How would you rate 2k8? Review wise.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sully

In the same token, VC could've packaged 10 Yard Fight with a APF 2K8 label, and the 2k fans would love it just because it isn't Madden. I don't play favorites, and have been highly critical of EA's football game in the past. I'm simply calling it like it is.

C'mon man - there's no need to make this into a "2K fanboys accept everything" argument. I respect your opinion. The thing that stuck out to me in the comment I quoted was the referencing of the price point - yet again. Before APF released, there were many threads debating it's price point - an argument I'd say we don't have for most other games. Some yes, but I think more often than not the 2K5 $20 price point is used against it. Then why aren't other games held to that standard? While the price point helped them gain a bigger market share, it also seems to have given people the perception that it should be the lesser priced product. 2K5 offered more than what Madden was at the time, yet there wasn't an outcry for Madden to lower it's price. Nor is there the perception that Madden should be priced less - as I said, the CG game is priced at $49.99. And I think it's safe to say it won't be much different from '07, which wasn't that different from '06.

It's not a fanboy sentiment imo. I don't visit a lot of sports gaming sites, but the ones that I do - even Maddenmania - have had relatively large pockets of fans that appreciate APF for what it is and what it's bringing to the table. Many of Madden's biggest features are gang tackling, double team blocking, branching anims, the ability to replay any play at any point from the game - all features that were in 2K5. Which was three years ago. And which was as you say, $20. Yet I think it's safe to say no one will bring that up in a review as a negative - it probably won't be referenced as anything but a positive. No one will argue that it should be priced less because these were things we got for a lesser price years ago.

Obviously I love APF - it feels like football, it brings emotion back to videogame football that hasn't been around. And they did it without the benefit of a blueprint in not having a license. Sure, they missed on some aspects - but they hit on a helluva lot more imo. If the game is only marginally successful I kinda hope they don't come out with another one. Collectively we don't deserve it. Especially when I'm willing to bet next year Madden/NCAA will look more like APF than vice versa - the same argument some of us were making 3yrs ago w/2K5.

[Bizzy Da Kid]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sully

In the same token, VC could've packaged 10 Yard Fight with a APF 2K8 label, and the 2k fans would love it just because it isn't Madden. As for longevity, obviously, YMMV, but I just don't see it. I've played this game offline for a week, and I'm bored of it.

So true.

I would love to see a thread with the opinion of those people who have never played 2k5.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by Skerik

But it is funny that for all the talk about the NFL license exclusivity meaning that Madden would lack innovation without any competition, 2K's fanbase is so happy with such a stale and dated game. But I guess you can't really improve what's already perfect.

It's funny and sad that you see people talking positively of the game, yet your interpretation is they're saying "it's perfect".

Your feeling of staleness, that it's "2K's fanbase" that's only accepting the game - despite the fact that there are 2K fans that don't like it because of the direction they took, etc. is your opinion. As I said, Madden and NCAA will look more like APF than vice versa next year. I think Tiburon's movie thing is a great idea. But outside of that, other than the obvious (graphics/franchise), there isn't much I'd say APF needs that either NCAA or Madden has, or will have. Gang tackling, double team blocking, etc. - let's be thankful that Tiburon's getting these ideas from somewhere.

[Sully]

Quote: Originally Posted by JayBee74

Actually Sully, you are calling it like you see it, which is fine, but I still don't understand your "pricing reasoning", where you are paying $40 more for a game that is essentially 2k5. As critical as you have been of EA's football games have you ever called them to task for having the audacity to charge $50-$60 for a game? 2K should be penalized because they ridiculously lowered the price of one of their games 3 years ago? There is a greater "night and day" between 2K5 and 2K8 then the Madden and NCAA series of the last 5 YEARS. The legends, the atmosphere, the tier no number ratings, the attributes, the online factor where you're not seeing the same 3 or 4 NFL teams all the time, THE IMPROVED DB AI (hey, they don't jump 10 yards from the ball anymore do they?), and the commentary (well 6 out of 7 ain't bad).

In fact, yes, I have criticized EA's games for their lack of innovation. Regardless, it's my choice to pay the $60 for the game. With that said, I can't recall EA ever stripping as much from a game as VC did with APF2K8. They opened themselves up to such criticism because they chose to price NFL2K5 at $20.

That's neither here nor there. I'm speaking exclusively about APF2K8. The DB AI is still a major issue with the game. Saying that it's better than what we saw in NFL2k5 isn't saying much. I've seen DBs standing still, like they're stuck in mud, as the ball sails over their head. I've seen AI controlled DBs run directly past the ball carrier to a blocker a few yards away. Granted, I have seen some good, such as DBs going stride for stride with a receiver. However, when the ball is thrown, on several occasions my DB failed to even make an attempt on picking it off or swatting it away. So, yes. If you're asking me if I'd rather have DBs jumping from 5 yards away to swat a pass down, I would agree. At least that's...challenging. Furthermore, if you've played this year's NCAA game, it's been toned down. Still there, but toned down. I guess I'd compare it to the slight improvement from the DB AI in NFL2K5 to that which I've seen in APF2K8.

What APF really has going for it is the atmosphere and presentation. Best I've seen. The commentary is awful, and I'm sure we can all agree on that, but it's still better than what we'll get with NCAA and Madden.

As for longevity, obviously, YMMV, but I just don't see it. I've played this game offline for a week, and I'm bored of it. Luckily, I see it having some legs online, but only if I'm involved in leagues that institute an offline draft. Still, we're capped at 15 teams because there aren't enough bronze legends to distribute amongst a larger league without having duplicates.

As I posted in a previous reply, for the most part, I'm enjoying the game. That doesn't mean it's perfect, in fact, it's FAR from it. Just because I think it's a 6 or a 7, that doesn't mean I dislike it. That just means there's a lot of room for improvement. And if you (not necessarily you, JayBee) can't see that, you're lying to yourself.

[JayBee74]

Quote: Originally Posted by Skerik

I'll give it a solid 5. Let's see....incredibly bare-bones game modes, including lack of franchise mode which has been in every sports title for the past five years or so. Stale animations. Very stale commentary. Braindead CPU DBs who don't react to the ball as it's moving past their heads. Ridiculous "pound on the A button" running system. (What is this, Track and Field for the NES?) Lousy playbooks with no variety. Every team pretty much plays the same. Overpowered legends who can't be tackled or caught by mere mortal default players. Overdone and overexaggerated momentum system. "Realistic" moves like charging up a QB for a super-throw by holding down the A button. Etc, etc, etc. I could go on, but I agree with Sully's point that 2K could take a steaming dump in a box and sell it for $60 to 95% of their fanbase. So pointing out the flaws in the game is pretty much a wasted exercise at this point. But it is funny that for all the talk about the NFL license exclusivity meaning that Madden would lack innovation without any competition, 2K's fanbase is so happy with such a stale and dated game. But I guess you can't really improve what's already perfect.

(1) 5-that's funny
(2) Bare Bones Game Modes-the most innovative online system EVER doesn't count for something? You want some mini track and field games too?
(3) Lack Of Franchise Mode which has been in EVERY sports game of the past 5 years-can't work that well with the legends.
(4) Braindead CPU DBs-I don't see it that much-improved from 2K5. It's dangerous throwing toward a Silver or a Gold.
(5) Every team pretty much plays the same-what are you talking about? A variety of teams can be created with different strengths and weaknesses. I guess you liked Indy VS New England games 50% of the time.
(6) Overpowered legends who can't be tackled or caught by mere mortal default players.-Absolutely not true-play the game more and you will see-sounds good though.
(7) "Realistic" moves like charging up a QB for a super-throw by holding down the A button-Couldn't that be something like a real QB reaching down to every fiber of his being to make that perfect throw? But let's get rid of the star under their feet too, because no real player has a gold star under his feet.
(8) So pointing out the flaws in the game is pretty much a wasted exercise at this point.-IN YOUR OPINION!!!!!! You guys in the minority here. You don't like the game-we do.

[Pappy Knuckles]

Quote: Originally Posted by Skerik

I'll give it a solid 5.

Okay, let's see why...

Quote:

Let's see....incredibly bare-bones game modes, including lack of franchise mode which has been in every sports title for the past five years or so.

This is a good argument, 2K should've provided one. However, are we gonna ever see a Madden or NCAA with leagues and tourneys? Why that doesn't get more heat than it does I'll never know.

Quote:

Stale animations.

I don't know what game you're looking at, but this game has some of the sweetest animations in sports titles period. The way that players move and interact with eachother is a beautiful thing.

Quote:

Very stale commentary.

I suppose that the two-man team isn't everyone's cup of tea. I also agree that quite a few lines have been recycled. However, I think it's a nice change of pace to Madden's weak radio announcer that bores you to sleep. I haven't played NCAA to compare those.

Quote:

Braindead CPU DBs who don't react to the ball as it's moving past their heads.

Pick the right plays and make adjustments at the line. That's all I'm gonna say.

Quote:

Ridiculous "pound on the A button" running system. (What is this, Track and Field for the NES?)

The tapping system is great. It gives the user a sense of really earning their yards since to be a good runner you need to tap the button rhythmically. holding down turbo and "steering" your way around obstacles just doesn't compare.

Quote:

Lousy playbooks with no variety. Every team pretty much plays the same.

I think the playbooks could be expanded as well, but I'm given more than enough options to mount my offense. Also be sure to add or subtract from your playbook in the options. As far as every team playing the same, that's false.

Quote:

Overpowered legends who can't be tackled or caught by mere mortal default players.

I got no issues here. If you know a guy is a problem to take down then you need to slow him down enough to get help. 90% of the people who complain about this issue are just garbage tacklers.

Quote:

Overdone and overexaggerated momentum system. "Realistic" moves like charging up a QB for a super-throw by holding down the A button.

I dunno how much football you play or watch in real life, but the momentum system is the most realistc that we've seen thus far. Again, I don't know what game you're playing.

Quote:

Etc, etc, etc. I could go on, but I agree with Sully's point that 2K could take a steaming dump in a box and sell it for $60 to 95% of their fanbase. So pointing out the flaws in the game is pretty much a wasted exercise at this point. But it is funny that for all the talk about the NFL license exclusivity meaning that Madden would lack innovation without any competition, 2K's fanbase is so happy with such a stale and dated game.

To each his own, but you are so dead wrong it's not even funny. I have no problem with anyone disliking the game, but the majority of the things you said are either flat out not true or arguably wrong.

Quote:

But I guess you can't really improve what's already perfect.

Hyuck Hyuck.

[JayBee74]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sully

In fact, yes, I have criticized EA's games for their lack of innovation. Regardless, it's my choice to pay the $60 for the game.

Great arbitrary statement.

Quote: Originally Posted by Sully

I can't recall EA ever stripping as much from a game as VC did with APF2K8.

EA rarely strips, then the game would be a little different from year to year.

Quote: Originally Posted by Sully

They opened themselves up to such criticism because they chose to price NFL2K5 at $20.

Who criticizes them for selling 2K8 for $60 instead of $20?

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Buddy Knox

Okay, let's see why... This is a good argument, 2K should've provided one. However, are we gonna ever see a Madden or NCAA with leagues and tourneys? Why that doesn't get more heat than it does I'll never know. I don't know what game you're looking at, but this game has some of the sweetest animations in sports titles period. The way that players move and interact with eachother is a beautiful thing. I suppose that the two-man team isn't everyone's cup of tea. I also agree that quite a few lines have been recycled. However, I think it's a nice change of pace to Madden's weak radio announcer that bores you to sleep. I haven't played NCAA to compare those. Pick the right plays and make adjustments at the line. That's all I'm gonna say. The tapping system is great. It gives the user a sense of really earning their yards since to be a good runner you need to tap the button rhythmically. holding down turbo and "steering" your way around obstacles just doesn't compare. I think the playbooks could be expanded as well, but I'm given more than enough options to mount my offense. Also be sure to add or subtract from your playbook in the options. As far as every team playing the same, that's false. I got no issues here. If you know a guy is a problem to take down then you need to slow him down enough to get help. 90% of the people who complain about this issue are just garbage tacklers. I dunno how much football you play or watch in real life, but the momentum system is the most realistc that we've seen thus far. Again, I don't know what game you're playing. To each his own, but you are so dead wrong it's not even funny. I have no problem with anyone disliking the game, but the majority of the things you said are either flat out not true or arguably wrong. Hyuck Hyuck.

Nice break down. Just sounds like the game wasn't for him. Only thing I can agree with is the bare bones offline features. The rest of the complaints I haven't experienced. If these animations and commentary are stale tho, I'd like to know what football game he's playing. I need that.