
day 1 - vote jeheinz (133)
day 1 - unvote jeheinz, vote cronin (290)
day 2 - vote mccollins (612)
day 2 - vote PB (728)
day 2 - unvote mccollins, vote PB (736)

4.jeheinze
I speculated that he may be a wolf along with PB due to the pattern of their votes. Adding to my suspicion was a defensive reply to a comment Pass made about votes seeming wolfish though he was not mentioned in the post he was replying to. CoD

vote history:
day 1 - vote The Jackal (150)
day 1 - unvote Jackal, vote hoops (189)
day 1 - unvote hoops, vote cronin (270)
day 2 - vote cronin (505)
day 2 - unvote cronin, vote EF (721)
day 2 - unvote EF, vote PB (745)

5.Lathum
Seems too connected to PB, including a reasoning to keep him around for a few more days when gth evote turned against him day 2 and attempting to turn the tide against hoops. Claims to be the fool, based upon cronin's claim of being the stray. Too many strange moves aound his vote and too tied into PB. CoD

vote history:
day 1 - vote Coffee Warlord (135)
day 1 - unvote CW, vote PB (187)
day 1 - unvote PB, vote mccollins (235) *** quickly following PB's switch to mccollins
day 1 - unvote mccollins, vote hoops (314) *** quickly following PB's unvote of mccollins
day 1 - unvote hoops, vote cronin (366)
day 2 - vote PB (516)
day 2 - unvote PB (528) *** claims vote was a joke after being called out fo it
day 2 - vote PB (594)
day 2 - unvote PB, vote hoops (670)

6.Mcollins
LOLCat from what he tells us. Not sure how this role plays in but I see no reason to suspect him at this time as he cannot be killed so he can only be lynched and we're not going to lynch one of our own. In my CoT.

vote history:
day 1 - vote EagleFan (218)
day 1 - unvote EF, vote cronin (283)
day 1 - unvote cronin, vote CW (358)
day 2 - vote CW (493)

7.Passacaglia
Not completely sure yet. He tried to call me out for my posts which were a combination of the joke vote for oliegirl (though I explained my reasons for that vote clearly in the vote post) and my comments towards a few others. I can't get any read from him yet.

vote history:
day 1 -vote hoops (299)
day 1 - unvote hoops, vote PB (367)
day 2 - vote PB (508)
day 2 - unvote PB (665)
day 2 - vote mccollins (690)
day 2 - unvote mccollins, vote PB (750)

8.RendeR
A no vote on day one is enough to make me look twice at him. Plus he is never this quiet in the few games I have been in with him.

vote history:
day 1 - no vote *** always suspicious, though he had a good explanation
day 2 - vote PB (593)
day 2 - unvote PB, vote EF (674)

9.St. Cronin
Has revealed as the stray. If this holds true it would make him full blooded feline. CoT

vote history:
day 1 - vote Lathum (157)
day 1 - unvote Lathum, voe PurdueBrad (174)
day 2 - vote PB (506)

10.Oliegirl
No feel one way or the other for her side yet. Something tells me that she is on the same side as her husband though, to help a new player.

vote history:
day 1 - vote hoopsguy (185)
day 2 - vote EF (561) *** response to my vote
day 2 - unvote EF (569)
day 2 - vote PB (610)

11.Eaglefan
Suspected PurdueBrad as BS reveal, wanted to give benefitof the doubt as he may be the fool which still would have made him a cat. My change from the PB vote should be viewed as suspicious, though I was calling him out prior to his reveal.

vote history:
day 1 - vote PurdueBrad (128)
day 1 - unvote PurdueBrad (197)
day 1 - vote hoops (203)
day 2 - vote oliegirl (557) *** vote was a joke for dragging her husband to see Sex in the City
day 2 - unvote oliegirl (564)
day 2 - vote cronin (582)
day 2 - unvote cronin, vote hoops (657) *** removed vote for cronin as he would look to likely be good following PB's reveal, even if PB's reveal was fake

12.the Jackal
No feel but the PB vote prior to PB being revealed as a fake seems quite a bit like a wolf trying to get on board before the trend.

vote history:
day 1 - vote KWhit (140)
day 2 - vote PB (683) *** after the fake reveal of PB but before it was exposed

13.coffee warlord
Seemedto be very much in favor of lynching mccollins, a now known cat.

vote history:
day 1 - vote hoops (111)
day 1 - unvote hoops, vote oliegirl (188)
day 1 - unvote oliegirl, vote PB (311)
day 2 - vote mccollins (562)
day 2 - unvote mccollins, vote PB (726)

14.seolian
Very new so very hard to read. Odd late vote to hoops on day 2 which changed one throw away vote for another.

vote history:
day 1 - vote CW (193)
day 1 - unvote CW, vote Lathum (207)
day 2 - vote PB (611)
day 2 - unvote PB, vote mccollins (692)
day 2 - unvote mccollins, vote hoops (772)

15.dangarion
Can't figure out his play. New? (not that I'm a vet)

vote history:
day 1 - vote Lathum (204)
day 2 - vote cronin (743)

17.Chief Rum
I have no real feel for his play yet. At least staying under my radar.

vote history
day 1 - vote PB (201)
day 2 - vote CW (661)

[EagleFan]

The above includes only up to the Lathum reveal. Time to get some sleep. I'll put a place holder in for the night and hope to get back online for a few tomorrow.


vote jheinz

[Seolian]

VOTE JEHEINZ

Just going off gut and the way he voted the previous days.

[Lathum]

I have no idea wht eaglesfan would have me in his distrust list. I can only think it is because he is trying to set me up if we have a showdown later.

But if he is to believe olie then he should have no reason to doubt me.

[oliegirl]

Something struck me funny last night...Lathum is going on and on about how when he tries to help as a villager everyone suspects him, etc...yet his "title" for the board is "World's Greatest Wolf"... :D

I'm willing to back off Lathum today, however I still don't trust him completely...if whatever goes on today clears him, then I'll admit I'm wrong...but in the spirit of doing what is best for the village, I'll grant him a temporary stay of execution...

[jeheinz72]

So that leaves jeheinz with his well-timed cigarette trip. Hmm...



I know Chief won't be back to reply to this, but why would I say I'd break the tie and then not do it, if I were a wolf?

It's risky enough for a wolf to even be involved in a vote move close to the deadline, let alone to say he's going to switch his vote and not do it, and broadcast that fact to the entire game.

I know this time of line has been used before, but, do you all really think I'm that stupid?

[jeheinz72]

Something struck me funny last night...Lathum is going on and on about how when he tries to help as a villager everyone suspects him, etc...yet his "title" for the board is "World's Greatest Wolf"... :D

I'm willing to back off Lathum today, however I still don't trust him completely...if whatever goes on today clears him, then I'll admit I'm wrong...but in the spirit of doing what is best for the village, I'll grant him a temporary stay of execution...

Olie, I think for now we have to call a spade a spade here and just go with the fact that you are likely the seer and lathum is likely the fool.

I just don't see how whomever is truly the 2nd half of the Seer/Fool combo could not have come forward yet. If they're out there, they need to pipe up, for then we surely have a wolf.

Otherwise it's looking like the vote is down to me and KWhit, and I can guarantee you that that pair of people is at the very least half-wrong.

[mccollins]

WOW EagleFan, thanks for doing all that work.

[jeheinz72]

Well, from what I can gather it's like 3-3ish me and KWhit, so i'll put this in as self-defense. I'll full well change this should a better defense come available.

I don't know if I for sure think he's a wolf. He could be, he's certainly not cleared. Personally I like the EagleFan option better, but hey, I'm not exactly in a position to be picky about things.

Vote KWhit

[Coffee Warlord]

Vote Sea Lion

Of the EF & Sea Lion pair that I feel deserve voting consideration today, and based on the switches they've made, this is where I'm gonna go for the time being. I don't have a problem with lynching jeheinz, as I agree, his record has been highly spotty. If it comes down to having to make a decision there, I'll move.

And EF, to answer your question as to why I should be trusted, I don't have a good one. I'd like to think I've been highly active, and inspired conversations and thought about the various people I've been poking and prodding. I could be dead wrong about anyone I've been gunning for (and it's looking like I was wrong with mickey C), but I'd rather be wrong and get people talking. More conversations mean more chances for the mutts to slip up.

If you think I've been less helpful and more just trying to muddle the waters, then there's not much I can do there.

Anyway. Mornin' kids.

[st.cronin]

Assuming noone comes out ALSO claiming they are Spartacus, I'm inclined to go with the simplest explanation: Olie is the seer, and Lathum is the fool. It fits.

Though if that IS the case, I think the seer reveal is not a real smooth move. Thinking about it in the car, I don't have a clue why she did. It's not worth revealing yourself just to clear Lathum.

The only reason I could think of, if she IS telling the truth, is she thinks I'm a wolf, and if I am, then that WOULD prove Lathum is lying.

Still catching up, but I believe olie. I have thought that she was a seer, based on some of her posts, for a while now. I don't think it was a bad reveal - I think its possible that the wolves had caught on that she was a seer, so its good to have the information out in the open.

[Passacaglia]

I know Chief won't be back to reply to this, but why would I say I'd break the tie and then not do it, if I were a wolf?

It's risky enough for a wolf to even be involved in a vote move close to the deadline, let alone to say he's going to switch his vote and not do it, and broadcast that fact to the entire game.

I know this time of line has been used before, but, do you all really think I'm that stupid?

Do you really need him to answer that? The tie was between PB (wolf) and cronin (likely villager), and the only way you could have broken the tie was by unvoting cronin, thus lynching PB. As for why you'd say you'd break the tie, well, you really *do* hate ties, so you're just playing like you would as a villager there. I'll have to look at when you said it -- if hoops and cronin are the lead vote-getters at that time, you're just screwed.

[Passacaglia]

Olie, I think for now we have to call a spade a spade here and just go with the fact that you are likely the seer and lathum is likely the fool.

I just don't see how whomever is truly the 2nd half of the Seer/Fool combo could not have come forward yet. If they're out there, they need to pipe up, for then we surely have a wolf.

Otherwise it's looking like the vote is down to me and KWhit, and I can guarantee you that that pair of people is at the very least half-wrong.

My hunch is that olie is trying to shed some doubt on her being the real seer, so that the wolves won't target her. But at this point, I don't think anyone's buying it, so I think it's important that the BG protects her tonight, rather than doubt what's going on here.

[st.cronin]

I also really don't get why people don't trust Lathum. Absent somebody else claiming to be a seer/fool, there is no reason not to believe both Lathum and oliegirl.

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066



let me know if i missed anything, pages and pages to go through!

[jeheinz72]

i think Lathum voted for KWhit (Unless he forgot to unvote or something, I don't know)

[Passacaglia]

I'll reverse it - if you are going to reveal as a seer why would you do it on Day 2 and not Day 1? That is what struck me as odd - there are players who take their role with them to their death, but PB hasn't been one of those in the past.

I felt that if he was the seer he would have given us a chance to learn that during the Day 1 lynch rather than chance us gimping the village out of the shoot. His own past behavior suggested this. He also had ample opportunity to do this leading up to the deadline, but he didn't cite a single post within 100 of the deadline where he dropped a hint.

I think the more interesting question here is why he didn't fake reveal on Day 1. Did he feel comfortable with the wolves level of control over the vote? Did the wolves know the tie-breaker mechanism? Did he just not think of it with less time to react (24 hours instead of 72 hours)? I don't have an answer for this right now.

I agree with your sentiment of the last paragraph -- I think it's poor play to have revealed Day 2 instead of Day 1, just not necessarily an indicator of wolfiness. The vote went down a little weird, with three likely villagers (me, Lathum, and mccollins) switching votes toward the end. The idea of the wolves knowing the tie-breaker crossed my mind, too -- the usual tie-breaker of first vote placed would have lynched PB, so if I were on the wolf team, I would have been afraid of that. I can't imagine that he didn't think of it, since he'd been dropping the hints during Day 1.

[jeheinz72]

Do you really need him to answer that? The tie was between PB (wolf) and cronin (likely villager), and the only way you could have broken the tie was by unvoting cronin, thus lynching PB. As for why you'd say you'd break the tie, well, you really *do* hate ties, so you're just playing like you would as a villager there. I'll have to look at when you said it -- if hoops and cronin are the lead vote-getters at that time, you're just screwed.

IIRC it was a 3-way still (not that it helps much).

But why actually post that I'll break the tie? Why not just vanish until like 12:10?

[Seolian]

Not sure who Sea Lion is but he sounds like he could be a kitten since a lion is a cat by the way. So not real sure why you are voting for a kitten, Coffee, but I guess that does kind of tell that you dont really know who is a dog or a cat yet.

[Passacaglia]

I also really don't get why people don't trust Lathum. Absent somebody else claiming to be a seer/fool, there is no reason not to believe both Lathum and oliegirl.

++

[Passacaglia]

IIRC it was a 3-way still (not that it helps much).

But why actually post that I'll break the tie? Why not just vanish until like 12:10?

I don't know. Why DID you do it?

[claphamsa]

i think Lathum voted for KWhit (Unless he forgot to unvote or something, I don't know)


he did, but he had already voted for Olie, and i didnt see an unvote.

[jeheinz72]

I know I'm not exactly posting from a position of clout, but Pass isn't in any cleared group is he?

I mean it's one thing to point out my record is spotty, it's another to reply to basically any post I make, even the ones where I admit to being culpable to drive the nail home.

It wouldn't shock me to find one of EF/Seolian is a wolf and Pass is trying to help ensure that I'm far-and-away the best candidate.

Take that for what it's worth (ain't much I'd imagine).

[st.cronin]

I would definitely be in favor of oliegirl scanning hoopsguy tonight, for the record. And the bodyguard needs to protect her. Don't get tricky and try to get a block - protect oliegirl. If the wolves kill somebody else, so be it.

[st.cronin]

I know I'm not exactly posting from a position of clout, but Pass isn't in any cleared group is he?

I mean it's one thing to point out my record is spotty, it's another to reply to basically any post I make, even the ones where I admit to being culpable to drive the nail home.

It wouldn't shock me to find one of EF/Seolian is a wolf and Pass is trying to help ensure that I'm far-and-away the best candidate.

Take that for what it's worth (ain't much I'd imagine).

Pass is not completely cleared, but on day 1 he made a very late vote for PurdueBrad. That's very compelling evidence of kitten-ness, to me.

[Passacaglia]

I know I'm not exactly posting from a position of clout, but Pass isn't in any cleared group is he?

I mean it's one thing to point out my record is spotty, it's another to reply to basically any post I make, even the ones where I admit to being culpable to drive the nail home.

It wouldn't shock me to find one of EF/Seolian is a wolf and Pass is trying to help ensure that I'm far-and-away the best candidate.

Take that for what it's worth (ain't much I'd imagine).

And I'm doing that by placing my vote on KWhit?

[Passacaglia]

Pass is not completely cleared, but on day 1 he made a very late vote for PurdueBrad. That's very compelling evidence of kitten-ness, to me.

Yeah, Pass is on my trsuted list, as well.

[st.cronin]

I also agree with Lathum that the duke should reveal, and asap. The duke reveals, and olie gets one more scan - that will give us a formidable cot. We don't want oliegirl scanning the duke tonight, that would be a waste.

[Coffee Warlord]

I also really don't get why people don't trust Lathum. Absent somebody else claiming to be a seer/fool, there is no reason not to believe both Lathum and oliegirl.

I think people find it hard when they see World's Greatest Wolf on his title. :)

But joking aside, I agree. If someone hasn't come forward by now, I think we can safely place Oli and Lathum as fully trusted.

[jeheinz72]

I don't know. Why DID you do it?

Because I actually did intend to. I know it sounds lame, but I got held up. I thought I'd be gone 5-minutes, max. Then I sit down and I have 2 minutes left and like 10-15 posts to decipher and then I wanted to do a final refresh just to make sure I wasn't inadvertently *causing* a tie and time was up.

Look, I know it was stupid. It was a bad play.

But it's not like I was the only person who was on Cronin who was around at the deadline who didn't switch (KWhit was as well)

[jeheinz72]

Pass is not completely cleared, but on day 1 he made a very late vote for PurdueBrad. That's very compelling evidence of kitten-ness, to me.

Yeah, that's a pretty solid point, for sure. That's big.

Carry on!

[jeheinz72]

Olie, I'd like to suggest you scan me tonight, if I'm somehow not lynched.

Let's face facts, the wolves won't night kill me (well, they shouldn't but granted they did try to kill mccollins) and it's pretty clear I'll be a distraction until somehow cleared. So you'd not only clear someone, you'd clear someone who is likely the least trusted into the trusted pile, whittling down lynch options.

[jeheinz72]

And I'm doing that by placing my vote on KWhit?

Then what's with the grilling...for going on like 2 days now...

[Passacaglia]

Because I actually did intend to. I know it sounds lame, but I got held up. I thought I'd be gone 5-minutes, max. Then I sit down and I have 2 minutes left and like 10-15 posts to decipher and then I wanted to do a final refresh just to make sure I wasn't inadvertently *causing* a tie and time was up.

Look, I know it was stupid. It was a bad play.

But it's not like I was the only person who was on Cronin who was around at the deadline who didn't switch (KWhit was as well)

Fair enough. I don't know what the point of guaranteeing that you'll break the tie is, though. If you don't like ties, I hear ya, just break it if you want to -- no need to posture about it. When you do that, it sounds like you're telling everyone else to back off, since you're going to "take care of it" -- someone like KWhit, who could have broken the tie, might have held off, thinking you were going to do something. FWIW, that's good or bad, considering that KWhit might have got cronin lynched trying to simply break the tie.

Anyway, you've got your vote on KWhit, but it's pretty much self defense. IIRC, you've shed a lot of suspicion on EagleFan. It sounds like if you had your choice on where to put your vote, it would be there. I know your reasoning is somewhere buried, but would you mind running it by me again? I don't have much other than "acting weird" for him.

[Passacaglia]

Then what's with the grilling...for going on like 2 days now...

I thought you were admitting it was a bad play. You think I should just leave it at that, and not bother grilling you?

[Passacaglia]

To clarify, when I talk about the bad play that makes me grill you, I'm not talking about the tiebreaker nonsense. I'm talking about how, when PB got a pretty good lead Day 1, you swung things toward cronin.

[KWhit]

I have a meeting from 10- 12 and will try to get out a little early for the deadline, but just in case I can't:

Self preservation vote:

Vote Jeheinz

[Passacaglia]

EF, I have to disagree with your analysis of The Jackal a little bit. You said he voted for PB before his fake reveal was exposed. However, he quotes a post by cronin saying 'I believe PB is lying.' -- the details of the reveal may not have been exposed, but if The Jackal was a wolf, then he would know cronin has something up his sleeve.

[jeheinz72]

Fair enough. I don't know what the point of guaranteeing that you'll break the tie is, though. If you don't like ties, I hear ya, just break it if you want to -- no need to posture about it. When you do that, it sounds like you're telling everyone else to back off, since you're going to "take care of it" -- someone like KWhit, who could have broken the tie, might have held off, thinking you were going to do something. FWIW, that's good or bad, considering that KWhit might have got cronin lynched trying to simply break the tie.

Anyway, you've got your vote on KWhit, but it's pretty much self defense. IIRC, you've shed a lot of suspicion on EagleFan. It sounds like if you had your choice on where to put your vote, it would be there. I know your reasoning is somewhere buried, but would you mind running it by me again? I don't have much other than "acting weird" for him.

KWhit didn't hold off though, he posted multiple times in the last 10 minutes for people to NOT switch their vote. I think, if he's a wolf, if anything he knew that he couldn't switch. Same gambit I'm in I suppose. KWhit couldn't have gotten Cronin lynched, he was on Cronin already (as I was)


Re: EagleFan, something just didn't sit right with me in his early Day 2. Maybe it was just the rapid-fire calling out of like 3-4 people then

In the early goings he lists NINE people (me, collins, PB, Cronin, and half-calls-out you, Jackal, RendeR, olie, Lathum)

But what doesn't reconcile is in post 626, PB takes his vote from CW (where he was 1 of 2) and puts it on EF (and was the 1st voter). Now maybe PB was just keen there at EF was about to pick up votes based on the sheer number of people he pinged, but one would think that if PB, who at the time was ahead 6-2-2-2 was going to move it'd be to create a 6-3-2 situation and not a 6-2-2 one. Especially since Collins (one of the 2's) had some doubt on him.

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100

[Passacaglia]

IIRC it was a 3-way still (not that it helps much).

But why actually post that I'll break the tie? Why not just vanish until like 12:10?

This is true that it was a 3-way tie. However, it's important to note that PB hadn't placed a vote yet.

[oliegirl]

I really, really don't think that SeaLion is a wolf...as a first time wolf I had a lot of help from my fellow wolves (Shrek game) and they made sure I didn't do anything super obvious like late vote moves and that sort of thing. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt for now, but he isn't in the clear.

I'm torn on where to vote right now - EF, Kwhit or Ketchup Boy. I'll decide shortly though...anyone have a current vote count? (Unless one was posted while I was typing this)

[jeheinz72]

I thought you were admitting it was a bad play. You think I should just leave it at that, and not bother grilling you?

Grilling is one thing, but we're going on 2 days of me going over the same scenario and all along I've admitted it wasn't a good play. It's not like i'm trying to cast it as me doing a smart thing here.

I just think time/energy is better served elsewhere. I can't imagine a scenario where someone hasn't formed their opinion on my bad play yet.

[jeheinz72]

To clarify, when I talk about the bad play that makes me grill you, I'm not talking about the tiebreaker nonsense. I'm talking about how, when PB got a pretty good lead Day 1, you swung things toward cronin.

Well by the same toke, I'm a kitten. How was I supposed to know, at the time, that PB was the wolf and Cronin was the stray? I think I had pretty good reason to vote for Cronin. His talk about who to vote for (voting for a lead candidate or voting for whom one thinks is a wolf) indeed *is* wildly inconsistent from previous games I played with him.

And I didn't "swing" anything. I placed my vote on someone I thought at the time was a wolf. People came *after* and joined me on him, and it's not like there weren't already other candidates in the mix as well against PB.

[jeheinz72]

This is true that it was a 3-way tie. However, it's important to note that PB hadn't placed a vote yet.

It is, if only I paid attention to such things. :D

[Passacaglia]

KWhit didn't hold off though, he posted multiple times in the last 10 minutes for people to NOT switch their vote. I think, if he's a wolf, if anything he knew that he couldn't switch. Same gambit I'm in I suppose. KWhit couldn't have gotten Cronin lynched, he was on Cronin already (as I was)


Re: EagleFan, something just didn't sit right with me in his early Day 2. Maybe it was just the rapid-fire calling out of like 3-4 people then

In the early goings he lists NINE people (me, collins, PB, Cronin, and half-calls-out you, Jackal, RendeR, olie, Lathum)

But what doesn't reconcile is in post 626, PB takes his vote from CW (where he was 1 of 2) and puts it on EF (and was the 1st voter). Now maybe PB was just keen there at EF was about to pick up votes based on the sheer number of people he pinged, but one would think that if PB, who at the time was ahead 6-2-2-2 was going to move it'd be to create a 6-3-2 situation and not a 6-2-2 one. Especially since Collins (one of the 2's) had some doubt on him.

My bad -- you're right that KWhit couldn't lynch cronin. But my point remains the same, that it messed with the play of some people -- not me, because I planned to switch to PB the whole time. But that's not really what I'm after you for, anyway -- that was just something to get you riled up. :)

[jeheinz72]

I think KWhit is a good choice. He scares the crap out of me as a wolf. Plus he cast the second vote on Cronin day one, maybe saw a chance to take out a solid player day 1.

VOTE KWHIT

FYI Lathum, you voted Olie in 959 and didn't unvote it before this.

[Passacaglia]

Grilling is one thing, but we're going on 2 days of me going over the same scenario and all along I've admitted it wasn't a good play. It's not like i'm trying to cast it as me doing a smart thing here.

I just think time/energy is better served elsewhere. I can't imagine a scenario where someone hasn't formed their opinion on my bad play yet.

I don't think that I'm singling this situation out as the only thing that matters in this dicussion -- I'm spreading myself pretty thin. I haven't had a chance to look at post 626 yet because I've been replying to posts on this page, but I will get to it.

[jeheinz72]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100


FYI, Cronin vote for me in post 878, that's not up there.

[Passacaglia]

It is, if only I paid attention to such things. :D

But come on, when you make comments like this? It's hard NOT to keep grilling you!

[jeheinz72]

I don't think that I'm singling this situation out as the only thing that matters in this dicussion -- I'm spreading myself pretty thin. I haven't had a chance to look at post 626 yet because I've been replying to posts on this page, but I will get to it.

The post itself ain't much, it's just PB changing his vote from CW to EF. It's the fact that he went from being up 6-2-2-2 to 6-2-2-1-1.

I don't think PB would change his vote (keeping in mind I don't think he'd tried the Seer reveal yet) to a fellow wolf there, if he changes as at all, I'd think he'd change to another leading candidate.

[Passacaglia]

Well by the same toke, I'm a kitten. How was I supposed to know, at the time, that PB was the wolf and Cronin was the stray? I think I had pretty good reason to vote for Cronin. His talk about who to vote for (voting for a lead candidate or voting for whom one thinks is a wolf) indeed *is* wildly inconsistent from previous games I played with him.

And I didn't "swing" anything. I placed my vote on someone I thought at the time was a wolf. People came *after* and joined me on him, and it's not like there weren't already other candidates in the mix as well against PB.

The thing is, though, you mentioned that he'd been acting weird, then waited an hour or so to see what kind of traction, it got, THEN voted for him. I'll find post counts to verify this, cuz I may be wrong.

[jeheinz72]

But come on, when you make comments like this? It's hard NOT to keep grilling you!

Just bein' honest man.

I just never have been big on noticing who hasn't voted yet, unless it's in the count. I keep a .txt open with the latest official count. If it isn't in there, I likely miss it.

[Passacaglia]

The post itself ain't much, it's just PB changing his vote from CW to EF. It's the fact that he went from being up 6-2-2-2 to 6-2-2-1-1.

I don't think PB would change his vote (keeping in mind I don't think he'd tried the Seer reveal yet) to a fellow wolf there, if he changes as at all, I'd think he'd change to another leading candidate.

Right -- I'll look around the vote, too -- I wasn't *only* going to look at that one post! :p

[jeheinz72]

The thing is, though, you mentioned that he'd been acting weird, then waited an hour or so to see what kind of traction, it got, THEN voted for him. I'll find post counts to verify this, cuz I may be wrong.

That could be correct, but that's just me making up my mind.

I mean, by the same token, you're coming pretty hard after me, but like you said, you're vote isn't on me, is it?

[The Jackal]

I also agree with Lathum that the duke should reveal, and asap. The duke reveals, and olie gets one more scan - that will give us a formidable cot. We don't want oliegirl scanning the duke tonight, that would be a waste.

Fine, fine, I'm the Duke. I have no reason to distrust you or Lathum so I don't feel too bad about putting it out there.

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100

[jeheinz72]

Fine, fine, I'm the Duke. I have no reason to distrust you or Lathum so I don't feel too bad about putting it out there.

I so knew that you were...

[Seolian]

I know that I am not a wolfie and my hat does not really mean anything either.

http://www.cutelittlekittens.com/kitten/8341.html

[The Jackal]

I so knew that you were...

I did sort of hint at it, good work. ;)

I wanted to keep it in my back pocket and use it late in the game, but I think it helps us increase our percentages of nailing a wolf right now. Ain't looking pretty for you Heinzy.

[jeheinz72]

I did sort of hint at it, good work. ;)

I wanted to keep it in my back pocket and use it late in the game, but I think it helps us increase our percentages of nailing a wolf right now. Ain't looking pretty for you Heinzy.

Indeed it isn't.

*OR* people could try believing me and not lynch a kitteh.

[RendeR]

I'm either not thinking clearly today or there just isn't a lot of evidence to go around.

I'm still not impressed with the idea of anyone else revealing. Maybe I'm overthinking this though:

The unknown role(s) are the BG and the duke, I guess I'm stuck thinking the BG is pretty vital right now, but is it really?

If they both reveal, then we have at most 4 people left unknown and at most 3 dogs in those 4.

Someone with better math skills thans me sort that out, can we control the voting enough to hammer that out and still win with losing the roled players each night?

Help me clarify this in my brain folks =)

[Passacaglia]

253, 8:53 -- heinz calls out cronin
255, 8:57 -- KWhit agrees
256, 9:06 -- PB agrees
261, 9:12 -- Pass disagrees
266, 9:15 -- KWhit disagrees with my disagreeance
270, 9:17 -- heinz screws it and votes cronin



My bad -- 24 minutes, not an hour. It seems to me that the discussion was enough to convince you that a bandwagon could form.

[The Jackal]

I just revealed as the Duke, RendeR. I felt more comfortable with it after two players I semi-trust in this game encouraged it.

[Passacaglia]

heinz, you're going to love this. I looked at 626, where PB puts in a vote on EF. He says that EF's vote on cronin looks worse from what he's seen. I wonder why he chose EF of all the people who had votes on cronin at the time? :)

[jeheinz72]

My bad -- 24 minutes, not an hour. It seems to me that the discussion was enough to convince you that a bandwagon could form.

Oh you meant cronin (I thought you meant EF).

Yeah, I often do that. I'll bring up a point and see where it goes. I wasn't looking so much for other people joining me though as cronin's explaination.

[jeheinz72]

heinz, you're going to love this. I looked at 626, where PB puts in a vote on EF. He says that EF's vote on cronin looks worse from what he's seen. I wonder why he chose EF of all the people who had votes on cronin at the time? :)

It's the man keeping me down, I swear.

[RendeR]

I just revealed as the Duke, RendeR. I felt more comfortable with it after two players I semi-trust in this game encouraged it.


I just saw that after I posted =)

I've got two digusting kids to clean up, someone find Lathum's list of who's Who for me so we can see what the best plan is and what smallish group we need to sift through? Please =)

[Coffee Warlord]

I know that I am not a wolfie and my hat does not really mean anything either.

http://www.cutelittlekittens.com/kitten/8341.html

Okay, that did make me laugh. :)

Alas, I still think there's a high probability that of the two non-trusted people who left votes on hoops (the only challenger to save PB) last night, one of them is a wolf. And right now, it's you over EF, though I think you're both safe today anyway.

[Seolian]

It takes me a little while getting used to people before I start making a lot of posts and such.

[The Jackal]

Here's that list.

1.Hoopsguy
3.Kwitt
4.jeheinze
5.Lathum- claimed fool, scanned clear by olie
6.Mcollins- claimes lolcat
7.Passacaglia
8.RendeR
9.St. Cronin- claims stray
10.Oliegirl- claims seer
11.Eaglefan
12.the Jackal - claims duke
13.coffee warlord- scanned clear by olie
14.seolian
15.dangarion
17.Chief Rum

[Passacaglia]

KWhit didn't hold off though, he posted multiple times in the last 10 minutes for people to NOT switch their vote. I think, if he's a wolf, if anything he knew that he couldn't switch. Same gambit I'm in I suppose. KWhit couldn't have gotten Cronin lynched, he was on Cronin already (as I was)


Re: EagleFan, something just didn't sit right with me in his early Day 2. Maybe it was just the rapid-fire calling out of like 3-4 people then

In the early goings he lists NINE people (me, collins, PB, Cronin, and half-calls-out you, Jackal, RendeR, olie, Lathum)

But what doesn't reconcile is in post 626, PB takes his vote from CW (where he was 1 of 2) and puts it on EF (and was the 1st voter). Now maybe PB was just keen there at EF was about to pick up votes based on the sheer number of people he pinged, but one would think that if PB, who at the time was ahead 6-2-2-2 was going to move it'd be to create a 6-3-2 situation and not a 6-2-2 one. Especially since Collins (one of the 2's) had some doubt on him.

So are you arguing that PB was up 6-2-2-2, and chose that time to throw away his vote on another wolf?

[jeheinz72]

So are you arguing that PB was up 6-2-2-2, and chose that time to throw away his vote on another wolf?

No, I'm saying the opposite. I'm being devil's advocate and thinking he wouldn't do that.

[jeheinz72]

Here's that list.

So we've got 6 allegedly cleared players and 9 uncleared players. I think if the BG comes forward (to ensure we don't mistakenly lynch him today...HAHAHAHA) and then protects Olie tonight so she can clear (or better yet, indict) one of the remaining 8 we would actually have a COT that outnumbers the amount of suspicious people remaining

So let's say I get lynched today, that'd leave 7 uncleared, 7 cleared, and let's say 3 wolves with the BG coming forward. Then they night kill the BG, but Olie clears one of the 7 uncleared, leaving 6 uncleared, 7 cleared, 3 wolves.

Always voting one of the uncleared with them taking out one of the cleared (starting with Olie, I"d presume) should end in a village win, provided none of the cleared folks are lying and getting away with it.

[The Jackal]

Or the bodyguard could not reveal, thereby forcing the wolves to guess and hopefully take out a regular kitten instead, both keeping the bodyguard alive and narrowing down our list of uncleared people.

[Passacaglia]

No, I'm saying the opposite. I'm being devil's advocate and thinking he wouldn't do that.

Then am I wrong in thinking that EF would be your top suspect? I know you've got your vote on KWhit now, but is that purely self-defense, or does he also happen to be your top suspect? I'm trying to see if you can convince me (and others) to move somewhere else.

[Passacaglia]

Or the bodyguard could not reveal, thereby forcing the wolves to guess and hopefully take out a regular kitten instead, both keeping the bodyguard alive and narrowing down our list of uncleared people.

But what about the seer?

[The Jackal]

But what about the seer?

Not sure I follow what you're asking about.

[RendeR]

Or the bodyguard could not reveal, thereby forcing the wolves to guess and hopefully take out a regular kitten instead, both keeping the bodyguard alive and narrowing down our list of uncleared people.


See I was thinking along this line as well, thank you for saying it.

What good is the bodyguard after tonight? Tonight he dies if he reveals, giving Olie one more scan, tomorrow Olie dies, they have no choice right?

So what good is staying secretive? who else can he protect that will make a real difference at this stage of the game? I think thats what I want to know. How does staying hidden really help us at all at this point?

[The Jackal]

I just don't see any merit in the BG revealing unless you want to avoid having a wolf claim BG when he's on the chopping block. But that nails us a wolf.

[Passacaglia]

I just think you're oversimplifying it -- a BG reveal would mean the wolves could guess between BG, seer or regular kitty. With the BG unrevealed, the wolves pretty much have to go regular kitty, cuz they can assume the seer is protected.

[jeheinz72]

Then am I wrong in thinking that EF would be your top suspect? I know you've got your vote on KWhit now, but is that purely self-defense, or does he also happen to be your top suspect? I'm trying to see if you can convince me (and others) to move somewhere else.

I don't know what to think to be honest. On one hand, EF has acted fishy in this game as well, but I don't think PB would throw-away onto another wolf (thinking if it got close again he'd have to switch again anyhow, and his votes will be scrutinized should he get lynched)

Right now, I like the idea of KWhit as the wolf (admiteddly for close to the same reasons as me, only difference is he was 2nd onto Cronin on Day One and he took the opposite tactic at the deadline, saying no one should move in an attempt to break the tie) ever-so-slightly more than EF as a wolf.

[The Jackal]

See I was thinking along this line as well, thank you for saying it.

What good is the bodyguard after tonight? Tonight he dies if he reveals, giving Olie one more scan, tomorrow Olie dies, they have no choice right?

So what good is staying secretive? who else can he protect that will make a real difference at this stage of the game? I think thats what I want to know. How does staying hidden really help us at all at this point?

Well we don't know who the BG protected last night. Could've been himself, could've been Olie, could've been cronin. I think that plays into the village's favor, because the wolves don't know who the BG protected either. A night block by the BG in the next few days would help a lot.

I could be missing something here, but I don't see the need for a BG reveal.

[RendeR]

But what about the seer?


Olie is dead on night 4 no matter what the BG does at this point. because he has to protect her tonight and he can't protect her two nights in a row.

The seer is toast tomorrow night. So the seer is rather irrelevent.

[oliegirl]

VOTE HEINZ

[Passacaglia]

olie, you around for a while? i'd like to convince you not to scan hoops

[The Jackal]

Olie is dead on night 4 no matter what the BG does at this point. because he has to protect her tonight and he can't protect her two nights in a row.

The seer is toast tomorrow night. So the seer is rather irrelevent.

Possibly. But the wolves kind of have to assume Olie is being protected, because it's a risky move to go after her tonight. Heinz and I went through this with Narc/KWhit last game.

And I don't particularly like that the people pushing for the BG reveal are uncleared people at this point.

[jeheinz72]

FTR, I'm not pushing for it, just that it is an option

And olie, don't vote for me, just vote KWhit and scan me tonight instead.

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148

[The Jackal]

dola

just to avoid confusion on what i was saying - its very possible the BG either can't or won't protect olie tonight, setting up a protection tomorrow. the strategy is all up to the BG, but I don't think we have to know what he's doing.

[Passacaglia]

See I was thinking along this line as well, thank you for saying it.

What good is the bodyguard after tonight? Tonight he dies if he reveals, giving Olie one more scan, tomorrow Olie dies, they have no choice right?

So what good is staying secretive? who else can he protect that will make a real difference at this stage of the game? I think thats what I want to know. How does staying hidden really help us at all at this point?

I figure if the BG has not revealed, after the seer is dead, he can protect any other cleared villager without having to worry about protecting himself.

[oliegirl]

Olie is dead on night 4 no matter what the BG does at this point. because he has to protect her tonight and he can't protect her two nights in a row.

The seer is toast tomorrow night. So the seer is rather irrelevent.

:(

[mccollins]

I think if the BG comes forward

Sorry man.
Vote Heinz

Can someone recap the case against KWhit?

[mccollins]

Olie is dead on night 4 no matter what the BG does at this point. because he has to protect her tonight and he can't protect her two nights in a row.

The seer is toast tomorrow night. So the seer is rather irrelevent.

Not necessarily ;)

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072
Seolion- Render1042, CW 1073
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148, mcollins 1156

[The Jackal]

That's now five uncleared people with a vote on Heinz. That raises some warning flags.

[jeheinz72]

That's now five uncleared people with a vote on Heinz. That raises some warning flags.

That my friend is an excellent point.

[Coffee Warlord]

We have under an hour, and there's been no real push to save heinz, either. Which I believe the wolves would really have to try SOMETHING to sway some votes, since they're already down one.

[The Jackal]

That my friend is an excellent point.

I don't know what vibe I'm getting off you anymore. You might have to be lynched just so we can get info from this - but if you do get lynched, whatever you turn up will provide us with some interesting discussion about the uncleared people who've voted for you.

[The Jackal]

We have under an hour, and there's been no real push to save heinz, either. Which I believe the wolves would really have to try SOMETHING to sway some votes, since they're already down one.

Yeah, you'd think so. Which is why the timing and order of the votes on Heinz becomes very relevant.

[Passacaglia]

I only count four uncleared -- CR, EF, KW, SL.

[The Jackal]

I only count four uncleared -- CR, EF, KW, SL.

My bad, I forgot MC had revealed as the lolcat.

[mccollins]

Can someone please recap the case against KWhit? I'm going back to re-read Jackal/Pass's comments when they both voted against him.

[oliegirl]

olie, you around for a while? i'd like to convince you not to scan hoops

Yep - I'm here. Go ahead and plead your case. I'd definitely like input from the others as well.

[RendeR]

:(


Sorry darlin', nothing personal =) I'd love to keep you alive for a few more days too so you can scan, but the facts is the facts.

Make tonight's scan a good one =)


And based on what I've just read perhaps it is best if the BG stays hidden, it does at least add a point of confusion for the dogs to deal with that they wouldn't have if he comes out.

Thanks for the help clarifying things guys!

[Passacaglia]

heinz, you have any thoughts about Sea Lion?

[The Jackal]

Can someone please recap the case against KWhit? I'm going back to re-read Jackal/Pass's comments when they both voted against him.

There isn't a strong one, really. My vote on him is mostly because of a read on his play this game, but I could be off. I don't feel the need to switch to Heinz because 1, I'm not convinced he's a dog, and 2, it's not even close anymore.

[jeheinz72]

I don't know what vibe I'm getting off you anymore. You might have to be lynched just so we can get info from this - but if you do get lynched, whatever you turn up will provide us with some interesting discussion about the uncleared people who've voted for you.

Yes, I'd say it looks pretty bad for CR, Seolian and EF.

KWhit's is defensible, given it's in self-defense.

Olie, if I were you, scan one of those 3 tonight (well, or me, but let's be real, I ain't livin).

[Passacaglia]

Yep - I'm here. Go ahead and plead your case. I'd definitely like input from the others as well.

If you're going to be around during night actions time, I'd rather wait to get too much into it, and worry about the vote now. The short of it is that PB case a then-deciding vote for hoops at the end of Day 1

[Passacaglia]

cast, not case

[RendeR]

Gut instinct on this one:


UNVOTE SEA LION
VOTE KWHIT

[The Jackal]

Now things get spicy.

[Coffee Warlord]

EF and SL come in as votes 3 and 4 on Heinz. Given the votes I'm not happy with on previous days with those two, if Heinz is good, we need to take a lonnnng look there tomorrow.

[jeheinz72]

heinz, you have any thoughts about Sea Lion?

Not really I'm afraid. He's new, so I have a tough time deciphering if his moves are made out of inexperience or what.

Part of me does agree with the thinking that if I was a veteran wolf (like a PB) and I had a newbie wolf (like Seolian) I would make it pretty darn clear to him to not do exactly what he's done.

That's about the only snippet I have to offer up on him. I'd say of the 3 non-cleared, non-KWhit votes on me, he's the one I suspect the least

[jeheinz72]

Gut instinct on this one:


UNVOTE SEA LION
VOTE KWHIT


And that vote counts as 9 right? :D

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072, RendeR 1174
Seolion- CW 1073
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148, mcollins 1156

[mccollins]

There isn't a strong one, really. My vote on him is mostly because of a read on his play this game, but I could be off. I don't feel the need to switch to Heinz because 1, I'm not convinced he's a dog, and 2, it's not even close anymore.

Yeah, reading back it doesn't seem like a very strong case?

[RendeR]

And that vote counts as 9 right? :D


It does in my little corner of the multi-verse =)

[jeheinz72]

Collins, the case vs KWhit is pretty similar to the one against me. The main differences are

While I'm being indicted for "swinging" the vote onto Cronin, I was the first to raise the issue and the first to vote it, KWhit followed me

Also, whereas I made the gaffe of proclaiming I would break the tie and didn't, KWhit, in the same situation (a vote on cronin) sat there and actively told people to not change their vote (possibly meaning me, since my lone place to switch to would've been to PB)

[jeheinz72]

It does in my little corner of the multi-verse =)

Motion to impeach Clap as GM and insert Render!

[The Jackal]

Yeah, reading back it doesn't seem like a very strong case?

I never said it was, really. Pass and I voted for him at the same time without realizing it, and neither were votes set in stone. Then Lathum tacked on real quick afterwards, and nothing has been heard of it until this recent switch.

[Coffee Warlord]

7-4 right now, huh.

Don't see much in the way of swings coming.

[jeheinz72]

CW, any chance I can convince you to move from SL to KWhitt?

[The Jackal]

I never said it was, really. Pass and I voted for him at the same time without realizing it, and neither were votes set in stone. Then Lathum tacked on real quick afterwards, and nothing has been heard of it until this recent switch.

Oh, and Lathum's vote didn't count.

[Coffee Warlord]

CW, any chance I can convince you to move from SL to KWhitt?

I'd probably do it if it made a difference. Not risking a tie though, so there'd have to be a lot of movers.

[Coffee Warlord]

Hell with it. I'll be around to swap again if need be.

Unvote Sea Lion
Vote KWhit

See if we can get some action going late.

[jeheinz72]

http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/6/3/yougotztehwr128569804283055047.jpg

[mccollins]

I never said it was, really. Pass and I voted for him at the same time without realizing it, and neither were votes set in stone. Then Lathum tacked on real quick afterwards, and nothing has been heard of it until this recent switch.

So why are our cleared folks on him? He'd be a good wolf?

I need more than this reasoning to switch.

[hoopsguy]

I agree with JEH's analysis above (post 1137) - if we have that number of wolves, if there is no conversion chance (2nd LOLcat? who knows), then we should have control of the game.

That said, JEH is also the guy I'm voting for at this point. I've never been able to shake the feeling that his vote for me on Day 1 was purposeful - that was further magnified when we saw that PB was a wolf.

VOTE JEHEINZ

[claphamsa]

Oliegirl- Lathum 959
Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072, RendeR 1174, CW1189
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065, Seolion 1066,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148, mcollins 1156, hoops 1192

[Coffee Warlord]

Nail. Meet coffin.

[hoopsguy]

And there were a ton of posts between when I started typing that and when I posted that.

[mccollins]

Dangarion is the only one who hasn't voted, but I don't know that he's been around.

[Lathum]

Olie, I think for now we have to call a spade a spade here and just go with the fact that you are likely the seer and lathum is likely the fool.

I just don't see how whomever is truly the 2nd half of the Seer/Fool combo could not have come forward yet. If they're out there, they need to pipe up, for then we surely have a wolf.
.

I think Eaglefan is trying to set it up so that he can later come out and fake reveal as a seer.

[hoopsguy]

As, I was considering three candidates when I started typing.

OK, I'm willing to consider moving the vote to KWhit but I've also got to get out of the door soon. I'll do a quick review of the voters on each candidate.

[jeheinz72]

And there were a ton of posts between when I started typing that and when I posted that.

So change it. :D

It's not going to get you a dog.

[The Jackal]

So why are our cleared folks on him? He'd be a good wolf?

I need more than this reasoning to switch.

If you don't feel a need to switch off of Heinz then don't, none of us are trying to push hard for a KWhit lynch.

[hoopsguy]

Olie, Mccollins - do you guys feel good about the Heinz vote compared to the KWhit one? Because I think the # of "cleared" villagers is about split between our two candidates.

[The Jackal]

But MC, I do think that as the numbers dwindle the cleared folks will probably want to start voting together. Not essential yet, but we'll start being on the same page soon I imagine.

[jeheinz72]

Nail. Meet coffin.

Probably right.

So when I come back kitteh, who do you guys go after? Might as well start having that talk amongst yourselves now.

[Coffee Warlord]

I think Eaglefan is trying to set it up so that he can later come out and fake reveal as a seer.

Doubt it. I think the time has passed for that. There's just no way anyone can sanely challenge a claimed role at this point.

[The Jackal]

PING Lathum - you do realize your vote is still on olie, right

[oliegirl]

Lathum, why haven't you moved your vote off me yet???? Your vote for Kwhit never counted b/c you didn't unvote me.

I'm really at a loss on who to scan tonight...I think if we can agree on someone in the next 23 minutes it would be good. Ideas??? Anyone feel super strongly for or against scanning someone???

[Coffee Warlord]

Probably right.

So when I come back kitteh, who do you guys go after? Might as well start having that talk amongst yourselves now.

Like I said earlier. SL and EF are still tops on my list, based on voting patterns.

If anyone has worse offenders for votes, I'd like to hear it.

[jeheinz72]

Lathum, why haven't you moved your vote off me yet???? Your vote for Kwhit never counted b/c you didn't unvote me.

I'm really at a loss on who to scan tonight...I think if we can agree on someone in the next 23 minutes it would be good. Ideas??? Anyone feel super strongly for or against scanning someone???

He tried to vote KWhit but didn't unvote.

Hook it up Lathum.

[Passacaglia]

Lathum, why haven't you moved your vote off me yet???? Your vote for Kwhit never counted b/c you didn't unvote me.

I'm really at a loss on who to scan tonight...I think if we can agree on someone in the next 23 minutes it would be good. Ideas??? Anyone feel super strongly for or against scanning someone???

You have until an hour after deadline, right?

[Lathum]

Unvote OlieGirl

[The Jackal]

Lathum, why haven't you moved your vote off me yet???? Your vote for Kwhit never counted b/c you didn't unvote me.

I'm really at a loss on who to scan tonight...I think if we can agree on someone in the next 23 minutes it would be good. Ideas??? Anyone feel super strongly for or against scanning someone???

I'd scan one of EF, SL, or CR. No particular order.

[Lathum]

Unvote Kwhit

I should still have a vote now

[Coffee Warlord]

Lathum, why haven't you moved your vote off me yet???? Your vote for Kwhit never counted b/c you didn't unvote me.

I'm really at a loss on who to scan tonight...I think if we can agree on someone in the next 23 minutes it would be good. Ideas??? Anyone feel super strongly for or against scanning someone???

If Jeheinz is good, I'm voting you scan the Aquatic Cat.

[The Jackal]

To be honest it's not crucial who you scan. We've likely got three wolves amongst the uncleared, but finding a kitten is almost as helpful. If you manage to nail a wolf, we'll all be pleased. :)

[oliegirl]

You have until an hour after deadline, right?

Yeah - I am off at noon though and have some stuff to do around the house...I can hang around for a little after deadline until we can reach a consensus...would like to get away sooner rather than later though.

[Passacaglia]

I'd scan one of EF, SL, or CR. No particular order.

I agree with this. KWhit is a possibility, too.

[hoopsguy]

Olie, if JEH comes up kitteh then go ahead and scan me.

If he comes up doggie, then I would like a little credit for getting good votes in on two straight bad guys.

If you are looking at someone besides me take a spin at Chief Rum (good player, not cleared), your husband (hard to be partial on him without knowing, right?), or EagleFan (toughest read for me in the game, based on his play and past games with him).

[jeheinz72]

Not that I have a say, but presuming you all incorrectly lynch me, just scan an uncleared person on me and you're sure to have your best odds at finding a dog.

[The Jackal]

I agree with this. KWhit is a possibility, too.

That's very true. KWhit would be a good scan so we know whether or not to go that route, since Heinz being lynched is pretty much irrelevant to KWhit.

[Seolian]

UNVOTE JEHIENZE
VOTE KWHIT

Just following the people that I think are good.

[jeheinz72]

You may want to slant it to picking a less-active person to scan, since if they are uncleared and hard to engage it'll be harder to get them lynched, dog or cat.

[claphamsa]

Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072, RendeR 1174, CW1189, seolion 1220
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148, mcollins 1156, hoops 1192

[jeheinz72]

7-6 with 2 non-voters (Lathum and Dangarion)?

[Coffee Warlord]

KWhit - 6
Heinz - 7

Interesting.

[claphamsa]

this is exciting!

[mccollins]

Honestly, both Seolian/SeaLion and Dangarion come across as newer players trying to jump in there and I don't really suspect them very much for their actions/votes as of yet.

As others have mentioned, it's highly probable there is/was a veteran wolf who wouldn't let them make some of their moves.

Just my $0.02 on those two.

[jeheinz72]

hoops, given you're not cleared, your own survival has a better chance by not casting a deciding vote upon me.

I think I was clear in why I voted for you Day One, I was reading you similarly to the game we were just wolves together in.

[Coffee Warlord]

Honestly, both Seolian/SeaLion and Dangarion come across as newer players trying to jump in there and I don't really suspect them very much for their actions/votes as of yet.

As others have mentioned, it's highly probable there is/was a veteran wolf who wouldn't let them make some of their moves.

Just my $0.02 on those two.

Yeah, but despite offering advice and all that, you can't possibly control/aid every move they make.

[hoopsguy]

Is Dangarion around? How do we feel about a tie here? Lathum could put us in that spot, and it gives us one more day without a lynch - for better or worse.

With as big a COT as we have right now, I think I'm OK with no lynch. We should have one more scan to add to the mix for tomorrow, and a nearly invincible COT to go after remaining uncleared folks.

[RendeR]

Talk about vote shifting, this thing was a done deal 30 minutes ago, now its neck n neck =)

[The Jackal]

I don't know if I like the no lynch. It gives us no information from today.

[Coffee Warlord]

Frankly, unless we REALLY fucked up and get the bodyguard, I'd rather see a lynch today. Give of definitive info one way or another on who someone is.

[The Jackal]

I think I should ask my cat what to do.

[Passacaglia]

UNVOTE JEHIENZE
VOTE KWHIT

Just following the people that I think are good.

Which people are those?

[Lathum]

Vote KWhit

if Heinze was a wolf he would have fake revealed as the bodyguard by now.

[hoopsguy]

hoops, given you're not cleared, your own survival has a better chance by not casting a deciding vote upon me.

I think I was clear in why I voted for you Day One, I was reading you similarly to the game we were just wolves together in.

At this point I'm not all that worried about my survival - I think good guys are winning this game with or without me. I would like the individual win, but I don't see a reason to move a vote between one guy I lean towards distrust over to a guy I consider neutral in my reads.

The movement of another uncleared guy from candidate 1 to candidate 2 makes me think there is a decent chance we have either two villagers or two wolves in the mix. In which case it wouldn't matter what I do here.

[Seolian]

Coffee and Jackyl

[jeheinz72]

I'll admit, I'm not the BG (psh, If I was, I should lose just for not bringing it up!)

[Lathum]

dola- Has dang dropped out/ lost interest?

EF is my #1 suspect right now.

[Passacaglia]

Coffee and Jackyl

Why them?

[Coffee Warlord]

Tie.

Someone gonna move?

[RendeR]

Vote KWhit

if Heinze was a wolf he would have fake revealed as the bodyguard by now.


I have to agree with you on this. There really hasn't been the reaction to his assumed doom that I would expect if he were a dog.

[The Jackal]

does anyone else agree with hoops about the no lynch?

[jeheinz72]

Vote KWhit

if Heinze was a wolf he would have fake revealed as the bodyguard by now.

That's a valid point. One that frankly I should've probably made myself about an hour ago.

[claphamsa]

Kwhit- Jackyl 1007, Pass 1008, heinze 1072, RendeR 1174, CW1189, seolion 1220, Lathum1235
Heinze- Cronin878, CR1062, EagleFan1065,Kwhitt 1100, Olie1148, mcollins 1156, hoops 1192

[Seolian]

I just think that they are not wolves at this point. Although I am new and probably would take a few games to really get the hang of it.

[EagleFan]

I see my name mentioned a lot in th eposts but not enough time to reply to them now. Had a brief couple minutes to look at the thread but have to go to another office shortly.

If I am still alive when I get back online I will try to give some defense to myself (not really sure what I need defended for accept my unvote of PB on day 1, though that was before the real mess started).

I will defend one thing that stood out, which is my playing style I guess. I was called out, again by heiz, for ruffling feathers early with some comments about a few players which I made in jest. I only mention 4 names with serious implication and the other posts were made jokingly (you need to shake the tree a little to see what falls out) but I never said that I truly suspect the people in those posts at that time. In this he keeps mentioning my calling out oliegirl, which I never did. I only made the joke vote on her for the Sex in the City thing but never intended on that vote remaining on her. She had no action on her at that time and was not in any danger (if that were the case I would not have made that vote).


Oh, one other thing. Not setting up for any kind of reveal. One thing that has been a pattern, other than always being on opposite sides as PB, is that I have either been a vanilla villager or the brutal. And neither would lend themselves to a reveal. ;)


Damn, getting called and have to go. Will be back later (not sure how later).

[hoopsguy]

What does a lynch gain us? There is the obvious of a potential wolf, but I think the downside of lynching a villager is worse in this particular case.

I'll put out the long argument next, but the above is the short one.

[jeheinz72]

does anyone else agree with hoops about the no lynch?

I do! I do! I do!

Here's what I know

Lynching me - 100% bad (from my POV)
Lynching KWhit - Could be good, could be bad
Lynching neither - doesn't hurt us any (Olie can just scan one of us two)
Lynching both (should the tiebreaking procedure be random) - Could be very bad if KWhit is also good, but if he's bad, well then, it's better than lynching just me.

[The Jackal]

But there's also a downside in still having the same amount of uncleared people.