Overpowered fighters

[bmlimo]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

This always gets me in trouble here so I'm hesitant to do this but here is the counter to your argument. (Its not my argument) 1) Comp players will argue that without true balance whats the point. There is a GC that argues constantly that ranked should be equalized stats. There are others that argue that they work their *** off playing and becoming great at the game and they dont want randomness costing them wins. They dont care if random or unpredictability results in real life wins. They dont care. They are playing a game. A game with a meta that they have worked hard to get good at and they dont want average players lucking into wins. 2) Ranked is a comp mode. A sim mode would be great for offliners like me and great as an option for quick match. Those comp players dont want that seeping into ranked. So all of you folks that want strict realism in ranked...you are fighting against a very vocal contingent who doesnt want that.

Well this vocal contingent has a clear advantage, they are choosing the meta that they want to play. So everybody needs to get good on their meta even when it’s not clear that is the right meta

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by bmlimo

The community change based on the games that we receive my man, what year this happened? I believe devs could put new gamechangers based on the current community meta

I dont think that part of the community changed much at all. Before the end of the old EA forum, OS was a small community of primarily offline realism focused gamers when it came to the UFC series. All that happened was that a bunch of people from the EA forums (who at the time were more online focused) came over here and the devs decided to spend more time here.

The game didnt change. Those people who voted in those gamechangers knew what they were getting and now they are upset that they got what they wanted.

To be honest, adding more reality focused gamechangers would be nice for me but it doesnt really solve the problem you guys are facing. I would LOVE to have a few more gamechangers who are MMA nerds who watch tape and have opinions about stats, movesets and other realism basd things. I'd love to have a comp player or 2 that is more focused on realism than wins and losses.

With that said, it doesnt change ranked. If you guys can honestly say that you would be 100% happy if the devs added a sim mode for online quick match and offline....I'm 100% with you guys. 100%. Development of UFC 4 is moving forward but maybe thats something they can slip in (if it already isnt in the game).

But if you are talking about ranked....I dont see it happening. The comp players have a valid argument that ranked should be about who is the best player not who picked the best fighter. Also EA always has an interest in the comp sports scene and isnt likely going to ignore what the community wants.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kingslayer04

Hey, I know you're the stats guy and I didn't mean to sound like you aren't doing anything about realism. That being said, I half expected a similar response and that's because that kind of discussion's already been had - the issue is not the stats but what the stats bring isn't pronounced enough. You say I could one punch KO people with Ngannou if they're vulnerable? They have to have stretched their neck out like a curious kid in the zoo for that to happen and even then the worst outcome is usually a non-flash KD. That's what I mean. And what I'm suggesting would be the default way the game plays, not just in Quick or offline. Sure, it's not "random" but it will be realistic and it should more or less satisfy your need for randomness since the possibilities and matchups would be numerous. Hell, even cuts can be implemented in the default version of the game with some mechanic where you can target them when they appear. While we're at it, let me resurrect this thread where I made a suggestion on TKOs - https://forums.operationsports.com/f...iscussion.html Oh, and something else - the rates at which fighters lose stamina while striking and while grappling should be different, as it is now, but the stamina itself should be uniform. That's of paramount importance. That's probably the first thing they should change/should have changed in development for UFC 4. You need to be able to take advantage of inefficient strikers by taking them down when exhausted, and to grind people until they are exhausted. No more of that bull**** where you take them down in Round 4 and they actually have more stamina now. This is a must.

Thats not true though. I one punch KO'd Tito Ortiz by countering a leg kick with an overhand using Rumble 2 nights ago. I've done similar things with Ngannou and Hunt. It can be done but its rare...and it should be. 1 punch walkoff KOs dont happen all the time.

Here is the problem: I play nothing but sports games (with the occasional game like GTA). I play games like NBA 2k way more than I do UFC. With all of those games (whether its NBA 2k or Madden or the Show) the default version is never the sim version. NEVER.

In games like FIFA and NBA 2k, there are no fouls at default. In the Show (I havent played this year's game), home runs are way more prevalent at default. Madden is HORRIBLE before sliders and AI tweaks if you are playing on PC.

My point is no game companies give you a completely sim game at default. They give offline players the way to tweak the game at default to make it more sim. They sometimes give sliders and options to online players. Those options arent usually found in any ranked or comp modes.

Dont get me wrong though. Keep pushing for it. Keep asking for it. I'm just here to let you know what goes on behind the scenes a little bit.

[Kingslayer04]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

Thats not true though. I one punch KO'd Tito Ortiz by countering a leg kick with an overhand using Rumble 2 nights ago. I've done similar things with Ngannou and Hunt. It can be done but its rare...and it should be. 1 punch walkoff KOs dont happen all the time. Here is the problem: I play nothing but sports games (with the occasional game like GTA). I play games like NBA 2k way more than I do UFC. With all of those games (whether its NBA 2k or Madden or the Show) the default version is never the sim version. NEVER. In games like FIFA and NBA 2k, there are no fouls at default. In the Show (I havent played this year's game), home runs are way more prevalent at default. Madden is HORRIBLE before sliders and AI tweaks if you are playing on PC. My point is no game companies give you a completely sim game at default. They give offline players the way to tweak the game at default to make it more sim. They sometimes give sliders and options to online players. Those options arent usually found in any ranked or comp modes. Dont get me wrong though. Keep pushing for it. Keep asking for it. I'm just here to let you know what goes on behind the scenes a little bit.

Oh that's true, I'm not really familiar with American sports but FIFA is anything but sim. I get that, I just feel there's so much more to be done in the way of realism and fighter uniqueness before the devs can say "guys, we did what we could, we can't make it any more realistic without ruining the game". UFC 2 was terrible in terms of realism and 3 is leaps and bounds ahead of it - that's why I expect 4 to be a noticeable improvement over 3 in that area as well and am trying to highlight what needs be looked at. But if other sports games are anything like FIFA, then I absolutely know what you're talking about.

As for the one hit knockouts...I don't know, they're very rare for me. The problem is most times I need to stun a guy 3 times and drop them twice with Ngannou to finish them. Same with Hunt, Rumble, Woodley, doesn't matter. It's just immersion breaking. Sometimes I feel like "okay, I don't feel like having technical prolonged battles here, I want to land a bomb and enjoy the impact, knock them out" - that's impossible. You always have to block break, with everyone, and drop people a hundred times. I'll say it again - I don't want cheap or "easy" wins. I want these fighters to have their weaknesses really pronounced too, so that it's balanced. I also agree that landing shots should be more difficult and rocking someone should be a big achievement in itself.

But yes, I absolutely see your point about sim in sports games. I just feel that plenty more can be done in that direction in this series without it being random or cheap.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

This always gets me in trouble here so I'm hesitant to do this but here is the counter to your argument. (Its not my argument) 1) Comp players will argue that without true balance whats the point. There is a GC that argues constantly that ranked should be equalized stats. There are others that argue that they work their *** off playing and becoming great at the game and they dont want randomness costing them wins. They dont care if random or unpredictability results in real life wins. They dont care. They are playing a game. A game with a meta that they have worked hard to get good at and they dont want average players lucking into wins. 2) Ranked is a comp mode. A sim mode would be great for offliners like me and great as an option for quick match. Those comp players dont want that seeping into ranked. So all of you folks that want strict realism in ranked...you are fighting against a very vocal contingent who doesnt want that.

(I realize these aren't your specific opinions Aholbert and I'm not referring to you in this response)

Yay. I repeat my initial comment and return to my pit of sadness.

Though in response to the second point, I don't care if online stays MK Jr, I just want offline sim as well or enough sliders to get close or whatever, quick fight would be nice too but whatever, just SOME type of sim option for players who are interested.

There should be some compromise instead of ranked players just being "Nah Dat realism might affect my record it's not allowed in any part of the game"

It really bugs me that the people you mention seemingly don't care that realistic elements of the sport aren't represented, or exclude them because they affect the precious meta. Personally, I don't think infatuation with your win loss record should be the main deciding factor that change is needed.

I realize I'm in a tiny little minority and might as well just shout at a wall but hey, maybe if we keep it up one day we will have a simulation fighting game to compliment the already large arcade fighter market.